Gnome Desktop Environment 2.8 was released today, on schedule. Including a slew of new features and the much anticipated Evolution 2.0, Gnome 2.8 achieves several milestones. Release notes can be found here, and a number of screenshots here. In other Gnome news, a new Gnome news site, gnomejournal.org, was announced today.
Gnome 2.8 Released
About The Author
Adam Scheinberg
Technology Executive • Web Developer • Father • Foodie • Music Snob • OS enthusiast
Follow me on Mastodon @[email protected]
Is always so surprising. Just when I think they got the last one nice and usably stable, they spit out another full release. The Gnome team is awesome, great work guys! Even though I use enlightenment now
.
Looks really nice, I must say. I have a feeling that Epiphany will eventually be abandoned for Firefox (and I say this as a die-hard Epiphany user), but some of the improvements are much welcomed anyways.
I’m still eagerly awaiting the Evolution-GAIM functionality – what’s up with that? SpamAssassin was an essential addition, though (especially for competing with Thunderbird!).
I’ll definitely be grabbing Fedora Core 3 in December.
-Erwos
Anybody know if this patch: http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=130308 made it in?
I’m just waiting for a WM with dropshadows and transparency.
Congratulations to the Gnome Team. Another objective met. These small but timely changes are a much welcome change to the huge changes but takes years to come out projects or the totally stateless project except for one: bleeding edge projects. (Nothing majorly wrong with the other style. This is just a personal preference)
I like having something solid come out every six months even if it’s not earth-shattering. It keeps one interested in the desktop without having to be totally involved in the development.
I’m sure new bugs get introduced. It’s a fact of life in any developing project, but it’s good to know that with each release, a lot of bugs from the previous release also got fixed.
Thanks!
Of course you know Gnome is not a WM. You can run Gnome on top of any WM. Also right now, there is the expirimental, but definitely working (somewhat slow), Xcompmgr. You can get shadows right now if you want.
Of course you know Gnome is not a WM. You can run Gnome on top of any WM. Also right now, there is the expirimental, but definitely working (somewhat slow), Xcompmgr. You can get shadows right now if you want.
Just a general hint: make sure you have the render acceleration enabled. Without 3d acceleration, the Xcompmgr seems slow, but is quite snappy with it.
Those features in xorg are still not included because they’re very unstable.
And enlightenment is a wm with transparency. There is probably some way to give it drop shadows as well.
and now evolution 2.0 can include this gaim
bounty http://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=127546
Anyone know when gnome 2.8 will be in debian unstable?
Are language bindings to Perl, Python, and C++ going to be included with Gtk+ libraries when you install Gnome 2.8?
WHY.
Since you know the bug number, why don’t you read the bug report and find the answer yourself?
I left Slack back to windows on my laptop. I didn’t expect it but after trying linux for a couple of weeks in my actual work application, I actually miss win2k. No acceleration on my video on xorg, and no terminal application as good as Vandyke’s SecureCRT…but those are not related to this subject
).
Anyway, I hope GNOME has included shortcut key combination assignment for menu items. E.g I like the fact the I can assign Ctrl-Shift-N to open Notepad or Ctrl-Shift-C for Calculator without reaching for the mouse in Windows. Plus, in windows, I also like the fact the one can just right click on Menu items like it’s a mere folder or shortcut and directly modify its properties. If there is such existing capability in GNOME, well, it’s not as obvious and that sucks.
These are probably small things for people who are not used to using them. But to people who are… it’s a big deal and will be missed.
While it’s nice that Gnome and KDE releases are coming out steadily, I find it a major pain in the buttocks to get anything going. Trying to update Gnome on Mandrake 10CE was an exercise in futility. I switched to Suse and downloaded their official updates for KDE 3.3 and Gnome 2.6 and I got nothing but dependancy errors. So I can’t even get things that are supposed to work to work.
I imagine when there’s an official 2.8 I’ll have the same problem. All Linux distributions seem to be so mindlessly and needlessly complicated to get anything to work right if it doesn’t come with the distribution in the first place.
But still I wonder. What exactly is new to anyone who uses XP together with LiteStep? Rendezvouz perhaps but that’s about it.
I’m happy to see Gnome coming along though, still 2-3 years behind XP, but it’s free so I guess it’s nice anyway =)
it’s already in experimental (has been for a while) so if you are running unstable you can fetch them from there.
gnome 2.7 has been running fine for me for at least more than a week
I’ve managed to install Gnome 2.6 in Mandrake 10.0 CE, it was a lot of trouble but in the end it has unworty!
??
The number of new features in these releases are ridiculous, almost nothing changed from 2.4 to 2.6 and now to 2.8 even less has changed.
I would happily install it dust to mess with it but in Linux is impossible to install anything bigger than 10 Mb, I’ve managed to install 2.6 rpms but i’ve had far too much trouble with it than what is worty…
But as always everybody will ignore it and say: “./configure, make, make install”
…
gnome 2.8 is now in experimental. Will be probably moved to sid when all 2.6 packages hit sarge.
It’s not on the front page, but I’ve written a how to about installing 2.7 on a Debian/Sid system on GNOME Journal. Here’s a link directly to it:
http://www.gnomejournal.org/gnome_debian.php
>Trying to update Gnome on Mandrake 10CE was an exercise in futility. I switched to Suse and downloaded their official updates for KDE 3.3 and Gnome 2.6 and I got nothing but dependancy errors.
Mandrake is kinda KDE-centric and SUSE is totally KDE-centric. If you want better gnome support go with fedora, debian, or slackware
RPM’s are a PITA for installing big apps like GNOME.Use Gentoo,Arch or even Debian, and your probles are gone (don’t you just love replies like this one
)
When I first installed Gentoo 6 months ago, the CDs came with Xfree, KDE 3.2, and 2.6.3 kernel. Today, I run the latest X.org, an updated QT, KDE 3.3 and 2.6.8.1 kernel, all without effort.
Yes, you’ve got to read a lot to get started and for a newbie it can be a pain in the ass to configure everything by hand, but Gentoo just works. Don’t blame Linux OS for your distro’s faults.
when i started using linux, i did it the “windows way” – whenever any package had a newer version, i downloaded and installed it. hell, when it works with winamp and mozilla under win, why shouldn’t it also work with mozilla and xmms in linux?
but i constantly had installation problems. broken dependencies, broken packages, whatever. over some time, i stopped downloading packages and went with what my distro had preinstalled. why get myself in trouble, when gaim 0.x+1 has virtually nothing more to offer than 0.x? the next version of the distro includes updated versions of my programs anyway, plus: they work without any installation issues.
i would never install gnome 2.8 packages on my fc2. even if there are official rpms – who cares? same should go for mandrake and suse. debianists and gentooists don’t have this problem anyway…
moral: don’t update stuff. it will far too often break your distro. and believe me, i also can’t wait to try out gnome2.8…
christian
That’s the truth, you don’t have to update everything all the time with Linux. The only thing that I update is the kernel, because all the stuff I need works fine (digital camera, web browser, music, video).
Anybody know if Gnome 2.8 has been built for Fedora Core 1 or 2 users yet?
of course compiled with all dependencies 😉
many many thanks!!!
http://people.ecsc.co.uk/~matt/repository.html
http://ipi.fi/work/pablo/matt/downloads/yum/fedora-2-i386/
As always with any third party repository, YMMV 😉
no, Mandrake is not at all KDE centric. It’s desktop agnostic; the development effort for KDE and for GNOME is equal.
It’s just as hard to install KDE 3.3 on a stable MDK as it is to install GNOME 2.8, currently. As soon as there are official packages, or well-built third party ones, it’ll be exactly as simple as it would be on Debian or Gentoo (when the packages are built, the command would be “urpmi gnome2”). Gentoo acolytes might like to note that anyone running Mandrake Cooker or Debian sid with experimental packages gets new software just as fast as they do (well, admittedly, Cooker is currently in freeze for 10.1 so KDE 3.3 and GNOME 2.8 won’t go in till 10.1 is released) and don’t have to build it from the source themselves. Which is nice when you’re on a P2 laptop. For people who run stable releases, well, they’re called stable releases for a reason. Mandrake 10.0 is a stable distribution consisting of software including GNOME 2.6 and KDE 3.2. If you install GNOME 2.8 or KDE 3.3 on it, guess what? It’s not the same stable distribution any more. It’s all about what you’re trying to achieve.
“Anyway, I hope GNOME has included shortcut key combination assignment for menu items. E.g I like the fact the I can assign Ctrl-Shift-N to open Notepad or Ctrl-Shift-C for Calculator without reaching for the mouse in Windows”
There are several ways that I can think of to launch applications without touching the mouse, the first would be brining up the menu Alt F1, and then selecting what you want from the menu would work, as would alt F2 and then using the tab completion. You can also bind any key combo to any arbitrary command with gconf-editor. (/apps/metacity/global_keybindings)
“Plus, in windows, I also like the fact the one can just right click on Menu items like it’s a mere folder or shortcut and directly modify its properties. If there is such existing capability in GNOME, well, it’s not as obvious and that sucks.”
Ever right clicked on a item in the menu? It works exactly the way you describe. Although some distros (Redhat) disable it for some reason. You can also access menu items at applications:// in nautilus.
Does anybody know if pressing Ctrl-L just on the desktop brings up the nautilus location dialogue? Thats probably my biggest gripe right there, having to open a nautilus window to open a nautilus window.
anyone would run in to problems trying to update that way, with Linux you just dont start grabbing packages with newer release numbers on em and try installing them…
you run FC-2 try using yum or apt-get from apt4rpm, http://apt4rpm.sourceforge.net/ or this is good too http://freshrpms.net/apt/
learn to use Linux from a Linux users point of view, and the sooner you forget Windows way of thinking the better your Linux experience will be…
i am a little rusty on rpm based distro since i switched to slackware a while back…
i understand gnomejournal has it’s first release only, but still, there is no “journal” there, seems more like slightly tweaked press-releases
Anyone can help me?
I dont find the ebuilds from gnome 2.8 on gentoo. i tried breakmygentoo.net but there aren’t-
Personally, I really don’t like the layout of the Gnome Journal site. To see what’s actually supposed to be the journal, you have to click the Current Issue link on the side: http://www.gnomejournal.org/current_issue.php
NO!
j/k there just not there yet, give it time. 2.7.4 ebuilds are @ breakmygentoo if you want to get ready for it.
Runs fine on one of my gentoo box’s.
But still I wonder. What exactly is new to anyone who uses XP together with LiteStep? Rendezvouz perhaps but that’s about it.
I’m happy to see Gnome coming along though, still 2-3 years behind XP, but it’s free so I guess it’s nice anyway =)
I don’t know what parts of Gnome you consider behind XP, but
in terms of usability it has already far past XP.
If you mean that the number of Gnome apps are too few, then you may be correct. Right now the only thing that makes XP better is the number of available applications and supported hardware.
There are already some 2.8 related ebuilds sipping into portage. Check gentoo-portage.com. They are still masked. I’m sure GNOME 2.8 will be on your system before/by the end of the week. Don’t quote me though.
people keep telling me that it is so important that x is networkaware so you can remotely use apps. then why is the gnome team using vnc instead? so they can remoteadminister windows clients?
Network-awarenes of X and VNC serve a different purpose.
With network-aware X, my flat-mate runs his Matlab session on a big and fast computer in school and has the Matlab window displayed on his local computer at home, on the same desktop as his other, local, applications. With the same window-manager decorations, etc. Simply, just another window, with the only difference being, that the computing is going-on elsewhere.
With VNC, I connect to an already running desktop, and to the whole desktop. I.e. I leave my computer running at home, go to work and when I connect to it via VNC, I can see and manipulate my home desktop. Windows from the home desktop are displayed in the VNC window, not amongst the other windows on my work desktop.
VNC is for checking an already-existing session, or to help someone sitting behind that computer. X is for running your applications remotely, but having them displayed locally. Different purpose => different tool.
Funny, in my case it’s the opposite. I run Debian/Sid at home and company-provided w2k at work.
I update my Sid installation almost daily, because it’s as easy as ‘apt-get update; apt-get upgrade’ and watching the lines fly by.
I update the software on my w2k computer rarely, because I would have to download the install.exe’s for cca. 10 programs by hand, run them by hand, reboot at least once, etc. Lazy to do that
.
ah, thanks for clearing that out… i have still much to learn
You can see some screenshots here http://gnome.org/start/2.8/notes/rnwhatsnew.html
Not to flame or anything, but there are many things in XP that do stand out…
First is the integration of all the applications. I can fire up the file manager (explorer), right click on 16 images sized > 1024px in width in some random folder, and select “send to -> Email recipient.” XP will ask me if I want to resize the images, I say yes and choose resize them all to “640×480” and voila. My default mail application fires up, I key in the email address and hit send. Not so sure how many more steps would I need to do the same in gnome.
Similarily with digital cameras, plug it in and a wizard shows up, where would you like to copy pictures? Not so sure if gnome has that(though I know there are apps like gphoto2, etc. that allow this, I’m just pointing out that they need to be installed seperately)
Windows Media Player 10 – Its an integral part of XP and please don’t tell me there exists an equivalent software like WMP for gnome/any linux environment that can do it all without dropping to the command line
There are many more reasons people get tied to Windows, software/hardware support basically sums it all up. I’m not bashing gnome or anything, I myself dual boot debian with XP, just making a point that gnome being superior does not mean a lot.
You are not a GNOME user, are you? Because all the things you mentioned are possible and even easier to do in GNOME. I’m sure you haven’t heard of Totem either. It so happens that Totem can play all media files known to man. Try playing Theora files on Windows Media Player, your feedback is welcomed.
actually, you can do this – there’s a theora DirectShow filter. I’ve done it, though my bf’s XP PC is so slow it was a bit of a slideshow
Yeah, I’m not familiar with a feature equivalent to XP’s email pictures thing, but everything else is covered, WMP equivalent has been covered for a while.
Rhythmbox for music and Totem/Xine/VLC(my fav) for videos.
FYI, I do use gnome exclusively on my debian installation;
Yes, I’ve used Totem. I really wonder how could I create an audio CD with it? I wonder how could I create a few smart playlists and watch streaming video of a slightly more used format such as Windows Media as opposed to Theora (check amazon.com et al. they all use Real or Windows Media). I’m sure Totem supports OGG too, but I really don’t see how does it make it any better than WMP – how many people really care? OGG? Theora? Unless they make it big, I doubt I will. Oh yes, did I mention Totem crashed a few times when I tried to watch a DivX movie on it? What kind of an audio CD can I rip into any format using Totem? What kind of a media catalogue (which I don’t care about, but i’m sure many do) does Totem offer? Syncing to music devices?
Please don’t think of me as supporting XP and bashing gnome, like I said before I do use gnome and it is by far my preferred DE in linux. What my point is that, even though all the tasks I mention can potentially be done in gnome by using multiple apps (Rhythmbox, Grip, Nautilus-cd-burner, totem, Eye of Gnome, gtkpod, etc.) they all lack integration and support for each other. Even little things would help, I don’t know for a fact if totem does this but I don’t think it tries to download a codec if you try and open an unsupported file in it. I also know it crashes if I try and open an invalid file it in. There are many issues to be ironed out – these apps don’t always work.
Btw, I myself use gmplayer for video, xmms for audio, and the rest of the apps as mentioned earlier to suit my needs.
Btw, for those that are curious, the only reason I continue using XP (I’ve been using linux for 2.5 years now and have tried over 30 distros, but could never make the switch) is simply for the hardware and software support it offers. I need SolidWorks, pro/Engineer, and AutoCAD. I also need iTunes and WMP. I need a decent -easy to use- basic photo editing application (NOT gimp, but something like Photoshop Elements which is so intuitive and simple). And don’t tell me to resort to WINE for these apps, I’d rather see something that always works. I want my scanner to work, after installing some kind of software and drivers (its a Canon one and colour scanning is not supported AFAIK). My wireless card simply doesn’t work (AOpen – yes its a cheap one but I’m not throwing it out just to get another one that is linux friendly). Canon i560 doesn’t do a good job at printing in colour under linux. If I’m using my PS/2 mouse, and I disconnect it, I expect my trackpoint to work without restarting X, or the even better fix it yourself /etc/XF86Config-4. Sigh, the list never stops.
Yes, I’ve used Totem.
But apparently it was one of the very early releases or you haven’t played around with it much.
I really wonder how could I create an audio CD with it?
Don’t know, don’t care. I don’t have a practically noiseless computer with a big music collection only to burn it to Audio CDs.
I wonder how could I create a few smart playlists
Rhythmbox
and watch streaming video of a slightly more used format such as Windows Media as opposed to Theora
Uhm, well, how about Totem, Xine, VLC, MPlayer? If you’re on 32-bit x86, you can even use Windows codecs with xine-lib.
http://www.real.com/linux/
I’m sure Totem supports OGG too, but I really don’t see how does it make it any better than WMP – how many people really care?
People who care about licensing, and audiophiles. OGG has better quality. I know several people who went away from Windows Media Player because of its lacking OGG support.
What kind of an audio CD can I rip into any format using Totem?
There is just one kind of Audio CD, and you can rip that with Rhythmbox to MP3 or OGG if I recall correctly. It uses Sound Juicer.
What kind of a media catalogue (which I don’t care about, but i’m sure many do) does Totem offer? Syncing to music devices?
Rhythmbox has a music library, very similar to iTunes. It can also sync to iPods.
I don’t know why I always see people complaining about the absence of features which in fact are already implemented for a looong time – are users too stupid to discover them, or are distributors unable to implement them correctly?
And it would not make sense to tie all this in a single application like WMP.
Habits with media are just too different:
When a user opens a video file, he or she will likely want to watch that video (mostly just one file), and while it is playing he / she will only concentrate on the video window (or even make it full-screen).
When the user opens the music player, the usual habit is to let it play randomly or to select an album and while it is playing do something else and have the player minimized or on another workspace.
Even in the rare case that you might have a mixed collection of audio tracks and music videos, you will have no chance to see the video if you are just doing some work.
Quick gentoo get an ebuild for this. Good work gnome developers 2.8 looks superb.
not to mention the fact that building all this completely distinct functionality into WMP makes it a fragile, sluggish, incomprehensible behemoth. GNOME’s cd burning + sound-juicer’s CD ripping + totem’s media playing (and rhythmbox, if you really, really can’t handle listening to music an album at a time, like you’re supposed to) = sleek, integrated, fast and reliable multimedia goodness.
The XP GUI is still way faster than anything X11, and will be for as long as X11 runs in a separate process from the application, whereas in XP the GUI is in kernel space. I also really like the little email notifaction box Outlook fades in in the lower righthand corner of the screen, it is a real timesaver. Contrary to previous Windows versions, XP is worth what you pay for it, as is Gnome.
above, people are confusing ogg and vorbis. ogg is a container file type, like avi – both vorbis and theora content actually arrive as ogg files. ogg is a container, vorbis is an audio codec, theora is a video codec, remember the differences
.
“pro/Engineer”
A Linux version exists.
“basic photo editing application (NOT gimp, but something like Photoshop Elements which is so intuitive and simple).”
Cinepaint, Corel Photopaint… which ones have you tried apart from GIMP2?
Totem is good until you try to install new versions of gstreamer, then all hell breaks loose, also gstreamer-plugins is hard to compile with all the pluggins like the xvid pluging etc. I find it much, much easier to install ffdshow [ http://sourceforge.net/projects/ffdshow/ ] on windows, but that’s just my opinion… Also totem sucks compared to mpc [ http://sourceforge.net/projects/guliverkli/ ] and winamp. And except for winamp all of these are open source btw.
The XP GUI is still way faster than anything X11
XP is most definitely not faster than Qt/KDE. GTK+/GNOME is slow, not X11.
and will be for as long as X11 runs in a separate process from the application
I’m sick of debunking this myth continually. Go benchmark X, and then go benchmark GDI. The Athene folks have shown that GDI is negligibly faster than X11 for drawing. There are bottlenecks, but X11 isn’t one of them.
I wonder how could I create a few smart playlists and watch streaming video of a slightly more used format such as Windows Media as opposed to Theora (check amazon.com et al. they all use Real or Windows Media)
I just previewed wmp and rm files in totem from Amazon. You create these types of playlists just like you create any other one. It also does mms streaming. What’s the problem?
Your divx problems are most likely codec issues, unrelated to totem. It depends on your mpeg4 decoder. Which one are you using? It could very well be a permissions issue with the codec library (I’ve had that issue before with wmv files). Regardless this is not a totem nor linux problem…this is an installation issue as I use totem for divx all the time and it does the job damn well.
What kind of an audio CD can I rip into any format using Totem?
What kind of an audio cd can I rip into any format using Outlook? What??? NONE??? Why the hell not!?!? Because that’s not what outlook is meant to do, just like this is not what totem’s meant to do. If you want to rip something into a digital audio format, use sound-juicer which is a DEADLY cd ripper.
Media catalogues I’ll give you this one. It doesn’t exist as far as I know. I don’t use it and I don’t know anyone who does but there you have it.
I only have an RCA lyra for a portable device and that plugs in like a USB flash drive. I do know that Rhythmbox (the actual MUSIC player) features iPod integration.
It seems like you’re coming at Totem and gnome in general from a very inexperienced viewpoint. Virtually every point I’ve seen you raise has either been in totem for a very long time, or is featured in another app (just like WMP doesn’t do email, totem doesn’t do audio cd ripping…you use the email app for email and audio ripping app for audio ripping). Once you get all the codecs installed I’ve found Gnome to be the equivalent of or superior to XP in all media areas save one: cd burning. There’s still virtually NOTHING for cd burning. Hopefully this will change if libburn ever makes a usable release (not looking too cheery on this one).
There’s still virtually NOTHING for cd burning. Hopefully this will change if libburn ever makes a usable release (not looking too cheery on this one).
Agreed. This parsing of CLI output to create a GUI has always struck me as one of the most stupid ways of creating an end user program. Particularly for something like CD burning, which is notorious for dying with weird and wonderful reasons. Can’t wait for a real C lib to do the job instead.
I’m sick of debunking this myth continually.
So am i. If you (JJ) or whoever else is gonna benchmark (e.g. X), at least do it thoroughly and provide the necessary details of the configuration you used (circumstances), state how you did the benchmark (method) so we can research wether you did an unbiased compare, or not. All too often, people don’t include such necessary details, or just make some wild claim like done here — which is quite unfortunate.
Can we get back to discussing the new features and such of gnome, it never fail that someone decides to turn every new release into a battle. If its no XP vs Linux, its KDE vs Gnome…Do what works for you, save who you can save, and move on…Personally I think the biggest problem is that alot of people want everything to look or feel like OSX or XP or whatever they are currently using, therefore rather than looking at a system with fresh eyes, they have “OS Blinders” on and if it doesnt do it the same as Windows, they arent doing it right…no thanks…same goes for the people who spend countless hours tryin to make kde or gnome look like OSX…time could be better spent tryin to create a “NEW” look….buncha chest pounding and pole swinging if you ask me…please can we get back to discussing the new Gnome Release, no gentoo-ebuilds yet and I would love to actually here about some personal experiences with the improvementss…ie. mime, metacity+xorg 6.8.0, etc
In Carnage We Trust,
Helfrez Gama
>> basic photo editing application (NOT gimp, but something
>> like Photoshop Elements which is so intuitive and simple).
http://www.gnome.org/projects/f-spot/
(I’ve read somewhere it will have a timeline as well, some day)
>>http://www.gnome.org/projects/f-spot/
>>
>>(I’ve read somewhere it will have a timeline as well, some day)
It already does… (and it’s finally made it into debian/unstable
Nautilus does have integrated cdburning just like XP does. Everyone is saying Gnome is inferior just because there is no official cdburning utility but gnome ships the same way XP does. The only difference is currently in windows you can download and install a 3rd party cdburning application while in gnome there is no “good” cdburning application.
Anybody know of a repository or RPMS yet for FC1?
“Anyway, I hope GNOME has included shortcut key combination assignment for menu items. E.g I like the fact the I can assign Ctrl-Shift-N to open Notepad or Ctrl-Shift-C for Calculator without reaching for the mouse in Windows. Plus, in windows, I also like the fact the one can just right click on Menu items like it’s a mere folder or shortcut and directly modify its properties. If there is such existing capability in GNOME, well, it’s not as obvious and that sucks.”
I just got a laptop, no icons, almost no mouse, one word for you:
IceWM
>> It already does…
Really? Cool
I should check out that app much more often.
CD Burning is as easy as opening up a burn:// nautilus window and dropping files into the window. With Gnome 2.8 and gnome-volume-manager the burn window will pop up when you place a blank CD in the drive. Music CD burning will be handled by Rythembox at some point. Also photo import works in a similar way. Plug in a supported camera and a importing app is launched. One big advantage is no need to install drivers. While there are areas we are still trying to address to surpass Windows and MacOS every six months we get closer and we do it all with open standards. And to think the focus of Linux has only recently shifted to the desktop.
Ok ok, congrats to the GNOME team &c, but really, guys, you should screen the desktop shots beforehand because some of your submitters really lack artistic sensibilities. Or try to make a set of official screenshots and put the user-contributed ones in a different place because some of them won’t make potential users drool…
everyone complains about dep issues and stuff with most distro. the solution to your problems is gentoo trust me
Phft…
Are you joking? No problem with burning a CD from the desktop here and I am in Slackware > GNOME.
Some people should do their research before they speak and remove all doubt for others.
The new mime system is greatly appreciated. The old one was tedious.
Can’t wait to be on Debian/sid :-).
I’m using GEdit to edit my C files, hope the 2.8 will improve it a bit because I’m particular missing:
– find && replace in files
– tab pressed for selection should move the selection
– word delimiter, for example if I have this line:
int pippo;
pressing ctrl + delete on the first column will result
pippo
why delete int too ?
The word delimiter example was not clear enough due to space cutting.
Replace with those:
____int_pippo;
_pippo;
“_” stands for white space
That network tools window looks like a direct copy of the one in OS X.
No doubts about that.
Let alone the file manager.
Explorer – XP’s file manager – is much faster than Nautilus (and Konqueror), has 10 times less bugs.
I know that most Gnome users aren’t aware of that. That’s no surprise.
Try this: click a folder with a lot of files (>3000) in your file manager. You can see that Nautilus (2.6.x, I admit I didn’t try 2.8 yet) still can’t handle large folders in an acceptable way. Konqueror is three times faster. Explorer is easily 50 times faster in showing the files.
Other examples are easy to find, file manager or other components, no problem.
No need to write them down.
>I don’t know what parts of Gnome you consider behind XP, but
>in terms of usability it has already far past XP.
Some want to work with the desktop environment, others want to watch the background images, the icons or the screensavers. Who cares about a working file manager?
So this opinion is also acceptable.
There are two problems as I see:
– People are lazy but they want _all_ by doing _nothing_
– People do not look to GENTOO or FREEBSD, but only to flashy “kiddie Linux distro’s”, I _never_ have problems with updating
Have phun in UNIX land
I prefer Window Maker as my desktop but I also use Gnome apps whenever possible because printing from Gnome apps (using CUPS) always works the way it should. For example, the Gnome specific version of AbiWord in Debian has much better printing options than the default AbiWord version. So, even if I don’t actually use Gnome, Gnome improves my Linux desktop experience. 🙂
Hmm. That’s interesting. My Recycle Bin in this 2800+ 1GB RAM system running XP has 162 items in it and takes ~30 seconds to load. My “Blender Models” folder in this 950Mhz 256MB RAM system has about 400 items in it and takes ~5 minutes to load in Nautilus. Admittably, that’s not 3000 files, but you really shouldn’t have 3000 files in a single directory anyhow. Isn’t that why we have hiearchial (sp?) organization?
/me wanders back to BeOS. Vive la Tracker!
the recyclebin is afaik a compressed folder and thus not a fair comparison
I still have not found a comprehensive list, saying:
Other examples are easy to find, file manager or other components, no problem.
No need to write them down. is just lame. It’s like saying
1. filemanager
2. several features
3. some ways of doing things
4. filemanager
5. too many to list
Could the real list of XP feature advantages over GNOME please stand up?
—
“If you start off with the assumption that X is better than Y, it is always possible to find evidence to back it up, irrespective of what X and Y are.”
Honestly, could someone with knowledge of both systems give us the requested list? Does it have more than one item on it? I’m curious since I don’t use XP.
I don’t know what parts of Gnome you consider behind XP, but
in terms of usability it has already far past XP.
Let me quote from the release and give you a nice example
“Removable storage devices, such as CDs, DVDs, USB memory sticks, and cameras, can now be recognised and mounted automatically.”
XP has had this for quite some time you know, and this is a very important usability feature. So just like I said, Gnome is getting there but 2-3 years behind.
I use both gnome (default slackware 10) and xp, the things i find better on xp are:
filemanager: autorefresh (like when you create new files), gnome needs ctrl-r. More views (nautilus only has 2). Better integration with other components like the control panel, network panel, drives, network places, desktop, gnome is weird (with all the applications:///, smb:/// etc). I find that the right-click menu on xp has more usefull stuff (i like the send-to, print, etc), file associations on gnome are also weird, i managed to bork the executable files association (including linux executables) when i installed wine and coulnd’t find a way to restore it
desktop: creating shortcuts is simpler on xp than creating “launchers” on gnome (xp gets icons automagically from .exe files for example, while you have to hunt for them on gnome). How do you restore individual files from the recycle bin on gnome (other than opening the folder and movind them), on xp you just right-click them and choose “restore”.
menus: adding apps to the start menu is easier on xp, including adding them to a specific user or all users. On the gnome adding “launchers” to the aplications:/// requires a logoff/login to show them (this one might be my fault, i don’t know).
other stuff that i can remember: when you open a folder with nautilus, leave it open, then for some reason “rm -r <folder>” that folder on the terminal and then click on the file pane on nautilus, nautilus crashes. the only problem i have with the xp file manager it when i’m browsing a folder with corrupted divx movies in thumbnail view and it starts hogging the cpu).
I also find nautilus slower when opening folders with lots of files.
Nice try. Let me help you reduce your list to REAL issues.
autorefresh (like when you create new files), gnome needs ctrl-r. — This is a lie, autorefresh works on my FC2 Gnome 2.6 system.
More views (nautilus only has 2)
OK, this is true, but how many views does XP have and how do they improve usability over GNOME.
Better integration with other components like the control panel, network panel, drives, network places, desktop, gnome is weird (with all the applications:///, smb:/// etc)
This is twisting the truth. Gnome is also integrated with control center, Computer, Network etc. You don’t need smb:/// unless you want to. Just like in windows you don’t have to type \myserverprinters but you can. So this point does not apply
xp gets icons automagically from .exe files for example, while you have to hunt for them on gnome.
True but then it cuts both ways because in Gnome you can theme every application icon but in XP you have to stick to the one provided no matter how butt-ugly
other stuff that i can remember: when you open a folder with nautilus, leave it open, then for some reason “rm -r <folder>”
This is a lie, the window dissapears when I “rm -r” the folder.
I also find nautilus slower when opening folders with lots of files.
Please time it and give us figures.
When a user opens a video file, he or she will likely want to watch that video (mostly just one file), and while it is playing he / she will only concentrate on the video window (or even make it full-screen).
When the user opens the music player, the usual habit is to let it play randomly or to select an album and while it is playing do something else and have the player minimized or on another workspace.
Indeed, which indicates that you should have 2 different programs, one for movie files, and one for music files.
But what aj was actually complaining about, and which it seems that everyone who responded to him seems to have missed, is basically that there isn’t a gTunes or GMP. He knows about the programs needed to do all the tasks that WMP can do, what he complains about is that they don’t work together, and that you actually have to know which programs to use for each task, and you might have to tweak things to get them to work together. He didn’t however say that it couldn’t be done.
I personally like the fact that no matter what music task i want/need to do, i can do it easily from within iTunes. Now i don’t care if it is physically a bunch of different programs under the hood, but in 2004 i get upset if i have to deal with my music at a file level at any time, and in my experience linux’ media capabilities are just not there yet.
I didn’t address movie files, as my use of those is basically playback within a web page, for everything else i use DVD or VHS 🙂
True but then it cuts both ways because in Gnome you can theme every application icon but in XP you have to stick to the one provided no matter how butt-ugly
You can change the application icon in XP if you wish with just a few mouse clicks. I find it to be kinda handy to be able to include an icon in a exe file, and i think it would be nice even with icon themes. Think of 3rd party programs that doesn’t come with an icon and menu entry. Though with the fd.o standards regarding icons and menus, this point might end up being moot. But as it is right now, a local install of mozilla for instance, is easier in windows than in linux, if you want a menu entry that is.
Theres a lot of things that affect Nautilus’s speed, it has thumbnailers for far more file formats than explorer last I saw it, and so if its your first time opening a directory, that can take quite a while, but its done in the background after already displaying the contents of the directory, and the thumbnails are loaded based on what you’re looking at. The time it takes for me to open a folder with 322 images takes about 4 seconds, when the thumbnails were created that took maybe a minute more. I see similar behavior with other file managers.
The time it takes for /usr/bin with 2118 files is 8 seconds. This is on a fairly old system (dual celeron 550).
I don’t think I have any folders with >3000 files in them, and even if I did, I wouldn’t use them in every day use.
You’re too quick accusing people of lying, but ok:
“This is a lie, autorefresh works on my FC2 Gnome 2.6 system.”
If you use nautilus to say, create a folder, then yes, it apears automatically. If you create a file using another app or the terminal then it doesn’t, at least not on my slackware box.
“This is a lie, the window dissapears when I “rm -r” the folder.”
No, it disappears when you click on nautilus. Try it: create a folder, open the folder with nautilus, open terminal and rm -r it, and click on nautilus, or press refresh to see what happens.
“Please time it and give us figures.”
Around 20 seconds openning /usr/bin, so no images or movies for thumbnails on that one.
as for the rest about usability, just compare it yourself, here’s two screenshots from both my xp and slack:
xp: http://clientes.netvisao.pt/fagona/xp.jpg
slackware: http://clientes.netvisao.pt/fagona/slackware.jpg
notice how much better the filesystem tree is on xp file explorer.
That said, i do like gnome, for the most part it’s has good has windows (DE).
you’re not using fam, otherwise it wont auto refresh.
I have just compiled it from source, and i must say I quite like it. I am glad i installed it on a test system though (Slack 10) coz I have been hit with the never ending XKB bug that seems to affect the GNOME 2.x releases. Does anyone know how to fix it coz I can only use GNOME as root.
http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/teams/marketing/en/2004/two-eight-sc…
http://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/teams/marketing/en/2004/two-eight-sc…
Its clarity, available here:
http://gnome-look.org/content/show.php?content=15607