Novell will launch a bundle of its network services running on Red Hat Enterprise Linux and SuSE Linux Enterprise Server later this year. And in 2004, the entire services stack from Netware will be running on Linux, the company said, as revealed this April by vnunet.com, VNUnet reports.
Novell Sets out Linux Roadmap
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iNovell has and incredibly iAnnoying iBranding eStrategy.
I’m sorry, what I ment to say is – Novell who?
iNovell has and incredibly iAnnoying iBranding eStrategy.
I’m sorry, what I ment to say is – Novell who?
You know, the company who has a better directory, better messaging, better file and print services, better management tools and better security than both Linux and Windows 2003?
Oh yeah, that Novell.
…that Novell is irrelevant.
As for better * – HAHAHAHA. Long story short, Novell told our moron IT people to consolidate the NDS trees for fear that it could not support eight thousand some accounts. The story reaks of bullshit, but never the less. Novell was relevant ten years ago, not now.
No, still doesn’t ring any bells? Novell Who?
The Novell being used at JPMorganChase on over 100,000 desktops and hundres of servers, to deliver apps via ZenWorks and give us reliable connectivity; you know, the stuff Windows cannot handle.
From what I’ve seen, ZenWorks is absolutely FABULOUS at blowing hundreds of desktops out of service at once. Then again I doubt that my observations are representative of Novell’s capabilities. Either way, their market share relagates them to irrelevance.
Pedantic asshole mode on:
Give you reliable connectivity to *what*? What can Windows *not* connect to? Are you saying that Windows/MS has *no* mangement/on-demand deployment facilities?
JohnGalt – 8000 accounts is NOTHING compared to what NDS can scale to. I think you’re full of it, or your IT people are full of it … Novell’s support may be full of it too but it has already been demonstrated that it can scale much higher than that.
As for better… “hahahaha” … ? What can compete with eDirectory? Active Directory? Wrong. Still sucks, can’t even tie NDS/eDirectory’s shoelaces. OpenLDAP? You have to be kidding me.
What can compete with Groupwise’ groupware capabilities? Exchange is the only thing that comes close … enjoy the downtime!
File and print services on Netware are far more manageable than Windows NT or Linux could hope to be.
Management tools? ZENWorks. ’nuff said
Finally, if you doubt the security of Netware and other Novell products, try checking out Bugtraq sometime and compare the number of Linux and Windows vulnerabilities as opposed to Novell products.
Finally, if you doubt the security of Netware and other Novell products, try checking out Bugtraq sometime and compare the number of Linux and Windows vulnerabilities as opposed to Novell products
That, my friend, is called security by obscurity…while you’re at it…check the number of vulnerabilities for OpenVMS
From what I’ve seen, ZenWorks is absolutely FABULOUS at blowing hundreds of desktops out of service at once. Then again I doubt that my observations are representative of Novell’s capabilities. Either way, their market share relagates them to irrelevance.
Yeah, we’ve found out that ZENWorks is great at doing that too… but only if your administrators have no idea how to use it. Here’s some advice for your IT people: RTFM.
Are you saying that Windows/MS has *no* mangement/on-demand deployment facilities?
Call me crazy, but I like Windows Installer. It’s one thing that Microsoft did right, I must admit. ZENWorks can use it to, along with regular applications which don’t use it.
We’ll see how well SMS 2003 fares against ZENWorks when it’s finally released.
grrr…
As I’ve sayd before I’m not going to argue Novell’s technical merrits. I have not had any direct exposure to Novell since mid-90s. My point is market share. As in their market share is non-existante putting Novell on the same level as Apple – some shiny knobs and levers, but over-all, irrelevant.
There is now way that I would start a new project using Novell. (new project using iPlanet, in case you’re curious). The price is right. It comes free with Sol9 which runs on a 20k server
That, my friend, is called security by obscurity…while you’re at it…check the number of vulnerabilities for OpenVMS
Somehow I doubt OpenVMS has the installed base Netware has.
Somehow I doubt OpenVMS has the installed base Netware has.
I bet they’re in the same order of magnitude, there’s actually a significant amount of OpenVMS boxen still deployed, mostly handling legacy applications that were never ported over to anything more modern. Don’t forget, DEC (the creator of VMS) was once the second largest computer company, period. I know of several universities that still run VMS for a CRUCIAL legacy app. In addition, several banks, government agencies, large corporations, etc. still make extensive use of it.
I cant believe ppl that have no clue what theyre talking about will spew FUD. “Novells market share makes them irrelevant” ….thats a load. Novell makes some of the best software in the world. Does this mean that any software company that isnt as big as MS or IBM are irrelevant? Novell is a billion dollar software firm. Why do you think Netware’s market share has anything to do with their entire business relevance? Netware is only one small part of what Novell does. Since you brought up market share. You should know that the real cornerstone to Novells products is Edirectory….you know the #1 meta-directory in the world with close to 800million licened users. And JohnGalt you need to get yer crap straight. Edirectory has been tested to scale over a billion objects. By comparison Microsoft Active Directory cant handle more than 35000. All the rest of Novell’s software (Groupwise, ZENWorks etc) are more scalable, more feature rich, cheaper, crossplatform, and secure compared to their competitors as well.
If ZenWorks blew your desktops, your administrator is probably an MCSE.
If you haven’t had 100,000+ desktops on your network (which I’m going to assume that Rush-Presbyterian doesn’t have) with a directory service that truly scales, you cannot comment on reliability or a lack thereof of a product.
Market share is irrelevant. Just because a talentless bimbo like Britney Spears grossly outsells the philharmonic is not indicative of her talent. A good product is a good product, whether anyone uses it or not. Market share does not equate quality.
Again…more nonsense here. ZENWorks isnt blowing any desktops away. Its what the bone head admins create and deploy via ZENWorks thats doing the damage. ZEN is a majorly comprehesive desktop management suite that gives your administrators great power to control every aspect of your workstations. If they dont know what theyre doing they can do damage. The software is only doing what its told to do and any other competing management suite will be the same. Ive personally used ZEN for Desktops for 5+ years here and its easily the best software Ive ever used. It would take me several new employees with enormous man hours to accomplish the things I (one person) can with ZENWorks from my desk.
And if any of you reading this are one of those bone headed admins….heres some advice. Keep all your workstations on the same image….including your test machine. TEST TEST TEST your complex distributions on a test machine with same image ALWAYS. DUH
I bet they’re in the same order of magnitude, there’s actually a significant amount of OpenVMS boxen still deployed, mostly handling legacy applications that were never ported over to anything more modern. Don’t forget, DEC (the creator of VMS) was once the second largest computer company, period. I know of several universities that still run VMS for a CRUCIAL legacy app. In addition, several banks, government agencies, large corporations, etc. still make extensive use of it.
I guess so. I do not believe that they are on the same order of magnitude simply because Netware is designed to play a greater role than hosting ERP systems and what-not. Netware is also still being sold today, so they would have long surpassed the installed base of OpenVMS anyway especially considering that mainframe sales are much more low volume/high markup than file/print/application servers are.
Even if OpenVMS had the same amount of market share it’s not apples-to-apples anyway since many Netware servers are going to be exposed to more attacks since they are more likely to be accessible via the Net (especially with remote services like Webaccess and iFolder)
eDirectory is more licensed than any other directory, run by high-profile sites like CNN and Yahoo. I can’t recall any alerts with regards to eDirectory (i’m not saying there haven’t been any)
I guess so. I do not believe that they are on the same order of magnitude simply because Netware is designed to play a greater role than hosting ERP systems and what-not. Netware is also still being sold today, so they would have long surpassed the installed base of OpenVMS anyway especially considering that mainframe sales are much more low volume/high markup than file/print/application servers are.
OpenVMS is still being sold too, what’s your point?
And actually, many of the OpenVMS systems I’ve come into contact with are just as exposed to the internet as your Netware machines. (They run a database and web front-end.)
OpenVMS doesn’t run on mainframes, please get your facts straight, it runs on Vaxen (obsolete but still out in the wild minicomputers), Alpha’s (workstation/server grade PC-style computers), and work is being done an Itanium port.
Im not really sure what the relevance of comparing OpenVMS to Netware is, but I know Netware has an install base somewhere around 5 million. As far as being exposed to the internet, Netware is exposed using market leading open source technologies such as Apache and Tomcat while being secured with Edirectory, PKI, RSA etc.
The only problem with netware is the $.
It is really good, but it costs money.
I wonder why so many people keeps ranting against each other’s OS while I wish I could see, test, use, tweak, squeeze and have them all !
I understand it’s a “networking layer.” It provides “management services and consolidation.” Maybe it’s just me, but I don’t understand all those crazy buzzwords and whatnot. What exactly does netware and zenworks do? My father’s office uses it to share a bunch of accounting applications over his network, but from what i can tell — it just replaces windows’ native file sharing junk. I don’t see it’s purpose at all..
Strictly speaking, Netware shares files, printers, etc. ZENWorks is remote administration for PCs. Install software, change settings, etc. As well as remote desktop control.
It doesn’t really do anything you can’t do with Linux, but you’d have to write a bunch of custom scripts and open up automatic ssh access to do it all.
You are comparing OpenVMS to NetWare? The similarities are? OpenVMS is a GREAT OS and it definately has its place, if only HP would decide to stop ignoring it (not likely however.)
First of all, NetWare is more like a platform than an OS. It has a bunch of services that are absolutely great, but all of them are written by Novell. Third party applications are very specialized, only recently did they support Apache – did I mention it doesn’t even have true pre-emption (good for well written applications, bad for crappy ones).
I love their new filesystem and its abilities and they have a great printing system. NSS is a fully journaling and highly competant FS with B-Trees and great caching algorithms. Very fast at servicing files, with an excellent security attribute system tied into a central directory, eDirectory.
eDirectory is a wonderful product, we have a tree with so many objects it is dizzying. But, it is certainly not NetWare centric, there are many people who prefer to run it on Linux or Solaris. What is it everyone is so emotional about everything. eDirectory is incredibely scalable and synchronized very quickly (imo.)
Active Directory was a followup technology to eDirectory, (so was iPlanet which os on closer ground with eDirectory) currently AD is a little lacking (come on there trees can’t get large, so we make forests!) but that doesn’t mean it won’t beat the crap out of NDS/eDirectory in the future.
GroupWise is VERY capable but also very fat. nuff said.
ZenWorks is a great system both on the server admin side with trending and network information, but also on the desktop side. It gives you an amazing amount of control over client systems, including registry updates, file updates, appliation installation, remote execution and remote control, etc.
It is not obscurity, but the fact no one gives a crap about it because it doesn’t have “buzz” surrounding it. That is very important when it comes to morons who create viruses.
From what I’ve seen, ZenWorks is absolutely FABULOUS at blowing hundreds of desktops out of service at once.
As I’ve sayd before I’m not going to argue Novell’s technical merrits. I have not had any direct exposure to Novell since mid-90s.
I believe you are contraddictiong yourself, GohnGalt. (Or was it JohnGalt? Perhaps you should figure out how to type your own name.)
All hype (and anti-hype) aside, real businesses use Netware. I have seen VERY LARGE Netware installations (100K+ workstation) deployments that just work. A lot of these deployments are for offices that do not have onsite fulltime IT people.
For Novell to say that they trust Linux as the underlying OS (esp. to customers with potentially very large deployments), tells me that Linux has indeed arrived. Forget the desktop, it’s endorsements like this that scares M$. Whereas M$ may tout AD, Exchange, SQL server, .NET, etc., Novell has made a steady income servcing companies that could care less about the latest and greatest technology. These companies want stability – bottom line. (BTW, I know of Novell Sysadmin types who laugh at monthes of uptime – they expect and get years worth.)
Maybe Novell’s offerings appear to be obsolete, but I guarentee you can make a rather healthy supporting Novell. Just because a technology doesn’t appear to be sexy, doesn’t make it any less important.
-dan
I remember back in the DOS days seeing Novell networks running on top of some packet driver… they had some sort of directory service and some facility for sharing files…
I can’t picture today what Novell does though, and I can’t figure it out from their site. If they can give me something better than NIS/NFS or NT Domains, I’m all for it. I can’t imagine Novell’s solution is worse…
They have too many strangely named and categorized products for me to find out just what it is I’d need. Maybe I’d know if I was running an enterprise network, and the sorts of problems it solves would just pop up.
In short, I want to know what Novell does today… and when it wasn’t running on Linux, what was it running on? I have never seen Nethack or Apache compiled for Netware, so does it do anything beyond file and directory service?
In the moment is running in the Netware kernel, and there are apache, java and other programs that run on netware in the server.
And for example the iDisk that will come in Panther exist right now as novell iFolder.
OpenVMS is still being sold too, what’s your point?
Oh.
And actually, many of the OpenVMS systems I’ve come into contact with are just as exposed to the internet as your Netware machines. (They run a database and web front-end.)
… Oh.
OpenVMS doesn’t run on mainframes, please get your facts straight, it runs on Vaxen (obsolete but still out in the wild minicomputers), Alpha’s (workstation/server grade PC-style computers), and work is being done an Itanium port.
How exactly is this relevant? “Please get your facts straight” ? Fuck you.