Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 25th Jul 2013 16:32 UTC
Legal "The U.S. government has attempted to obtain the master encryption keys that Internet companies use to shield millions of users' private Web communications from eavesdropping. These demands for master encryption keys, which have not been disclosed previously, represent a technological escalation in the clandestine methods that the FBI and the National Security Agency employ when conducting electronic surveillance against Internet users." Well. "And where once you had the freedom to object, think, and speak as you saw fit, you now have censors and systems of surveillence coercing your conformity and soliciting your submission." When quoting a work of fiction befits the state of reality better than reality itself, shit has officially hit the fan.
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RE: Saw this coming...
by WorknMan on Thu 25th Jul 2013 23:17 UTC in reply to "Saw this coming..."
WorknMan
Member since:
2005-11-13

I'm seriously considering starting to use my own cryptography at some point, because it's becoming clear that the encryption provided by big businesses for their services is about as good as nothing at all.


Question is, what are you doing that's so goddamn secretive? I'm not accusing you of anything; in fact, I bet the answer to that question is, probably nothing. As is the case for 99.9% of Americans. I'm not one to say "If you're not doing anything wrong, you don't have anything to hide", but should I really be expected to give a shit if the government might have access to my grocery lists or exercise routines that I have stored in the cloud?

If I'm going to store anything sensitive in the cloud (which seems like a dumb idea on the face of it), I'm going to make sure that the only person who has the decryption key is me, and possibly whoever else I need to look at it. Then I don't have to worry about the government looking at my stuff.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: Saw this coming...
by fossil on Thu 25th Jul 2013 23:55 in reply to "RE: Saw this coming..."
fossil Member since:
2009-05-29

My grocery list is no one's business but mine. If you are OK with the governments having access to all your data, how about remotely-controlled cameras and microphones in every room of your apartment or home?! That is also coming, I can hear it now, "Think of the children!"

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[3]: Saw this coming...
by WorknMan on Fri 26th Jul 2013 00:43 in reply to "RE[2]: Saw this coming..."
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

If you are OK with the governments having access to all your data, how about remotely-controlled cameras and microphones in every room of your apartment or home?! That is also coming, I can hear it now, "Think of the children!"


I didn't say I was ok with the government having access to all of my data. I said I don't care if they have acccess to stuff I have posted online, because I don't post stuff that I wouldn't want them looking at. Doesn't mean I'm HAPPY about it, but I don't lose sleep over it either.

To use an analogy, when I'm at work, I might leave a pen unattended on my desk, because I really don't care if it gets stolen. Does that mean that someone has the right to come and take it, or that I would be ok with them doing so? Of course not, esp if I bought it. But if somebody does take it, I'm not going to complain to HR and start going desk-to-desk to find out who took it.

Would I be as nonchalant about somebody taking a $500 Rolex off my desk, assuming I had one? Of course not. On the other hand, I wouldn't leave something like that out on purpose, and then get pissed when somebody takes it. If I need to leave it at my desk, I lock it in a drawer. I tend to treat online data the same way. If you don't want people (whether it be the government or somebody else), looking through your shit, don't post it on somebody else's server. THAT is the message we should be sending to people.

Edited 2013-07-26 00:44 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: Saw this coming...
by UltraZelda64 on Fri 26th Jul 2013 00:17 in reply to "RE: Saw this coming..."
UltraZelda64 Member since:
2006-12-05

It's not that I desire total secrecy; if I did, I wouldn't be using and posting this on a public message board right now. I just want people to keep their damn nose out of my business when they have no business peaking in there to begin with. The government, especially, has its own legal procedures--obtaining a warrant through probable cause--which it is supposed to have to go through. It shouldn't just be sucking everything I do up and storing it for later decryption as it wants. That's a blatant violation of the Constitution itself--it is supposed to be protecting us from this kind of government behavior.

When I go to Google and check my Gmail or do a web search over an SSL/TLS connection, I am *not* asking the government to butt in and spy on me. In fact, the encryption specifically means to keep out--no one has any business intercepting the communications on that channel or collecting it for future decryption. The simple fact is, I don't really trust the U.S. government any more than just some random hacker, and they can keep themselves out of the picture.

Edited 2013-07-26 00:23 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[2]: Saw this coming...
by ndrw on Fri 26th Jul 2013 00:59 in reply to "RE: Saw this coming..."
ndrw Member since:
2009-06-30

That's true today but there are some extremely difficult times ahead. Governments around the world know it very well but by now it is simply impossible to avoid the turmoil.

Surveillance is a great tool for the government during such times so expect more of it. Internet is a great tool for the people - expect less, especially in p2p and freedom of information areas. We don't know yet how these tools will be used against us in the future but I can assure you Soviets didn't have them.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: Saw this coming...
by Morgan on Fri 26th Jul 2013 02:52 in reply to "RE: Saw this coming..."
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

I feel like I say this all the time lately. Working in law enforcement, I have a unique perspective on the government and the public's expectation of privacy. Basically, the law enforcement community loves it when an activity that was once considered legal is rendered illegal by the courts. That's one more charge to add to the docket, one more source for probable cause. So, that online activity that you currently enjoy because it's legal today might be used against you in the future, and if they have records of you doing it you can be sure it will be fuel for the fire.

It's one of many reasons I'm looking forward to a career change very soon. I hate being a part of an establishment that views the people it is meant to protect as the enemy.

Reply Parent Score: 8

RE[3]: Saw this coming...
by zima on Tue 30th Jul 2013 15:00 in reply to "RE[2]: Saw this coming..."
zima Member since:
2005-07-06

I applaud you for taking a personal stand; I think most people wouldn't do that, blaming all the bad stuff at "others"

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: Saw this coming...
by TechGeek on Fri 26th Jul 2013 04:39 in reply to "RE: Saw this coming..."
TechGeek Member since:
2006-01-14

WorkNMan: The problem isn't what your doing now. Its that they keep the info forever. Maybe someday you run for a political office. Maybe you stand for a platform that the mainstream group think doesn't like. How many of us can say we have never done anything embarrassing? Or been involved with someone and the other person go a little off the deep end? Point is, the information gathered now that doesn't matter may mean a great deal at some point in the future. It gives those collecting the information power to control anyone they want in the future. Saying that you have nothing worth collecting now is just short sighted. I am sure Paula Dean didn't think much about her comments when she made them either. Look how that came back to bite her in the ass.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[3]: Saw this coming...
by WorknMan on Fri 26th Jul 2013 18:08 in reply to "RE[2]: Saw this coming..."
WorknMan Member since:
2005-11-13

How many of us can say we have never done anything embarrassing?


That's EXACTLY what I like about it. If it makes people think twice before doing or saying something incredibly stupid, I'm all for it ;)

Reply Parent Score: 2