Sun posted some updated ‘Java Desktop System’ screenshots, their Linux-based x86 OS.
New Sun Java Desktop System Screenshots
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Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
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hi deak…see you are still around trolling
but seriously, are these new…they look almost identical to the ones I saw on the same exact site about a month ago?
They mention a trade up program, trade in your pc for 50% off of the Java Desktop….
Will it run on regular X86? Will it be downloadable?
One wonders if they actually use the inhouse resources or if they let the coders do the design…
Not bad, but I still prefer Ximian Desktop (or GNOME 2.4 with Ximian’s Industral theme).
Deak R. (IP: 193.111.198.—) – Posted on 2003-10-30 04:02:33
I wonder how long Sun will support this distro, since Redhat is not supporting their versions of desktop OS. I think I should get a refund on Redhat Linux since they are not supporting it after Dec 31, 2003. At least with MS they still support and you can download updates free of charge.
Why wouldn’t they continue supporting it? the customer is paying $100 per-year, per-employee, of course they’re going to continue to support it, why else would they be charging $100 per-year, per-employee?
You pay $100 per-year, per-employee and that is what you’re receiving, not only updates but upgrades as well.
mick_nobody (IP: —.plyntv01.mi.comcast.net) – Posted on 2003-10-30 03:58:48
They mention a trade up program, trade in your pc for 50% off of the Java Desktop….
Will it run on regular X86? Will it be downloadable?
For Pete’s sake, read the website that is provided:
http://see.sun.com/Apps/DCS/mcp?q=ST7005TFRywuZi
“What do I get?
In return for each desktop license you trade-in you will receive a 50% discount on the purchase price of a Java Desktop System. Its as simple as that – trade-in your existing desktop and get an even better deal on the best value desktop system available.
They aren’t selling hardware, they’re selling software. They’ve got an agreement with Dell who will pre-load it onto the corporate desktop range.
“At least with MS they still support and you can download updates free of charge.”
So M$ still supports Win 3.1/3.11/95/98???
I wonder why Sun does not use one of the Linux distro as a base, build every single application that users need in Java including office, mail client, messenger…etc.? Even that it should not be called Java desktop. Unless Sun releases its own OS using minimum assembly/C/C++ code to load up the OS, and build everything by Java, then this is true Java desktop environment.
Well, to release redhat linux 9 personal and not support after a few months? What kind of deal is that for the consumer after he or she just got through paying around $40 for it? NOT considering, they did not inform the consumer of this on the front end. This sounds like a double standard to me, but I guess the end user just gets stuck holding the bag. No big deal it is just money, they got theirs, no you got an OS without updates, very nice indeed…..
Nothing new here, looks like the same old desktop. Well, you got those little java cups all over the screen. What is the point of this, it is boring. I would take a raincheck on this package, or use it as a coaster…
This package is being targeted at enterprise customers as part of the Java Enterprise System, not at individual consumers. Try to analyze it from that perspective, rather than that of a dateless teenager who runs SuSE on his mom’s computer in the basement.
Unless Sun releases its own OS using minimum assembly/C/C++ code to load up the OS, and build everything by Java, then this is true Java desktop environment.
Sun is using Java as a brand name. There are a host of Java applications bundled with it, but obviously most of the applications are going to be implemented in C/C++
It’s not really any different from Microsoft calling everything .NET, although Microsoft did finally realize that diluting the .NET name by branding everything .NET only furthered customer confusion.
Sun, on the other hand, did not begin to dilute the term Java by applying to things other than the language and its associated tools until recently, which allows them to begin diluting it now without leading to too great a deal of customer confusion.
Sun put so much input on the HIG but they can’t design a nice looking desktop.
For such a major corporation, which probaly has the kind of money Apple does, you think they could get some decent graphic designers for the desktop.
It’s just an ugly desktop…
I like it. Anyone know if there be a downloadable version? I’d like to try it.
What do you want? Redhat has officially stated that thier software since RH8 and up will have a one year erreta, maybe longer, but they only garentee a one year erreta. Well, RH9 will have its one year too…
What wrong with using fedora? You get the same thing but for free. Also, no this isnt the windows world. Its a different world with a different way things behave in terms of products. In the open source world, thing move much faster. For example, there are gnome releases every half a year, and so on…
So redhat figured that fedora should be fast moving too for the desktop. How many people use an unmodified debian stable release as (and only as) a desktop? How many people have created repositories for new software because their favorite distro didnt release it fast enough, or because the distro dosnt want to include this much needed library?
Now back on topic:
The gtk theme looks like a smooth-engine variant, and the icons look like a beos variant with some ximian addones.
But arnt they worried about UI consistancy? Why would osmeone want to change the theme if only half of the apps meet the theme? Lets see, mozilla, adobe acrobat reader, all the java apps (jedit, jdictionary, jdiskreport, etc…), star office, realplayer, and I am sure I missed a few more…
So thaf the desktop is themeable and the other half is whatever the heck it wants?
Looks like gnome to me. And the ‘mozilla-based’ and ‘evolution-based’ apps seemed to be…mozilla and evolution. Don’t get me wrong, I think it’s great that they’re putting together a bundle to sell to businesses…I just don’t see anything particularly new or exciting.
As for a downloadable version — don’t have a clue. I’m doubtful.
I just don’t see anything particularly new or exciting.
I see stability and virus free for less money.
I think it remains to be seen whether or not this will offer anything over other linux desktops. It may or may not be more stable/virus free. I’m not trying to trash sun, or say that this is definitely all hype — I’m just saying that it doesn’t really look all that thrilling, and we won’t know in any case until it’s released.
Great OS (Linux), great Office software (Star Office), evolution, upgrades, java applications, etc.. for just $100.00?. looks really good to me.
I work in an office, and we had to play 3 times that quantity plus antivirus and firewall software for every computer (12.
I could spend those $100 w/o think it twice.
If Sun had come up with this desktop before Microsoft came up with Windows 95, and then Microsoft came out with Windows 95, Sun would surely sue Microsoft. This stuff all looks like cheap attempts to cash in on Microsoft’s R&D into desktop design, and application UI design.
I would run it if all of the Java apps had the GTK+ theme.
The only problem is that Sun might make this impossible for the home user to purchase. Are they going to offer the ISO’s for downloading?
They say “Mozilla-based” and “based on Evolution” but to me they look simply like Mozilla and Evolution (yep, I’ve seen the Sun logo, but you know what I mean). Have they made any (significant) changes to either application?
Nothing major. I know that they added more default plugins and a slighly different UI for mozilla but thats about it(I think).
That is true Open Source moves fast, actually to fast for me sometimes. When I use Linux I always like I’m getting out of date all the time just in a matter of months. I have two fold, on the one side I feel better then Windows because things are ‘newer’ but on the other side things get updated so much I don’t feel I have every achieved bliss of my system. I won’t use RedHat 9 now because to me it feels out of date because I know a new release will be around the corner. And when I am using a Linux I update all the time all the software trying to keep up. That is the one thing about Windows I can say I do enjoy… I can still be using Windows XP and be happy with it and not feel I am out of date completely and need an upgrade since Windows 2003 Server came out. Don’t get me started on Mac OS X feeling out of date…
This Java desktop is almsot as bad looking as Swing.
I know this is only a superficial aspect of the OS but it hurts my eyes to a certain extent so I have to comment on it.
Perhaps we should form some sort of support group for those people who just need the latest upgrades. I know how you feel, and its really challenging not to want to stay on the cutting edge.
It offers a well-integrated office environment with Java (not all Linux distros have JVM integrated correctly) which allows for easy application development in the style of Visual Basic – not too fast, but easy to design and implement, suitable for all those little in-house apps.
BUT MORE IMPORTANTLY what it offers over other Linux desktops is support over many years. Sun supports it’s software for a long time. Solaris 9 has been out for a couple of years, and yet, Solaris 8 is still going strong and plans are still made for the next several years, for products based on Solaris 8.
To me looks like a very clean and professional interface. But then, it’s just a screen shot and I haven’t used it yet. On my Windows XP I use the classic mode.
Judging from the looks, which can be deceiving, the Ximian desktop looks more polished than the SUN’s Java Desktop. I’ll have to wait and see what their java software products have to offer. Otherwise, good luck to SUN.
I didn’t say anything was “new”. Although I can’t help feeling sure they’ll bring something new to the distribution that wasn’t apparent in the screeshot. I’m saying it looks “polished”. To me it is an appealing look. And, I’d like to install it and see if it meets my expectations.
>>That is true Open Source moves fast, actually to fast for me sometimes. When I use Linux I always like I’m getting out of date all the time just in a matter of months.<<
Is this a problem with opensource, or is your own hang-up? A three year old linux distro is no more out of date than a three year old windows distro.
Proprietary vendors have conditioned us to believe that there is something terribly wrong with not having the latest version. Vetern Linux users don’t buy into that nonesense. I know of people using Debian 2.2, and they love it.
Msft works hard to kill off old products, to force you to buy new msft products. Linux doesn’t do that.
First you make a bunch of unsubstantiated allegations, a tirade of stereotypes and empty phrases with NO actual facts at all.
And then, the only fact that you try to utter, is completely wrong:
Besides, I don’t think this is even certified to work with Oracle. So where is the great advantage over RedHat or SuSe?
This is a desktop environment, no need to run Oracle. And it’s based on SuSE, so Oracle would run just fine. If Sun wanted they certainly could easily get Oracle certification for this one.
I was the author of the OSNews.com peview a few weeks ago, and then I already complained about the GUI. Not only it’s looks didn’t appeal to me (but that’s subjective), the looks actually influence it’s usability. I’m not saying the JDS was unusable, their theme/color scheme/widgets are just hard to use in a glance.
Seems like they didn’t really do anything about that (as if my review would push them to
).
I would run it if all of the Java apps had the GTK+ theme.
Who cares how it looks if can do the job very well?
i am a small business owner. recently, i upgraded some old laptops (4-5 years old) using win 98 with Suse 8.2 personal edition. to these laptops, i added ximian XD2 desktop (the free edition). so far, i have less problems with these old laptops than a new laptop with winXP. For the business environment, i am quite happy with linux and ximian solution. we don’t play games at the office or burn music cds…the desktop environment works.
having said this, does anyone know why i should or would switch from the Suse/Ximian solution to the Sun solution?
Food for Thought:
for $100/year per user Sun solution, i may be tempted to try an apple os & hardware solution. in terms of cost it looks like apple only charges $125 per new os. does anyone have an opinion on this?
Hi guys,
I get build 10 in a few days, 11 is already released. I’m gonna test it and maybe write a review.
You cannot compare it to Panther or something but it is really for the low cost business user. According to my friends at SUN there is a lot of demand for it already but they cannot tell me company names.
Even the final pricing is not official yet according to them, at least not in Europe.
One of the problems for companies to migrate is that Staroffice doesn’t support embedded VB code and they don’t want to rewrite their excel files.
But if you look at the cost of the virus “Windows” then you are stupid to not switch to Mac or some of these distros.
Buying SUN products is buying great support as well and that is what makes the real difference.
cheers guys
I might buy one.
I’m looking for a new Java development workstation, and I like to support Sun when I can.
Why risk vendor lock-in?
Lock-in… to Linux/x86? How exactly is this vendor lock-in?
Especially with a company that is conspiring with scox to kill off free linux?
A conspiracy theorist, I see. Better keep that aluminum foil around your head… wouldn’t want the alien beams messing with your brain.
Don’t forget where sunw makes their real money.
Service contracts?
It’s not hard to figure sunw’s true motives.
Is this going somewhere? Your post is full of disconnected sentences which don’t form a coherent argument.
It seems to me like Sun’s “true motives” are to put together an enterprise-worthy software package which places Linux on the client side, and hoping that Linux’s hardware/software compatibility will be enough to coerce buyers into considering the Java Enterprise System as a viable alternative to Windows.
Don’t be fooled. A drug dealer usually gives you the first hit for free.
And you know this from… personal experience? Perhaps you should lay off the drugs, buddy.
Was that supposed to be a metaphor? If so, what exactly is Sun giving you for free?
Besides, I don’t think this is even certified to work with Oracle.
This is being sold as the desktop component of an enterprise package, which will come with Solaris/SPARC servers. Take a wild guess as to if Oracle is certified to work on those.
So where is the great advantage over RedHat or SuSe?
$100/employee/year for a complete client/server enterprise computing solution. This completely transcends the scope of anything RedHat and SuSE offer as companies (they’re both software companies after all… Sun is offering a software/hardware solution here). And, as has already been mentioned, the Java Desktop System is SuSE based anyway…
Why do I keep responding to trolls…
It sure looks nice! I tried the early versions on SUNs Gnome desktop. Im assuming this is pretty much the same stuff. The hardware i tried it on was my SUN Ultra10 333Mhz and it was unusably slow!! I think we can all agree on that CDE sucks and something like this is much needed but it wont be usable on the kind of machines we have at work (Ultra10’s)… I think i’ll go for a fluxbox desktop instead!
regards /telecom java coder
It’s not the same as GNOME 2.0 on Solaris; it’s a combination of some 2.2 stuff with a few things backported from 2.4, apparently.
Hopefully the desktop will be ported to Solaris too, though.
I think it remains to be seen whether or not this will offer anything over other linux desktops. It may or may not be more stable/virus free. I’m not trying to trash sun, or say that this is definitely all hype — I’m just saying that it doesn’t really look all that thrilling, and we won’t know in any case until it’s released.
I agree why compete is a crowded linux market? this doesn’t bring anything earth shattering to the table. Now if it was x86 Solaris with the nice gui that would be something different. It seems to me that SUN is very confused nowadays.
>>First you make a bunch of unsubstantiated allegations, a tirade of stereotypes and empty phrases with NO actual facts at all.<<
I would be glad to prove my case. However, on osnews, anything that isn’t glowing praise of sunw gets modded down. You can bash msft all you want, but you can’t say anything negitive about sunw.
Notice my original post was modded down? Not the first time a post critical of sunw has been modded down.
Especially with a company that is conspiring with scox to kill off free linux?
A conspiracy theorist, I see. Better keep that aluminum foil around your head… wouldn’t want the alien beams messing with your brain.
===========================
But isn’t it an interesting coincidence that, just like msft, sunw never found any reason to give milllions and millions of dollars to scox *before* scox started their anti-linux campain. What amazingly coincidental timing. All the years that scox has been in business, msft and sunw never had any interest in scox products, then at the exact same time both companies need millions worth of scox products.
And at the same time, McNeally finds it necessary to vigorously support scox’s position on several occasions, often parroting McBride’s exact words. McNeally openly gloats about sunw having the only legal version of linux. BTW: sunw doesn’t really have the only legal version of linux, but don’t try to tell McNeally that, he’s to busy screaming “buy from sunw or scox will sue you” every chance he gets.
Of course it’s not as if scox is the only company getting their backs scratched. Msft gets to sell windows licenses to scox to fullfill msft’s anti-trust settlement. Sunw gets a boatload of warrents from scox as a thank you. As if that’s all normal in bona-fide arms-length transaction.
Sun has a real hit on it’s hands. This is the missing piece of the puzzle and all Sun has to do now in submit Java to the folks at ISO. The folks in Redmond have got to be quaking in their boots.
That’s what I would have said had this happened in 1988 – 10 years ago. Now I say – Yawn! Time for Sun to roll over and die.
i work with clients everyday that have never used a computer before and just want it for word, so i sell them a system with 98/xp and word or staroffice. now in a lot of cases the software costs more then the hardware and that is not what they want to hear, when i give them a cost of the software most want to go borrow it from a friend.
i think this distro is just missing major one thing to make it better and thats windows emulation (wineX or wine). but i do want to get my hands on a copy ASAP to try (and hack the crap out of) and i can’t wait. if people where just after a good linux distro they should go to gentoo or somthing else fast but if your after somthing easy (for lazy people like me) it sounds good to me.
Now if it was x86 Solaris with the nice gui that would be something different. It seems to me that SUN is very confused nowadays.
I think this has been explained already: Sun wanted to solve the hardware compatibility issue, which arises in the x86 world of DESKTOP computers. Sun wanted to avoid the driver problem, hence they opted for Linux on the desktop. Not confused, I think.
so what if some of you think that sun is dealing out free drugs, it’s better then being nailed to the wall by the *nice* ms boy pumping you full of there sh!t and no(or little) option of escape. ms send me letters every month “informing” me of who they have sued/settled with a message to buy there sh!t or else. i don’t get sun sending me letters(yet). [sVen]
Your post was modded down because it contained little more than trashtalk, NOT because it bashed Sun. Many Sun-bashing posts are not modded down, because they contain something of at least marginal significance. Your post didn’t.
so all of the screenshots have come from sun, and not many linux guys have given a full run down, sun don’t give much info on what’s “under the hood” the most info comes from the screenshots. i do want to know what it is really like, that means info on how easy it is to insall new software or even if it’s got cdrw burning software installed? so what if there evil in the eyes of some just want to see for my self. [sVen]
“I agree why compete is a crowded linux market? this doesn’t bring anything earth shattering to the table.”
What it brings to the table is the backing of a company that corporations have been doing busienss with for years. It brings a trust relationship to the table that they are doing business with a company that has a good history of supporting their IT infastructure. And it helps to shed the image of Linux as a renegade, cowyboy, rogue operating system developed mostly by rebels who can’t stand commercial software (and who often display attitudes of extreme immaturity.)
Sun brings to the table an established corporation with an established history with most major companies. Major companies know they can trust Sun and Sun gives “corporate credibility” to Linux. That’s something that other than IBM, no other Linux player can do. Red Hat can’t do it, etc.