Microsoft’s Jim Allchin says that the number one design goal for Longhorn has been:
“it just works.” In other words, a lot of the fiddly, annoying tasks that computer users have become accustomed to (or never quite got the hang of) such as searching for files, defragmenting, changing network configurations, and tweaking security settings, will happen automatically.
for my taste the windows operating system already does too much things one doesn’t want or that one doesn’t have any control of. instead of playing with itself it should do more tasks i want it to do…
No defragmenting ? *nix has had that for a long time. Anyway they have no plans to replace NTFS, and WinFS will only be another layer on top of NTFS. So don’t expect much filesystem goodness in Windows.
I agree with uwain. I have SP2 installed on my windows box. I have it set for automatic updating. While playing a game (Simcity 4, to be exact), patches were applied. Every 5 minutes, it would break out of the game to show me a window to tell me that patches were applied and I needed to reboot. I would click “Later.” Every 5 minutes, the same window would minimize my game and ask me to reboot.
Finally, I had to get up to do something else for a few minutes, and I come back and the stupid thing rebooted. Granted, I should have saved my game. But Microsoft just doesn’t want to take “NO! I’ll reboot later” for an answer.
And on a side-note, hasn’t Apple been using the “It just works” slogan for a few years? But the difference, for Apple, it’s true.
In a closed, proprietary environment where every piece of software comes from the same supplier, this is the least that can be ask: that everything “just works”. Just like when IBM reigned on the IT world. It just worked too.
But I see 2 problems:
– IBM, and now Microsoft, is hampered by its legacy environment (come on guys, it does not take 5+ years to come up with a slightly revamped GUI like you promise for Long/Shorthorn. And shall I mention WinFS which, under various names, is being promised since 1995?).
– Windows’ architecture also makes possible for worms, viruses, trojans, spyware and others to also “just work”. And it works so well that even script kiddies can program them in a matter of hours.
Still about “just working”, I refer readers to this article where it cleary shows that it “just does NOT work“…. http://news.com.com/The+Acid2+challenge+to+Microsoft/2010-1032_3-56…
Just like Microsoft replaced IBM, I hope a new player will emerge…
“Every 5 minutes, it would break out of the game to show me a window to tell me that patches were applied and I needed to reboot.”
That pissed me off so much! I left the window open and then put it in the very lower corner of my second monitor and left it there out of site. I later just turned off automatic updates. Anyways, I really dont feel like I have had to do much tinkering with Windows. Maybe upon first installing it, but even then most everything works out of the box and the OS itself doesnt need much tinkering. I dont even remember having a virus in the last 5 or so years, so I just scan for viruses once a month. Overall I dont waste nearly as much time tinkering with Windows to get it to work unlike other operating systems i’ve used.
Hey, I for one believe them. Remember when they said that they were going to make Windows a secure and trusted platform? They delivered on that, so why not this?
How long has Jobs been famous for saying “It just works” (that exact phrase) for, over two decades, right? And in Steve’s case, at least more so than for most other computer companies, it does.
If I’m not mistaken, that is very close to the NeXTstep (now owned by Apple) phrase. I do not recall if it was a trademarked phrase or not, but if it is, I wonder if MS using it is covered under any “licensing” agreements between MS and Apple. And, if it isn’t, I wonder if Apple will stand up and rattle their sabres on this one. “It just works” is _NOT_ something I’d consider describing Microsoft or Windows.
And, if you notice what they are talking about, they are not even talking about their OS just working. No, they are talking about things like searching for files. <sarcasm>Oh yes, searching for files is much more important than stability.</sarcasm>
But Microsoft just doesn’t want to take “NO! I’ll reboot later” for an answer.
Really? On my Win2k pro system when I say reboot later it leaves me alone.
In other words, a lot of the fiddly, annoying tasks that computer users have become accustomed to (or never quite got the hang of) such as searching for files, defragmenting,
Thank god, I can’t stand starting speed disk, or actualy typing in the name of the file in the search box. Really MS stop treating us like we are a bunch of idiots.
“Windows is only getting started, as far as Allchin is concerned.”
Here’s that mass psychology thing again: build anticipation.
M$ might not be a half bad company with Allchin running it and Gates and his clown-prince Ballmer out of the picture.
I could swear MS was trumpeting this exact make thing as the underlying philosophy for the WinXP development project.
With all the resources they have available, just how long is it going to take them to make it “just work”?
MS has used “It Just Works” since Windows 95.
Somehow, all these changes that are announced for Longhorn just mean “We’ll let you have less control of your system and inestad, you’ll get transparancy. And cool windows you can see right through.”
Sadly, I noticed it in KDE 3.4 too…on-mouse-over popups the size of Texas? Blueargh.
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Really? On my Win2k pro system when I say reboot later it leaves me alone.
”
Yeah, the asking you if you want to reboot every 5 minutes is a new annoying….erm….feature….erm….innovation from Microsoft that was included in XP SP2. It is really annoying.
Right now M$ cannot very well run an ad saying “Go out and get your copy of Longhorn today”, yet the word “Longhorn” is on the tip of the tongue of everyone in the computer cognoscenti. How did they do it? All of these “unveilings” and “previews” and “sneak peeks” amount to free advertising for a product which is still on the drawing board, and it doesn’t cost M$ a dime. It is all very carefully orchestrated, make no mistake about it. The M$ publicity machine is playing the public like a piano.
Sadly, I noticed it in KDE 3.4 too…on-mouse-over popups the size of Texas?
They are easy to switch off. Although, I’d prefer not to have them on by default, as well.
Dear Microsoft,
Hereby some statements that might come closer to reality …
It just worked (and now it doesn’t)
It just works (from time to time but we don’t know how and we don’t know why)
Please, do not try to register these sentences as trademarks. I currently don’t have enough money to sue you for stealing my ideas here.
Regards
“It just works” has been Apple’s mantra for the longest time.
The no defragmentation thing would have been nice five years ago, but that too has been solved on both Linux and OS X (which auto-defragments during file operations).
‘It just works’…as if by magic? 😉
[cues “The Greatest American Hero” song]
than done.
When will “It just works” create novelty Windows security problems. Doesn’t “spyware” exploit “It just works”?
good point, we’ve already seen windows designers going for Just Works.
maybe a better slogan for ms would be “It Just Works…… and no, this is not a joke.”
…or it wouldn’t be so used. Linux must be made to work, which is a pain in the as*.
Anyone who still believes what Microsoft says is a fool.
How Apple of you.
Aah c’mon guys… Win XP isn’t that bad. Given, 9x sucked big time but if you buy good hardware that’s compatible with each other (as you’re doing when buying a Mac) you won’t have a prob with XP and it runs nicely and stable. And yes, OS X is superiour in a lot of ways but I cannot stress enough how difficult it is to make an OS that runs on every piece of crap hardware out there! Apple has such a big advantage there!
Disclaimer: I’m a happy Linux, OS X AND WinXP user. Use them all for different purposes and each OS does it’s job for me.
“Really MS stop treating us like we are a bunch of idiots.”
but sometimes people are a bunch of idiots. they cant find files because they didnt learn how to use the windows file system. they dont patch windows, office , av, firewall or other third party software, and they use admin accounts.
they use p2p programs like kazaa and morpheus and they open email attachments because somebody sent them “sexy pics.” these are major security violations.
they dont read the necessary instructions from “read me.txt” documents or purchased books to learn how to use the software properly. learning cost money.
if you put me in front of windows xp pro for the first time and said intuitively try to figure it out, i would be totally lost in space. computers loaded with winxp pro is a tool and users need to understand that they need to be educated to use them safely and properly.
check this out:
The Dumbing Down of America http://www.pcmagazine.com/article2/0,1759,1787713,00.asp
I think, “Just Works” implies that no user intervention is required, even in complex functions. That is pretty much not true for Linux setup – my experience. I think a good distro name would be Transparent. Because that’s what I want my Linux experience to be.
Of course, my SUSE box just works too, but I had to jump through a lot more setup hoops. Folks brag about how easy and comparable to XP most distro setups have become but in my experience, setup is just the beginning of a sometimes arduous process toward tweaking and getting it right. By that time, the next distro release is out. Some folks thrive on that. I do too, but then again, sometimes, I get worn down by it. I am eccentric Linux user #395900
I cannot stress enough how difficult it is to make an OS that runs on every piece of crap hardware out there! Apple has such a big advantage there!
You’re right — Apple does have a big advantage there – Darwin. If I’m not mistaken, Darwin is based on FreeBSD. FreeBSD runs on how many different types of hardware? Yes, Apple added their GUI on top of it, but you have to admit, the PowerPC architecture is very similar to Intel/AMD PCs. They even share PCI bus, memory, IDE drives, and so on.
That argument held true pre-OSX. And, perhaps it still does today, but to a much lesser degree.
I agree with part of what you say. making an OS for a lot of different hardware is tough.
I can’t install XP on my hardware, My roommate has a nearly Identical system(1.4 ghz 256mb ram, 1.3 ghz 640mb ram) He runs XP, On my slightly faster system it installs but fails to find the PS/2 ports for mice, and refuses to install any other mice.
Linux on the other hand , No problems, Win 9x, yea but why?
My current main machine now is 12″Powerbook hooked up to an 18″ LCD Now that is sweet. Oh and “It just Worked” from day one.
My first big switch was about a decade ago, from mac to windows. I was getting into development, and windows is definately the place to be if you plan on making money.
Anyways, apart from more general UI annoyances, tweaking and playing with windows really brought out the geek in me. Theres *much* more exposed in windows 2k then there is on os8. After a few years, I discovered linux and havnt looked back.
Linux of course has everything I liked about windows x 100. It has *everything* exposed, things work in a logical manner, there are no black boxes, you can actually learn it instead of rote memorization, you can troubleshoot virtually anything, etc, etc. geeks paradise.
Started out with KDE, as the whole tweaking thing is even more previlent there then on windows. Spent hours reading about the archetechture, pouring through config, log, and man files, and whatnot. Truely a ton of fun.
Finished school, got a job, and all of a sudden my computer went from a playground to a tool. I yearned for the old mac days, but there was no way in hell i could go back to mac. hell, i had trouble in windows with its crappy cli. (didnt know about osx at that point, other then it was purty. mac had fallen off my radar). At one point after trying out redhat, i was really impressed. the environment was clean and consistant, nothing like the patchwork feeling i alwas got using linux. things were well layed out, and pretty much everything was easy to find. thanks to bluecurve, took me almost 10 minutes to realise i was in gnome.
so since early gnome 2.x when the big cleanup was going on, i became an instant convert, and have been not only using it, but closely following gnome development since. To maintain consistancy, I do my best to use GNOME apps whenever possible. Ive got a set of apps i use now, and generally dont install qt/kdelibs.
Well, after i got over my WoW addiction, I went back to linux. Most of what I used to use were still there, with a bunch of improvements both big and small. one thing was sorely missing though, being in windows for so long, and as the owner of an ipod and massive mp3 collection, I found I now had a dependance on tag based “jukeboxes”. No problem I said, gnome has rhythmbox,which is pretty much an iTunes clone anyways. Theres just one problem, gstreamer is nowhere NEAR ready yet, and rhythmbox still has a nice way to go. So I decided to bite the bullet and install amaroK, and by extension the rest of kde so i could configure themes and colors and whatnot.
This is the most obvious contrast I have ever experienced in any environment. I am just not used to spending 45 minutes configuring an app anymore. Amarok has a grand total of FOUR config panes. dont get me wrong, it is by far the best jukebox on linux (currently), and really, its worth the effort to set up. but the ui is a disaster, an insane amount of complexity, a redicules amount of things that need to be gone through, and a ui thats packed to the brim.
after i went through the config process, i launched konq to configure kde. (to get same fonts/colors as my gnome setup). The KDE devs have put alot of work into cleaning it up, but the kontrol panel is still packed with all kinds of things that are all over the place, and need to be gone through methodically (or memorized). All in all, it took me a good hour before I had amarok/kde set up in a way that didnt drive me nuts. (still does a bit, but thats because of constant iTunes/iPod usage. its wierd using the tree to navigate through the collection, even though i remember i used to perfer this method)
It reminded me of the windows years, when i would install an app, the FIRST thing i would do is familiarize myself with the configuration options. On gnome, i only hit the preferences if/when i need to, and 90% of the time i dont. when i install gnome, i barely spend any time “setting it up”, theres no need to. its good to go out of the box, the only really nessicary customization is filly up a panel with applets and launchers and whatnot. when i install a new gnome app ive never used before, 9/10 i dont need to configure it before actually using it.
anyways, a very long rant to say that i have extensively used mac (pre osx), windows, kde, and gnome (with a brief fluxbox dalliance). The mantra of windows/kde is FEATURES!!! the mantra of mac/gnome is Just Works.
(please dont flame, this was not intended to paint kde/windows as bad, it was intended to show my subjective experience of stuff that Just Works. I use and love to tinker with linux, which most definately doesnt Just Work, and if i had the time i once did for such things, would still be using kde.)
yep, copying mac again
I think most windows users are going to be skeptical of MS new slogan. It’s like saying that cruise ships are safe and year after year we see fires, flooding, sickness, etc. So, yes they’re lying to our faces and that is what makes people upset. The balls of MS to outright lie to us. I use windows and like it over all other oses but MS has to become humble and just accept facts that things are never going to work 100% all the time and stop trying to fool us otherwise. Longhorn will have issues just like every other sw. We’re humans, so we make mistakes. Learn to accept it and don’t hope for miracles.
I guess Microsoft is waiting for everybody to upgrade there computers to 64bit before they release longhorn.
Upon entering the frase “it just works” you get a list of several software projects and firms clearly in violation of the MS slogan patent:
– UPnP in the Digital Home
– Mac OS X: It just works
– BashBurn – It just works!
– Ubuntu – It Just Works
– NetWare: It just works
– Motino 1.1 – It Just Works
– Everything Basecamp: “It Just Works!”
– Mepis: It just WORKS
– and so an
IMO it’s just another example of MS’ incredible ability for innovation. It’s almost sad…
I’m expecting to see something like
[GONG]
Longhorn, simply the best OS around!!
[appluse] next.
And how are they going to top that “XP makes people fly” commercial?
Use Longhorn and get a free Carmen Electra clone??
“In other words, a lot of the fiddly, annoying tasks that computer users have become accustomed to (or never quite got the hang of) such as searching for files, defragmenting, changing network configurations, and tweaking security settings, will happen automatically.”
Yea, give them something pretty to look at and make them stupid… great idea. OSX and Linux are going there too, but at least with those the power to do it all yourself will still be there too. If you know where to look.
So are Microsoft admitting up til now Windows Just Hasn’t Worked? Tell us something we don’t know. I use a Mac now as I got fed up with all the Windows crap (virus, spyware, crashes). Sure, there is Mac crap to put up with, but it isn’t as headache inducing as Windows, and at least its UNIX underneath. Oh, and I’m not helping fund an illegal monopolistic company. Which feels nice.
They’ve been working on Longhorn long enough that it damn well should work by now, and it is what the average clueless computer user needs.
Personally, I prefer making any changes to my computer myself, and I certainly wouldn’t want an OS that tweaks settings for me. So I’ll just stick to Linux and keep using it unless Microsoft give me the sort of control over Windows that I can get out of Linux and provide features I want that are unavailable in Linux or better than what Linux has to offer, but I think there’s a snowballs chance in hell of that happening.
MS left out a word in it’s “it just works” phrase. There should be a “barely” inserted between “just” and “works.”
I just barely works.
Now, doesn’t that seem more accurate?
It sort of works, unless you try to do something silly like burn a CD, while copying a large file or any other such insane thing.
I can never figure out how such a huge company can’t figure out how to make an OS multitask, or how to have the OS not pause to page when there’s 1.25GB of free RAM.
It’s all the little annoyances that are causing me to switch my home computers to Ubuntu, as soon as I can figure out how to get all my progs to work under Linux.
From the article: Allchin did have a lot a lot to say about a major change that is coming to Windows this month. Rather than running just on computers that process 32 bits of data at a time, the new version will run on chips that process 64 bits. For Allchin, this is a very big deal for businesses and individuals. The reasons are technical, but the bottom line is that 64-bit computers will be much faster.
What a load of marketing rubbish! Just hide behind “technical reasons”, and you can sell anything to ignorant people.
I guess Microsoft is waiting for everybody to upgrade there computers to 64bit before they release longhorn.
Everybody? They’d have to wait pretty much forever.
But even if they were only waiting for a majority in developed countries, they’d have to wait for at least another five years as lots of 32-bit only machines are still being sold now. And the Pentium M in most laptops hasn’t even got 64-bit extensions yet.
I can agree, especially for the average user occupying one standard deviation on either side of the mean, that “just works” makes sense.
I only hope that the 10% of the time that you actually want to pop the hood and manage things at a lower level is also well documented and supported.
Microsoft’s products, in my personal experience, have played horribly with other operating systems the user may care to have installed, and I hope this is unborked in the future.