“I have been a Linux user since 1995. It has been my desktop and server of choice since about 1997. But there is more in the Open Source operating system world than just Linux. So, I decided to play with the Wasabi Systems’ distribution of NetBSD. The basic distribution comes on two CDs with a small instruction booklet.” Read the rest of the NetBSD review at NewsForge.
A Linux Guy Looks at NetBSD
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
has as much clout as me reviewing french wine. Linux loosers should stick to Redhat/Mandrake and leave the real OSs to profesionals.
If you could take the time to actually read the article, you would see that the reviewer is trying to review NetBSD on his VAX station, not on his x86. The reviewer, apparently does have a clue, at least as much needed to write his review.
I use BSD, now i’m leet.. but my favorite hacking scripts don’t work under bsd, so I have to go back to my l33t h4x0r Os linux.
Eugenia – what does the fact that *one* of the machines he’s installing NetBSD on happens to be a VAX have to do with anything??? And if _you_ would have read the article you’d find out that he did install NetBSD on an x86 (blah)
From the article:
“Since there is no working X Window System for my VAX (a fact that was not clearly expressed in any of the documents I examined), and my DECstation has no video monitor, I had no need to install a GUI on either of these boxes. However, my IBM Thinkpad laptop could benefit from a usable GUI. So I decided to install KDE.”
>what does the fact that *one* of the machines he’s installing NetBSD on happens to be a VAX have to do with anything???
You said that people should leave BSD to professionals. Personally, I have met some people who have used VAX as admins. They looked pretty professionals to me. Not everyone gets to tinker in that way with VAXes.
>And if _you_ would have read the article you’d find out that he did install NetBSD on an x86 (blah)
Yes, but his main gripe was the VAX. That *seemed* to be his original reason for trying out NetBSD in the first place. He wanted to try it out on his VAX.
I do not understand. What _exactly_ is YOUR problem with his article? What did you not like?
>Linux loosers should stick to Redhat/Mandrake and leave the real OSs to profesionals.
I think everyone should decide themselves if they should install BSD/Plan9 and any other alternative OS’s.. I’m not a pro myself, still I had FreeBSD, Plan9 and AtheOS on my comp.. Maybe you’re one of those people who only use other OS’s to look ‘nerdish’ and l33t to your friends??
have you been banging your pots again?
Do you want the genital cuff?
(Man, I *love* that movie!)
Go for the eyes Boo, go for the eyes!
ARRRRGGGHHHH!!!!!!
Protect the innocent!!!!!
Banzai to kill!!!!
what kind of troll would this be without tj?
my view of netbsd is the same software as linux just less hardware support.
ooh, that should start a flamewar…
We were quoting a movie that featured Ruprecht the Monkey boy, not attacking.
As Big Al says those were quotes from the movie “Dirty rotten Scoundrels”.
Its a very funny movie about some con men working the south of france.
In the movie steve martin would play the part of ruprecht to scare off the people they were scamming.
You have to have seen the movie to get the joke.
NetBSD is NOT the same as Linux with less hardware support. A BSD kernel, though it might feel like Linux, is not Linux. I am in the process of blowing away my Mandrake 8.1 box in favor of FreeBSD. Many reasons account for this decision, but mainly the non-forked development. I want something stable and reliable, but I also want to know that it doesn’t COMPLETELY change on every system. Thanks to the GPL, every jackass with 1/2 semester of C programming can run his own distro of Linux. With the BSDs, you know what you’re getting.
I may be a Linux <STRONG>loser</STRONG>, but I don’t use Redhat nor Mandrake. Why does everyone think Linux revolves around these distro’s? Get a clue.
I personally use Slackware on both my servers and laptop.
What I love about NetBSD is that it’s the same on all the supported platforms. Surely there are a zillion of Linux ports, but there is no distro that is the same on all of them, and even if you just do PPC an x86 within the same distro, there’s still a lot of differences.
😀
*ducking and running away*
NetBSD doesn’t run on the 600MHz iBooks. So does BeOS. 😉
C’mon, isn’t the whole idea about having multiple OSes available about -choice?-
A BSD user shouldn’t abuse another BSDer for using a different flavour, nor should they be anti-Linux because they are a BSDer.
I was very reluctant to move from my Atari Falcon to an x86 architecture and I swore that I would not go MS. I did DR-Dos + Desqview, moving to OS/2 (2.11 through 4), then FreeBSD, followed by my final settling with Linux.
And as someone else indicated. Linux <> Redhat/Mandrake. I use Debian currently and am looking very seriously at the LinuxFromScratch project for a truly ‘roll your own’ OS.
Let’s not get wrapped up in a ‘my OS is better than your OS’ campaign, because then we will get left with a singular dominant OS, stiffling innovation and causing serious security flaws to go unpatched…
Besides, if you want to kick an OS user, find a Windows user; much easier and more deserving targets!
Please, don’t kick Windows users. Those poor guys are suffering enough already.
Eugenia – I had nothing against the article. I thought the article was funny. I simply submited my unsolicited opinion. As for VAX people looking profesional – what’s that one about judging a book by its cover?
I do not have “other os’s” to look nerdish in front of my friends. My friends know quite well what a nerd I am. As for the “other os’s” – I use Solaris. Period. Bar none the BEST os there is – unless I’m stuck on an x86 machine, then it’s FreeBSD all the way.
“my view of netbsd is the same software as linux just less hardware support.”
Actually, that would be like saying OSX is just Windows with less hardware support. Yes, they both have drag and drop, mouse pointers and overlapping windows, but they are very different.
BSD is unix and supports Linux apps, and Linux is unix-like, but they are very different.
I have been a Linux user for many years. I also use Windows. Recently, I installed FreeBSD. I did the absolute minimal install possible using the FreeBSD install disks and built my machine to my own tastes using the ports tree. I like all the OSes I have used, but I was surprised how well FreeBSD was documented and how easy it was to make everything work, especially considering it was a laptop that I installed it on.
Ruprecht,
what are you using your computer for that you find Solaris so great?
This explains it all
http://www.spatula.net/proc/linux/index.src
One of the (in my opinion) most valid points:
To install Joe’s program, you need Bob’s kernel hack, but for Bob’s kernel hack, you’ve got to have Suzy’s patches, but Suzy’s patches only work with a year-old kernel, unless you get Mike’s patches to Suzy’s patches, but even then, those conflict with Jeff’s drivers, which can be resolved only by installing Nancy’s patches…
I have great interest in *good* hardware. After a day of dealing with mostly wintel machines, sitting down at an Ultra 10 is like a breath of fresh air. More indepth – I’m an application developer. I find that Solaris has the best documentation and lower level system api. For an example on both,if you have access to an Solaris 7/8 box, lookup a manual page on cdio or audioctl. You’ll see exactly what I’m talking about.
Antarius came out of the closet to say:
“I use Debian currently and am looking very seriously at the LinuxFromScratch project for a truly ‘roll your own’ OS.”
Go for it. I did an lfs system a few months ago as a sort of a “learn linux properly” project, after messing with the hand-holding distros for too long. It took some time, but worth it – linux actually makes some sort of sense to me now.
Article seemed OK to me, a NetBSD fan since version 0.9. Maybe a little heavy on the difficulty of the partition table editor, especially if his only complaint is that it fails to suggest sizes. (If you don’t know what size you want to make the partitions, why not use the default?!) Anyway, NetBSD (and the other BSD’s) did right to implement their own partition structure and not rely on the PC BIOS partition.
He’s right, it isn’t “user friendly”, you need to know a lot. On the other hand, it might be about the most conservative operating system in active development today, if only because of the mammoth job of coordinating release changes on a full operating system across all those platforms. They don’t mess around with things just on a whim. When you’re used to software that introduces gratuitous changes in every release, you don’t want to learn anything and you look for “user friendly”. NetBSD dares to be boring.
Dear LinuxPenthouse,
I never thought it could happen to a guy like me.
I was in a stable relationship with a really nice penguin.
Then this sexy little red devil showed up at my door one day.
One thing lead to another…..etc.
Sorry, but, end user reviews of long term existing
software are a bane to me. The old journalistic adage,
“If it’s not news, it’s advertising.” seems to ring here.
Geese!, *yet another* distro of BSD/linux!!!! Wow! I’m so amazed!!!
Is there anything *new* out there?
Just my opinion.
Who really cares what the @#$% OS you can get on or how many you wear or weather one does this or that. the fact of the matter is they are all toys, not very good ones at that but yet we play with them and many arrogant little BOYs measure their self worth by them. It all sounds just like a gradeschool play ground, “mine is bigger than yours”, who gives a rats @#$@. Someday there will be a good OS but not yet.
good day little boys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
solaris, buhahahaha, if you like insecure systems…..
Hello stew!
Could you go a little into detail what the problem about netbsd on recent iBooks is? I was about to give it a try (doesn’t have anything to do with the article)
What’s with all this nonsense about people using BSD to be |337?
I use FreeBSD for the exact oposite reason. It’s not cutting edge, it’s not full of bells in whistles, and it isn’t exactly the coolest OS out there. What it is, is pretty vanilla Unix OS. It works as advertised (and even the quirks are advertised). It has excelent documentation. And it’s stable. If such and such driver is supposed to work with FreeBSD 4.whatever it almost always does. I have yet to be able to say the same about Linux, after having to actualy edit the source code to get a sound card to work.
When I want a Unix system that just works, I boot up FreeBSD. When I want the cutting edge, adn that |337 feeling, I’ll boot up what every flavor of Linux I happened to install this month.
But I’m not trying to beat up on the Linux users either. Because even though the fast pace of development causes so many inconsistancies, it also produces alot of good ideas.
If you sit my mom down in front of Linux-Mandrake (heh
and sit her down in front of *BSD, she will see WindowMaker on both screens. She will be running the same applications in the exact same way. Unless she knows “uname,” she will think it’s the same OS.
IT’S THE EXACT SAME SOFTWARE. EXCEPT FOR THE KERNEL.
If you like something about the kernel, then use BSD, but the reason I DON’T is because when I installed FreeBSD, I didn’t notice anything spectacular about the kernel. It just didn’t support my hardware.
With the size of the networks I have to look after around the world, Solaris gives us the least problems. BSD gives us just as few problems, as does Linux (Whatever flavour)
I prefer Solaris, that’s just my preference.
I shall not comment about MS for fear of opening the wankers forum.
All I can say is use what you’re comfortable with and what fills your needs.
Sim
Well it is just a day in the life of one Guy, so lighten up.
Sim
that web page that ruprecht put up is WAY out of date, and doesnt recognise the differences between linux and gnu. (rms stops.. sniffs the air and roars!
the gnu toolset has been extended over the “standard” unix tools in a number of ways, some good some not. and its true that software written expecting bash/gmake/gcc wont compile with unix “standard” tools.
but there really ISNT a unix standard. that has been one of the big problems, and maybe why all the old unix vendors suddenly like linux? linux (the kernel) isnt professionally coded, documented and released and linus torvalds never asked you to slag off his work. i’m sure everyone has written code that isnt so good. linus’ just happens to be distributed world-wide.
there are some brain-dead things about bsd, too. the politics is merely the first that springs to mind.
I think windows on x86 would be the best platform, I don’t know why you keep talking about all this bsd/solris/vax crap. Its all about the Windows.
Only loosers use unix. Looses and people to stupid to figure out that windows is far more stable, and secure then bsd. If I was stuck with any other OS besides Windows XP, it would have to be linux.
Mine is biger than yours.
>I think windows on x86 would be the best platform, I don’t know why you keep >talking about all this bsd/solris/vax crap. Its all about the Windows.
>
>Only loosers use unix. Looses and people to stupid to figure out that windows >is far more stable, and secure then bsd. If I was stuck with any other OS >besides Windows XP, it would have to be linux.
lol
Parece só os mais tolos das pessoas podem fazer tal comenta.
Mas se você for um zelote, eu esperaria nenhum melhor. Por que hipocrisia você se dá bem e é criativo.
Ao invés, você continua lamentando.
Idiotas
Lol! Well said!
Querido, disse-se que Deus repartiu a tolice igualmente entre todos. Acho isso errado : muita gente receberam mais do que mereciam. E temos que aguentar.
>Querido, disse-se que Deus repartiu a tolice igualmente entre todos. Acho isso errado : muita gente receberam mais do que mereciam. E temos que aguentar.
Você fala meus pensamentos.
Como possa nós planamos como águias, quando nós somos rodeados por perus.
Niger Pablo
I am glad to see Linux is getting popular enough that people like Ruprecht are no longer flocking to Linux, but using one of the BSDs instead. People like that are an embarassment to whatever OS they are advocating.
That said, I have to agree with him that Solaris documentation is better then Linux documentation. For example, from the stat 2 man page for Linux, we have the following excerpt:
<pre>
They all return a stat structure, which contains the fol
lowing fields:
struct stat {
dev_t st_dev; /* device */
ino_t st_ino; /* inode */
mode_t st_mode; /* protection */
nlink_t st_nlink; /* number of hard links */
uid_t st_uid; /* user ID of owner */
gid_t st_gid; /* group ID of owner */
dev_t st_rdev; /* device type (if inode device) */
off_t st_size; /* total size, in bytes */
unsigned long st_blksize; /* blocksize for filesystem I/O */
unsigned long st_blocks; /* number of blocks allocated */
time_t st_atime; /* time of last access */
time_t st_mtime; /* time of last modification */
time_t st_ctime; /* time of last change */
};
</pre>
No more explanation of what these fields mean is given.
The Solaris man page is far more helpful:
<pre>
Descriptions of structure members are as follows:
[…]
st_dev This field uniquely identifies the file system
that contains the file. Its value may be used as
input to the ustat() function to determine more
information about this file system. No other mean-
ing is associated with this value.
st_rdev This field should be used only by administrative
commands. It is valid only for block special or
character special files and only has meaning on
the system where the file was configured.
st_nlink This field should be used only by administrative
commands.
</pre>
…and personal attacks? Please outgrow this vulgar juvenility.
Actually there is a standard for UNIX(tm) if you want to get your OS into Unix98 and POSIX compliance and hand over a chunk of cash to http://www.opengroup.org/. Neither *BSD or Linux are UNIX(tm) though *BSD is more directly descended from historical Unix. Note this is about the trademark and has little to do with functionality.