Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 11th Aug 2006 19:10 UTC, submitted by Dolphin
.NET (dotGNU too) "Four short years ago, Microsoft unveiled its new framework/engine for programming and running applications in a virtual environment, and the world was stunned. Microsoft had introduced a run-time environment that was for the first time a true 'write once, run everywhere' implementation, but that was far from being the end. With .NET 3.0 on the loom, NeoSmart Technologies takes a look at how far .NET has come and just how long it can keep going."
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RE: Great article
by Ford Prefect on Sat 12th Aug 2006 12:29 UTC in reply to "Great article"
Ford Prefect
Member since:

Sure, MS has good dev tools. It's still that .Net can't beat Java, as it doesn't offer any significant feature over Java, while Java is mature und _really_ "write once, run everywhere".

The article is bullshit, and the readers recognize this, and post about it. This is not about OSS fundies, this is just about senseless crap.

And btw, Java had much to learn, but did, regarding desktop usage. Future will tell if it's too late or not.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: Great article
by Gryzor on Sat 12th Aug 2006 17:51 in reply to "RE: Great article"
Gryzor Member since:

It's still that .Net can't beat Java, as it doesn't offer any significant feature over Java,
You obviously have no idea what you're talking about.
Now compare the time it takes to write a single Windows application with Window Forms (for god's sake I hate WinForms) and then compare it with Swing/AWT or whatever "toolkit" you happen to have...

I've seen dozens of companies choose .NET over Java because Java has no decent presentation layer... Java apps look horrible, behave horribly and take "ages to load" (Azareus anyone?)
Now before you troll again: "ages to load" means the Java Runtime Environment scratching the HDD (I have 1GB RAM) *much more* than "other applications".

Plain simple. You can tell when Java has loaded or is loading... there are a "few" seconds of hdd thrashing.

So, Apart from that "little detail" (faster processors, more ram, precompiled java, and stuff like that will dimish this problem), then there's the need for an easy, well integrated (full of bugs, like WinForms ;) ) toolkit... Swing doesn't do...

You gotta admit it. I choose .NET over Java because we needed a Visually Stunning Application with TabletPC capabilities, and very very easy to use.

By Using GDI+ and C#.NET + WinForms, we did it and we get "ahhh" "oohhh"s when people see it. And behind the scenes? .Net is as good as Java...

So saying that ".NET doesn't have any significant feature over Java" is childish.

You don't seem to understand that:

a) Not every company needs to support a zillion plataforms.
b) Not every company is developing websites.
c) Not every company can spend *more* time developing... .NET is, like VB was back in 1998, faster to develop... you may like it or not, but it's the truth.

I had to integrate a VB/VC++ (6.0) project with a Java application a couple of years ago. We went for SOA and webservices; we had the webservices and everything up and running in one day. It took the java devs at least two to set up a myriad of open source projects, apache, tomcat, etc...
And the company was SUN Certified as a Java I don't know what and had more than 100 Java devs... they Knew what they were doing.

So no, not everyone can "afford" that...

.Net has a lot of problems, but in VS2003 (and now 2005) you can develop windows applications really fast... really. And the quality can be as good as a Java/C++ application from an "OOP" perspective. (Sometimes even better!). Now there's no excuse.

All in all, I wish I could go back to Objective-C and my Mac ;)

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[3]: Great article
by Ford Prefect on Sat 12th Aug 2006 18:05 in reply to "RE[2]: Great article"
Ford Prefect Member since:

I got my tomcat up & running in 10 minutes... (it's "Apache Tomcat", a single product, btw)

So well, I guess everybody has his own experiences on that field. Don't be too blind to tell everybody it's a pain in the ass to set up a production environment with j2ee only because of single experiences.

You're right about the GUI framework, Swing is really infamous, I didn't have a further look into AWT and others, yet.

So ok, likely that we have this additional feature Windows.Forms, which wouldn't help me, as I develop cross-platform, but should be a feature over Java for Windows only developers.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[3]: Great article
by andyleung on Sun 13th Aug 2006 03:50 in reply to "RE[2]: Great article"
andyleung Member since:

I guess you really have no idea of what you are talking about right? As far as I know, there are tons of good to go high performance Swing apps out there in many enterprise companies including big ones like IBM, Oracle and BusinessObject....o well...who cares if you don't look around.

Reply Parent Score: 1