Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 20th Sep 2013 23:33 UTC
Windows

Speaking at Microsoft's financial analysts meeting today, CEO Steve Ballmer was refreshingly realistic about the company's struggles in smartphones and tablets. "Mobile devices. We have almost no share."

Right. Now that Ballmer himself admits it, can we please settle the discussion? Windows Phone has been a failure up until now.

Thread beginning with comment 572784
To view parent comment, click here.
To read all comments associated with this story, please click here.
RE[8]: Doesn't matter
by japh on Sun 22nd Sep 2013 17:25 UTC in reply to "RE[7]: Doesn't matter"
japh
Member since:
2005-11-11

Google is also doing the same thing. They are not making much at all giving away Android..


No, I imagine giving away something doesn't generate much direct income. But they do make a lot of money on mobile users. Android is not a loss leader.

Nelson thought I should congratulate Microsoft on being a loss... third place?

Fact is that Microsoft is pretty much fighting to stay relevant and are prepared to spend enormous amounts of money on that. And in doing so, they aren't really doing the consumers any favors. Competition works very poorly when one player doesn't need to care about a working business model.

When Microsoft can show that they're actually have a sustainable niche that didn't come from killing off competitors with long-running loss projects, then we can start talking about milestones.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[9]: Doesn't matter
by Nelson on Sun 22nd Sep 2013 17:40 in reply to "RE[8]: Doesn't matter"
Nelson Member since:
2005-11-29

No, I imagine giving away something doesn't generate much direct income. But they do make a lot of money on mobile users. Android is not a loss leader.


So giving something away isn't loss leading? Google sinks real money into the engineering of Android.

By giving it away they obviously hope to recoup the lost potential sales through ecosystem and service revenue. They take loss leading to the extreme. The fact that you can't distinguish this only serves to underscore your naiveté in such matters.


Nelson thought I should congratulate Microsoft on being a loss... third place?


You're looking at this as some static thing and completely ignoring the very real possibility that they might become #2 and eventually #1 (Already #2 in some regions as my links have shown, and you have played down).

And that just about wraps up the quasi intelligent part of your comment. The really ridiculous part is that you think Samsung doesn't spend inordinate amounts of money it derives from being a vertically integrated conglomerate on Android -- and instead focus on Microsoft sinking a few billion (out of a marketcap of 200 billion)

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[10]: Doesn't matter
by japh on Mon 23rd Sep 2013 07:47 in reply to "RE[9]: Doesn't matter"
japh Member since:
2005-11-11

So giving something away isn't loss leading? Google sinks real money into the engineering of Android.


They are giving away Android, but they're obviously making money off of it. It's not a loss leader if Android generates the revenue in other way than direct payment for the OS. You can't say the same about Microsoft, which is a loss for Microsoft still.

By giving it away they obviously hope to recoup the lost potential sales through ecosystem and service revenue. They take loss leading to the extreme.


Exactly. Except it isn't a loss, unless you count Google Play as completely separated from Android, which is just silly.

The fact that you can't distinguish this only serves to underscore your naiveté in such matters.


And what does name calling underscore?


You're looking at this as some static thing and completely ignoring the very real possibility that they might become #2 and eventually #1 (Already #2 in some regions as my links have shown, and you have played down).


I'm looking at the current picture, yes. And you think that I should be more generous with praise for Microsoft based on the the current situation.

When they have a self-sustaining business, that didn't come from killing off their competitors with huge losses, then I'll reevaluate my position. Right now, I don't feel they accomplished much.
Don't get me wrong, Windows Phone is a decent offering, but like I wrote before - if you don't need to have a sustainable business, most companies would be able to pull that off. And Microsoft had a head start since they have a long history in smart phones. What they've done so far is not above what I would expect from anyone in the same situation.

The really ridiculous part is that you think Samsung doesn't spend inordinate amounts of money it derives from being a vertically integrated conglomerate on Android


Did I mention Samsung?

Reply Parent Score: 2