Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 19th Jan 2010 23:31 UTC, submitted by jebb
Apple Now this is material that piques my interest more than anything: insights from one of the bigger names in the industry. Jean-Louis Gassee debunks the "Apple-must-license-its-software-or-die" myth by looking back upon the past - and if you don't know who JLG is, then please take that dunce hat and stand in the corner for three hours, contemplating your existence. Note: OSNews has a bug with using diacritic marks on the front page, so JLG's name is misspelled. It is correctly spelled in the article body.
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RE[4]: LOL Gasse..
by Thom_Holwerda on Wed 20th Jan 2010 18:41 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: LOL Gasse.."
Thom_Holwerda
Member since:
2005-06-29

I doubt that MS even knew what BeOS was, I am fascinated by the level of detachment with reality by some of the BeOS fans.


I guess you don't know your history. Be sued Microsoft for anticompetitive practices, and got a successful settlement out of it. Both Hitachi and Compaq were pressured (Compaq even by Bill Gates himself) NOT to sign deals with Be.

It was an OS with no OEM support


See above. Several Mac clone makers and companies like Compaq and Hitachi shipped or wanted to ship the BeOS. Linux only recently has gotten somewhat of the same level of support.

no user base to speak of, and almost no apps (never mind any resemblance of an actual killer app)...


How old are you? You never experienced the heydays of the BeOS, did you? BeBits used to be filled to the brim with applications


it even had an awful TCP stack right when the internet was taking off and they were trying to position the OS as a web appliance. LOL


The R5 stack was indeed a mess, but they had a new stack ready, which can be seen at work in dan0 and Zeta. It's miles better than the R5 one.

But I guess you have started many more successful businesses than JLG, and have a decade worth of executive experience at one of the biggest electronics/computer companies in the world.

Edited 2010-01-20 18:41 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[5]: LOL Gasse..
by Soulbender on Thu 21st Jan 2010 05:47 in reply to "RE[4]: LOL Gasse.."
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

But I guess you have started many more successful businesses than JLG, and have a decade worth of executive experience at one of the biggest electronics/computer companies in the world.


Well, Thom, you better stop criticizing Ballmer, Jobs, Torvalds, Siego, de Icaza and pretty much any OSS or commercial software effort because, you know, how many hugely successful software projects have you started and how many companies have you had executive management in?

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[6]: LOL Gasse..
by StephenBeDoper on Thu 21st Jan 2010 18:41 in reply to "RE[5]: LOL Gasse.."
StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

Well, Thom, you better stop criticizing Ballmer, Jobs, Torvalds, Siego, de Icaza and pretty much any OSS or commercial software effort because, you know, how many hugely successful software projects have you started and how many companies have you had executive management in?


Or, instead of erring to the opposite extreme, he could try to limit himself to *reasoned* criticism of those figures (as opposed to armchair-CEO pontification peppered with "LOL"s).

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[5]: LOL Gasse..
by memson on Thu 21st Jan 2010 12:26 in reply to "RE[4]: LOL Gasse.."
memson Member since:
2006-01-01

"it even had an awful TCP stack right when the internet was taking off and they were trying to position the OS as a web appliance. LOL


The R5 stack was indeed a mess, but they had a new stack ready, which can be seen at work in dan0 and Zeta. It's miles better than the R5 one.
"

<rant>
Okay.. firstly.. my BIGGEST BeOS related pet hate: there was never a release of BeOS, neither public or leaked, called "Dan0". The "R5.1" release name was "Dano0" which if you look at R5 release numbers matches the R5.0 release, "maui0". The only reference I have ever seen to Dan0 in BeOS related stuff, was that one of the PRIVATE beta updates to R5 (OpenGL I beleive) changes the release name string to "Dan0". However, this was a service pack, NOT an OS release. </rant>

The net_server wasn't all bad. The issue with it lay more in the assumption by many that it should be Kernel mode (and the fact that anything that needed access kernel level services as well as the GUI had a nasty hack stub app to work and this often proved flaky as heck - e.g. WON.)

Most flack came from the fact that it wasn't a perfect clone of the BSD Sockets style interface, which made porting apps that relied on more UNIX/POSIX/BSD Sockets type functionality almost a Herculean task. The PowerPC never saw a public release of a working BONE, so we still have net_server, and it works just fine, thanks ;-) Also, all of the BeIA R1.0 (and pre-release) images I have seen still use the net_server.. I think it was a 2.0 image that I saw that was the first to have BONE.

BONE was good, but it still contained a whole heap of bugs. I saw it get better in Dano0/R5.1 release and Zeta seemed to use it pretty successfully, but it was still not perfect.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[6]: LOL Gasse..
by StephenBeDoper on Thu 21st Jan 2010 19:10 in reply to "RE[5]: LOL Gasse.."
StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

The net_server wasn't all bad. The issue with it lay more in the assumption by many that it should be Kernel mode (and the fact that anything that needed access kernel level services as well as the GUI had a nasty hack stub app to work and this often proved flaky as heck - e.g. WON.)


Agreed. I think the "R5 networking sucked" argument is more of a meme than anything else. Not that net_server was perfect, but most of those who repeat the criticisms of it are unable to provide even a single, specific example of a problem resulting from the net_server (because they've most likely never used it).

Reply Parent Score: 2