Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 3rd Dec 2013 19:04 UTC
Games

Absolutely fantastic article by Tracey Lien.

If the selection at the average retailer is anything to go by, girls don't play video games. If cultural stereotypes are anything to go by, video games are for males. They're the makers, the buyers and the players.

There is often truth to stereotypes. But whatever truth there may be, the stereotype does not show the long and complicated path taken to formulate it, spread it and have it come back to shape societal views.

The attitude towards women in video games is even worse when you take online multiplayer into consideration. One of my team mates in League of Legends is a woman, and I've seen some absolutely terrible things being thrown her way in chat - during and even after the game is over. I've also pretended to be female in League of Legends just to see what would happen, and it was just as bad. However, I could just shrug it off - hearing the things guys say while you're pretending to be a woman as an experiment is a hell of a lot different than hearing these things when you're actually a woman.

I even caught myself thinking 'my female team mate should just pretend to be a guy' - but you know what? That's expletive ridiculous. As Lien details in her article, changing the way video games are being marketed would be a very good first step that could most certainly snowball into the future.

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RE: Dear fellow males
by Novan_Leon on Wed 4th Dec 2013 02:34 UTC in reply to "Dear fellow males"
Novan_Leon
Member since:
2005-12-07

The lack of self awareness of many posters is tragically proving the point.

Perhaps us guys should let women speak and hear their point of view, before rushing to say what they should or should not feel/experience/behave/do?


Who says we haven't? This has been a common topic on the internet (and elsewhere) for ages. Personally, I find it more constructive for people to concentrate on things THEY can do to remedy the situation for THEMSELVES than go online and demand bad people stop being bad. Bad people will always exist, and anonymity will bring out the worst behavior in many. Nothing short of total censorship will change this, and even then you're only hiding the symptoms, not curing the illness.

Why should a woman who is called the C-word receive more attention and sympathy from a man who is called the same or worse? Evolutionary psychology would suggest that women are more sensitive to aggression (i.e. have thinner skin) than men. At the same time, men are far more protective of women who experience said aggression than of other men. There's a strong case to be made, based on the evidence, that PERCEIVED aggression against women may be significantly higher than ACTUAL aggression. Take that for what you will.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: Dear fellow males
by kwan_e on Wed 4th Dec 2013 02:41 in reply to "RE: Dear fellow males"
kwan_e Member since:
2007-02-18

Why should a woman who is called the C-word receive more attention and sympathy from a man who is called the same or worse? Evolutionary psychology would suggest that women are more sensitive to aggression (i.e. have thinner skin) than men. At the same time, men are far more protective of women who experience said aggression than of other men. There's a strong case to be made, based on the evidence, that PERCEIVED aggression against women may be significantly higher than ACTUAL aggression. Take that for what you will.


If the word "cunt" is REALLY the highest level of abuse you can imagine for female gamers online, then you really have no clue.

Threats of rape, and rapey-vibed comments happen quite frequently. Males rarely gets rape threats and those that do tends to get threats to female members of their family.

You can capitalized PERCEIVED all you want, but you are making the same stupid mistake by not actually facing up to the ACTUAL abuse that can happen.

The word "cunt" is just the beginning.

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[3]: Dear fellow males
by Novan_Leon on Wed 4th Dec 2013 02:56 in reply to "RE[2]: Dear fellow males"
Novan_Leon Member since:
2005-12-07

If the word "cunt" is REALLY the highest level of abuse you can imagine for female gamers online, then you really have no clue.

Threats of rape, and rapey-vibed comments happen quite frequently. Males rarely gets rape threats and those that do tends to get threats to female members of their family.

You can capitalized PERCEIVED all you want, but you are making the same stupid mistake by not actually facing up to the ACTUAL abuse that can happen.

The word "cunt" is just the beginning.


Are you kidding me? I've received rape threats hundreds of times online. I just used the C-word as an example.

ACTUAL abuse happening somewhere doesn't validate all threats of abuse everywhere.

I can see I've hit an emotional note with you, but don't lose your ability to reason as a result. Nobody is claiming actual abuse doesn't happen or even that all verbal abuse is avoidable or meaningless. I'm merely reciting the evidence as it stands, and the scope of the evidence is in generalities, not specifics.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: Dear fellow males
by tylerdurden on Wed 4th Dec 2013 06:13 in reply to "RE: Dear fellow males"
tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

I take basic reading and comprehension ain't your things. Different strokes, I guess.


It really is very simple: Those who are affected by the issue should be the ones expressing their point of view about it, while those who aren't should be the ones doing the listening. Some people seem to have a fantastically hard time grasping such a basic concept somehow...

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Dear fellow males
by leos on Wed 4th Dec 2013 20:33 in reply to "RE[2]: Dear fellow males"
leos Member since:
2005-09-21

I take basic reading and comprehension ain't your things. Different strokes, I guess.


It really is very simple: Those who are affected by the issue should be the ones expressing their point of view about it, while those who aren't should be the ones doing the listening. Some people seem to have a fantastically hard time grasping such a basic concept somehow...


You seem to think that hasn't happened. The issue is clear. There are lots of jerks and abusive idiots playing games, and a potentially disproportionate amount of abuse is faced by people with minority attributes in that group (female, race, sexual orientation, lack of skill, overweight, etc).

There is nothing to be gained by explaining for the 100th time that this is the case. What I have yet to see is an effective proposal to improve the situation. A generic appeal for everyone to be nice mmmkay is not going to to do it. So let's hear something realistic. The regular non-abusive gamer can do nothing to help this situation. This is not like real life where bystanders can step in to prevent abuse. It's really in the hands of game companies (strict family friendly servers) or enforcing real name policies so that abusers are easily traceable.

Edited 2013-12-04 20:35 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 4