SCO could get an injunction that would prevent Utah neighbor Novell from shipping Linux, but it won’t try to derail the planned Novell-SUSE merger–at least not legally, an SCO spokesman confirmed. Elsewhere, Ransom Love shared his Linux views in a discussion with CNET News.com.
SCO Says It Will Go After Novell-SuSE
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
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Novell is privy to the AT&T/BSDi agreement, and yet they believe that Linux and the BSDs are safe. Every day it becomes clearer that SCO’s scheme was either to get bought out quickly, or to raise stock prices high enough to make the execs (and lawyers) rich, at the expense of the company itself.
That’s the sound of SCO’s fundage spilling down the drain of one-too-many lawsuits.
This is all just PR to keep their stock a float. They have only filed one lawsuit, the rest are all hollow threats.
It is just a continued attempt to slow the advancement of Linux until Longhorn goes GOLD.
Wow. Whether that is true or not (and it could be), that is none-the-less and interresting take.
I am so sick of this ______ (fill in own bad explative)
As we sit and hear the sound of thousands of geeks not being surprised.
Yeah, lets support the SCO (a company that does nothing).
“I’m almost certain that Novell has existing rights for using Unix products, so they may very well be indemnified. When they sold Unix to SCO, they kept a lot of stuff themselves.”
I hope he’s right about this.
I am sick of hearing every week that SCO is targeting new companies…
Can’t they just sue every person on the world who has ever used a computer so we’ll get finished with this???
And these are only allegations too…no real lawsuits (except a couple few…)…
I had read that as “SCO says it will go, after Novell-SuSE.” ’bout frickin time, I thought.
This is wonderful. Then finally, Xenix will make it to the desktop, as SCO and Microsoft have been planning this all along.
The title says SCO will go after SuSE-Novell, article says it will not. Hm..??
“When the Novell-SUSE deal is complete, we will take measures to enforce the non-compete agreement with Novell,” a SCO spokesman wrote to CRN”
Probably refers to this statement.
SGI already admitted they illegally contributed code, and has tried to retract it! But go ahead, stick your head back into the sand.
Is that really you, top speed?! OMG, his back
Who will SCO sue next week ? Anyone ?
I remember that SGI admitted they did an oopsie but I don’t remember if it was significantly important or not.
Have any link backing your point?
?????
Just hanging out on OSNEWS which is a great site for news articles. Too bad most of the commentary is worthless, but so is slashdot and zdnet too.
Wrawrat: You are aware that you’re responding to the #1 troll ever has faced the surface of OSnews ?
You must listen to the fanatics too much…
http://www.smh.com.au/articles/2003/10/03/1064988375879.html?from=s…
“SGI vice-president of software, Rich Altmaier, said: “We quickly and carefully re-reviewed our contributions to open source, and found brief fragments of code matching System V code in three generic routines, all within the I/O infrastructure support for SGI’s platform. The three code fragments had been inadvertently included…”
i don’t think anyone’s head is in the sand. SCO’s behavior is not that of a company that seeks to remedy a wrong doing.
Their behavior, statements, lawsuits, etc. are all about discrediting or killing open source. Want evidence, look at all the flag waving, the comments, the threats; they will sue anything and try anything. They are pretty much trying to show that open source is some heinous illegal form of….. god no…communism. its sad. those tactics might work for fox news on the mass of american but i don’t think it will fly in the tech world.
I just gave evidence of Silicon Graphics vice president admitting illegal code exists in the predominant version of Linux right now. So if you ignore that while pretending SCO has no legal claims then yes, your head is firmly planted in the sand.
those tactics might work for fox news on the mass of american but i don’t think it will fly in the tech world…
<p>
Sorry but many in high levels of the tech world are against Linux, not just those watching foxnews. I’d say these recent compromises of their root serves such as Debian and GNU should be of great concern to anyone in tech right now.
You’re a troll but, he admitted that code from SyS V was was there but, it still needs to be proved that it was there illegally. There are numerous parts of Sys V that could potentially be used legally.
He made no statements about legality.
“I just gave evidence of Silicon Graphics vice president admitting illegal code exists in the predominant version of Linux right now. So if you ignore that while pretending SCO has no legal claims then yes, your head is firmly planted in the sand.”
True enough, those statements were made. The problem with this whole scenario is that it is a fix-it ticket. SCO still refuses to let people who can correct the problem, if it exists, to see what the problem is. SCO may have a legal claim, one that only effects kernel 2.4 and later as they have stated themselves. Therefore it is a NEW problem, not one that has been existing for years. Since the 2.6 kernel is still in testing, when it is released, will that one have “infringing” code in it? If SCO was doing the legal thing then it would not for sure, as they would have had to disclose the code so it can be changed. Whether SCO has a case or not, they have discredited themselves by refusing to show the problem. It is like the user who calls the helpdesk and says “My PC is broke…fix it!”, with no other details.
This is the same as getting a ticket for having a broken tail light. You have so much time to get it fixed, and then prove it is fixed. Once fixed and proven there is no fine or record and everyone goes about their business.
Not sure what these Dungeons and Dragons names like “troll” have to do with it, but I’m a realist. Something the Linux crowd doesn’t like to deal with, because it disturbs their fantasy world where Linux is the best overall O/S.
It’s not. It’s a clone of Unix, of which several versions exist that are superior to Linux. On the desktop, Apple is a superior *nix solution, albeit more expensive.
The only thing Linux offers is that it is free, but even that is a lie. So one does get tired of listening to these constant chants of how superior Linux is, when in reality it is one of the most backward O/S available.
That is the bottom line, deal with it however you like.
Has SCO sued SGI?
Considering their propensity for legal action, one would presume they would initate a law suit against SGI if they had a winning case, correct?
Hell, have they even yanked their license yet? I know they said they were going to if they didn’t do something by October, but I don’t think they’ve actually revoked the license… Anyway, if SCO HAS revoked the license, then, REALISTICALLY, SCO should have a clearcut case, yes? Have they sued them yet?
No I don’t believe SCO has sued SGI, but I believe it is out of mere pity. Dont forget, SGI is still primarily a Unix vendor, and has lost most of their Hollywood studio business to Linux, and most importantly unlike IBM does not have the ability to restitute damages suffered by SCO.
Which is by the way another issue with open source, the fact that all these companies squeaking by on their profit line could not afford to restitute full damages for code misappropriation. SGI, Novell, even IBM has laid off engineers twice the last couple of months. The open source business model has shown few if any winners starting with the VA-Linux disaster of a few years ago. It’s time more people starting realizing these facts and disputing some of the Linux hype.
Imagine Michael Schummacher, driving for Ferrarri, and winning 85+ percent of the races. A couple of other companies, like BMW and Porsce, and they are winning about 5 percent of the professional races each.
Then there is this garage downtown, where all these guys work on each other’s cars, borrowing parts and throwing together whatever they can get to run on Sunday.
That is the difference between Linux and professional software, there is just not the investment in R&D or hiring of the most competent to assist with open source software. Of course some posters will now come along and say the guys with the garage downtown could beat Michael Schummacher.
You must listen to the fanatics too much…
No, it’s just that I actually go outside and enjoy the Sun sometimes…
That said, you shouldn’t cut the quote right in the middle next time… The rest can be quite interesting:
“…and, in fact, were redundant from the start.
“We found better replacements providing the same functionality already available in the Linux kernel. All together, these three small code fragments comprised no more than 200 lines out of the more than one million lines of our overall contributions to Linux.”
He didn’t said if they had removed the lines but I suppose they did or SCO would already had revoked their licence. However, such lines don’t taint the kernel forever. BSD was developed directly from UNIX code and we consider it as untainted.
Perhaps there’s some lines in Linux that is from SysV but they’re removeable. Personally, I don’t think SCO should be allowed to claim 600$ per seat if there’s only 200 or 300 lines of their code in the kernel although they should definitely be allowed to sue who putted them there. If they really want to claim that, they should be audited to know if their code is tainted or not as we already know that this code already encountered some legal issues in 1993.
I’m not saying that SCO is entirely wrong, but they don’t seem to have a case right now. They don’t actively defend their claims by showing concrete proofs, they just seem to spread FUD. It’s hard to take them seriously.
When a question was raised by the community earlier in the summer about the ate_utils.c routine, we took immediate action to address it. We quickly and carefully re-reviewed our contributions to open source, and found brief fragments of code matching System V code in three generic routines (ate_utils.c, the atoi function and systeminfo.h header file), all within the I/O infrastructure support for SGI’s platform. The three code fragments had been inadvertently included and in fact were redundant from the start. We found better replacements providing the same functionality already available in the Linux kernel. All together, these three small code fragments comprised no more than 200 lines out of the more than one million lines of our overall contributions to Linux. Notably, it appears that most or all of the System V code fragments we found had previously been placed in the public domain, meaning it is very doubtful that the SCO Group has any proprietary claim to these code fragments in any case.
As a precaution, we promptly removed the code fragments from SGI’s Linux website and distributed customer patches, and released patches to the 2.4 and 2.5 kernels on June 30 and July 3 to replace these routines and make other fixes to the SGI infrastructure code that were already in progress at SGI. Our changes showed up in the 2.5 kernel within a few weeks of our submission, and the 2.4 changes were available in the production version of the 2.4 kernel as of August 25 when the 2.4.22 kernel was released. Thus, the code in question has been completely removed.
Now go home.
>>already admitted they illegally contributed code, and has tried to retract it! But go ahead, stick your head back into the sand.<<
Wrong. SGI never admitted to any wrong doing. SGI removed the code that scox was complaining about because the code sucked anyway.
>>Who will SCO sue next week ? Anyone ?<<
The only company scox is actually suing is IBM. Scox has threatend to sue many other, including: Linux Torvald, SGI, RedHat, and all linux end-users who don’t pay the extortion money.
Scox has also threatend to stop ibm from selling aix, and to audit all aix users. Scox has also threatend to stop sgi from selling irix.
he is funny as hell, and he reminds me of a Gandalf line from the books, what is it….
“you missed your calling and should have been a jester and earned your strips imitating your betters.”
i like him!
SGI already admitted they illegally contributed code, and has tried to retract it!
Actually, SGI has denied any wrongdoing, and it seems that SCO has pretty much dropped that “lead.”
I was referring to the XFS question, of course. True, there was a snippet of code that was indeed similar to SysV code, but as far as I know this was promptly removed and not part of production kernels.
Not sure what these Dungeons and Dragons names like “troll” have to do with it,
Come on, I’ve told you before it has nothing to do with the mythical creature known as a Troll (which predates D&D by oh, about 1300 years?), but in fact refers to the fishing term “trolling”, i.e. fishing by drawing a baited line through the water.
A troll is someone like you who comes in a discussion group and makes inflammatory (and usually misleading or false) statements in hope of eliciting a response. So, indeed, you are a troll.
but I’m a realist.
Seeing as how you still believe SCO has a chance, then I’d say you are definitely not a realist.
It’s not. It’s a clone of Unix,
No it’s not. It’s a Unix-like OS. Big difference.
On the desktop, Apple is a superior *nix solution, albeit more expensive.
Whether or not OS X is superior to Linux on the desktop is debatable. However, OS is a Unix system, in this case a “genetic” Unix through BSD – but it is not a “trademark” Unix like AIX or Solaris.
Linux is neither a genetic or trademark Unix. Linux is not Unix.
The only thing Linux offers is that it is free, but even that is a lie.
The only lies here are coming from you.
So one does get tired of listening to these constant chants of how superior Linux is
If you’re so tired, why do you keep coming back? No one here takes you seriously, and you have been proved wrong so many times the novelty has completely worn off.
I also notice you only post on SCO stories, which makes me believe you probably have a personal interest in SCO (stock, perhaps?)
when in reality it is one of the most backward O/S available.
No, that would be SCO’s Unixware.
I honestly get tired of the trolls that roam these boards. I almost think that some of the articles are posted in ways to attract people like this. Notice how top speed managed to drag in more posts than news that was far more interesting? I mean and even the title of the news is contradictory to some of the closing arguments in the article. So why was that title chosen?
We all know SCO is a pump and dump stock operation, they pointing fingers at multiple companies. Their stock price is going up. And they have a small group of faithful who like to cause trouble, either that or they jerk off while watching people flame up against their comments. It sure produces hits though.
All I know is that for those who read the article you are sure puzzled as to the news post title here.
For all of those who haven’t figured this site out. There’s how it works in plain english. Too bad you’ll have to read it from the moderated pile.
Whether or not OS X is superior to Linux on the desktop is debatable
!!
Otherwise excellent and succint reply
SCO, please sue a European company too. We’d love to see you here in court.
In Europe, we don’t file silly lawsuits, and especially we don’t file lawsuits when we don’t want to show prove. Even in the States, I think the law says: “Innocent until you prove differently”.
So, SCO, put up or show up. Like the German goverment told you to do when you tried to go after SuSE in Germany.
It’s off course: put up or shut up.
Now with all those threats to Linux and BSD, I get a little afraid that some time the BSA will put me into prison because I used an operating system containing bad code. Therefore, I’ll immediately remove Linux and FreeBSD from my PC, and buy a nice, legal copy of OpenServer.
But wait… maybe I should first look at the HCL! Is my video card supported? No. Is my network card supported? No. Is my sound card supported? No. Is my harddisk/bios combination supported? Probably not.
So what do they want to reach? For me to buy a Linux license for a lot of money? No thanks. But what should I use then? Ah, of course, the original Windows 98 that came with my PC. Let’s try it.
But heck, Windows 98 does not support my 40 GB harddisk, according to it’s setup.exe. In this light, it seems that Solaris 8 Intel edition is the only affordable solution for me to keep my computer running legally.
Moral of the Storal: whatever SCO might do, I won’t buy their products.
Someone had cropped the liscence off of it. And included it in Linux. SCO discovere the same code in their code. So they complained. What SCO didn’t check was that the liscence for the code was BSD. So SGI put BSD code in linux wihtout a liscence. They corrected this problem.
SCO also put the same code in their OS without the BSD liscence attached. I wonder if they too have removed the offending lines? Or added the BSD liscence.
The code was from Unix v 7 and was written in 1979, It was believed to be written by Dennis Ritchie. The code may later have become part of BSD.
But anyone who thinks this code is somehow important to running a big UNIX system is smoking crack. SGI had already removed it from the Linux 2.6 dev kernels because there where better methods.
Im so freaking sick of this s**t i hope their stock makes a dive …..next in the sco soap opera will the stock dropp will SCO’s love affair wirh M$ result in world domination…
stay tuned…
“Whether or not OS X is superior to Linux on the desktop is debatable”
!!
Well, that’s what I mean by debatable. Personally, I prefer my customized Linux+KDE to OS X+Aqua, but I know a lot of other people feel differently. That’s fine, we can debate it, it’s mainly a matter of opinion. 🙂
Otherwise excellent and succint reply
Thanks
Hey, wait a minute: UnixWare is an excellent UNIX. I think you don’t have any knowledge of what you are talking about!!
2015 the SCO battle continues
Let’s compare hardware compatibility under Linux and then Unixware, shall we? Let’s compare scalability under Unixware and Linux after that.
And then let’s compare Unixware’s future with that of Linux.
SCO’s toast, and by extension so is Unixware.
Hey, let’s compare hardware compatibility under Windows98 and Linx 2.6, shall we?
Now that has nothing to do with it. TopSpeed trolled that Linux was the most backward OS available. I snapped back that this honor would go to UnixWare. Therefore there was an implicit comparison of the two.
You’re such a moron.
Oh, that’s rich. Are your verbal skills that limited? IIRC that’s reason enough to report your post for abuse.
Yes, UnixWare is more scalable than Linux – it utilizes multiple CPUs better than Linux.
That’s not what the tests suggest.
It had much better management tools and a more robust package manager.
Yeah, yeah, whatever. I don’t discuss with people whose debating skills are so limited that they must retort to insults to get their point across.
Anyway, who’s going to support UnixWare once SCO crashes down in flames?
Here you go:
http://techupdate.zdnet.com/techupdate/stories/main/0,14179,5097546…
>>Hey, wait a minute: UnixWare is an excellent UNIX. I think you don’t have any knowledge of what you are talking about!!<<
Are you kidding? Sales of UnixWare are awful, and getting worse all the time. Here is a review of unixware, compared to other OSes (it’s the only one I could find):
“Looking over the OSes we’ve been talking about in this article, there are a few things that stand out. The first is that SCO’s UnixWare and OpenServer are underpowered, overpriced, and lacking in scalability and security. Furthermore the company is highly unstable, having gone through a long period of financial loss before deciding to blackmail corporate GNU/Linux users with legal threats backed by invisible and baseless claims. To add to it all, SCO refused to respond to any of my queries about product features, leading me to believe that most of their information is mindless propaganda. In short, the company stinks, their products stink, and you’d be insane to buy one of their operating systems for any environment, let alone a corporation with sensitive and important data. SCO may be the “true” Unix, but it’s also the weakest.”
http://www.thejemreport.com/articles/sco.htm
That “article” is talking about OpenServer. Get your facts straight. OpenServer has always been an entry-level solution.
The mere fact that you came forth with the power of a non-argument, not even knowing that UnixWare is not OpenServer, and then telling me “Are you kidding?”, like you knew what you were talking about, well, that just shows the value of your post: lots of noise and NO substance.
Besides, just look at that website you were reporting. “Article” written by Jem Matzan, only contributing author to thejemreport.com. I read that “article”, and don’t think many would take it too seriously. But even if so, OpenServer != UnixWare.
Yeah, yeah, whatever. I don’t discuss with people whose debating skills are so limited that they must retort to insults to get their point across.
You don’t? I think you just discussed, quite a lot, actually. Or are you selective as to which facts you want to discuss, and which you will just “not discuss because my verbal skills are so limited”. Hmmm.. now, that seems a bit suspicious to me. Could it be that you don’t have actual arguments?
SCO could get an injunction that would prevent Utah neighbor Novell from shipping Linux, but it won’t try to derail the planned Novell-SUSE merger–at least not legally
Does anybody else get images of SCO execs in black balaklavas (ski masks), and tight-fitting black jumpsuits, breaking in through the skylights, stealing files and torching the place?
“That will teach you pesky Novell/SUSE people. Muahahahahaa!”
🙂
One large problem with your analogy. For me to make an engine costs me money, a lot of it. Ferrarri’s aren’t cheap, at least last time I checked. On the other hand after an OS is developed little money is needed to distribute the software, not even pennies for bandwidth, or a few bucks for a CD. This is where your comment falls apart. The point is it is hard for people to get together and throw car parts together, because they need money to do so as well. They may be able to beat pros at racing given the same chance, but they are not, and maybe they don’t want to. Maybe they are in it to have fun, and becoming a professional takes the fun out of things. In a lot of ways becoming a pro programmer does this as well. It is no fun to be told what to make and have no say in the matter.
However I have a different attitude from the one I got from top speed on my forst postings here. After talking with the Amrican patriot Linux users at Free Republic and Liberty Post as well as reading Source Forge (a better Open Source news site than slashdot in my point of view)
I have dropped my trolling habits against Linux and became a Linux user and developer again.
My opinion on these SCO/Micro$oft/Linux related matters now is that we should have Darl McBride, Bill Gates and Steve Ballmer investegated and arrested for stock fraud and illegally attempting to monopolize the entire computer software industry as soon as possible.
I meant NEWS forge. Not source forge. Now that I’m back in the Open Source community I’ve got to get these sites streightened out again. ;c)
At first, I just thought that they were threatining the kernel developmnet staff because they needed some “free” publicity. But when they are going to sue the kernel development staff, Novell-SuSE, IBM, and dispute the AT&T/BSD lawsuit, this is f-ing assanine. First off, dosen’t SCO realize that if they did successfully overturn the AT&T/BSD settelment, that all thier code would become the property of AT&T? Also, why the hell do they care if they do have a settlement agreement or not?
You don’t see me bitching because Apple vs. MS ruled that you cannot patent functionality, and only artwork because I use Windows XP? or that IBM tried to sue Dell becaue they reverse engeneered thier BIOS to get the exact function for less the price and I use a home made computer with an American Megatrends BIOS? I certianly do not!
Frankly, if IBM and Apple had been successful, we would still be using DOS or CP/M on only IBM machines. If we wanted to get a GUI, we would be forced to make the jump to apple. Compitition is what keeps this economy working. That reminds me, if the DMCA had been around during the IBM clone revolution, every x86 based computer in the US would be an IBM, and to get a GUI, you would have to use Apple. Compitition not only drives down prices, but it also stimulates innovation, and better quality products. Thier is a word for govornment supported monopolies that control everything, and this word s facism. Do not let it spread. Keep capitalizm alive!
Microsoft is funneling money through this “investment groups” Royal Bank of Canada, Canopy Group ,etc to invest into SCO. SCO is going to the “bad corporation” going after the the Open Sources OSes, including Linux, the BSDs (including Apple), while Microsoft sits in the background secretly calling the shots. SCO will “attempt” to invalidate the GPL, the BSD license, etc. Find “infringing code” in BSD and Linux. Still remains to be seen if they have any proof. Let’s say, heaven forbid, that SCO gets the GPL invalidated and get’s the BSD settlement overturned. Microsoft will jump in and “buy” SCO. Microsoft will then own virtually every operating system on this Earth. Some of you may say I am crazy, but crazier things have happened in this world. Either way, Open Source can’t continue to operate as it has in the past and must ensure more safeguard to protect themselves against these type of “unsubstantiated” lawsuit. I will say SCO is blowing smoke out of their caboose until I see the PROOF.
“Yeah, yeah, whatever. I don’t discuss with people whose debating skills are so limited that they must retort (sic) to insults to get their point across.”
You don’t? I think you just discussed, quite a lot, actually.
In other words, you admit that your debating skills are so limited that you must resort to insults to get your point across?
Thanks for proving mine.
UnixWare sucks. Deal with it.
I guess that people like @mario and top speed will never Realize that Micro$oft and SCO are criminal organizations like I have.
“That “article” is talking about OpenServer. Get your facts straight. OpenServer has always been an entry-level solution.”
This is what the article itself
http://www.thejemreport.com/articles/sco.php
says:
SCO OpenServer 5.07 Enterprise System
SCO UnixWare 7.1.3 Datacentre Edition
“In looking over these tables, one can’t help but wonder why SCO’s UnixWare and OpenServer are even mentioned. They offer nothing over GNU/Linux, *BSD, BSD/OS, and Solaris, yet UnixWare is astonishingly more expensive than its competitors.”
And then you come forth with this gem of an argument:
“The mere fact that you came forth with the power of a non-argument, not even knowing that UnixWare is not OpenServer, …”
The article in question:
“There seems to be a use for just about every Unix we’ve listed here, except of course for SCO UnixWare and OpenServer. As previously mentioned, these trademarked UNIXes don’t meet the UNIX98 standard like the heavy hitters do. They’re also severely limited in the hardware that they can use, and the licensing structure for both of them is draconian. UnixWare and OpenServer are the only Unixes that I have listed in this article that, like Microsoft, require you to pay for per-seat user licenses.”
“… and then telling me “Are you kidding?”, like you knew what you were talking about, well, that just shows the value of your post: lots of noise and NO substance.”
Every time I read the JemReport, I find the same thing – he mentions UnixWare as the higher-level and more expensive SCO offering, and he mentions OpenServer as the lower-level and cheaper SCO offering. He doesn’t restrict himself to one or the other – he condemns them both as being unfit and overweight.
mario, you remind me uncomfortably of a woman I once tried to discuss something important with. Quite capable of confusing two different incidents years apart, and then perfectly capable of conflating them in quite an inventive and abusive flow of imagination – I’m glad I lost touch with her.
In programming circles, confusing and conflating two addresses a couple of bytes apart can lead to quite embarrassing results; confusing two different measurement systems led to the loss of a Mars probe – are you sure you belong here?
First, you didn’t even try to address the point of being selective when it comes to answering my remarks. When you run out of arguments, then you spout off “Yeah, yeah, whatever. I don’t discuss with people whose debating skills are so limited that they must retort (sic) to insults to get their point across” – and you even seem to have forgotten that I have quoted YOU – and use your own quote against me. Talk about debating skills, yours are totally berzerk.
All you can say is “UnixWare sucks. Deal with it.” – that’s how far the technical argumentation goes. I think an impartial observer can deduce very little out of this, except that you didn’t really offer any arguments. You totally have never even seen UnixWare, so there is little wonder you have no clue what you are talking about. I, on the other hand, have been working (as in, at work, 40+ hours a week) with UnixWare, Openserver, Solaris and Linux since 1997, and with HP-UX since 1999. I have been doing development work on all the mentioned systems except Unixware and Openserver, so I had quite a bit of time to compare these operating systems, and to use the management and configuration tools therein. I, at least, know what I am talking about. That’s how I got to be a senior system engineer in my company – because I have something to back up what I say.
..thinking it was mine!
Yeah, yeah, whatever. I don’t discuss with people whose debating skills are so limited that they must retort (sic) to insults to get their point across
What a gem. I wouldn’t have even bothered to correct you, but you bothered to correct ME – when, in fact, those were YOUR words.
Sure, I can also publish some of my opinions on my weblog. I can only hope they will be used in a debate about such topics as UNIX OE worthiness.
>>That “article” is talking about OpenServer. Get your facts straight. OpenServer has always been an entry-level solution. <<
Dude, learn to read:
“Looking over the OSes we’ve been talking about in this article, there are a few things that stand out. The first is that SCO’s UnixWare”
http://www.thejemreport.com/articles/sco.htm
Mario, tell us speciacally what unixware has that I can’t get elsewhere? Does it even have USB support?
You do know that scox doesn’t run their own web-server on unixware, don’t you? Scox uses Linux, I think Mandrake.
If unixware is so great, why is so unpopular? About the only place where unixware is used is in legacy POS systems for fast-food places, and unixware is even losing that market – McD in Germany is switching over to Linux.
Take a look at people trying to unixware licenses on ebay – they can hardly give them away.
Why has scox never made a profit except for fud money from sunw and msft? Other companies make money selling their unixes, why not scox?
Why does scox have to try to force people to use unixware? Why is scox threatening linux users with lawsuits, if those linux users don’t buy a unixware license?
First, you didn’t even try to address the point of being selective when it comes to answering my remarks.
Uh? What are you talking about?
When you run out of arguments, then you spout off “Yeah, yeah, whatever. I don’t discuss with people whose debating skills are so limited that they must retort (sic) to insults to get their point across” – and you even seem to have forgotten that I have quoted YOU – and use your own quote against me.
Again, what are you talking about? I did not run out of arguments, I stopped caring when YOU called me an idiot and a moron – which got two of your posts modded down, if I may add.
And where exactly did you quote me? You seem very confused about this whole thread.
Oh yeah, and then you even go and correct YOUR own quote thinking it was mine!
Are you kidding? Of course I know it’s my own quote! That is why what I said was in quotes and in italics, why your own response was only in italics. I was providing it for context, to show how you yourself admitted that you needed to resort to insult to make your point. Note that you insulted me, not the other way around…
And if I corrected “retort” into “resort”, that is because english is my second language and I still confuse the two sometimes.
You may be a “senior systems engineer” at Nokia (ooh, I’m impressed – hey, did you work on those explosive phones? or the usability nightmare that is the N-Gage?), but you seem to be quite confused about this particular thread.
You totally have never even seen UnixWare, so there is little wonder you have no clue what you are talking about.
You’re right, I’ve never used Unixware, and never will. I’m basing my appraisal on every recent review of Unixware I’ve read. They all say that it’s the weakest commercial Unix around, noting the irony that it’s from SCO; several have also said that it doesn’t scale as well as recent Linux kernels. So until you give me links to articles (that weren’t funded by SCO) that prove the contrary, then I shall continue to believe that, indeed, UnixWare sucks.
I certainly won’t take your word for it. You’ve lost all credibility when you started using insults in your posts – that was quite some time ago – and it’s clear to all that you have an anti-Linux agenda. That doesn’t make you an impartial observer.
I, on the other hand, have been working (as in, at work, 40+ hours a week) with UnixWare
Sure, that’s why you cling to it. You wouldn’t want to have to adapt. I can understand that, that’s a natural human emotion. But the writing’s on the wall: SCO doesn’t have a case, and will simply cease to exist once IBM is through with it (maybe before). So you’ll end up with an expensive and proprietary Unix system with no one to support it. And an inferior one at that.
I, at least, know what I am talking about. That’s how I got to be a senior system engineer in my company – because I have something to back up what I say.
Then I’m sure you’ll have no problem providing links that support your opinion. Because to me it seems that you’re only another troll (and an aggressive one at that), one who hides behind his title and throws insults instead of arguments. P.s. titles don’t impress me – I’ve seen incompetent IT directors before. You should get acquainted with the “Peters principle.”
So…according to all the recent reviews I’ve read, Unixware sucks. And SCO’s toast. Deal with it.
Very astute response. Careful, he might call you a moron or an idiot now…
Unixware’s on its way out, and he’s just frustrated that all the expertise he’s developed on it will become obsolete.
Or maybe he’s just pissed off because the N-Gage will crash and burn as well…
If unixware is so great, why is so unpopular? About the only place where unixware is used is in legacy POS systems for fast-food places…
I wouldn’t go that far, I worked as a shift manager for a mcdonalds in my area, all of the mcdonalds here, and a bunch of other fast food places uses DOS 6 for the registers and POS. So it appears that good ol’ DOS is beating out unixware
I, on the other hand, have been working (as in, at work, 40+ hours a week) with UnixWare
Sure, that’s why you cling to it. You wouldn’t want to have to adapt. I can understand that, that’s a natural human emotion. But the writing’s on the wall: SCO doesn’t have a case, and will simply cease to exist once IBM is through with it (maybe before). So you’ll end up with an expensive and proprietary Unix system with no one to support it. And an inferior one at that.
Let’s see what I said:
I, on the other hand, have been working (as in, at work, 40+ hours a week) with UnixWare, Openserver, Solaris and Linux since 1997, and with HP-UX since 1999.
hey, did you work on those explosive phones?
You should get one of them. In fine print, it’s written on their batteries: “Dorks like Archie Steel should plug their butt with this phone, in hope of providing a Darwin Award winner.”
Because of you I missed a good 10 minutes of “Rough Science”. :o))))))
…you must really enjoy being modded down.
So, where are those links to support your assertions? As others have indicated – and studies have shown – UnixWare is a sub-par Unix, and doesn’t scale as well as recent Linux kernels. You’ve claimed the contrary, but the only evidence you’ve offered is “I’m a senior Engineer and I know what I’m talking about.”
As an aside, I’ll admit the exploding phone comment was flamebait, but I’ll reiterate that the N-Gage is a UI nightmare. When you talk into it, it looks as if you’re holding a Taco. Oh, and what about the fact that you can’t disable the powersave mode for backlighting even when you’re playing a game?!
If that’s the kind of “senior engineering” that goes on at Nokia, then no wonder you think UnixWare is a good Unix…
Meanwhile, you’re still resorting to insults. That’s rather weak, but I don’t mind. The more you do, the more your credibility goes down the drain.
Does it even have USB support?
Not that a server OE really needs USB support that badly, but yes, it does support USB:
To support the new legacy free system designs, Universal Serial Bus (USB) support has been integrated into the new release including:
• USB 2.0 support (EHCI)
• USB 1.1 support (OHCI, UHCI)
• Class Drivers are provided for HID devices such as Hubs,
Keyboard, and Mice and for Mass storage devices such as CDROM, Floppy, LS-120 and LS-240
http://www.sco.com/images/pdf/unixware/SCO_UW7.1.3_Broch_LetALL.qxd…
Scox uses Linux, I think Mandrake. They use Caldera Linux (not Mandrake, of course) with Apache, because it’s a good intel-based webserving solution.
Someone mentioned UnixWare and POS. UnixWare is very much a server operating environment, it is totally unsuitable for POS. It has great thread management and I/O, making it suitable for databases.
My first post here was just a comment that UnixWare is a fine UNIX. I stand by that. I have no sympaties for SCO, but what’s true it’s true.
…that’s why is the #1 mobile phone company. Your personal rants about N-gage won’t change that fact.
This is from 1999, and already Linux edges ahead of Unixware in overall features. The gap has only increased since then.
http://www.aplawrence.com/Bofcusm/65.html
I work in video games, and the N-Gage is the laughingstock of the whole industry.
I like Penny Arcade’s take on it myself:
http://www.penny-arcade.com/view.php3?date=2003-08-22&res=l
The “best engineers in the world”, eh? Too bad they didn’t have good designers. You still have to hold the Ngage like a taco in order to talk to it. From a marketing point of view, that’s very, very bad.
Personally, my next phone will be an Ericsson…or perhaps one of those Motorola Linux phones.
..your personal rants won’t change a thing. Nokia has the best engineers in the world, like it or not. Sure, Motorola has some good engineering, too, but why is it that their user interface is so bad and counter-intuitive? Not enough money for good UI specialists?
Linux is suitable for a webserver, and even for some embedded applications, but I doubt it will make it big in mobile phones. I don’t have a crystal ball, so I can’t predict the future, but I suppose this Linux-powered mobile phone will flop. Actually, I think there’s a chance Motorola won’t even launch the phone, because it’s possible that adding all the necessary (software) components to Linux to make it work efficiently in a mobile phone, would cost Motorola too much. It’s not as simple as it seems.
…I guess we’ll just wait and see.
Over and out.