Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 2nd Mar 2007 21:04 UTC
Novell and Ximian "Novell on Mar. 1 announced preliminary financial results for its 2007 fiscal year first quarter, showing net revenue of USD 230 million. The first quarter's revenue represented a decline of USD 12 million, or about 5 percent, from the prior year's first quarter revenue of USD 242 million. Despite the unexceptional overall results during the first fiscal quarter 2007, however, Novell reported USD 15 million of revenue from Linux Platform Products, up 46 percent year-over-year, and USD 91 million of invoicing, up a whopping 659 percent year-over-year. Linux - make no doubt about it - is Novell's future."
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RE[2]: Business as usual
by kaiwai on Sun 4th Mar 2007 09:43 UTC in reply to "RE: Business as usual"
kaiwai
Member since:
2005-07-06

Going for .NET and the whole mono enchilada, with the attendant performance and legal issues. Without mono, the deal with Microsoft may have never happened.

Hmm, the legal issues aren't the big problem; the big problem is the continual payments required to Microsoft from the Linux camp - but the person to blame for bringing dot net to Linux isn't Novell or Ximian; the bringing of dot net to Linux was merely a biproduct of Sun unwilling to opensource Java with its list of lies and excuses as to why they couldn't do it.

If there wasn't the issue with Sun and Java was opensource, the need to bring dot net to Linux would never have existed and Novell would have spent time along with Red Hat creating Java bindings for GNOME based technologies along with making SWT-GTK the default Java widget set for GNOME development.

The irony of the whole thing, Beagle was a port of an existing Java product that was adapted to mono and GNOME - so we would have gotten many of the features we see today except running on some sort of enhanced version of Java which included shared VM and the likes.

Regarding the performance hit of VM based software as bought up in your post; there is nothing wrong with VM based software, its benefits in regards to speeding up software development, improved stability and security - Lotus Notes 8.0 which is in development and based on on the Eclipse framework is an awesome application and definately defuses any 'Java is crap for general purpose applications'.

Java doesn't suck; Swing sucks, and the horse that is constantly beaten by Sun isn't going to correct the situation; SWT-GTK should ultimately be the defacto standard widget kit for Java development IMHO, it integrates well with *NIX GNOME desktop.

One (or a couple) bad experience with Java shouldn't be used as a benchmark as to whether the idea of Java persay is a good framework for GNOME or whether Mono is.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Business as usual
by Morty on Sun 4th Mar 2007 15:00 in reply to "RE[2]: Business as usual"
Morty Member since:
2005-07-06

but the person to blame for bringing dot net to Linux isn't Novell or Ximian; the bringing of dot net to Linux was merely a biproduct of Sun unwilling to opensource Java with its list of lies and excuses as to why they couldn't do it.

If that's the reason, the blame still falls squarely on Ximian. They could afterall have joined efforts with Kaffe, gjc and Classpath creating a free Java regardless of Sun.

At least Java is finally getting a decent GUI toolkit now, combined with becoming GPL perhaps we'll see some good apps coming out of it.

Edited 2007-03-04 15:01

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Business as usual
by kaiwai on Sun 4th Mar 2007 20:24 in reply to "RE[3]: Business as usual"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

If that's the reason, the blame still falls squarely on Ximian. They could afterall have joined efforts with Kaffe, gjc and Classpath creating a free Java regardless of Sun.

True, but at the same time, they probably looked at both situations; create a dot net implementation or help implement, couple that with the perception that C# makes up for deficiences back when Java was missing a whole heap of features which C# natively included with the language, one can hardly blame Ximian when you look at the bigger picture, even when comparing the two technologies purely on technology grounds.

At least Java is finally getting a decent GUI toolkit now, combined with becoming GPL perhaps we'll see some good apps coming out of it.

True; I don't think Sun is going to give up on Swing, but what you will see is is SWT simply become the defacto standard used by device manufacturers such as Nokia with gtk becoming the toolkit of choice for future development, and application vendors like IBM via Eclipse using it for application development.

The better approach I think with Java is not necessarily "write once, run everywhere" but instead aim for something atleast along the lines of "write once and make porting easier" - so then atleast there is the benefit of portability whilst at the same time being able to integrate it in well with each unique desktop rather than trying to have a GUI with the lowest common demoninator widgets and have uniformity accross all platforms.

Reply Parent Score: 3