For those interested in looking at the screenshots for Solaris 10 (with gnome pre-installed) and a dmesg checkout here. Update: It seems that the site got OSNews’ed moments after the story went live.
Solaris 10: dmesg and Snapshots
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
It seems the bandwith limit on the above site has been reached…
-mag
Sorry Guys, but the Site seems to be down !!!
Btw, are there any Looking Glass screenies?
-mag
So fast disapeer this Snapshots
GNOME looks really good!
Solaris 10
I’m running a copy of Solaris 10 that I downloaded on August 18, 2003 on my ultra 5: UltraSparc 400 Mhz with 512MB of Ram and 9.1 GB IDE Harddrive. Its a nice machine I bought on eBay for CAD $360 (including shipping)…a very good deal, IMO. Anyways, without further wait: here’s is what you’re looking for:
* Dmesg for the Solaris box
* Screenshot of Solaris 10.
Solaris 10 by default comes with Gnome 2 preinstalled and used up about 1750 MB space during the inital install. In addition, most of you may need to install gcc-3.3 (about 110 MB) or SunPRO + other goodies you usually use on a *nix box. Too bad I can’t have sex with my neighbor on Solaris-SPARC as most of the dll’s don’t work on this processor. However, I’ve had pretty good success using xine. My only quirk is that mozilla is not shipped with it. However, you can very easily download the latest mozilla from Sun’s website.
Enjoy!! 🙂
-Bruno
Bruno.S.Delbono(NOSPAM)@Mail.AC
ive copied it to here
http://anyweb.kicks-ass.net/solaris10screenshot.png
cheers
anyweb
http://www.sun.com/2003-0805/feature/index.html
If the Mad Hatter screen shots are similar to Solaris 10, then the Sun UI looks like it’s made a giant leap forward.
http://anyweb.kicks-ass.net/solaris10screenshot.png
http://www.sun.com/2003-0805/feature/index.html
These are the default themes? Could they have chosen something better.
Couldn’t they hired UI designers from that other computer company they love so much (Apple) to create a simple theme.
Although I do like the menu structure.
the default XD2 theme looks better than the one found at http://www.sun.com/2003-0805/feature/index.html
going by that shot from Sun10 it would seem like they havn’t got render fully ported into their Xserver let, seen that the text is not antialiased, then again it’s a screenshot on a beta release, and it still looks alot better then CDE
John Blink (IP: —.wc.optusnet.com.au) – Posted on 2003-08-21 09:11:54
http://anyweb.kicks-ass.net/solaris10screenshot.png
http://www.sun.com/2003-0805/feature/index.html
These are the default themes? Could they have chosen something better.
Couldn’t they hired UI designers from that other computer company they love so much (Apple) to create a simple theme.
Although I do like the menu structure.
What are you going on about? I’ve just had a look at the screenshots, and IMHO, if people are still not using the SUN solution after what SUN has done, I really question whether these CIO’s are looking for an alternative or are they just using the *l* work to scare Microsoft into lowering their prices.
SUN has an alternative and unlike before, these aren’t half-assed attempts, they’re REAL solutions to REAL problems rather than the fictional crap Microsoft try to come up with, for example, Sharepoint. Do you know what most people use that for? forums, thats it, an internal discussion forum which could be done using PhP and Phorum.
Another example, what do most people use exchange for? most don’t use the advanced calandering features, they simply use it as a email server. In otherwords, they bought a canon to kill a flea.
Yet another would be the so-called “need” to use Office. Who said that a person “needs” to use Word just so they can write up a report/letter?
This is the type of crap which managers get sucked into. They get told by so-called “research groups”, yes, the same type of people who said xyz.com is a “GREAT BUY” are now giving advice about computers, that they “NEED” Microsoft software to be “PRODUCTIVE”.
How about some of these managers actually stepped outside the Microsoft reality distortion field for a few seconds, take a reality pill and actually look at the situation as it is. They keep chugging out money, for what? upgrades and patches that either fail to address the problem, address the problem but inefficiently or are extremely costly to maintain.
Worse still, I was talking to a mate who works for SUN. Talks to a customer, the first question, “What type of solutions are you looking at?”, just to strike off a conversation and to get a feel of what the customer wants. Guess what the customers says? “Oh, I want Outlook on the PCs……” and so forth. Question, if the person has already made up their mind on what they want, why consult someone over it? Why is there this “need” by some to assume that they “NEED” Outlook over another package?
It’s a shame the site got OSNews’sz’s’zed’sed…
On the other hand…is Sun going to put their own personal touches on the graphical side of GNOME? That would be quite nice.
I just mentioned the theme. Just look at it and try and find some usability issues. Other than that their solution is fine.
I can’t believe you posted so much text when I posted so little.
But yes your comments are valid on many posts.
Now something for you to smile about.
Today before my car got stolen (seriously), I was sitting a cryptography (yes I know so data doesn’t get stolen).
Anyway my lecture was spending about 5 minutes before swearing and other sort of cursing at a windows machine in the corner of the room used for a projector. He was trying to access his computer in his office.
He was saying “Bloody windows”, a student was shocked and said “why”, and the teacher turned and said to him “I use Linux buddy, for the last 10 years!!!The best thing that ever happened to me, getting away from this crap”
So yeah I guess there are solutions and people don’t need to get dependant on windows, because then you get stuck in their formats for everything.
Now look I have made a big post too ;B
Is Gnome integration any better than in Solaris 9 8/03 (the recently released one that first included Gnome 2)?
I was a little disappointed by that. While it basically works fine, there are some small annoyances that should be fixed easily (or so I guess), and would make Gnome look less like a second-class citizen. For example, lots of Solaris-specific stuff like the “Suspend” menu item isn’t in the Gnome menu (like next to “Lock Screen” and “Logout”, where I would have expected it), but only available in a “CDE” submenu, as are programs like the Solaris Management Console. Many packages do not show up in the Applications menu when installed, like the Sun-branded Mozilla, OpenOffice, or the Sun Download Manager – some of them do integrate themselves with CDE, though.
My impression was then Gnome 2 in Solaris 9 8/03 was definitly a step in the right direction, but not really done yet. I hope that will we better in Solaris 10.
(And btw., does anybody know which Gnome version they plan to include? Is it still 2.0?)
“He was saying “Bloody windows”, a student was shocked and said “why”, and the teacher turned and said to him “I use Linux buddy, for the last 10 years!!!The best thing that ever happened to me, getting away from this crap””
I still have yet to run into a person in real life who seems to know anything about Linux. Being a forty-something father/husband/surgeon, I may not fit the usual demographics for a free software enthusiast. Still, I am amazed how far off the radar screen Linux is for the general public, considering how much everyone could stand to benefit from having unrestricted access to free software on cheap commodity hardware. People generally don’t even imagine that it is a possibility. At a dinner party last night, people were talking about the recent msblast and sobig virus outbreaks, and I said that it isn’t a problem if one doesn’t run Windows. One person said something about getting a Mac. I suggested keeping your PC and running Linux, and the response was blank stares.
I just mentioned the theme. Just look at it and try and find some usability issues. Other than that their solution is fine.
I can’t believe you posted so much text when I posted so little.
But yes your comments are valid on many posts.
Compared to Windows XP default theme and the current Longhorn screenshots, and SUNs original them, IMHO, the theme used is awsome. It is visually appealing, yet, not distracting.
This is not going to be used on a desktop but at a corporate workstation, also, one has to also take into accoutn the fact that SUN sells Server + Thin-Client packages so this will be most likely part of that package.
Now something for you to smile about.
Today before my car got stolen (seriously), I was sitting a cryptography (yes I know so data doesn’t get stolen).
Anyway my lecture was spending about 5 minutes before swearing and other sort of cursing at a windows machine in the corner of the room used for a projector. He was trying to access his computer in his office.
He was saying “Bloody windows”, a student was shocked and said “why”, and the teacher turned and said to him “I use Linux buddy, for the last 10 years!!!The best thing that ever happened to me, getting away from this crap”
So yeah I guess there are solutions and people don’t need to get dependant on windows, because then you get stuck in their formats for everything.
Now look I have made a big post too ;B
Well, thats Murphys Law in action. Goto a lecture about security and something gets pinched.
As for the teacher, that isn’t uncommon. My operating systems teacher asked, “what operating systems are out there”, every student, except me and a few others, replied something from Microsoft. His reply was, “is someone going to name a REAL operating system?”. Me, in my smugness shouted out “VMS”, and I promptly shouted a can of Coke 😉
Hatred of Microsoft and all things inferior seperates the IT desk jockeys from the people who are really passionate about IT. IMHO, if a person isn’t passionate about their job, maybe they should look at entering another field.
“He was saying “Bloody windows”, a student was shocked and said “why”, and the teacher turned and said to him “I use Linux buddy, for the last 10 years!!!The best thing that ever happened to me, getting away from this crap””
I still have yet to run into a person in real life who seems to know anything about Linux. Being a forty-something father/husband/surgeon, I may not fit the usual demographics for a free software enthusiast. Still, I am amazed how far off the radar screen Linux is for the general public, considering how much everyone could stand to benefit from having unrestricted access to free software on cheap commodity hardware. People generally don’t even imagine that it is a possibility. At a dinner party last night, people were talking about the recent msblast and sobig virus outbreaks, and I said that it isn’t a problem if one doesn’t run Windows. One person said something about getting a Mac. I suggested keeping your PC and running Linux, and the response was blank stares.
Although I’ll most likely get raped and pillaged by the OpenGroup, when I mention Linux, I immediately follow it up by, “oh, its a type of UNIX”, and there is a “oh, how easy is it”. That is the great thing with UNIX, it is like the word mainframe. The word UNIX conjures up ideas of realiability, security, super computers and all things hi-tech. If you mention that Linux is a UNIX AND can run on a desktop AND has a nice graphical user interface, the response is “ooh, could you install it for me?”.
If you mention that Linux is a UNIX AND can run on a desktop AND has a nice graphical user interface, the response is “ooh, could you install it for me
Did you ever consider, hey there is something called FreeBSD which is also Unixlike but is a lot easier to keep up2date and smoother in most things you’d like to do?
Or is it because Linux is a hype you prefer saying Linux to everyone instead?
Hatred of Microsoft and all things inferior seperates the zealots from sane people. IMHO, if a person is too passonate about operating systems maybe they should turn off their computer and discover the real world.
If that UI gets any uglier, I would need to have my eyes plucked out in the most barbaric manner to quell my utter disgust. Okay, so if they have extremely untalented artists – use GNOME’s default!
Yes, Windows XP requires you to squirm in order to read the text on that way default – NOT. Windows XP has small tiny widgets that is also extremely boxy and so 80s – not. Heck, the only thing I can think that Windows XP is bad is the default colour scheme, which as they say, customizable.
And then you also cite Longhorn, which is at best 2 years away from delivary and probably would be even more far off, you seem to be sure that Longhorn would look the same.
“Hatred of Microsoft and all things inferior seperates the zealots from sane people. IMHO, if a person is too passonate about operating systems maybe they should turn off their computer and discover the real world.
Believe it or not the computer is part of the “real world” – operating system companies also exist in the “real world”
No, it is about people seeing the FACTS instead of being sucked into Microsofts reality distortion field.
The constant promoting, hyping and so-called “conferences” would make anyone blind to the bloody obvious. Sure, choose Microsoft but make sure you know the FULL story instead of just sucking down the latest hype generated by a software companies.
This goes for EVERY company, not just Microsoft. Choose technology based on the FACTS not the HYPE. The hype sounds great but in 12 months time, when the reality distortion field slowly wears down, you will be left with a piece software or hardware which doesn’t live up to the hype.
But of course, when the next lot of hype comes along, you’ll be sucked right into it again, and make the SAME mistake AGAIN without learning a thing. Again, after 12 months, you’ll have the same self doubt and then wonder why you made the decision. Its a continuous cycle and people don’t learn a bloody thing no matter how many times it has been repeated.
Hardware and software purchases, I stress should be based purely and utterly on the facts. What are the problems, what can the hardware and software combination do, and do they line up? there is no use purchasing software that does not address the problem, but you simply chose it because it is based my zyx company.
With that being said, there is no use buying a solution which is equal to killing a flea with a canon. For example, if you have a mail server, and all it will do is relay email, why would one need exchange when the build in Windows server or Sendmail could do the job quite nicely?
As I said previously, TOO MANY software purchases are done purely on religous zealotry rather than looking at the facts. Windows 2003 is a very capable server when run on good quality hardware, however, in some cases, FreeBSD or Solaris could do a better job.
It is about using the right tool for the right job based purely on the facts NOT emotional or religious rhetoric.
I own Microsoft software and some software they produce is VERY good, however, some of it is crap. Microsoft is like every other company, they have their good products and bad, and it up to the consumer to stop being blinded by the brand and buy the good products regardless of what the vendor is.
If a good combination is Windows 2003 with Lotus Domino, then why turn it down in favour of simply being an “all Microsoft shop”? If Windows 2003 with Novell eDirectory does a good job, why then turn it down in favour for Active Directory simply in favour of being an all Microsoft shop?
You think this sort of thing doesn’t happen? it does, every day. People so-called “stanardising” on a vendor, not because its the best solution but purely on religious grounds. Its like the Vendor who says, “oh, I’ll only use SUN One Application server on Solaris SPARC”, not because it is a good combination but because you want to be an all SUN shop. Again, same situation, if BEA Application Server does a better job, then that is what you should chose, based on the FACTS.
As for Xbe, I would suggest FreeBSD but I don’t want to constantly be teaching them how to install things from the ports, also, the hardware support for FreeBSD is a lot lower. If all things were equal, I would promote FreeBSD, heck, I used longer than I used Linux, I know its capabilities, however, I am not blind to its limitations as a desktop for an average user.
Ok, lets use the typical Eugenia Loli-Queru tag, “who cares if that is the default, that is what the user sees first. The user shouldn’t need to customise their operating system to get things working acceptably”.
If the colour scheme is shit, then Microsoft should never have used it, simply as that. Stop trying to dodge the facts. The Windows XP Default desktop setup, the desktop setup the user gets FIRST, the desktop setup users AREN’T likely to tweak, it plain shit. Instead of making up excuses for a multibillion dollar company, how about look at the facts objectively instead of through rose tinted glasses.
>> I own Microsoft software
No, you don’t.
Having bought a license on a product and owning software are 2 different worlds.
Is 10 going to be offered to x86 users for free again? please?
Is Sun Linux available for download? Is it going to be released for free via ISO?
I really like the new sun desktop.
It looks way better than the solaris 9 GUI (x86) that I am using now
– looks to have more features too 
(GO SUN!)
> No, you don’t.
> Having bought a license on a product and owning software are 2
> different worlds.
My Guess is:
a) You’re a lawyer
b) You work for Microsoft
c) You’re a hardcore FSF advocate who can’t quite get the message across effectively
c) You have a lot of spare time
What he meant was he OWNS THE SOFTWARE and he shall do whatever he please with it because he’s paid company X money for it. Why is this concept so hard to grasp. I think life would be a lot simpler if people would allow thers to say things that aren’t “technically correct” but convey the message. If I’ve just paid $1,200 for an office suite I’ll be damn well furious if I’m not allowed to say “I own it”.
>> I am amazed how far off the radar screen Linux is for the general public
>>
No kidding, and I think the situation is even much worse, because you don’t actually have to vendor as far out as the public to meet stunning linux ignorance. While shopping for memory, I took my laptop to a couple of computer shops a few months back. While all the technicians I spoke had heared about linux, every single one of them was completely stunned and amazed to see someone actually running a linux desktop! And these are the same technicians that recommend and sell white box computers to the public. We need to work harder!
I never dodge that. I hate Windows XP default. But then again, a whole lot of people do. I also hate Aqua, and other gee-wiz UIs. I like stuff like BlueCurve, modern and not boring, yet completely functional and not flashy.
But you missed my point completely. Solaris 10 default is wwwwwwwwwwwwwaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy more terrible than Windows XP default, and comparing Longhorn, a product bound to be changed drastically (see just about every other major Windows release). Small text, lack of contrast between the default wallpaper and the icons and its text labels – heck, the wallpaper itself looks so amateur, it makes Windows XP teletubbyland one look like a piece of fine art. I’m not going into looks, I’m going into functionality. Not too many people I know can live with such small text.
But even so, Solaris 10 does look exceedingly ugly to me. Only blue and green are calming colours – yellow isn’t. Certainly much better than using bright red, but still a stupid choice of colours. Everything about it speaks unprofessionalism. They are far better off sticking to GNOME default, which isn’t too shabby.
But that’s not my point, my point again is that Windows XP is way better than Solaris. Just take out your anti-MS hat and admit that.
These screen shots would have been nice in 1995 or even 1998. In 2003, with OS X and XP and even KDE raising the bar, these shots are butt-ugly. I am not sure if these machines are meant to be workstations or desktops, but whatever they are, a big company like SUN should be doing much better. Get some good graphics people, for Xt’s sake. With this, SUN will continue to suck and lag way behind when it comes to desktops.
People standardize on one vendor for convinience and business sack. Additional discounts come with more licenses purchased, plus support can be taken from one company. In addition to the fact that there is some assurance the software would work together, although most of the time it isn’t true.
But on religious grounds?
I don’t know too many people that religiously support MS without being on their paylist.
And you say you aren’t blind to the limitations for a desktop, but what about the fact that Linux lacks a whole lot of apps, especially customized apps used in many companies? Though matter how secure, easy to use, blah blah blah the OS is, if it can’t do anything, it is as useful as a desk ornament.
What he meant was he OWNS THE SOFTWARE and he shall do whatever he please with it because he’s paid company X money for it.
Well, he can’t do everything he pleases with it. In the EULA that he must accept to use it, there are limits specified. Not that there aren’t any in free software, but your affirmation is too utopic
I never dodge that. I hate Windows XP default. But then again, a whole lot of people do. I also hate Aqua, and other gee-wiz UIs. I like stuff like BlueCurve, modern and not boring, yet completely functional and not flashy.
So the issue isn’t looks but functionality. Why then do you proceed to call it ugly when the issues you have raised have NOTHING to do with looks.
But that’s not my point, my point again is that Windows XP is way better than Solaris. Just take out your anti-MS hat and admit that.
Great, when a person loses an argument, why the heck not just call them anti-MS? I “license/own” Microsoft software, the only problem is YOU whe have a problem with people who are willing to LIKE and LOATH Microsoft at the same time.
People standardize on one vendor for convinience and business sack. Additional discounts come with more licenses purchased, plus support can be taken from one company. In addition to the fact that there is some assurance the software would work together, although most of the time it isn’t true.
Do you know what it means in the long run? the vendor then has you by the short and curlies. They know it will cost a fortune to migrate due to all the proprietary crap they’ve bundled in the so-called package, so, they up the price, aka, License 6. Why put all your eggs into one basket? it makes no sense.
Just look at the companies now have have “standardised” on Windows/MSOffice and now are looking at an alternative. They’re now so reliant on Micosoft that they can’t move from one vendor to another without majorly disrupting the business.
But on religious grounds? I don’t know too many people that religiously support MS without being on their paylist.
You would be surprised. I worked at an ISP once, a so-called MCSE was completely clueless about any solution besides what Microsoft provides. This is your a-typical zealot. He can’t be bother learning anything new, sits on his certificate and blindly props up a company based on cheap rhetoric from the companies website.
This ISP was a joke, Windows for the dial in servers, MySQL for the authentication database, Access for the website database! yes, I am being serious. Thank god I left, in a VERY big hurry.
And you say you aren’t blind to the limitations for a desktop, but what about the fact that Linux lacks a whole lot of apps, especially customized apps used in many companies? Though matter how secure, easy to use, blah blah blah the OS is, if it can’t do anything, it is as useful as a desk ornament.
DAAAAAAH, that is why I don’t run Linux. You really are thick if you can’t even read what I have wrote both in this thread and other threads on this site. I see the reality out there, however, I do see people make REALLY stupid decisions when making software due to some sort of religious loyality they have to a particular company rather than looking at the facts and what alternative vendors can provide, not only has a homogeneous solution but also mixing and matching products from difference companies.
When you said wwaaayyyyyy, I was thinking even CDE in all its purple glory looks better than that GNOME theme. That looks like some stupid theme out of enlightnment.
GNOME defaults look better than sorry that is just my opinion to everybody.
The minimise, maximise, close are just too small, notice how they tried to make them look like the top part of screws.
Also things like scrollbars are made to look like rounded metal or something.
I can tell you someone using it as a workstation won’t like it. Unless they are some geek who is an ALIENS movie fan or something.
Whoops I was looking at Mad hatter screenshots,
http://www.sun.com/2003-0805/feature/images/defaultevolution_scrnsh…
but still this isn’t any better
http://anyweb.kicks-ass.net/solaris10screenshot.png
Bruno Saverio Delbono is that the default?
No its because anyone pretty much can install Linux. Hardware detection etc is far superior if your are using Redhat, SuSE, Mandrake, etc,. Hardware support for Linux is also superior to that of FreeBSD.
Those are facts, which is why Linux is an option for the regular user and FreeBSD is not.
RANT WARNING
I’m in a bad mood right now.
RANT WARNING
Those screenshots don’t tell anything on the OS. I couldn’t care less if the UI looks slick or is 8-colors. It’s about responsiveness, intuitivity, stability, efficiency.
The only problem is that, for an UI, you need designers. Not pixel artists, not l33t code h4x0rz, but designers, and in that department I have never seen worse as in any given UN*X clone, period.
Torn between “don’t complain, it’s free”, “if you don’t like it, change the source”, and “it works for me”, 98% of the “free software” community have no idea what it takes to make a user interface – be it text based or graphical.
And Solaris using Gnome… well… I’m working on some of the most expensive Sun hardware available almost every day, and I’ve never seen more of that machine than a bash and a drive share. For me, Solaris is a damn fine OS given that it’s a UN*X clone – which might be due to the fact that I don’t have to administrate the beast.
And now most comments here underline that shortcoming in understanding what makes an OS by arguing which goddamn skin or theme looks “better”…
That being said, let me flame some more:
> Or is it because Linux is a hype you prefer saying
> Linux to everyone instead?
Oh yeah, now that one Windows alternative even gets close to be generally usable, it’s suddenly no longer PC to name it because it’s unfair to the “other alternative”, which, after all, is just one more goddamn flavor of UN*X. Peppermint or Spearmint, it’s still Wrigley’s chewing gum.
One urgent message to the folks behind Linux, FreeBSD, NetBSD, OpenBSD, HURD, and whatever else “free” UN*X clones are out there:
UN*X is the worst case of patched-together legacy crap I’ve ever seen. The only reason I could ever picture of people choosing UN*X clones over Windows is because, between Microsoft, “pro” UN*X clones and the “free software” zealots, you very effectively wiped out any other alternative.
Bah.
FreeBSD indeed has bad hardware detection. But why don’t you try NetBSD or OpenBSD? Because they have an old-fasioned, monolithic 6 MB kernel, they can autodetect almost all hardware like sound cards, USB storage devices, USB drawing tablets and such.
Unfortunately, setting up a printer is horrible on all BSD’s, I haven’t managed it with either apsfilter/lpd (does not print, even when configured) or cups (does not see my parallel port) 🙁
For the rest, that Gnome screenshot looks really ugly! If they don’t use anti-aliasing, they could at least have chosen a font that is a bit *readable* instead of that one.
And I’ll end with a question: does anyone know if Sun changed Gnome to display that nice “Shutdown/Reboot/Cancel” dialog when you press the power button on the keyboard?
> …because anyone pretty much can install Linux.
> Hardware detection etc is far superior if your
> are using Redhat, SuSE, Mandrake, etc,. Hardware
> support for Linux is also superior to that of FreeBSD.
>
> Those are facts, which is why Linux is an option for
> the regular user and FreeBSD is not.
Thanks for the laugh! That brought my blood pressure back down after writing the flame above.
Following that line of arguing, it’ll still be Windows for 95% of the desktop users for another ten or twenty years…
Give me:
* drivers I can install without using a compiler;
* drivers that don’t require me to know the exact distro / compiler / kernel combination of my system;
* drivers I don’t have to update for the next kernel;
* drivers I can install with a click-n-run;
* kernel updates I can just click-n-run;
* apps and tools I can just install without having to download sh**loads of dependencies;
* a default service menu (as in, Start button clone) that has a meaningful, intuitive, non-cluttered layout;
…and we are *halfway* to an “option for the regular user”.
Sorry but in this department, either Linux and *BSD are still behind 1980‘s standards.
“What he meant was he OWNS THE SOFTWARE and he shall do whatever he please with it because he’s paid company X money for it. Why is this concept so hard to grasp. I think life would be a lot simpler if people would allow thers to say things that aren’t “technically correct” but convey the message. If I’ve just paid $1,200 for an office suite I’ll be damn well furious if I’m not allowed to say “I own it”.”
I am not a lawyer, or any of the other things you posted either. Unfortunately, read the EULA, and you will see that you have a license to use it and you do own the media, however you do not own the software. As such you can not do anything you want with it no matter how much you paid. That is the part that needs to change IMHO.
> Give me:
>
>* drivers I can install without using a compiler;
>* drivers that don’t require me to know the exact distro / >compiler / kernel combination of my system;
>* drivers I don’t have to update for the next kernel;
>* drivers I can install with a click-n-run;
>* kernel updates I can just click-n-run;
>* apps and tools I can just install without having to
> download sh**loads of dependencies;
>* a default service menu (as in, Start button clone) that
> has a meaningful, intuitive, non-cluttered layout;
Just a quick set of questions.
1) How often do YOU install drivers? There aren’t that many out there.
2) RedHat, SuSE, Mandrake, Gentoo, Debian, FreeBSD have pretty good package management systems for new apps and usually take care of this for you. My wife loves YAST and she seems to be able to add new apps and their associated dep’s without problems (and she isn’t a computer geek, only married to one).
3) You can modify menus to suit your needs.
IMHO these are non-issues since drivers and adding apps are a rare thing once a box is set up. Perhaps you can enlighten me a bit…
That screenshot is not the default Sun shipped theme. The screen shot posted is the users own theme. The sun theme has a purple solaris logo on the background and is simple and clean.
>> b) You work for Microsoft
😀
No, sorry.
I installed Solaris 10 Preview on my Ultra 30 with 1 GB of RAM and two 9 GB disks, Gnome performs about the same as the FCS version downloaded from Sun with the Media Library upgrades. On anything less than two CPU’s Gnome performance sucks, and in my experience this has been the case since 1.4 (installed on a dual processor Sparc 20, dual processor Celeron rig, and an Ultra 2).
The is a new install cluster called Reduced Network Support that weighs in a few MB below a core install (SUNWreq) which I haven’t had a chance to use.
I cannot get Solaris Management Console (SMC) to work, the default gateway is printed to screen every time the system boots, and Solaris Express documentation (Solaris 10 Preview) is password protected. I really wanted to play with Solaris Zones (partitioning a machine).
And nobody has mentioned that the “release” of Solaris 10 is a mistake on Sun’s part, it was not supposed to be released until September.
Yeah, the screenshot looks terrible. The theme is unattractive and unprofessional looking. I doubt this is their default theme (the Mad Hatter screenshots that were also posted here look much better though still not great). But hey, it is just a theme.
Hopefully, Sun will finish implementing the AA text render extensions before the release (and use better fonts like the free Bitstream ones).
Regardless, I’m glad they are working on their Gnome desktop. It looks like an advance beyond CDE and should lend some corporate credibility/acceptance to the Gnome project.
OSNers’ed just doesn’t sound as cool as /.’ed. :p
Hi Guyz,
I’m the admin for mail.ac (and the one with the snapshot). There were sitewide restrictions on the bw, and I’ve upped the values 😉
Enjoy
-Bruno
The default is:
– Crux Theme
– Solaris background (similar to gnome 2 you can find on sun’s site)
I’ve added/changed some themes and ofcourse the background.
Gnome is pretty nicely integrated within the OS now. However, its still missing some core components which most people would most likely use:
– Evolution
– Proper sundtmail. It still can’t read Maildir or connect to cyrus based imap servers (and I’m running SunOne Messsaging Server!)
– Comes with java media player (dunno how well it works)
– xmms/xchat etc. need to be compiled
etc. Otherwise, if you read the dmesg, you can see that there is something new: KERNEL CAGE. I haven’t been able to find any info on it though.
-Bruno
Here is where you can try out Solaris 10:
http://wwws.sun.com/software/solaris/programs/trailblazer/get.html
-Bruno
Anything new regarding support for common video cards?
For x86? You can use Xfree porting kit
http://developers.sun.com/solaris/developer/support/driver/tools/vi…
I got a SparcStation 20 with 2 processors SuperSparc. I have Solaris 9 running in this box. Will be Solaris 10 for sun4m??
BSDero
sun4m is not supported in solaris 10.
All sun4u are however supported.
HCL for SPARC
http://wwws.sun.com/software/solaris/programs/pilot/supported_platf…
HCL for x86
http://soldc.sun.com/support/drivers/hcl/index.html
Yellowdog Linux 3.0 with GNOME 2.x, probably 2.2.x, is more responsive on a G4 400 Mhz Mac than a 2.2 Ghz P4 Compaq. So it should be quick on a Sun box, but in my experience it is not.
I have a feeling these performance problems will be fixed soon if they haven’t been fixed already.
“I installed Solaris 10 Preview on my Ultra 30 with 1 GB of RAM and two 9 GB disks, Gnome performs about the same as the FCS version downloaded from Sun with the Media Library upgrades.”
gnome support for Media library is not compiled into solaris 10 builds. Just do a pldd on a gnome process id. Look for libmlib in any of the dynamic libraries. You won’t find any.
I have heard they are going to support medialib 2.2 which just came out that has better performance (blending functions gnome uses a lot of) than 2.1. So Solaris 10 with media library will be faster than the pervious versions compiled with version 2.1.
See media lib readme for fixes and API additions.
http://www.sun.com/microelectronics/vis/download/mlib/README
“Give me:
* drivers I can install without using a compiler;
* drivers that don’t require me to know the exact distro / compiler / kernel combination of my system;
* drivers I don’t have to update for the next kernel;
* drivers I can install with a click-n-run;
* kernel updates I can just click-n-run;
* apps and tools I can just install without having to download sh**loads of dependencies;
* a default service menu (as in, Start button clone) that has a meaningful, intuitive, non-cluttered layout;
…and we are *halfway* to an “option for the regular user”.
Sorry but in this department, either Linux and *BSD are still behind 1980’s standards.”
I’m sorry, but this is a very weak argument. First of all, you don’t need a compiler to install drivers if they are available as binaries. Secondly, one driver doesn’t work on just any version of Windows either. Why do you expect it to be different on any other operating system? Granted, it is easier for Windows to have clearly packaged drivers because there are only a few very well defined versions they need to support. This isn’t true in Linux. However, there are only a few versions of BSD. So that argument still doesn’t fly. Now I can understand the fustration with the dependancy problem, but what else can you do with the applications aren’t coming from a single source? This has nothing to do with having a modern design. Lastly, who says the start menu is a good thing?
> Just a quick set of questions.
>
> 1) How often do YOU install drivers? There aren’t
> that many out there.
With drivers not included in / not successfully autodetected by the setup, well, after each system update because I have yet to see a system *update* that works – so far, I have to reinstall, which means installing any “custom” drivers all over again.
Also, so far any Linux I’ve been trying sucks at autodetecting any hardware / peripherals that weren’t present at system setup. (Since I am using a laptop, new peripherals are the rule instead of the exception.)
And since I have so far been utterly unable to get my whole system running smoothly under Linux, add endless nights of installing, re-installing, re-compiling, and giving up using Linux for another 6-9 months (which is when I come back to see if situation has improved).
> 2) RedHat, SuSE, Mandrake, Gentoo, Debian, FreeBSD
> have pretty good package management systems for new
> apps and usually take care of this for you.
I still have to download ’em. If I download tool A, I expect tool A to run. Without having to download tool B, library C and installing yet another windowing toolset.
> 3) You can modify menus to suit your needs.
Which would require me to understand each and every entry, which tool is superior, which is redundant, and assuming that I actually will invest time in reorganizing what should be a commodity!
> IMHO these are non-issues since drivers and adding
> apps are a rare thing once a box is set up.
Copy that on the apps, if you are satisfied with them. (I had to try, uh, >10 text editors before finding one that even comes close to what I expect. Hint: Neither vi nor Emacs.)
Drivers are another issue. Let’s see: inbuild (PS/2) touchpad, two different external USB mice (one fitting my hand, one for my wife). That’s sheer hell all on it’s own.
Inbuilt PS/2 keyboard, external USB one… more woes.
External SCSI scanner via PC-Card SCSI adapter… nope, didn’t get it to work so far.
Internal 1024×768 LCD when mobile, 1280×1024 CRT when docked… well, I figured *that* out, but only after great lengths of pain.
Canon BJC connected to a router / WLAN AP / printserver combo… much mojo required there, too.
The list goes on. All of that stuff runs under Windows readily out-of-the-box, or after running some setup.exe gathered from the web.
Yes, sure Windows is better supported by the hardware vendors. Well, too bad – that’s why the UN*X clones aren’t “there” yet by a long shot. And I have better things to do than accepting an environment that gives me pain, problems, and malfunctioning peripherals at every end.
Giving Linux another try every 6 or 9 months is the best you can hope for from anyone who doesn’t see an OS as religion.
> First of all, you don’t need a compiler to install
> drivers if they are available as binaries.
If, that’s the point.
> Secondly, one driver doesn’t work on just any version
> of Windows either.
That’s why they usually come bundled together, with the setup.exe making the choice for you.
> Why do you expect it to be different on any other
> operating system?
I don’t. I expect the driver setup to take care of such bull without bothering me.
> Granted, it is easier for Windows to have clearly
> packaged drivers because there are only a few very
> well defined versions they need to support. This
> isn’t true in Linux.
Choice is so beneficial…
> However, there are only a few versions of BSD.
How many brands of Linux does the average user know of? Two?
And while all magazines are full of “how to get Linux to run in 21 days”, where’s the help Joe Average gets with *BSD?
> Now I can understand the fustration with the
> dependancy problem, but what else can you do
> with the applications aren’t coming from a
> single source?
Wait a minute… Adobe, Microsoft, IDM, GPSoft, RedHat, Micrographix, half a dozen Shareware authors… can’t say my applications are coming from a single source. Not a single dependency there. How come?
> This has nothing to do with having a modern design.
I disagree.
> Lastly, who says the start menu is a good thing?
Give me a different, quick, intuitive way of starting my apps without having to type path/executable name in a shell, that’s available even when I maximized windows, and I’m a happy camper.
Windows “Start” works for me. AmigaOS ToolDaemon or DirectoryOpus LaunchBar worked for me.
KDE/Gnome “Start” button clones don’t work for me, because they are cluttered with loads of stuff I never knowingly installed, I don’t know about, and I damn well don’t care about except for the fact that it gets into my way when I want to start the apps I need.
Wait a minute… Adobe, Microsoft, IDM, GPSoft, RedHat, Micrographix, half a dozen Shareware authors… can’t say my applications are coming from a single source. Not a single dependency there. How come?
Because they either:
a) have all dependencies built in, wasting lots of disk space, or
b) still have all dependencies in their SETUP.EXE and place them in the system directory.
So the system Windows uses, wastes lots of bandwidth, and sometimes disk space too.
I still have to download ’em. If I download tool A, I expect tool A to run. Without having to download tool B, library C and installing yet another windowing toolset.
See above, both systems have their advantage and if you don’t like the UNIX way, then shut up and use Windows.
That’s why they usually come bundled together, with the setup.exe making the choice for you.
There are just as much websites where you need to pick a setup.exe specially suited for your Windows version.
> Why do you expect it to be different on any other
> operating system?
I don’t. I expect the driver setup to take care of such bull without bothering me.
Let’s turn it around for once. When I install Windows on my PC, my video card + sound card + monitor + printer + zipdrive are *not* detected automatically, for *each of them* I need to surf to the manufactorer’s website, search the driver section for the appropriate driver, download it, install it and reboot.
When I install SuSE Linux, *all this hardware* either works automatically, or can be installed using a simple wizard, *without* surfing the web and all such troubles!!!
So what do you want? The Windows solution of “search search search think download install reboot configure reboot”, or the Linux solution of “configure”?
> So the system Windows uses, wastes lots of bandwidth,
> and sometimes disk space too.
I prefer either over wasting my time. Bandwidth and disk space become ever more readily available. My time, on the other hand, is limited, and best spent on my projects instead of setting up the environment.
> There are just as much websites where you need to
> pick a setup.exe specially suited for your Windows
> version.
At least I know which version my OS is. (Even while I really loathe that bull idea of calling an OS by a year / name instead of a proper version number.)
Which is the version of your OS? Is it the kernel? The distro? Desktop? What?
> Let’s turn it around for once. When I install Windows
> on my PC, my video card + sound card + monitor + printer
> + zipdrive are *not* detected automatically…
Gimme a break: You claim you need drivers for your monitor? Or your zip drive?
> for *each of them* I need to surf to the manufactorer’s
> website, search the driver section for the appropriate
> driver, download it, install it and reboot.
1) Where did you lose the driver disks that came with the hardware?
2) Don’t give me the “reboot after every install” or I’ll claim no “free” UN*X can do 3D acceleration. We’re not talking about Win95 vs. Linux 1.x here.
> When I install SuSE Linux, *all this hardware* either
> works automatically, or can be installed using a simple
> wizard, *without* surfing the web and all such
> troubles!!!
Tell that my WLAN card, my printer, and my card reader.
You also dodged the subject of multiple HID in the system, which makes at least RedHat and SuSE throw up hard.
> So what do you want? The Windows solution of “search
> search search think download install reboot configure
> reboot”, or the Linux solution of “configure”?
Oh come on. As if SuSE has drivers for everything and WinXP doesn’t. As if I don’t have to search the net for a Linux driver if the distro doesn’t have one. As if it’s easier to find drivers somewhere as to find them on the manufacturer homepage. As if I don’t have to think before downloading the right Linux driver. As if I never have to reboot a system because some nifty feature requires me to rebuild the kernel.
I won’t argue about Microsoft being a monstrous monopoly. I won’t argue about Windows being not a good, enjoyable OS. I won’t argue that a viable alternative is overdue. I won’t argue that Linux is closer to being a viable alternative than any other OS out there, except perhaps for MacOS X which I haven’t tried because the hardware dongle (“Apple computer”) coming with it.
I will argue the point that Linux (or any other UN*X clone) is that much better than Windows, or ever will be.
Can no one on this site read? if you read the article, the screen shots are not from the default installation of solaris 10. The guy fixed them to his liking. I don’t see why this story was even posted, it didn’t show anything except for some guys custom gnome setup.