Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 26th Aug 2013 14:52 UTC
Windows

Nokia is preparing to back Windows RT by launching a 10.1-inch tablet soon. Sources familiar with Nokia's plans have revealed to The Verge that the tablet, codenamed Sirius, will be launched shortly. While prototype pictures of the device leaked earlier this month, we understand that the final design more closely resembles Nokia's Lumia Windows Phone products.

Nice specifications, but Windows RT. Nobody wants Windows RT, and for good reason. I say this from experience: Windows RT is horrible. It offers nothing over iOS (let alone Android), Metro applications are side projects riddled with bugs, performance issues, and bad design, and the platform barely plays third fiddle compared to iOS and Android, so developers have little interest in it. On top of that, virtually everyone has abandoned Windows RT.

But, I'm pretty sure some people will tell us this tablet will turn Nokia around.

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RE[6]: Comment by _cynic_
by enx23 on Tue 27th Aug 2013 08:02 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Comment by _cynic_"
enx23
Member since:
2008-12-17

Complete and total failure with double digit volume growth quarter over quarter and year over year, you have a peculiar definition of failure.


I think that you Nelson have a very peliculiar definition of failure!

It is very easy to get double digit volume growth quarter over quarter when one has small numbers. By this definition if one sells one mobile phone today and another 50 next quarter will have triple digit volume growth! I think that according to these kind of measures the company Jolla (see www.jolla.com) will look even better than Apple, Samsung! Jolla will have an infinite volume growth quarter over quarter (some number divided by zero)!

"Double digit volume growth quarter over quarter and year over year" can be seen very often when one has less than 5% of the market!

Here are some more appropiate measures of failure:
- Nokia had over 30% of the market in 2010 and now it has 3%-4% of the market => 10 fold decrease for Nokia!
- Windows Mobile has ~12% of the market (during Gates time) and now the Windows Phone has 3%-4% of the market => clearly the todayƤ's strategy of Windows for mobile phones is even worst than in Gates' times!
- Nokia was number one mobile manufacturer of smartphones in 2010 and today is number 10!

Edited 2013-08-27 08:06 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[7]: Comment by _cynic_
by Nelson on Tue 27th Aug 2013 11:31 in reply to "RE[6]: Comment by _cynic_"
Nelson Member since:
2005-11-29

It is very easy to get double digit volume growth quarter over quarter when one has small numbers.


But Nokia does not have small numbers. Nokia went from 5.6 million to 7.4 million units in a quarter. That is not small. Maybe compared to every single Android OEM combined that's small, but if you look at the other Android OEMs (besides Samsung, obviously) they are posting similar types of volumes. Nokia is in the ballpark. So if Nokia is a failure, then the other OEMs have failed as well.


By this definition if one sells one mobile phone today and another 50 next quarter will have triple digit volume growth!


That's nice, but Nokia did not sell one, or 50 phones. They sold 7.4 million. This quarter its expected to increase by double digits again, as it has for the past few quarters.


I think that according to these kind of measures the company Jolla (see www.jolla.com) will look even better than Apple, Samsung! Jolla will have an infinite volume growth quarter over quarter (some number divided by zero)!


If Jolla posts strong QoQ gains, then it does imply that they are getting a strong reception relative to their own volumes. I'd be encouraged and others should too. I was encouraged when it was Lumia shipments going from 2 to 4 million, and I am encouraged when its from 5.6 to 7.4 million.

can be seen very often when one has less than 5% of the market!


5% of a very large market is still a large amount of units to sell, and when speaking about the impact it will have on Nokia's health and stability moving forward, it was a good bet.

If you look at their bottom line sans one time restructuring costs, they've posted strong underlying profits since Q3 of last year. That' significant and as these costs sunset at the end of 2013, you'll begin to see this materialize in IFRS profit.


Here are some more appropiate measures of failure:
- Nokia had over 30% of the market in 2010 and now it has 3%-4% of the market => 10 fold decrease for Nokia!
- Windows Mobile has ~12% of the market (during Gates time) and now the Windows Phone has 3%-4% of the market => clearly the todayƤ's strategy of Windows for mobile phones is even worst than in Gates' times!
- Nokia was number one mobile manufacturer of smartphones in 2010 and today is number 10!


Everybody knows Nokia is no longer #1, and that's fine, they don't have to be and aren't going to be for a while. This is about managing a very risky transition and setting them up for the future, which, like it or not is happening. Their devices are gaining traction, they are gaining marketshare, and the ecosystem is being fleshed out. It was the right bet.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[8]: Comment by _cynic_
by crocodile on Tue 27th Aug 2013 12:57 in reply to "RE[7]: Comment by _cynic_"
crocodile Member since:
2010-01-18

" It is very easy to get double digit volume growth quarter over quarter when one has small numbers.


But Nokia does not have small numbers. Nokia went from 5.6 million to 7.4 million units in a quarter. That is not small.
"

Sorry Nelson, but 7.4 millions units sold in a quarter is a very small number when for example during Q2 of 2013 have been sold in total ~230 million smartphones!!!
7.4 millions is very very small compared to 230 millions!

Here matters the relative numbers and not the absolute numbers!!!! It matters the percentage of the "pie" one gets. It is similar like you would basically start to count the number atoms in your favorite piece of pie even that is 5% of the entire pie and based on the fact that it has billions of atoms you state that your favorite piece of pie is big!!

Your "quarter to quarter" and "year to year" statistics start to become relevant/significant only when one has over 5% of the market. Below 5% of the market those numbers are not significant (there plenty of small "fishes" which can get astonishingly good quarter to quarter numbers).

Edited 2013-08-27 13:02 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[7]: Comment by _cynic_
by bnolsen on Wed 28th Aug 2013 02:15 in reply to "RE[6]: Comment by _cynic_"
bnolsen Member since:
2006-01-06

if you want to read and read and read about nokia you can visit this blog:

http://communities-dominate.blogs.com/

The best point this guy brings out is that bill gates even identified windows phone as a failure during a public interview. So while nelson argues technicalities the business side definitely points to failure of windows phone and nokia falling far far short of expectations.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[8]: Comment by _cynic_
by Nelson on Wed 28th Aug 2013 09:37 in reply to "RE[7]: Comment by _cynic_"
Nelson Member since:
2005-11-29

Tomi has been shown to be wrong on numerous occasions. The fact that some of you (still!) take him seriously frankly is very revealing.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[8]: Comment by _cynic_
by Nelson on Wed 28th Aug 2013 11:23 in reply to "RE[7]: Comment by _cynic_"
Nelson Member since:
2005-11-29

Really? Is that his best point? Because it is wrong.

http://dominiescommunicate.wordpress.com/2013/02/19/bill-gates-inte...

You're a smart guy, I hope you can see how severely misleading he is.

Reply Parent Score: 3