“Of all the topics I’ve disemboweled in this space in the last year, the question of moving to Linux is the hottest. It seems almost all of you have a leaning toward Linux. But Staight’s point is important. The existence of a constellation of issues, rather than one or two dominant ones, was cited by perhaps 80% of those who wrote to me saying they aren’t migrating.” Read the article at IDG.
Linux Loved, but Windows Wins
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
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I want to see all those people say the same thing 1 year from now.
indeed
linux is _not_ ready for the mass-desktop as some claim.
linux is ready for the hobbyist-desktop of someone who likes to fix things because he learns something from it, or the desktop of a guru who knows all the tricks, or the desktop of someone who hates MS and is willing to give up ease of use
and for all these people (including me) it’s the best ever, but it’s not _yet_ ready for the masses
I really don’t think “disemboweled” is an appropriate word here; I just can’t stop laughing.
Aside from that, hmm, the article is prognostication, and if things were as he claims, I might agree. But hasn’t Red Hat done some useability studies, ie BlueCurve? So the criticisms have some merit, but not a lot.
I try to use Linux/BSD everywhere i can.
Yes, they are not perfect, or better than commercial rivals, or even not good at some aspects.
But i use them to defend the freedom except for fun, if all of us give up, we all at last have no choice.
I remember a factory that a mother always courages his son to do some farming, she want a well grown-up son more than a harvest.
>>I want to see all those people say the same thing 1 year from now.<<
Yeah they will still be there, their response will be the same as it was in 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003, when people like you said the same thing. There is no earth shattering things that can be done in linux that are going to cause people to switch. People just don’t care. Thats what most seam to ignore on this whole subject. That most people don’t know of linux or don’t care. About the only thing that could change this is some advertising. But linux isn’t there so that would be counter productive. Also that cost money! OMG having to spend money. As shown by yopper on distrowatch. If one wants to get seen advertising works. Their ad on here had a big impact. But alas it’s sort impreeding in a way. If a person comes here they know about linux. Maybe not yopper, but there not getting people who don’t know about it. Untill there is tv commericals for a linux distro and it truely is everything anyone would ever want nothing will change. Look at Be, they had a full OS that was very much up to par with anything at the time. Now there is many things that killed them. But the simple matter that no one new of them didn’t help things. You only new of BeOS if you were running it on your computer. A few commericals could have changed this a good amount. There is not enough money in linux to support companies, let alone advertising. Redhat is the only one to break even. But they could crumble at any time. To grow cost money, if what you have makes you none, you are only going to grow so much. And 1% seams like it.
Interesting comment he posts from one of his “emailers”
in the article.. the person states that they can not move
servers over since he can not find linux/unix admins or
people experienced in linux/unix. Strange… a few of my
unix friends and myself included (eh, like over 10 years
unix/linux experience each) can not find a unix/linux
job to save our lives…
I wonder if most of this “Our company can not find unix/
linux talent” is just FUD or just plain not looking around?
linux is ready for the hobbyist-desktop of someone who likes to fix things because he learns something from it, or the desktop of a guru who knows all the tricks, or the desktop of someone who hates MS and is willing to give up ease of use
I’d say it is also ready for a business desktop administered by the sysadmin and not the user running it, provided that the apps a business wants to use can run on Linux.
sure i occasionally use Windoze, but only Win98 that has been gutted with “Revenge Of Mozilla” & have not bought a M$ Win OS or app in many years…
i keep Linux Slackware for most my computing needs with OpenOffice…
http://www.ifrance.com/snoopy81/ROM2.htm
I find ‘disemboweled’ a creepily appropriate choice of words for what he and other opinionators like him do to a given subject. They’re brutral hacks who slash open the belly of their topic to look at the pretty colors of it’s guts. Then they leave it to rot while they search for a new victim for their gross oversimplifications.
This article is a near classic example. Basically it says, “Yep, switching OS’s is complicated.”
I’d say it is also ready for a business desktop administered by the sysadmin and not the user running it, provided that the apps a business wants to use can run on Linux.
Even better, an application server for thin clients (hardware X servers).
Brad has a good point, people don’t buy linux becausee they don’t know. If they do know, it is to hard, or lacks software/hardware support. Comercails about linux would be good, distros have ads in linux magazines, but alot of good that does for people who don’t know about linux. You would think some of the distro makers would get the hint & advertise to a wider audiance. Shit linux is a great product, they need to let people know.
or is that 3 words?
I only use [SENCORED] because i have a scanner and SANE/XSANE
doesn’t support it “very well”
And because i play Counter-Strike =]
“I’d say it is also ready for a business desktop administered by the sysadmin and not the user running it, provided that the apps a business wants to use can run on Linux.”
Even better, an application server for thin clients (hardware X servers).
Or as clients running Citrix Metaframe.
I want to see all those people say the same thing 1 year from now.
Isn’t that what people have been saying for the last couple of years?
The article is realistic. I wouldn’t recommend a linux solution to my worst enemy.
We’ve got 4 servers and 10 desktops running Linux that used to run WinNT and Win98.
We too had those same nagging questions, not to mention the fear, uncertainty and doubt. However, things in Linux work much, much better than we thought they would. We’ve really got no regrets and saved a whole bunch of money in the process. It took a while to get things sorted out, but once you set something up in Linux, you can generally forget about it.
well, i use linux since 1998. of course it was hard at first but i just wanted to become a cool hacker, not just a pc-*ussy how can use word, etc. at the moment am using linux for evertithing (i work as a financer) and only use a cracked windoze for gaming.
and for all of those who speak of masses: linux is cool cause its not for the masses. just imagine that the linux mailinglist would need to help 10 millions newbies, think thats possible?
I think Linux is ready for the enterprise and desktop productivity as well.
I can do the same I used to do with Windows a long time ago.
I guess Red Hat Linux is ready for both home users and business users (SOHO, small business, …). You may install within minutes and start working inmediately.
And if you have a pretty-old system, just try to install an old version of GNU/Linux (Slackware, Red Hat). Slackware is the best at using resources (it really needs little resources -RAM, HD,-). Isn’t hard to install. But you may have trouble configuring something. Unless you know some basic UNIX/Linux stuff, having a Linux handbook (Slackware essentials, Red Hat sys admin’ing and net’ing) is strongly recommended.
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n0dez – http://www.n0dez.com
why do all computer news sites bait their readers?
please stop posting idiot rantings by idiot columnists!!!
many people simply don’t want to migrate. they’re happy with windows. they don’t have an irrational hatred of microsoft or bill gates just because of penis envy. they realize that winxp is a rock solid OS, even more so than linux. why would you possibly change? what does linux actually fix? if a linux system breaks, are you going to take the hours and hours necessary to hunt down the problem, or are u just going to reinstall? maybe you’d say you hunt down the problem on your own system, but what if it’s a corporation with 100 computers u have to maintain and 10 of them are broken? are u gonna take the dozens of hours to hunt down the individual problems, or are you gonna reinstall?
plus, what about installing softare in linux? distributions do everything differently.
in Windows, u run the installer and it Just Works(tm) regardless of whether you’re on win 95/98/ME/NT/2k/XP. sure sometimes it doesn’t, but what about linux? sometimes on windows is like 5% of the time maybe, in linux it’s 95% and if you argue otherwise u are a dolt.
don’t try any bull here, windows isn’t perfect but it works FAR better than linux can ever hope to be. linux is trying to get to the point where it “Just Works(tm)” too but Microsoft has thousands of programmers and a 10 year head start, and they’re making new progress every day while open source community lags behind.
in the end linux will end up the exact same way windows is now. it will work most of the time, though it still crashes, and if u have a problem it’s just easier to reinstall linux than try and diagnose it. sure the linux kernal is free but if u want easy to use linux u will have to buy it from some place like red hat or lindows or xandros or lycoris, so in the end it WON’T be free. microsoft will soon control the hardware platform with things like palladium and hardware and software integration with windows will grow even closer and windows will work much better. linux developers will have to reverse engineer paladium to get that level of integration, and they’ll be way behind windows anyway.
While some people might not care and some people don’t know…alot of people would like to learn something new and different, its knowledge that drives us. I’m interested in anything to do with computers and i will go out and ask and learn. Of course there are limits to what i can do (given the amount of hours in the day) but in the last 365 days alone i’ve decided to play with 3 versions of linux, OSX and still want to find time to code some java, create websites and create some flash animation if only to better myself.
There are like minded individuals out there.
When people i have met first hear about linux they gasp because its something different, the first question they ask is “What does it do”. People will be bothered and interested if other people make it interesting, but don’t bullshit and lie about it and thus create false expectations.
Also to note, GNU Linux will go as far as people take it.
if a linux system breaks, are you going to take the hours and hours necessary to hunt down the problem, or are u just going to reinstall?
I don’t think the situation is really any different than Windows. In fact, I think Linux has the advantage in this area. Of course, with products like Norton Ghost, one is about as easy to ‘fix’ as the other
If I have even a semi-serious problem with Windows (which is very rare these days), I don’t even bother trying to fix it if it’s going to take longer than an hour – I just use Ghost and have a freshly installed Windows (including all drivers) back on my box in less than 5 minutes. I can do the same with Linux also.
Once people’s freedoms become restricted by the misuse of DRM and other lock in features on the windows platform, i think people will be more inclined to make a move to something else, something less restrictive.
I here more and more businesses everday are thinking about moving or staying with their current setup, this wouldn’t of been heard of 3 years ago.
This train of thought can only trickle into the consumer market as does any new idea or way of working.
Once people’s freedoms become restricted by the misuse of DRM and other lock in features on the windows platform, i think people will be more inclined to make a move to something else, something less restrictive.
I wouldn’t be so sure about that. In fact, I think DRM (especially with music, movies, books, and other type of data in electronic form) has the potential to hurt Linux more than it would help it. Why? Because if something requires DRM to run, people can either run it in Windows and be limited to how they can use it, or switch to Linux and (more than likely) not be able to run it at all. The only hope is that the content creator will support a Linux solution (not likely to happen and even if it did, the content would still be copy-protected) or else hope that somebody in the Linux community can crack it, as with DVDs.
and there is no need to hurry it. Yes, part of the problem is lack of awareness and advertising can fix that. But actually I think advertising NOW is a bad idea. The plain fact is, that Linux is NOT READY for the MASSES and even for most businesess. It has neither the apps (obvious) that windows has, nor, I would argue, is it a superior OS to Win _at this time_. Sure, it is a superior OS _in some aspects_, but overall, for the masses, that is not true compared to Win. Now, I think in time, Linux will be a superior OS, but it is not so now. So, advertising now to the masses is counterproductive – it’ll waste money, and it’ll merely fix in people’s minds (those that try it), that Linux is INFERIOR.
A better tactic is to let Linux evolve (and encourage developers to join) at its own pace. So far, it is the superior way to go on the server (in most cases) – it’ll continue to gain ground there, no advertising necessary. Gradually, it’ll move to the enterprise space, thin client and all that. And finally, it’ll be ready for the homeuser/joesixpack desktop. That’ll happen when the Linux OS is actually superior to Win – and when more apps are available and have caught up with Windows apps. Already the kernel is being developed more with an eye toward desktop needs. According to Torvalds, Linux will not be desktop-ready until 2006. When it is, that’ll be the time to advertise to joe-sixpack. At that point, I would expect the OS itself to be superior to Win (stability, flexibility, power), and a vastly superior cost proposition. It will still be weaker in some key respects – mostly apps, a very important point. But, it should have some of the basics covered (office, email, internet). So how can it then challenge windows? Well, being vastly cheaper, people are willing to put up with lesser apps (at least for a time) – an experience we’ve had in technology time and again of what wins in the marketplace. In the very long run, apps should mostly catch up, but it’ll be good enough to get Linux going. So, start advertising when Linux is ready for the desktop (masses) – around 2006, not now.
Everybody seems to forget that there’s a piracy war going on, that month after month, windows and windows applications will became harder to crack, and warez (that devil to corporations) is one of the main engines to Microsoft Development.
How? Very simple, just think a while, who do you know that doesn’t use warez products once in a while? who among you, that use windows, never used a crack or an illegal serial? I personally don’t know noone like that, not even companies, not even state departments.
This “fact” doesn’t add-value to companies but keeps a lot of people using windows, if software companies start pushing people to buy their products they will be force to look for cheaper alternatives, and that alternative is linux. And if people stick with the best out there on desktop solutions (Mandrake, Suse, etc..) they won’t need windows after a month or two, and i doubt that after six months they will miss windows.
*I’m not including game addicts, but hey if you can buy a 9999€ graphic card you can also afford windows, and you deserve it, in all your stupidity.
And if people stick with the best out there on desktop solutions (Mandrake, Suse, etc..) they won’t need windows after a month or two, and i doubt that after six months they will miss windows.
And of course, whenver somebody even attempts this argument, I always say .. find me a program in Linux that can do this:
http://www.propellerheads.se/de/products/reason/frame.html
I’ll admit it. I don’t use cracked warez anymore. When I first got into computers, when I was in highschool, I had all the cracked games I could get my hands on because I couldn’t afford anything. I had to grab a cracked copy of NT so I could learn how to admin it since that’s the career path I chose to take. But I felt like a criminal everytime I clicked through that EULA. I hated feeling like that.
I moved to Linux is ’96 (back when X didn’t support my video card, ie. text only.) and since then I’ve only used Windows for things I couldn’t do in Linux. Like popular games and video/audio editting. But now there are fewer and fewer reasons to use Windows. So I buy the games I want to play and the A/V software I want if it outperforms my open source tools, which is very rare.
But I refuse to steal from anyone. I make more than enough to purchase the latest software and hardware from both Microsoft and Apple but I chose Linux because it is by far the most economical and feature complete.
YMMV
P.S. I hate theives!
I was talking about linux as a desktop solution, as I see things linux is fully capable of filling any need of a desktop user. This application “Reason” is a professional music/sound solution and no, there’s nothing like that in the linux world, at least that I’m aware.
I defend linux because I use it for tons of things nowadays and every application is opensource, I don’t defend the idea that it’s better than windows or that it’s free(€) and that makes it better. What i defend is that linux is different and better in many ways than windows, the concept of opensource is the main strenght of linux, it not only powers it as it provides constantly updates and improvements to the programs it uses. Diversity of programs and systems as a result of diferent minds working together.
“I don’t say it’s perfect, it simply works better.”
I have tried Linux many times over the last few years and have always been turned off by niggling hardware incompatibilities. Its always….this version supports my burner but in the next version theres some weird issue,my digital camera isnt supported,my soundcard isnt supported properly,my scanner is supported but doesnt scan as well as in windows,i cant get my printer to print in colour properly after 4 hours of fiddling and searching the net. Ive had nothing but trouble trying to get hardware working.
I have however switched over to many open source apps such as Openoffice and Mozilla running on Windows. This has worked great-i dont have to upgrade my windows 98 system to run them and i dont need to pay insane prices to use them.
Windows has the apps. Does it have anything else going for it?
You know, does it have any objective merits independent of the fact that it has, you know, all the apps. Apparently not, because nobody seems to be able to cite any other reason for using it.
You know, does it have any objective merits independent of the fact that it has, you know, all the apps. Apparently not, because nobody seems to be able to cite any other reason for using it.
Well, yeah …. that, and it supports all the hardware too. I’d say those were two pretty good damn reasons
I’ve been a Windows guy since 1989 having been through every beta cycle for every mainstream version of Windows. I’ve also been a Unix guy since Sun OS 4.1.1.
I think Windows is like a car you buy at the showroom – it comes with all the happy marketing and feel-good stuff. But moreso, you know that when you buy from Honda, etc. you’re getting something that comes with everything you need to use the car. If you need some add-ons, visit your Honda parts department or any one of thousands of 3rd party vendors. Most people seem to buy their cars this way – and their operating systems as well.
On the other hand, there’s this market of do-it-yerselfers who are assembling and managing their own automobiles. They are able to get limited support from 3rd parties, so they’ve created clubs and communities where they share information and trade add-ons for their car kits. Most people don’t seem to buy their cars this way – but somehow there’s this tendancy to think that Linux will take off in its current incarnations. I’m dubious – at best.
Lindows, Lycoris, and Xandros appear to be the first distros that have picked up on this phenomenon as it relates to the desktop. Albeit they are Windows impersonators, they’re trying to appeal to a transitional market while attempting to eliminate any perception that “if it ain’t Windows, it ain’t for me”. Applications will not arrive on the Linux desktop in abundance anytime soon. It will take a few years – mostly thanks to (a) better Wine support and (b) more importantly native .NET support via Mono/gnuDotNet. Sadly, you have to join them to beat them.
it supports all the hardware too
That depends on who you ask actually. I’d stay focused on the app issue since for certain you can say that Windows has the apps. Linux supports some hardware that modern windows systems do not and modern windows systems support some hardware that Linux doesn’t. It goes both ways.
People won’t migrate because
Marketing is not there
You cannot go to most computer stores and buy it (In my country)
Some Apps that are marketed heavily don’t run on it
Anything else probably doesn’t cross the masses minds.
They don’t understand security, installation, drivers etc they get someone else to do that for them. That person is either the salesperson or a friend. When all those people say use Linux then Linux is for the masses.
It worked when windows was at version 3.1 compare it to the other offerings at the time. What idiot would buy a backwards windowing system that most apps didn’t work properly with and had to run in a dos box if at all?
Another aspect on this…
At my setup (30,000 desktops), we have organisation-wide licenses for a number of IBM/Lotus products, which are deployed to the desktop on the Windows NT platform.
Despite the “commitment” of IBM/Lotus, none of these products are available for Linux except for one. The one that is available has both client and server components, and only the server is available under Linux.
IBM/Lotus is recognised as a ‘corporate leader’ of sorts in the Linux world. So far, their bite (deliverables for Linux distributions) has not matched their bark (talking up the use of Linux-based systems). Why should anyone else feel motivated to make Linux compatible software deliverables if the ‘leaders’ is this area haven’t delivered as yet?
Yes, I’m sure IBM/Lotus has a grand plan to get the deliverables there, but every week that goes by sees another business or four take the tried-and-trusted Windows route, despite the fact that this will likely expose them to more technical problems and microcomputer virii.
Having deliverables in place so that businesses are not orphaned from their data, even if the deliverables are from different vendors, is already recognised as the key to this conundrum. As the voice whispers in Field of Dreams, “If you build it, they will come…”
This year i took the plunge, and got me Suse 8.1. OK. Install is slick. No problems. So i start to learn Linux. Mail, Internet all OK. OpenOffice. Nice, does its stuff. Then I tried to connect my digital camera through the USB. Hey, strange, de hardware vendor (Canon) does not support Linux . So back to XP for uploading the pics. I have a Matrox Parhellia video card with 2 monitors attached. In XP sleek install. But in Linux. Only a Beta version available, 10 pages of readme files. You have to edit several files to get the stuff to work. I tried, but failed. Did not locate all the files, can’t figure out how VI really works, etc, etc. This is really counter productive. OK. It’s not Linuxes fault, but merely the hardware vendors who do not supply Linux drivers.
As long as the big hardware companies do not provide ‘easy to install’ drivers for linux, I will use XP for Multimedia applications. It’ s a pitty, because at first glance Linux seems to be a promising tool, but it is not fit for the ordinary user (no wizards, no drivers …). And it has been this way for several years, and nothing seems to change.
The hardware vendors do not really see Linux as a consumer OS so they put no effort into drivers for consumer peripherals. It used to be a lot worse and it is still bad. If you go out and look at server peripherals you will see that linux is much better supported. It will take some time for the vendors to change their minds, probably helped by things like tablet pc’s or pc’s in consumer items.
As for me I hardly ever have hardware driver problems because I make sure that a) the hardware works with my operating system b) never buy cheap and crappy hardware that causes your computer to crash. Lack of consumer education can be a problem as well. Just because you can buy it off the shelf doesn’t mean you should