The GNOME project has released GNOME 2.24 today. In case you’re new here: “GNOME 2.24 is the latest version of the GNOME Desktop: a popular, multi-platform desktop environment for your computer. GNOME’s focus is ease of use, stability, and first class internationalisation and accessibility support. GNOME is Free and Open Source Software and provides all of the common tools computer users expect of a modern computing environment, such as e-mail, groupware, web browsing, file management, multimedia and games. Furthermore, GNOME provides a flexible and powerful platform for software developers, both on the desktop and in mobile applications.” GNOME 2.24 comes packed with changes.
One feature down, 3945349878345 to go until Nautilus equals Konqueror.
This is what bothers me. I personally like Nautilus a whole lot more than Konqueror. Konq feels pretty heavy and bloated compared to Nautilus, and Nautilus is a file browser/manager, it doesn’t even try to do anything else. Konq tries to be a do-all-be-all which approach just isn’t suitable for everyone.
As for the other new stuff in 2.24..Well, I’ve tried Empathy. In my opinion Pidgin works a lot better as a multi-protocol messenger. And as a MSN Messenger replacement it does a pretty poor job compared to any of the dedicated alternatives, most notably my favorite of Emesene. Ekiga is equally useless to me (note the word “me”, it is probably useful to many others) since I don’t know a single person who does use such services.
So, unfortunately this release hold little value to me. And KDE4 takes a lot of strides forward and seems just a tad more interesting every day. I just happen to like the look and feel of GNOME so much that it’d be hard to switch.
I have only just recently managed to get KDE 4 running in a stable and useable way. I installed Kubuntu 8.04.1 for KDE4, then I added the Ubuntu Hardy kubuntu-kde4-members ppa repositories, and upgraded the system to KDE 4.1.1. I installed the new lancelot menu (which is quite reminiscent of Mint Menu), ditched the kickoff menu, installed the glassified theme, and installed the gtk-qt and qt-curve libraries that give a decent common style between gtk applications and qt (KDE) ones.
It is getting there. KDE 4.1.1 still doesn’t allow different folder views on different desktops, which would unleash the real potential of folderviews (this will have to wait for KDE 4.2 apparently), but I can at least use it now whereas it was lacking before now. Amarok 2 beta is working OK … although to get .mp3 support enabled I first had to install Amarok 1.4.something, enable the .mp3 support, then install Amarok 2 beta, then uninstall Amarok 1.4.something. There is no KOffice 2 available yet. K3B is still the version from KDE 3.5.9. Printer configuration support is still weak (for some things I had to use the browser web interface via localhost:631 to configure some elements of CUPs). I had to run a little bash script I found online somewhere in order to get flash player 10 working with firefox (since I am running the 64-bit X86-64 version).
SMplayer is great though … far better than the Dragon player that is installed with KDE4 by default.
The point in all this is though that gtk applications work just fine, and with a bit of tweaking using the Qtcurve style and Glassified theme I can get them looking just the same as the qt applications. Even firefox 3, thunderbird and OpenOffice 2.4 are fairly nicely integrated into this desktop now.
BTW, Dolphin is the equivalent of Nautilis on KDE4 desktop, rather than Konqueror.
With a bit of tweaking, IMO it is possible to switch over. KDE 4 has all the promise going forward, IMO, compared with Gnome, and there is siginificantly less chance that you will end up with the mono libraries or other Microsoft dependencies (such as Moonlight) surreptitiously installed on your system.
I’ve always wondered how come each Virtual Desktop doesn’t show a different kicker filled view for those apps/views specific to each virtual desktop environment. I could have 25 windows open with 4 virtual desktops but what I get are tiny little minimized references with that many application views open.
It’s not a problem when you have 5 icons representing apps/views in today’s kicker or yesterday’s kicker, but when you’ve got multiple virtual desktops with specific app/views assigned to a specific virtual desktop, how is it we have to put up with a cluttered kicker?
I’d rather click on the virtual view and then load the view minimized specifically for that space than to just click amongst 25 icons to get to the right one. I’m comfortable wasting an additional movement/click combination.
While we’re at it, what is up with the KWin effect that attempts to duplicate Expose and not keeping this behavior virtual desktop specific?
I mean, if I’m in Virtual Desktop 2(VD 2) and move to my active corner with the mouse or keyboard combination, I only want to see the cluttered views of that VD [in this case, VD 2] and no other.
But the most annoying behavior of all is the spurious mouse flying up to the active corner and giving me the Expose effect as if a ghost is running my X11 Environment. I realize that there is some serious work going into mouse geometry and curve paths in the upcoming 7.5, but it’s damn annoying that I can assign the KWin Expose corner to any corner and once assigned the random ghost to the corner goes straight to that active hot spot.
Was that really needed?
Does it even need feature parity with Konqueror? AFAIK even KDE has moved to a “simpler” file manager (Dolphin) by default (have no idea where that lies in the comparison…).
From an editorial standpoint, it was certainly poor form. Even as a regular comment, it would be of questionable value. Then again, OSNews gets lots of posts of questionable value, and we’re used to it. But putting such a comment in the story blurb was just plain tacky.
Stop taking software so seriously. It was just an innocent joke.
Up. Lighten. You figure it out.
I wasn’t commenting on software. I was commenting on proper editorial form.
Stop taking software so seriously. It was just an innocent joke.
Up. Lighten. You figure it out.
Being an editor on a very popular news site and having done that for a long time you should know already that such a “joke” can be seen as pretty offensive. Open source community is place where feelings and opinions are usually strong (that’s the motivation for doing anything, really) so such a stab against a major part of a major DE will draw attention even if it was intended as a joke. It could have atleast been made clearer that it was a joke and not a questional comment about Nautilus’s current functionality.
Being an editor on a very popular news site and having done that for a long time you should know already that such a “joke” can be seen as pretty offensive. Open source community is place where feelings and opinions are usually strong (that’s the motivation for doing anything, really) so such a stab against a major part of a major DE will draw attention even if it was intended as a joke.
Without trying to be a troll, I want to point out that if this is how you feel, then you are acting like a child. What you’re describing — a passionate dedication to a particular DE — is the definition of zealotry. It’s not healthy, even if it helps motivate developers to work harder. Zealotry blinds you from seeing the positives of alternatives, even when they’re poking you in the forehead. Even those hard-working programmers who are dedicated to their project are being unhealthy, as they may be failing to take into account the user’s needs, while they instead assume that their own ideals are the best. I’m not saying taking pride in your work is a bad idea, but it’s important not to try and declare that your work in fallible and immune to jokes.
Secondly, who are you to declare that no one else is allowed to negatively comment on Nautilus, joke or not? He/she is an editor; hence, it’s his/her JOB to be critical in his/her reviews. If every review we ever saw about every product was always hearts and rainbows, then there wouldn’t be any suggestions for improvement. No software is perfect, there is always something negative (yet constructive) to say.
All that said, the underlying point still holds: it was a joke! Even without the newly-added “WARNING JOKE WARNING” tags, it was clearly a joke. Even if you claim that zealotry isn’t clouding your judgment, surely you can admit that your sense of humor has been pulled pretty tight.
Edited 2008-09-25 00:54 UTC
What you’re describing — a passionate dedication to a particular DE — is the definition of zealotry
Having passionate and strong feelings about something is not zealotry. Those feelings could be either negative or positive, and they are just feelings about a subject. A person is a zealot when they consider every other opinion wrong, but that has nothing to do with this.
Secondly, who are you to declare that no one else is allowed to negatively comment on Nautilus, joke or not? He/she is an editor; hence, it’s his/her JOB to be critical in his/her reviews. If every review we ever saw about every product was always hearts and rainbows, then there wouldn’t be any suggestions for improvement. No software is perfect, there is always something negative (yet constructive) to say.
Did I say he can’t write negatively about Nautilus? No, I didn’t. I said he should have expected the feedback he got. It was very easy to guess the reaction of people for a poor AND recycled joke. And secondly, it’s not even a review. It is just a news item that lists what’s new in GNOME 2.24.
All that said, the underlying point still holds: it was a joke! Even without the newly-added “WARNING JOKE WARNING” tags, it was clearly a joke. Even if you claim that zealotry isn’t clouding your judgment, surely you can admit that your sense of humor has been pulled pretty tight.
If you’ve ever been reading my comments you’d know that I am not a zealot. I defend things when they deserve it, and I do critisize things also, including (but not limited to) GNOME, KDE, Linux, Windows etc.
And no, it was not “clearly a joke”. Judging from the other comments here I am not the only one who didn’t understand it was meant as a joke.
NEED MOAR SMILEYS
I will be honest and admit I did not realise it was an attempt at humour.
How much more obvious does it need be?
uhm… you do realise the bold bits were added later as appeasement?
Edited 2008-09-25 04:47 UTC
If a joke needs explaining or cap n’ bold joke alert, it may be better just not tell it…
We’re not taking software seriously, we’re taking the use and abuse of the written language and the editorial form seriously. I imagine you would have gotten the same comments had you been writing about a poetry anthology or a lawnmower.
It was also an old joke that you’ve used before. Last time to you used it people called you on it as well and questioned its use. Perhaps you should reconsider.
C’mon, if you have to work that hard to justify leaving such a statement in an article, you’ve got an agenda or an axe to grind. The thought process would resemble, “Okay, Konqueror really twists my happy knobs and I vastly prefer KDE over Gnome, but if I throw this in there even as an editorial aside, my bias will be evident and I’ll lose the credibility issue… I know! I’ll bracket it in an obvious bold JOKE warning! That way, I get to state my bias, and anyone who “doesn’t get it” will be called out as a humorless idiot!”
It should have been left out, or owned up to as bias. As is, it’s a passive-aggressive coward’s move.
Edited 2008-09-25 13:05 UTC
This site is getting ridiculous, can people not read a comment without commenting on the appropriateness of the comment? I have to wade through a whole pile of crap to find something interesting. Now I’m adding to the crap, by commenting myself on the commenting on the appropriateness of the comments…
Lighten up indeed.
Luckily, your crap is of a superior grade. Oddly, you’re reinforcing the original point, wherein the commenting parties were asking the original poster to stay on the matter at hand, or at least make the effort to make the sly aside a complete ownership of the editor’s bias. You want people to only comment in a way that reinforces the thrust of the original article. So do I, and so, it seems, do several others.
Let me put it this way: if the original poster could have mustered the strength to fight the compulsion to insert a Teflon (read: humor)-coated dig in the text of the article, none of this would be posted. Crap averted, lightening up unneeded.
But I digress.
You have missed the point. There are about 11 posts related to the in-appropriateness of the comment (not including yours and mine). The original comment was at least related in some way to the news on this site, whether or not it was biased is irrelevant. The viewpoints on editorial form are not and should take place elsewhere. This happens quite a bit, someone posts something and some people can’t wait to jump on them and say “oh its inappropriate for you to say that” blah blah blah. And yes everyone is free to discuss what they like and I can ignore those threads but do people not come here to discuss OS news? Obviously not everyone.
“Does it even need feature parity with Konqueror? AFAIK even KDE has moved to a “simpler” file manager (Dolphin) by default”
This ironic turn of events (KDE switching to Dolphin while Nautilus continues to improve) is one of the reasons I moved away from KDE. Gnome is on my machine. KDE4 is not. KDE3 remains however and will stay there until it is no longer in Debian Stable (or Testing if I get antsy). I for one am glad to see Nautilus improve. It’s still far from being any sort of mess.
That sucks. I’ve been anxiously awaiting the new Webkit-based version of the browser. Looks like I’m gonna be waiting more.
Epiphany 2.24 is pretty much the same as 2.22. All the effort is going into the WebKit branch, which is coming along nicely, but not quite ready. I’m running from trunk, which is considerably further along than the epiphany-webkit in 2.24. Webkit will be the only supported backend in 2.26, and will likely give you the browsing experience you are looking for. 🙂
Actually you can add that yourself. If you are going to be running Ubuntu 8.10 you can just type in sudo apt-get install epiphany-webkit. Make sure you have webkit at the end if not you will get the gecko version. Not sure about other distros but they should also have it in their repos.
Be advised, however, that as I mentioned in a previous post, compiling the latest Webkit and Epiphany, which is really not very hard, will get you an epiphany-webkit which is much closer to being ready than you will find even in Gnome 2.24, which the coming distros are using. Little things like “find in page”, “text resize”, and “print” are working in trunk. And the “find in page” facility does “highlight all” which Epiphany-Gecko does not do.
Its going to be good times for the Linux Desktop with Linux 2.6.27(Pending) + X.Org 7.5 + Gnome 2.24 + OpenOffice 3.0(Pending) + FireFox 3.1(Pending) the 8.10 Distributions are going to be awesome. The 8.04 Distributions brought stability to so many needed features, but this is like seeing a race in slow motion everything is just going to hit at the same point.
I think other than smaller projects like nouveau and gnash. I cannot see how this setup could be improved. This has got to bring a lot of interest into the FOSS world.
Well… except for all the people with permanently ruined motherboards and laptops.
Edited 2008-09-24 22:45 UTC
Well… except for all the people with permanently ruined motherboards and laptops.
Not a single distro will ship with a kernel that hasn’t been fixed, you know that
And at the moment it’s just _some_ of the early-adopters/tinkererers that have suffered from the bug, and the bug has already been plugged. So, as unfortunate as it is for those who have gotten their NIC broken, the kernel will be all good and well when it’s released.
lol your poor luck with hardware continues God must hate you, if only your cutting edge computing extended to X then perhaps you would have been enjoying OpenArena at better framerates. Although I have to say this mesa 7.2 seems to boosted my fps by 20% I’m getting 50+ at 1600×1200 when I get the STABLE linux release I will probably get a big boost from GEM. mind you I will probably just upgrade my motherboard after that tp x4500HD one of the advantages of not having to pay exorbitant amount of cash for an OS I can upgrade
without any activation/cracking nonsense.
I dodged this thunderbolt, even though I *am* running a 2.6.27-rc:
“””
Ethernet controller: Realtek Semiconductor Co., Ltd. RTL8111/8168B PCI Express Gigabit Ethernet controller (rev 02)
“””
just as I did when Mandrake was destroying CD-RW drives right and left a while back.
As you know, Cyclops, my superior X4500 chipset outperforms your puny X3500 by about 70%. And don’t look to GEM to save you. I’ve seen mixed benchmarks on that. Keith says its faster than classic. Others say its slower.
You’re still running CRT at 4:3? (Ugh! Yuck! Bleah!)
Get a 16:10 flat panel first.
Edited 2008-09-24 23:39 UTC
Ah-hem, slightly biased intro: One feature down, 3945349878345 to go until Nautilus equals Konqueror.
Not all of us like a file manager which is similar to a Swiss army knife. Keep it simple and less bloated is better.
Edited 2008-09-24 22:55 UTC
yeah, turn it back into something like Dolphin.
</joke>
Updated the article with an elegant and subtle joke alert. Intarwebs, be happy.
nice.
Loveley.
It wasn’t the fact that you made a joke or ‘insulted’ nautilus that was the problem. It was that it was an unfunny, recycled joke that just didn’t work or belong. Your new correct doesn’t fix the root problem, which is that you needed a better joke.
It may have conservative changes, but you know what? I like it that way, I stopped playing with my computer and start looking for stability and reliability, if you like a highter level of configuration then you can use KDE, but I don’t feel atracted to it.
So, is nice to have a new version of GNOME again, more stable and with those litle changes that are not noted but make you more productive.
Thank you to GNOME developers for your hard work, And Im specially aiming to try Ekiga.
Edited 2008-09-24 23:43 UTC
Buckling down and fixing bugs is very good, but there’s something to be said for innovation. If Gnome stops innovating, it will fall behind, because no one else will.
I’m not sure Gnome has stopped innovating, but they seem to be innovating in smaller incremental steps. While no release is probably ever going to be as dramatic as KDE4, each release should bring some minor innovative change which over time will add up to something significant.
As a user I certainly appreciate this approach. As much as I’m in awe of KDE4 and what they’re trying to achieve from a technology standpoint, it’s so far only produced a desktop environment which I personally cannot use. I still think they can pull off something cool and useful over time with the technology they’ve built, but I’ll be using GNOME until they do.
Why is Gnome still on version 2 anyway? Considering it’s been around for approximately the same length of time as KDE.
Yeah, what’s up with that, anyway? I mean, Linux itself is all the way up to version 2.6!
Oh, wait…
Every KDE major release has been accompanied by a toolkit change, as has Gnome.
I wasn’t necessarily comparing Gnome to KDE, but to all the UIs out there. I’m not saying I think Gnome needs to innovate with every release, just that they must never stop altogether.
It seams that this release contains very few notable changes from 2.22. However, if this means that the developers have spent time fixing bugs and improving the quality of the system, this could actually be a good thing.
The plan for 2.26 looks exciting though. They are planning to improve IMAP support. I really hope this means that we get a Evolution that handles the Trash folder as a standard serverside IMAP folder, rather than as a virtual folder like today. Using virtual folders makes for such things makes it hard to switch back and fourth between evolution and web based mail clients. Not to mention that it increase the cost of accessing IMAP mailboxes from cell phones.
If they fixt this, that would be something to look forward to.
Aside from not having userfriendly enough GUI for some parts(adding accounts), what’s wrong with Pidgin?
The GUI-problems could easily be improved anyway. What makes this Empathy better…?
It’s nothing wrong with Pidgin, but Empathy is a frontend for new powerful framework “Telepathy”.
It’s something really spectacular IMHO, I’m surprised that it got so little attention.
Check it out
http://telepathy.freedesktop.org/wiki/
TLZ wondered…
See here:
http://developer.pidgin.im/ticket/34
Now look back at the features quoted by Empathy:
http://live.gnome.org/Empathy
Notice the words “Voice and Video call using SIP and Jingle“?
My guess is that the GNOME developers are planning to take advantage of Telepathy to ensure all supporting protocols will have webcam support. Since the Pidgin guys are not just resistent but seem to be actively hostile to any changes the Gnome developers went with a different solution to the problem of webcam support for IM.
I think this will be a good thing!
–bornagainpenguin
Yet another GNOME release coming without a comprehensive tool for not just monitoring the network or printer status or “listing” installed system components and peripherals, but also updating and configuring core device drivers without recurring to the CLI…
any pc user WILL sooner or later install some HW device other than a new printer, and for a project like GNOME to ovelook this is something behind understanding – especially since a project to create such a tool actually exists (gnome-device-manager, forked from the one in the HAL tree by one ubuntu developer) but hasnt been neither picked nor merged upstream, so left to bitrot without any contribution in one year
Edited 2008-09-25 15:00 UTC
Anyone know when Gnome 2.24 will make it into Debian Sid?
I can’t wait to check this out. Gnome for me has always seemed more lean than KDE. I like their philosophy.
KDE 4.1.1 is very nice, too. It just doesn’t seem as stable as Gnome, for me at least.
Great job Gnomers
According to the (now archived) RoadMap for 2.24
http://live.gnome.org/RoadMap/Archive
“Evolution;
Windows Support for Evolution.”
Where? Does this mean that there is an official port of Evolution for Windows? As much as this is sacrilege, I cannot stand the pile of poo that is Outlook, and Thunderbird doesn’t have the unified calendar / tasks / notes that Evolution does.
I’ve looked around, but all I could find so far is Evolution 2.22 which I’ve tried and is still rather buggy.