Linked by Rayiner Hashem on Tue 15th Nov 2005 17:44 UTC
Apple I recently bought one of the new dual core PowerMacs. Having used the machine for a couple of weeks, I thought I would share some of my observations and feelings about it. First, let me get my biases out in the open. I have, for about four years, very happily used Linux on my desktop. Doing so has made me very comfortable with the UNIX environment in general, and with GNOME specifically. During that time, I have used OS X machines on a regular basis, so I am quite comfortable in that environment as well. Since I switched to Linux, I have not used Windows for anything more than the occasional bit of software testing or lab work, and generally feel quite uncomfortable with it. Thus, this article is very much written from the perspective of someone who finds OS X and Linux pleasing on principle. I implore the reader to make his own value judgments based on my comments.
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japail
Member since:
2005-06-30

That your G5 can't make use of higher-performance memory doesn't make it any less value-added.

Out of curiosity do you know what ECC does? And do you think that all ECC memory of the same quality? Premium ECC memory is an entirely different market segment. Much as a luxury sedan is an entirely different market than a limousine.

And before I forget, I defined "generic" as "in as much as any random OEM will use them" which you miraculously managed to repeat in a reply to my comment, and you don't even disagree that these don't afford any of the value-added performance guarantees, nor that stick of memory is superior to the random PC OEM. Now all you have to do is stop pretending the only value added to memory certified to work in various configurations or with certain timings differs solely in the presence of a heat spreader and you're all the way there. If for some reason you think I bothered to put "generic" in quotes in order to suggest that "micron" and "samsung" are not names, then I'm impressed.

Edited 2005-11-16 17:47

Reply Parent Score: 1

Arun Member since:
2005-07-07

That your G5 can't make use of higher-performance memory doesn't make it any less value-added.

What is the value add?? The fancy heatspeader and the Corsair name??? What exactly is the value that the enthusiast DIMM is provding for the added $$$s?

Out of curiosity do you know what ECC does? And do you think that all ECC memory of the same quality? Premium ECC memory is an entirely different market segment. Much as a luxury sedan is an entirely different market than a limousine.

Yes I do. What is a premium ECC memory Brand? Corsair doesn't even make ECC memory and they only have buffered DDR1 DIMMs. I am curious what is "premium ECC memory"

And before I forget, I defined "generic" as "in as much as any random OEM will use them" which you miraculously managed to repeat in a reply to my comment, and you don't even disagree that these don't afford any of the value-added performance guarantees, nor that stick of memory is superior to the random PC OEM.

Your definition of generic is flawed at best. Let's see hartge mods premium cars for appearance. That is thier value add. Since there is a hartge BMW 6 series in the market, a value added BMW, carried by a few BMW dealers . Does it mean that BMW now is a generic brand of cars because every BMW dealer stocks the factory trim version and only a few carry the hartge one. Or extend that example to dinan for performance.

The BMW is still a premium car brand even if value-added brands that customize BMW exist. Get it.


Now all you have to do is stop pretending the only value added to memory certified to work in various configurations or with certain timings differs solely in the presence of a heat spreader and you're all the way there.

Please tell me what the technical difference is between a Corsair DIMM and a Samsung DIMM with the same memory chips. Why would you need a heat spreader on slower clocked DIMMS?

I wonder why Corsair's Valueselect line has no timing information or heatspreaders on them. Is the value select line from Corsair still considered premium memory according to you?

If for some reason you think I bothered to put "generic" in quotes in order to suggest that "micron" and "samsung" are not names, then I'm impressed.

If for some reason you think I bothered to put "generic" in quotes in order to suggest that "micron" and "samsung" are not names, then I'm impressed.

What? You lost me.

BTW you were claiming crucial was a premium brand, till I told you that crucial sells the same OEM micron sticks and adds a crucial label. Wonder why?

Edited 2005-11-16 19:00

Reply Parent Score: 1

japail Member since:
2005-06-30

> What is the value add?? The fancy heatspeader and the
> Corsair name???

Tested memory that is certified for aggressive timings, bandwidth, dual-channel configurations, and the quality of the circuitry of the modules. These are the highest-quality are resilient batches of memory supplied with guarantees of performance. And this isn't just a matter of Corsair, it's a matter of premium memory. Which doesn't exist for you, outside of the uniform-quality ECC DIMMs that you don't mind replacing just as long as they detect they're pieces of crap before they go.

> Yes I do. What is a premium ECC memory Brand? Corsair
> doesn't even make ECC memory and they only have
> buffered DDR1 DIMMs. I am curious what is "premium
> ECC memory"

OCZ does provide ECC memory, so does Mushkin.
If you understand how ECC memory works you know that ECC memory quality is as variable as any other DRAM, and that the error correction is only useful for correcting one-bit errors and does nothing to ensure the quality of the memory. Premium ECC memory will be from the better bins, have quality circuitry, and all of the niceties associate with selectiveness.

> Your definition of generic is flawed at best.

My definition of generic applied directly to what I said. Though your continued allusion to BMWs (now I'm certain you're an Apple zealot, btw) is certainly comparable to the DRAM industry.

> Please tell me what the technical difference is
> between a Corsair DIMM and a Samsung DIMM with the
> same memory chips. Why would you need a heat spreader
> on slower clocked DIMMS?

What do you mean the same memory chips? Do you mean identical memory chips put through no different sorting with no different circuitry? What would be the difference in that? Hey, what's the difference between 3.6GHz and a 3.4GHz Xeon? Did you ever get around to that whole GPU discussion?

> I wonder why Corsair's Valueselect line has no timing
> information or heatspreaders on them. Is the value
> select line from Corsair still considered premium
> memory according to you?

No. Why would it? Don't tell me, despite that I told you that these brands have value models hours ago, you've just now discovered them. To think, you only need to Google everything someone says to construct a half-assed response.


> BTW you were claiming crucial was a premium brand,
> till I told you that crucial sells the same OEM
> micron sticks and adds a crucial label. Wonder why?

And I quote me:

"Samsung is a company, not a model of memory. They provide a large variety of modules, but they are not a premium performance brand. Mushkin, OCZ, and Corsair are premium brands (though they have 'value' models). Crucial isn't a premiun brand either, so it's not a big improvement."

"Crucial for example is Micron memory with a different brand name to set it apart as "quality." Keep in mind that there are only a few DDR/DDR2 manufacturers in world. In picking Hynix, Samsung, or Micron branded memory you're picking from the ass-end of the spectrum."

Hey, maybe you can repeat me some more and lie about what I've said. Quality, that.

You can pick your designation from (1) illiterate (2) stupid (3) troll that's wasted my time.

Edited 2005-11-16 19:18

Reply Parent Score: 1