Microsoft has urged businesses running Windows XP to upgrade their machines to take advantage of added security features, but only a quarter of XP corporate machines have been upgraded to Service Pack 2, according to a new study.
Businesses slow to move to SP2
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Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
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gree microsft.. I find a lot of the apps my clients use are still not supported (e.g. some of the sol6 suite) under xpsp2 yet microsoft are removing the sp2 blocker.
for big companies, they are aware of how potentially damaging SP2 can be (to existing, working systems I mean) – I think a lot want to sit back and wait for the bug reports to come in first.
However, I do think the upgrade/bug fix/windows update needs a serious think through. for many companies monitoring the available updates and then managing them across perhaps hundreds or thousands of computers (possibly over many locations) is a full time job in itself.
-although to be fair, this isn’t JUST a microsoft thing. Linux is way gulty of that too!
I think most folks and organizations are just tired of upgrading everytime they turn around, especially when they just got what they have working fine.
It’s a real shame how Microsoft has positioned itself to treat Win2000 like a 2nd class OS. But then again, I think they’ll come to regret this as many of my clients refuse to upgrade to XP (Redmond’s backing off of support for XP RTM doesn’t help, they treat the orignal XP like a 2nd class citizen, wow), perfectly happy with a solid Win2000 environment “that just works” and doesn’t require new hardware to keep XP happy.
Many are also seeing that going to XP SP2 also means taking a performance hit. Granted it’s usually just a few percetage points on certain benchmarks, but it’s just more bloat for most folks, especially if you don’t do a clean reload. Upgrading on top of previous XP installations can be a real nasty hit-n-miss deal, plenty of horror stories out there.
Doesnt’ matter to me, many of my customers are going to stick with Win2000 for the foreseable future. Then they will examine Longhorn versus Linux, if they even wait for Longhorn. Like Intel, Microsoft’s lack of a clear strategy and roadmap is turning a lot of folks off.
Just my 2cents worth, flame all ye wish.
In other news, businesses are stupid and use lots of broken software (ie, ActiveX) that they’re not willing to replace (ie, it would cost money).
There are still folks out there installing NT 4 on new systems.
I installed SP 2 as soon as it was available, and turned off the built-in firewall right away (because my office and my home have real firewalls). Not a single problem on any of the machines. Then again, I’m not risk-averse and conservative.
– chrish
I have not put sp2 on my office workstations either, It is causing to many problems with software that is critical, by just adding sp2 is breaks lots of software we cant live with out, Btw turning off the firewall does not help. it is some of the other”security” parts that break them. I just keep my vs up to date. and keep our company firewalls and content filtering running.
Home users are as well. At least this home user is. I have not even installed SP1 simply because I have no reason to. I run Firefox for the Web, Thunderbird for email, Kerio Personal Firewall and Kaspersky AVP for antivirus. I don’t need a SP.
Programs such as what?
I love ancedotal claims so vague you can’t verify a single line of it, but needing to be taken on faith.
Here’s one of my own: A clean SP2 installation has given me zero compatability issues with any of the programs I’ve ever worked with. To me, programs getting firewalled out is a non-issue and is more about user training — something many Windows users likely need. The only cases of service pack installs going ape that I can verify has been traced to things such as Norton AV, Theme service hacks and deeply-rooted spyware.
If you have an application that’s trashed due to SP2, I’m more willing to point fingers at the application developer than Microsoft. The app developer has had a long time in SP2’s beta to test and patch, it’s certainly out in the field now.. And I’m likely guessing they’re going about something completely wrong — given that a majority of apps still function fine. This is similar to many apps that refuse to run under non-Administrator level accounts.
Hopefully after XP SP2/Win2k3 SP1 and IE7 the big need for remaining absolutely current will diminish greatly. *THAT* is more up to Microsoft and the quality of their work.
I’m afraid the NX-bit like technology in SP2 sometimes breaks things.Although it seems to run outstandingly with AMD64 systems who enable hardware support for SP2’s noexec memory features as well.But you can turn it all off by the way.
http://nonadmin.editme.com/
What the market needs is better guidance about how to configure Doze.
Seems bizarre that Mr. Softy isn’t overtly sponsoring such an awareness campaign about how to configure their operating systems. Maybe they are, and someone can help point to it. In the meantime, something is better than nothing.
It seems odd to me that we are blaming IT for this problem. Seems to me that IT is only doing it due diligence to make sure they don’t further the destruction that is Microsoft inside their networks and on their desktops. If Microsoft had Windows XP secure in the first place then a major patch of this nature would not cause any trouble, but in fact since WindowsXP is in my opinion, is crap, then a patch of this nature does just that. Makes XP secure? (again you need to define secure.) and make all the apps that depend on the insecurities of XP to not run as designed.
Just to help I don’t call an OS (XP) with over 300,000 potential viruses, Trojans, or other ailments secure. You should not have to by anti-virus software for your OS to protect it from things the OS should not allow in the first place.
If you are an IT manager and are leading companies IT department and have not even talked about this problem of the fact that there are two other OSs (Linux & MacOSX) that are far more stable and secure then YOU SHOULD BE FIRED! Yes I said it. I thing the majority of IT manager and CIOs are all just as stupid as the paper they pay you with. This is coming from someone who is in your shoes and has to deal with the likes of all of you from time to time. You are as dumb as a box of rocks and do not have the companies best interest in mind, only your own. The savings of getting rid of you security team that patches desktops alone would drop in half, not to mention the fact the Windows is still really hard to use and has way to many problems for as old as it is and as many folks it takes to create it. It the fact that the better part of the worlds PCs run Windows would directly effect the stability and the ease of use then you would also think that XP would be the best damn thing out there, but it’s not? We continue to prop up a company that delivers poor solutions that given all work together, but wt what cost long term?
It’s like they selling us the most expensive car on the road and asking us to bring in the car for service every other week and that it might just fail at any given time without warning. You would never buy that car, but yet they continue to by XP…..
SP2 is merely the tip of the IT/Data Centers worlds problems, the narrow minded IT directors that prop up MS and continue to ignore the rest of the IT world are all just self involved, self absorbed morons and you all need to really take a look at the illness and not the symptoms.
as I have worn in my machine more and more, little problems have come up… like XP will drop my Gigabit connectioon about every 2 hours, but leaves alone a 10/100 connection.
a week straight of BSOD’s and no answer on why other than NT.DLL … directX installation issues,
I don’t know , shit I should not have to deal with from an UPDATE taht is supposed to fix broken things, not make more.
XP2 rollout went fine at my work.
For those who constantly get surprised by changes to software:
TEST IT!
If you don’t know how to plan change you get surprised, problems occur, and *then* you should be fired.
For the angry mac/linux fanboy – You really need to get into IT and get a real job. Technical capabilities != business decision.
“Life’s hard, buy a friggin’ helmet” – Dennis Leary (Paraphrazed)
In most cases where there are no known issues and pre-deployment testing indicates there will be no problems then there is no excuse for not upgrading. I admin a mixed environment (Windows, Mac, Solaris) and I make sure everything is as up to date as possible.
However, there are exceptions. Some of our machinery runs specific software (often old) that was provided with it by our vendor and with this larger vendor being slow to keep up to date we often have to run old software. Heck one machine is still running NT4 on a Pentium, and to “upgrade” to a Win2000 Pentium-3 machine (special RIP controller) they want $20,000. Of course there is no support for providng our own computer. Now, there is no way in hell a SMB is going to pay $20,000 for that crap of an upgrade.
SP2 just recently was supported for some other piece of software we run. Lack of SP2 support is not 100% MS’s fault, though if it was closed up to start with developers would not have made insecure shortcuts either.
Anyhow, we have had less than an hour of downtime (combined total) due to viruses and spyware since I was brought on as IT Admin two years ago.
Security also means training employees to avoid actions that could increase vulnerability, and running as much as possible in limited accounts (though a lot of software wants admin rights).
Home users are as well. At least this home user is. I have not even installed SP1 simply because I have no reason to. I run Firefox for the Web, Thunderbird for email, Kerio Personal Firewall and Kaspersky AVP for antivirus. I don’t need a SP.
Bsed on you above statement you are extremely niave when it comes to Operating systems. My guess is you can’t upgrade becasue you have a pirated version of the OS otherwise you would be a fool not to upgrade to the latest SP2 and IE.
If you have an application that’s trashed due to SP2, I’m more willing to point fingers at the application developer than Microsoft. The app developer has had a long time in SP2’s beta to test and patch, it’s certainly out in the field now.. And I’m likely guessing they’re going about something completely wrong — given that a majority of apps still function fine. This is similar to many apps that refuse to run under non-Administrator level accounts.
If you have ever worked in the Enterprise you would know that compnaies hang on to old software versions becasue alot of software companies charge for newer versions to run on different service pack releases of Windows. Coupled with the fact software companies do not support certain SP revisions with their software. So its cheaper for companies not to upgrade to SP2 less they have millions of dollars of unsupported business critcal software.
f you are an IT manager and are leading companies IT department and have not even talked about this problem of the fact that there are two other OSs (Linux & MacOSX) that are far more stable and secure then YOU SHOULD BE FIRED! Yes I said it. I thing the majority of IT manager and CIOs are all just as stupid as the paper they pay you with. This is coming from someone who is in your shoes and has to deal with the likes of all of you from time to time. You are as dumb as a box of rocks and do not have the companies best interest in mind, only your own. The savings of getting rid of you security team that patches desktops alone would drop in half, not to mention the fact the Windows is still really hard to use and has way to many problems for as old as it is and as many folks it takes to create it. It the fact that the better part of the worlds PCs run Windows would directly effect the stability and the ease of use then you would also think that XP would be the best damn thing out there, but it’s not? We continue to prop up a company that delivers poor solutions that given all work together, but wt what cost long term?
@as400tek I love this, any negative Microsoft articles and guys like this come out for the wood work screaming Switch to Linux,or OSS yada yada. Its obviuos you have no clue on how IT operates in Business! My suggestion go back to you closet with your EBCDIC and leave Open Systems talk to the big boys
Microsoft needs to get it in their head that XP Service Pack 2 is not necessary in a business environment. Of course if the company is building their network correctly.
In a business environment, companies already have a firewall installed. Having the firewall turned on by default in SP2 when one is already in place, isn’t necessary.
True the security updates done with IE is a good idea, but again if companies are doing things correctly, IE should already be strickly tightened through proxy servers and or some other method!
Also in the IM world, the trend is moving towards companies closing those ports down as well to external IM.
SP2 is for the home user, where none of this stuff is implemented.
If employees in companies want a popup blocker have them install Firefox, or the MSN toolbar that comes with that feature.
Based on you above statement you are extremely niave when it comes to Operating systems. My guess is you can’t upgrade becasue you have a pirated version of the OS otherwise you would be a fool not to upgrade to the latest SP2 and IE.
Well, that’s a pretty big assumption on your part and perhaps an attempt to bait me, but, I’ll play along for the moment.
Naive? No, I don’t think so, I was a commercial DB programmer for 18+ years, involved on all sorts of platforms. From the very largest mainframes to the very smallest PC’s.
Pirated version? Even if I was, I could still apply a SP to it. It’s so easy to do, that anyone could if they really wanted to. I even have the SP disks right here beside me.
I’d be a fool not to? No, I don’t think so. I feel it’s rather foolish of me, or anyone, to install something they don’t need. I don’t use IE, so why bother upgrading it? All the features of the original XP work fine here on my PC, I’m protected by a firewall and good AV software already. Why would I bother fixing something that already works just fine?
What would be truly foolish of me though, is to continue a conversation what someone who has the arrogance to subject others to bombastic criticism.
I run a local SUS server for our 400+ users instead of having them auto update through windowsupdate.microsoft.com. I have not “approved” the XP/SP2 update for installation to clients as yet due to several imcompatibilites recently discovered with our MRP/ERP client application.
I’m wondering if Microsoft will somehow override this type of SP2 blocking, also.
Does tend to slow thing down. Outlook in particular is running very slow these days.
“What could it be? it must be crappy unstable Windows right? There is no way it could be user error!!!!! ”
Oh yes, that’s what the geeks always do. Blame it on the average user who doesn’t have time to study manuals or spend the whole day in internet forums to make sure they are up to date on Windows philosophy and structure. Instead, the well paid programmers (w/ healthy stock options to go with it), recruited from the top schools and working admittedly ungodly hours up at Redmond only have a get a product out the door. From there on, it’s figure it out yourself or go ahead and put on a dunce hat. If they can’t figure out their problems with Windows, call them stupid. That’s always easiest. And in the same way that muscleheads push around that skinny guy at the beach, that skinny guy at the beach ridicules anyone who doesn’t know an OS inside and out.
Could it be user error? Sure. Is it always? No. There wouldn’t be a need for patches 75MB in size if Windows was perfect just as it is.
Microsoft Fanboy Wrote: For the angry mac/linux fanboy – You really need to get into IT and get a real job. Technical capabilities != business decision.
I have been now for over 15 years, I have helped companies like Bank of America, Coke, Cingular, Sears, Alltel, Scholastic, and other make those IT decisions, and I am working with a fairly large company now too.
You might want to have a look at the title in my name on my post…that would be AS/400 Tech. So don’t get all happy that you got to call me “angry mac/linux fanboy” cause I am neither. I use a Mac, I use Linux, I too use Windows, and I really have problems with all of them to any extent. I detest all of them a little for each of their problems, and if you don’t get it that there are far too many folks at MS (about 5000-10,000 developers, designers, and QA people) working on that OS for it to be as broke as it is? It comes back the old joke…
How many (Useless Group of Folks here) does it take to screw in a light bulb?
Why did it take Linux 10 years to make it to the desktop and only took Apple 5 to make it work? And might I say work right. Now I love Linux. I was a Linux user before I was a Mac User, I used Windows before I was a Linux User, but there are some things that really just started working in Linux that made it desktop worthy IMHO. Tons of things in MacOSX that make it a great desktop, and XP has it strong points too, but then again folks really like FIAT (Use an British Car Here), the cars looked great but ran like S##T long term.
Back to the AS/400 or iSeries. Seeing as how that is my platform of choice, only no desktop. I would only be an iSeries Fanboy. The AS/400 is simple and easy for Admins to us and far more powerful and stable than any of the big iron OSs out there. It was stable long before anyone wanted to talk about that feature; mainly MS. IBM has always built software (OS) that works when it comes to the big iron, and for some reason MS can’t even deploy a desktop that is not riddled with bugs and problems.
I have issues with MS, I used to work for them at one time, and I am not as petty as one might think. I see more going wrong with MS than just the surface problems, so I am not some basher as you would imply, rather I am a seasoned veteran of the Data Center and if I were to imply by your use of the word “Microsoft Fanboy” that you were a fan of MS, then you truly lack the insight to see the bigger IT picture and have no idea what a larger IT shop should look like or what platform they should run on.
Go Away Rookie! I have had the likes of you replaced many times over. IT managers do not understand you are the problem in IT and the first to upgrade the entire company and never test other then your own PC.
Let me know when you have over 5000 users 200 developers pounding on some big iron all with a CPU workload average of 96%, zero outages, 24/7 uptime and then we can talk.
Microsoft would fall flat on its face under those extremes and I can say that seeing as how I have seen it happen. MS was not building for large IT shops.
Lastly: Seeing as how you work @ MKS I would think you would have a better head on your shoulders, but who knows. Probably part of the reason I refuse to talk to that company anymore, they seem to hire folks who don’t get it and only want to take me to lunch and not talk about my solution. Just Ask Mark Sutton.
It all comes together now. You work for MKS, you are a MS Fan and that company couldn’t make a sale because they all bored me to death and never saw the need to talk about a solution just kept sending me CDs and taking me to Lunch.
I will make sure I ask about your SP2 upgrade next time they call me to go to lunch and ask how it went.
You have no room to talk to me about:
Technical capabilities != business decision.
Seeing as how no on at MKS has any. I am in tears I am laughing so hard. You kill me. You want to bash me and all you got is that and you work for MKS. Come On!
ROOKIE!
I view WinXP patches like routine maintennance on a car…
I have yet to see a machine that let’s the automatic updates run or the user does the critical updates only by hand at LEAST once a month have a problem with installing SP2, or problems after SP2… It’s the people who waited and don’t run the critical updates who have problems with it. They don’t let the automatic updates run, haven’t patched the OS since they installed it, and wonder why when they try to apply the latest update it doesn’t work…
Now, if you are driving your car and it starts squealing every time you brake, you get the brake pads replaced, right? No? Oh, I see, it stops squealing after another two-hundred miles or so… Getting hard to brake? Ah, it’s fine, it’s just old… Oh @#$%, I don’t have brakes!!!
Assuming cheap rice-box:
Step 1: Pads – $20 + an hours labor (per axel)
Step 2: Rotors & Pads – $80 + two hours Labor (per axel)
Step 3: Calipers, Master Cylinder, Rotors, Pads, Drums – $1200 + a days labor
I am often amazed how people allow what is a $60 fix today to become a $1200+ dollar fix a month or two from now. A computer is no different!
Maintaining ANY OS that connects to the web is basically the same process, from patching the OS to upgrading your browser to downloading virus-scan patterns… It’s called routine maintennance, and to be brutally honest I have zero sympathy for anyone who doesn’t do it.
You don’t run the critical updates as recommended, then you wonder why a ‘major’ patch 9-12 months later doesn’t work? Morons.
As to “SP2 broke our in-house programs” what the @#$% are you calling for system routines that it broke? Sounds like sloppy programming and not following the guidelines M$ set down for writing programs… (either that or you are a ‘professional programmer’ that uses VB, an oxymoron if I’ve ever heard one!)
The only thing that should cause any issues is the Windows Firewall, AND YOU CAN TURN THAT OFF! (which if you are a large company you should have a hardware firewall, so…)
Those of you saying that you should turn off the SP2 Firewall inside large companies probably haven’t been inside large companies. One of the biggest issues is that viruses get inside the networks FROM the inside (traveling sales people, transfers from stuff from home, surfing the web/getting mail and saying ‘yes’ to something they shouldn’t). Once a virus gets inside if you have no protection you are just plain screwed. This is how large companies get taken out internally.
Bottom-line, it is REALLY tough trying to solve this generically. Ideally SP2 is installed with the firewall, but enough legacy crap exists that will break … called rock and a hard place.
Considering it took my company till this year to upgrade to XP, I seriously doubt we will be rushing to upgrade to SP2 within the next four years.
Oh yes, that’s what the geeks always do. Blame it on the average user who doesn’t have time to study manuals or spend the whole day in internet forums to make sure they are up to date on Windows philosophy and structure.
Ya know i might agree with you if it wasn’t so bleeding easy to update windows i can’t see how they could make it any easier. So you just buy into something without doing some basic research on the topic? My 89 year old great Aunt doesn’t have a problem using windows yet you and other can’t figure it out? AN i believe she is using win98
While I will say it is easy to update windows (if you are broadband it is easy but on dialup it is hard), it is true that many IT people do BLAME the average user. I have heard first hand from Administrators, Programmers, Tech support, help desk, and even the heads of IT who blame the users (wait a minute they are now called customers) for the problems in the corporate world. This is not a joke, this is not a lie, this occurs daily. And it is up to me the lowly paid pc tech/help desk guy to calm the customers down.
Windows 98 does not and never has had an 75 MEGABYTE service pack to download. My father still runs Windows 98 and the largest fix he has ever done lately is like 2 megabytes so you can not compare the two.
For me there are two problems with Windows XP (basically all versions of windows):
1) DLL Hell
2) Way too much software integration in Windows
If Microsoft can copy one thing from MacOS X it would be to install software into its own directories and its own directory only. No other software should reside in the operating system folder other than the operating system.
Reluctantly got SP2 for all my home computers…no problems. Had a problem on a workstation though because it had a lot of business and enterprise apps on it…but I did a fresh install.
Contrary to what people say about SP2 slowing the machine down, I have yet to experience anything like it. Well I did cheat and use nLite.
I think he is right on the money given the intelligence of most corp I.T. Managers/sys admins but for the wrong reasons. SP2 is not the problem, laziness on the part of I.T. shops is. Get out there and test the bloody thing. XP SP2 has had no issues in the environments I’ve dealt with and given the need to keep Windows installs patched to help guard against exploits, well enough said.
XP Pro craps all over Win2K from an administration perspective and also gives acccess to newer technologies i.e. Wireless Networking better USB2 support and the likes.
Still, for home use I’ll stick with something else but at work, aside from the usual hand holding that’s Windows XP SP2 is good.
I quote:
Let me know when you have over 5000 users 200 developers pounding on some big iron all with a CPU workload average of 96%, zero outages, 24/7 uptime and then we can talk.
>> Let me know when you can stay on topic, troll..
PS) I use and have used a variety of hardware and operating systems including unix, windows and as/400. The reason I’m a microsoft fanboy is because they understand that what is not used has no value. Microsoft technologies typically enable more users to do more. This is more important than having more capabilities that are used less.
It’s a mistake to use Microsoft as a model, because their whole culture derives from that one lucky break. Microsoft is a bad data point. If you throw them out, you find that good products do tend to win in the market. What VCs should be looking for is the next Apple, or the next Google.
I think Bill Gates knows this. What worries him about Google is not the power of their brand, but the fact that they have better hackers.
Shock at idiocy? Well, it’s not like I have to justify myself to you, although you seem to be insisting that I do. But, I did take the liberty of reporting your rather abusive postings to the moderators.
Kool-Aid Drinking Microsoft Fanboy Said:
I use and have used a variety of hardware and operating systems including UNIX, windows and AS/400. The reason I’m a Microsoft fanboy is because they understand that what is not used has no value. Microsoft technologies typically enable more users to do more. This is more important than having more capabilities that are used less.
What did you say?
How can you do more with an OS that is broken from the install and even better the SP after the release make matters worse in established IT shops? You used the term that Microsoft uses a bunch….”typically enable more users to do more”, although you forgot the “with less” mantra.
The reason you think you can do more with MS OS and other stuff from them is because they are the Garanimals of OS and products. Just match the colors and point them all to the AD and you’re done, no admin required. Not saying that is bad, but id does not take a real IT person to implement a MS solution. Simple Solutions for simple people. If you want a real solution you had better call someone other then an MS admin, and you had better forget about SP2 for now. It is not fixing anything and only making the already tarnished MS look even more ridiculous after the “We are going to make our OS secure” stance they took before XP was released.
Pretty graphics and tons of wizards do not make for a good OS. Then again you wouldn’t know that because you work for a company that can’t seem to sell anything, and don’t tell me to stay on topic even thought that would be good for MKS seeing as how they can’t stay on topic long enough to close a deal.Silly Kool-Aid drinking MS Lover. IT folks who love one platform should all be fired too since they can only see IT thought MS painted glasses like your Fanboy here.
What the hell does this mean? “What is not used has no value”
How about MS charging an arm and a leg for things that don’t work or if they do they will soon fail as soon as someone figures out a way to exploit it. I really have no idea what you are saying with that last statement. If you are implying that the AS/400 or UNIX offers too much and that they have no value then I think you had better do some fact checking. If the AS/400 offers no value then why to over 90% of the Fortune 100, 200, 300, 500 & 1000 companies run one in their data center? Now the same can be said for MS. Just about every data center run some MS, but a print server or file server is no mission critical for the most part. MS servers were not built for batch processing even thought you have MS saying they do, and again I don’t have to patch my AS/400 for security problems. Mostly they are enhancement or small fixes.
I think it’s great too when you get to pull the rug out from someone like you and blow holes in your entire crappy premise and then all you got is “Stay on Topic”. Come on, you stay on topic and stop drinking the Kool-Aid.
I am tired of talking to the MS block heads. You all don’t get it and then have the audacity to tell me I know nothing of IT when I have implemented solutions that you use every day and have no idea you are using them, and all you got is they help you work better, sure but at what cost?
Yes I am full of myself, and no I know from experience that MS is not the answer to everything and never will be if you want to run a company with more then 100 people and a real application to boot. We can talk about thins next time MKS calls up and wants to tell me about the fine lunch we are going to have and how you and the likes of your company will never have a solution, only lunch.
Keep drinking the Kool-Aid, stay in Canada and keep working for the solutionless MKS. You should go far in my world, my AS/400 breathing, Apple Stable, UNIX/Linux running world, call IT land.
PS MSFB: Please don’t come back if you can’t back up anything to do with MS and why they don’t suck as a solutions provider. I want you to try and think outside of your box you live in and for once become a thinker instead of a follower. If you really want a time of it. Look me up in your CRM solution there at MKS and give me a call. I would love to pick you apart and explain to you why you are so very wrong and then you can ask me to lunch with you and Mark.
Shock at idiocy? Well, it’s not like I have to justify myself to you, although you seem to be insisting that I do. But, I did take the liberty of reporting your rather abusive postings to the moderators.
No you don’t have to justify yourself to me but again to make statements like you made is well ignorant. As i am ignorant of The Buddha you are ignorant of Windows Operating systems. Plain and simple no disrespect meant.
Well good for you Fan Boy. Nice to see the kitchen was too hot for you.
I never once was mean to you I even invited you to call me seeing as how you know who I am. But instead you took the cowards way out and reported me.
Super.
It amazing how many load mouth cowards there are on the internet who can’t make a decent point much less take it when anyone calls them on it.
It just proves my point that MS heads like you don’t get it and probably never will. SP2 is a bigger problem then you knw and just because it worked for youtr small 50 man shop does not mean it will work everywhere if we just test.
Enjoy your bliss that will be your undoing since in the long run we do not need MS for solutions, rather MS needs us.
You said:
@as400tek I love this, any negative Microsoft articles and guys like this come out for the wood work screaming Switch to Linux,or OSS yada yada. Its obviuos you have no clue on how IT operates in Business! My suggestion go back to you closet with your EBCDIC and leave Open Systems talk to the big boys
Well I am one of the Big Boys. I am not here to bash just MS. I was with someone that it is across the boards, only MS has promised things that know not how to deliver. Like a secure OS. They keep on saying that its on the way, but it has not happen yet. (Hold my breath.)
As for coming out of the wood work, hardly. Would you call over 15 years in IT coming out of the wood work? Over 6 years on the radio new, over 12 years of print? I don’t think you can call me new to the whole IT thing.
How about this. I will leave the simple minded Admining of MS to all you guys and I will do the heavy lifting on the Big Iron. That way your small companies can fail and flounder with the likes of Microsoft, and I can make sure the big boys have their systems up not even worrying about SP2 for windows and are taking over the small unwanted MS shops of the world.
Pinky and the Brain kind of stuff. You guys all take this way too seriously. If you think I am not laughing each and every time you post some more anti-me, MS loving post I am. You guys have been killing me since Wnidows95 and before…..keep going it’s just way to fun to stop.
I have an opinion and by god I am going to spew it like vomit.
That i can respect. What i will not agree with is the one platform is the best idiots that seem to still exist. The Unix relic that makes statements like “I don’t know how to use windows i am a Unix guy” Translation=”I am too stupid to figure out how to use a Operating system a child can use” or ” I am a closed minded moron and can’t change to business needs” The Unix bigot are bad but i ran across some of you AS400/mvs/mainframe guys at IBM and frankly you people are friggin weird you can’t even speak proper tech speak. I have had the misfortune of having to access a mainframe system tunning IBM contract software at IBM using PC3270 what a pice of crap that interface is! a DOS command line is more intuative. Either way ancient computer system relics fall by the way side as newer an better systems come out(open systems) I personally use the best tool for the job be it a HP Superdome or a WIndows 2003 server.
I have been working on and with the AS/400 for over 15 years. I am not one of those smelly mainframe geeks. I know what you are talking about. I can’t stand them either. I am a former press, radio guy that used to write about tech and live tech on the radio. I can use and help most anyone with any OS out there.
Here is my list of desktops in my lab @ home: OS/2 Warp and Server, Redhat 7,8,9, RH ES3, SLES 8,9, MacOS 9, X, SUSE Desktop 9.1, Novell Linux 9, BeOS 5 Pro, Windows XP, Windows 2003, Lotus Domino on Linux, Solaris 9 on SPARC, and 9 AS/400s at work to tinker with.
So you had better come heavy if you are going to call me a on OS kind of guy.
And yes I have OS/2 running. I used to be in banking and still have a need for both for a former client to make small changes in REXX. OS/2 was a good fit to for some things in the past. ATMs were all running on OS/2 for a long time and most still are.
I am a UNIX/Linux user. I have a Mac for all around good stuff, but have found windows to be to troublesome.
There was an article written by a dude in the Denver Post about how he pickup up Linux because it was good, and so that he had an excuse not to help his windows friends. That made sense to me. I feel as if over the past few years I have helped IT shops make the right choice and in some of those choices it was Microsoft, but more over I find my self not using them to do most of the heavy lifting. Widnows2003 does not do batch very well seeing as how it has a 30% overhead already driving that GUI.
You are right PC3270 sucks and I used to work for IBM and I know of the main fame you speak of. I have to use CA with PC5250 and while it is not great it is better than it was 10 years ago and that is always a good thing. In the next realease they are promising SSH.
I drive past that mainframe on my way to work every morning. While Main frame attracts a less attractive crowd, they (mainframes) are very powerfull and aslo very hard to find an admin for that also know what soap is. Not SOAP the connector, rather soap the body wash.
I agree the Open Source stuff is making things better while the likes of MS make themselfs look more and more stupid as each day passes. I have been testing Novell Linux Desktop and let me tell you, it is pretty darned nice and ripe. I like it and could see that in corp america in the next three years.
Keep on rocking and have no worries. I bathe, I can talk to you like any old geek and even new geek and am not so narrow minded that windows is not a solution, but should be only used when the situation calls for it.
Fanboy…..you still have alot to learn about stuff, but I ain’t the one to do it. You need real help….like a virus or two to show you the errors of you ways. Rock on Geeks!
but more over I find my self not using them to do most of the heavy lifting. Widnows2003 does not do batch very well seeing as how it has a 30% overhead already driving that GUI
Right, I don’t recommend Microsoft OS’es for big iron jobs either. But i have seen in the past compnaies spend upwards of $50k in order to scale a 1 user Access database to oracle on unix. All of which could have been scalled to existing SQL servers they had in the environment. This particluar case was afflicted by the database bigots i.e.”if it ain’t Oracle its not a databse” another bunch of idiots. Batch processing! very funny!
Keep on rocking and have no worries. I bathe, I can talk to you like any old geek and even new geek and am not so narrow minded that windows is not a solution, but should be only used when the situation calls for it
I look forward to your continued posting on this site then there are quite a few weenies here that have no clue on how IT works in big business. Besides us Coloradoians need to stick togther