Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 11th Aug 2006 19:10 UTC, submitted by Dolphin
.NET (dotGNU too) "Four short years ago, Microsoft unveiled its new framework/engine for programming and running applications in a virtual environment, and the world was stunned. Microsoft had introduced a run-time environment that was for the first time a true 'write once, run everywhere' implementation, but that was far from being the end. With .NET 3.0 on the loom, NeoSmart Technologies takes a look at how far .NET has come and just how long it can keep going."
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Great article
by ronaldst on Fri 11th Aug 2006 20:25 UTC
ronaldst
Member since:
2005-06-29

.Net changed my opinion on Virtual Machines. Seeing Java's failure on the desktop, I had completely abandonned the idea of apps running on virtual machines for desktop usage.

Let's face it, Microsoft has the best devs tools. And .Net shows that they haven't lost their touch.

What's not amazing is that the OSS fundies have already spammed the comment section of the article with their usual unfounded Microsoft hatred. -_-

Reply Score: 2

RE: Great article
by andyleung on Fri 11th Aug 2006 20:34 in reply to "Great article"
andyleung Member since:
2006-03-24

You just don't face the fact yourself. Try running a C#.NET program on desktop is only insignificantly faster than a Java app on desktop these days. If you don't want me to mention OSS, fine, how about Websphere? Oracle's JDeveloper and Middleware? How about BI platforms? Database like DB2? Oracle10g? obviously you are not living in enterprise's world.

I don't mind using Microsoft products if they are good. Like Microsoft Office 2007, none of any office suite can compare for its very initiative UI, OOo is far from it. MSN? well, you think everybody is using MSN but everybody in Asia and many in Europe are using Yahoo, Jabber and Gaim. Try looking around the world, you don't wanna live in front of your own Windows XP Home world only right?

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[2]: Great article
by kaiwai on Sat 12th Aug 2006 10:54 in reply to "RE: Great article"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

I don't mind using Microsoft products if they are good. Like Microsoft Office 2007, none of any office suite can compare for its very initiative UI, OOo is far from it. MSN? well, you think everybody is using MSN but everybody in Asia and many in Europe are using Yahoo, Jabber and Gaim. Try looking around the world, you don't wanna live in front of your own Windows XP Home world only right?

Excuse me, outside the US of A; AOL/AIM mean jack shit; Microsoft is top shit, grand poobah, big kahuna; ask anyone in New Zealand, Australia or the Asia/Pacific region what they have for their chat client, its going to be MSN; sure, there are some hold out few still hugging their Yahoo accounts more to do with compatibility than enjoying the service.

As for C# etc. Like I said, its a Windows platform technology; for all intensive purposes, if you want multiplatform, then go Java, if you want an improved development framework for Windows, then go for .NET.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE: Great article
by zambizzi on Fri 11th Aug 2006 21:45 in reply to "Great article"
zambizzi Member since:
2006-04-23

Best dev tools?

Ever tried eclipse? Ever tried Netbeans? JBuilder? JDeveloper? Sounds like maybe you're not speaking from experience.

Having a *choice* of platforms and tools is perhaps just an advantage you're not accustomed to.

Unfounded MS hatred? I don't hate MS personally, they produce *some* good software. However, I don't think it's the best bang for your buck. It's not the best out there and it just doesn't justify the price tag. I'll take superior quality + zero license fees any day, thanks.

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE: Great article
by Ford Prefect on Sat 12th Aug 2006 12:29 in reply to "Great article"
Ford Prefect Member since:
2006-01-16

Sure, MS has good dev tools. It's still that .Net can't beat Java, as it doesn't offer any significant feature over Java, while Java is mature und _really_ "write once, run everywhere".

The article is bullshit, and the readers recognize this, and post about it. This is not about OSS fundies, this is just about senseless crap.


And btw, Java had much to learn, but did, regarding desktop usage. Future will tell if it's too late or not.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: Great article
by Gryzor on Sat 12th Aug 2006 17:51 in reply to "RE: Great article"
Gryzor Member since:
2005-07-03

It's still that .Net can't beat Java, as it doesn't offer any significant feature over Java,
You obviously have no idea what you're talking about.
Now compare the time it takes to write a single Windows application with Window Forms (for god's sake I hate WinForms) and then compare it with Swing/AWT or whatever "toolkit" you happen to have...

I've seen dozens of companies choose .NET over Java because Java has no decent presentation layer... Java apps look horrible, behave horribly and take "ages to load" (Azareus anyone?)
Now before you troll again: "ages to load" means the Java Runtime Environment scratching the HDD (I have 1GB RAM) *much more* than "other applications".

Plain simple. You can tell when Java has loaded or is loading... there are a "few" seconds of hdd thrashing.

So, Apart from that "little detail" (faster processors, more ram, precompiled java, and stuff like that will dimish this problem), then there's the need for an easy, well integrated (full of bugs, like WinForms ;) ) toolkit... Swing doesn't do...

You gotta admit it. I choose .NET over Java because we needed a Visually Stunning Application with TabletPC capabilities, and very very easy to use.

By Using GDI+ and C#.NET + WinForms, we did it and we get "ahhh" "oohhh"s when people see it. And behind the scenes? .Net is as good as Java...

So saying that ".NET doesn't have any significant feature over Java" is childish.

You don't seem to understand that:

a) Not every company needs to support a zillion plataforms.
b) Not every company is developing websites.
c) Not every company can spend *more* time developing... .NET is, like VB was back in 1998, faster to develop... you may like it or not, but it's the truth.

I had to integrate a VB/VC++ (6.0) project with a Java application a couple of years ago. We went for SOA and webservices; we had the webservices and everything up and running in one day. It took the java devs at least two to set up a myriad of open source projects, apache, tomcat, etc...
And the company was SUN Certified as a Java I don't know what and had more than 100 Java devs... they Knew what they were doing.

So no, not everyone can "afford" that...

.Net has a lot of problems, but in VS2003 (and now 2005) you can develop windows applications really fast... really. And the quality can be as good as a Java/C++ application from an "OOP" perspective. (Sometimes even better!). Now there's no excuse.

All in all, I wish I could go back to Objective-C and my Mac ;)

Reply Parent Score: 1