Linked by Thom Holwerda on Mon 9th Dec 2013 22:43 UTC
Windows

Two changes supposedly coming to the next version of Windows, according to veteran Paul Thurrott:

Metro apps running in windows on the desktop. As you can today with third-party utilities such as ModernMix, the next version of Windows will let users optionally run Metro apps in floating windows on the desktop.

Start menu. After bringing back the Start button in Windows 8.1, Microsoft will take the next logical step in the next Windows version and make the Start menu available as an option. It's possible this will appear only on those product versions that support the desktop.

This would be Microsoft admitting they got Windows 8 all wrong.

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Laurence
Member since:
2007-03-26

I really don't want to tare your post apart because really I only came on here to talk about what I personally prefer from a UI. But your post is so full of hypocrisy that I really need to address those points first, in the hope that we can drop this stupid attitude.

First of all, you cannot use your own anecdotal evidence if you're going to bitch and moan at others for doing the same.

Secondly, you cannot argue that other people need to cite evidence while yourself making sweeping generalisations without any evidence.

Thirdly, you have no right to claim that I have a reading comprehension problem when you've constantly ignored my comments and at several points completely misunderstood what "anecdotal" and "experience" even means (for the record, listing off the aesthetic properties of the ribbon isn't anecdotal, it's literally just the same as your screenshot evidence but expressed verbally rather than pictorially)

And lastly, you have no right to come on here and spout superiority over unverified claims that you happen to work in IT. We all work in IT. This isn't the Dail Mail forums; this is a technology forum. So I bet 99% of us (myself included) have successful careers in IT. If you want us to be swayed by your arguments then you have at least bother to make a logical argument to begin with because we're all smart enough to spot when someone is bullshitting us. And by that I mean all of us; you, me, and everyone else commenting and lurking on OSN. So don't think I'm going to respect you just because you type that you work in IT for a big company.

Now to get back to the crux of my argument; my point was only ever about why I, personally, don't like the ribbon bar. Nothing you can say nor do will change that opinion because even I cannot control that opinion. I just like something or I don't. I may be able to substantiate why I don't like something, but that doesn't mean that my preference was a conscious decision. And this is why I mentioned about the dyslexia - it wasn't to pretend I have some kind of disability (in fact people who blame things on their dyslexia are people who really wind me up rotten). I merely offered up that as one possible explanation as to why I see white noise rather than signal (metaphorically speaking, of course) when glancing at the ribbon bar. So you'd do better by respecting my personal preferences just like you choose to respect your own preferences and those that fall into the mythical "95%" figure which I'll go into next. And just like I respect the fact that you like the ribbon bar (and I mean that sincerely!)

However your point about, and I quote, "95% of people find the one UI paradigm easier" DOES need citation. So either put up some hard numbers (as you like to call them) yourself or stop demanding that I have to evidence my own personal preferences. Or better yet, stop telling me I'm wrong because my preferences happen to differ from yours.

Anyway, I wish I never bothered to open dialogue with you because I've now wasted several hours of today when I should have writing a caching daemon for one of my webfarms. ;)

Edited 2013-12-11 00:47 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

lucas_maximus Member since:
2009-08-18

Christ almighty, your posting couldn't be more hypocritical and arrogant if you tried.


Your opinion. Opinions are like nipples everyone has at least a couple.

First of all, you cannot use your own anecdotal evidence if you're going to bitch and moan at others for doing the same.


I provided screenshots of Word. Those screenshots are a fact, not an opinion, they are screenshots of the actual application running with the UI presented "AS IS".

The logical grouping is self evident. If you choose to argue otherwise, I cannot convince a person that wishes to discount reality itself.

I dunno how a screenshot of an application running can be called "an opinion".

Secondly, you cannot arguing that other people need to cite evidence while yourself making sweeping generalisations without any evidence.


Didn't do that.

There is an image with logically grouped functionality, which I took from a running system with the applications that first implemented the Ribbon.

It is there in the image. I dunno how there can be an argument when there is a picture illustrating my point.

Each grouping is labelled clearly, each grouping has functionality that is described in the label. It is shown quite clearly with the screenshots I have provided.

Thirdly, you have no right to claim that I have a reading comprehension problem when you've constantly ignored my comments and at several points completely misunderstood what "anecdotal" and "experience" even means.


I do, because you have either ignored or misunderstood it. I have consistently said the same thing now for quite a number of replies in different way. I have now lost patience.

Why should I bother with yours?

As for word definitions:

Anecdotal - Based on personal experience.

Experience - comprises knowledge of or skill of some thing or some event gained through involvement in or exposure to that thing or event.

Sorry I understand these terms rather well.

And lastly, you have no right to come on here and spout your usual BS fanboyisms with superiority over unverified claims that you happen to work in IT. We all work in IT. This isn't the Dail Mail forums, this is a technology forum. So I bet 99% of us (myself included) have successful careers in IT. If you want us to be swayed by your arguments then you have at least bother to make a logical argument to begin with because we're all smart enough to spot when someone is bullshitting us. And by that I mean all of us; you, me, and everyone else commenting / lurking on OSN.


In the words of Tupac "I ain't even mad at ya".

I honestly don't care whether you agree or not at this point. It quite obvious you don't want to listen.

Again, I have provided screenshots, I have provided my reasoning. All I have heard from you is your personal opinion about me my apparent love for Microsoft (even though I own a quite a few Macintoshes, bought OpenBSD releases and extol the virtue of using Linux in the Amazon cloud for PHP, Python and Node web apps at work) and the Office
Ribbon.

In fact I am so fed up of it, I just taken a web cam pic of me with the actual media (I have many more releases, these were easily at hand):

http://i.imgur.com/xxJIT3g.jpg

I have even provided you with the situation in which I work so that you may understand my attitude better, yet still you are using terms like "who are you to say" and "christ almighty".

You have not presented anything that approaches a hypothesis, let alone data to support you claims.

I don't even know why you are getting so upset.

Now to get back to the crux of my argument; my point was only ever about why I, personally, don't like the ribbon bar. Nothing you can say nor do will change that opinion because even I cannot control that opinion. I just like something or I don't. I may be able to substantiate why I don't like something, but I cannot evidence it and nor can I change my preferences easily. So you'd do better by respecting my personal preferences just like you choose to respect your own preferences and those that fall into the mythical "95%" figure which I'll go into next.


And my point is unless there is hard data your opinion is pointless to the company that produces the application when their data for the majority of their users doesn't support it.

This it the reality. Don't get upset with me because I merely explain it.

However your point about, and I quote, "95% of people find the one UI paradigm easier" DOES need citation. So either put up some hard numbers (as you like to call them) yourself or stop demanding that I have to evidence my own personal preferences. Or better yet, stop telling me I'm wrong because my preferences happen to differ from yours.


Again it is a reading comprehension problem on you part. I said "If 95% of all the people that used this" I even backed it up with a browser statistic and my thinking behind it to illustrate the point further.

The number was picked to illustrate a point.

Not my fault you don't understand.

I am fed up with this now.

Edited 2013-12-11 01:21 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

Laurence Member since:
2007-03-26

Yeah, you're definitely over compensating now. I'd wager your "career" is failing and you're little more than an opinionated 1st line support officer who thinks the world owes him a break while simultaneously wasting most of your working life dossing on message boards telling everyone how important you are.

Most sane people respect others opinions - just like I have yours. But you need a serious chip on your shoulder to be carrying on the way you are just because I happen to dislike your precious ribbon bar. I mean seriously dude, grow the fuck up.

I expect you'll use your multiple fake accounts on here to down vote me - and I'm certain that's what you're doing because no sane person would have read through the numerous pages of our exchanges and not have lost the will to live before now. But honestly, I think this post deserves down voting anyway.

Reply Parent Score: 1