Home > In the News > SuSE 9 PRO Outsells OSX Panther at UK’s Amazon Sales Rank SuSE 9 PRO Outsells OSX Panther at UK’s Amazon Sales Rank Eugenia Loli 2003-10-29 In the News 64 Comments The revenge of the penguin is really here: SuSE 9 PRO outsells the brand new Mac OS X 10.3 Panther in UK’s Amazon! However in US’ market, things are a bit different. About The Author Eugenia Loli Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker. Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli 64 Comments 2003-10-29 5:52 pm Anonymous Was just before I installed RH 5.1, I suppose I should give it another try… 2003-10-29 5:53 pm Anonymous I don’t know how many people would buy Panther from Amazon, as most students would probably buy them direct from Apple as they get the education discount. Or I could be wrong…. 2003-10-29 5:57 pm Anonymous Same for Amazon Germany, even without accumulating all the different SuSE 9.0 Pro flavors in the top 15: http://www.amazon.de/exec/obidos/tg/browse/-/464378/ref=cs_nav_sn_4… 2003-10-29 5:57 pm Anonymous I think that a lot of non-students may have purchased it there because they were offering $10 off the price in the US. I don’t know if they offered the same thing in the UK though. 2003-10-29 6:14 pm Anonymous Why are there no reviews for Suse on amazon? No average customer rating either. Its a lie 2003-10-29 6:14 pm Anonymous I don’t know about the UK, but this would be true for SuSE as well, at least in Germany… 2003-10-29 6:16 pm Anonymous Quite the opposite — how do you expect to see user reviews where the products are just about out of the door..? Are you crazy..?! 2003-10-29 6:16 pm Anonymous More and more states begin to understand that, for the same amount of money, it makes sense to create jobs in your country and develop your local industry (thanks to free software) instead of giving it up to an american monopoly. The first who understands the point was the Congressman from Peru Edgar David Villanueva Nuñez in his well-known answer to Microsoft-Peru : http://www.aful.org/politique/perou/english/alt2_ms_to_villanueva.h… http://www.aful.org/politique/perou/english/rescon_en.html 2003-10-29 6:20 pm Anonymous SUSE Linux can also be obtained directly from SUSE, and some people do so to give them more profit. 2003-10-29 6:22 pm Anonymous “(thanks to free software) instead of giving it up to an american monopoly” Apple a monopoly ??? Or maybe you talked about Microsoft ? But anyway in either case, there’s no monopoly. You probably don’t use the same defintion for this word as mine : “sole company in his field without any viable concurrent”. Ok, so now that you choose a viable concurrent product to either Microsoft or Apple, where’s the monopoly ? 2003-10-29 6:23 pm Anonymous OSX outsells Windows XP in USA That kind of tells the whole story. 2003-10-29 6:26 pm Anonymous >OSX outsells Windows XP in USA >That kind of tells the whole story Not really. WinXP is now two years old, OSX is 4 days old. I think that tells another story. 2003-10-29 6:29 pm Anonymous … since apple’s european market share is waaaay smaller than in US. the big surprise is that suse is outselling microsoft and norton products. 2003-10-29 6:38 pm Anonymous “(thanks to free software) instead of giving it up to an american monopoly” Apple a monopoly ??? Or maybe you talked about Microsoft ? Microsoft is just the hide tree which hides the forest. I think it is misleading to focus on Microsoft. I think that the true value of Free Software is in states who used to be third or 4th world country in this industry, like Africa, like Peru, like Germany, like France, like Europa, like a bunch of others who just can’t compete with the USA with the existing rules. Eugenia speaks about a “Revenge of the penguin”. The true revenge of the penguin is in these countries. If you don’t understand why, read the letter of Edgar David Villanueva Nuñez. 2003-10-29 6:40 pm Anonymous s/hide tree/huge tree/ sorry. 2003-10-29 6:41 pm Anonymous If you look at the list of US software purchases made at Amazon, as compared with the ones made in the UK, it really makes the US look like a group of computing newbies. I mean, come on, 3 typing programs in the top 10? And not any antivirus software until #19? I wish there were numbers so we could see how many people who are buying win XP professional and home are going to get owned in the coming weeks. The UK has things in the right priority; two OSes (functionally) immune from viruses, then an antivirus/firewall package for the susceptible platform. 2003-10-29 6:42 pm Anonymous I don’t know about you, but I buy software when I think that it will meet my needs and doesn’t cost too much. The last thing on my mind is whether it is creating jobs in the UK, the US, or <insert your country here>. 2003-10-29 7:12 pm Anonymous And the sad part is they both got beaten out by everyones must have program of the year, “1001 Hikes in North America”. Oh well, at least they managed to scrape by “The Ultimate Birder” in 6th place. 2003-10-29 7:13 pm Anonymous With no european iTunes musicstore, .mac having a seriously reduced feature set and prices being inflated for Macs throughout europe I’m not all that surprised. 2003-10-29 8:16 pm Anonymous Apple aren’t important outside America. And even inside America they are a fringe. 2003-10-29 8:28 pm Anonymous at least right now (3:30 EST) SUSE is outselling OSX on Amazon in the USA, #30 vs. #43. 2003-10-29 8:45 pm Anonymous Ultimate Birder, Typing Pal, Nancy Drew…it’s really unbelievable. People have to be kidding… 2003-10-29 8:50 pm Anonymous I believe having to pay money for Linux and constantly having to upgrade to new versions that are hardly more than a face lift with any other functionality is ridiculous. The major problems still exist, no applications that have backwards compatibility, dependency problems that will probably never have a final solution on how to resolve them other than re-install the Operating system. Some of the results from testing, I have imported in a excel spreadsheet from MS Office into Open Office and had several cells with invalid information. This is a serious problem, what would happen if an organization sent in a new price listing and the figures were skewed from the original MS spreadsheet sent in. That’s right it is just money, meanwhile you have invalid data this is just a start. The whole argument with Open source software is flawed; I have not seen a cost to benefit report that actually shows any cost savings. Other than the erroneous fact that it is cheaper. Cheaper how, when a company is using invalid data because the Open source office suite cannot import the numbers correctly? Second, the same goes for the Evolution email client, this is in NO way an Office Outlook threat. It is a ‘bug’ at best if it could even register for this status. Linux is in no way ready for the desktop in the enterprise, nor will it ever be until applications exist that have standards, functionality (this one seems to elude the whole community) and so on. One might say in Germany, but that is where Suse is from they are still angry over losing WW2. Lastly, Windows has the desktop wrapped up because it is easy to use, has the best applications that are installed by a simple ‘click’ and the best of all end user functionality. Until, then Linux will remain floundering around in the backwoods of the user community. 2003-10-29 9:25 pm Anonymous Yes, yes, yes, Germany, France, and “Europa” are third world countries. 2003-10-29 9:26 pm Anonymous What are all these magical automatic cleaning stuff for Windows on Amazons’s top lists? Olav 2003-10-29 9:46 pm Anonymous Okay, I’ll bite… dependency problems that will probably never have a final solution on how to resolve them If you stick with official packages, this won’t be a problem. Modern package management apps (and new approaches like Autopackage) have solved most dependency problems. I personally haven’t had one in more than two months. I have imported in a excel spreadsheet from MS Office into Open Office and had several cells with invalid information. Personally, I think you made that up. I’d be curious to see an actual proof of this…so far the only problems I’ve had while importing Excel files into OpenOffice are formatting issues, not data issues. But, if this is such an issue, do like I do most of the time: use Excel in Linux – that way you’ll have peace of mind… Second, the same goes for the Evolution email client, this is in NO way an Office Outlook threat. It is a ‘bug’ at best if it could even register for this status. Are you kidding? Evolution is a wonderful piece of software, very stable – and a lot less risky to use than Outlook from a security standpoint. Linux is in no way ready for the desktop in the enterprise, More and more businesses disagree with you. In fact, Linux is quite ready for the business desktop, depending on the exact need of each business of course. nor will it ever be until applications exist that have standards, functionality (this one seems to elude the whole community) and so on. Linux apps have more chance of following standards than Microsoft ones (what about Cascadin Stylesheets in IE?) As a desktop, KDE has more functionality than Windows. Linux apps are quite functional, thank you very much. One might say in Germany, but that is where Suse is from they are still angry over losing WW2. So, not only are you trolling, but you’re xenophobic as well? Question to moderators: how the hell was this not modded down? Lastly, Windows has the desktop wrapped up because it is easy to use, The latest versions of Gnome and KDE are as easy (if not easier) to use as Windows. has the best applications that are installed by a simple ‘click’ Actually, it’s more like “double-click, next, I agree, next, next, next, wait, restart computer.” In with URPMI it’s “urpmi nameofapp” and Enter (or you can use the GUI tool, where it’s “select app, click”). And no restart. So I think it’s actually easier to install software in Linux (for you Windows fans, Autopackage is coming along quite nicely). and the best of all end user functionality. Most people would say that OS X wins here. I’d say it’s a tie between OSX, KDE and Gnome. WinXP comes after that. Until, then Linux will remain floundering around in the backwoods of the user community. Actually, Linux is progressing at a steady pace, despite MS spending millions and millions of $ to fend it off. Nice trolling and all, but I’d lay off the xenophobia if I was you. 2003-10-29 9:56 pm Anonymous Typical Linux reponse, I imported a MS Office spread sheet into Open Office and it skewed the cell numbers causing invalid data. Second, Linux still has no applications, so now I have to use emulation to use MS Office in Linux to get the right results. This is insane, MS Office works best with MS XP, so why would I need Linux then? Lastly, MS is improving Windows and the next release will be even better. MS XP Pro is rock solid, it still retains the desktop majority and will continue to do so. It all boils down to hype of the Linux community. Also, Evolution is slow loading, takes a ton of memory and leaves a lot to be desired. I have used it and was very disappointed, plus it is buggy. What more would you expect from the the wonderful world of ‘free’ stuff. NO functionality other than some cute icons and screensavers. 2003-10-29 10:15 pm Anonymous Typical Linux reponse …to typical anti-Linux FUD. I imported a MS Office spread sheet into Open Office and it skewed the cell numbers causing invalid data. What versions of Excel and OpenOffice did you use? Can you post a sample somewher on the Internet, that we may independently verify this? Excuse me for being skeptical, I’ve seen formatting mishaps, but never any problems with actual data – especially skewing cell numbers. So unless you can back this up, we’ll just have to consider it for what it is: an unsubstantiated claim. Second, Linux still has no applications, Linux has plenty of applications. OpenOffice is one, which we already use at our place of business. so now I have to use emulation to use MS Office in Linux to get the right results. Wine is not emulation. It is application layer translation. This is insane, MS Office works best with MS XP, so why would I need Linux then? Well, it makes sense if you already have a MS Office license, doesn’t it? I mean I’ve paid for it, so why shouldn’t I continue using it? Oh, and it works as good as on XP – and I get the plus value of using a stable, fast and free Unix-like system. Lastly, MS is improving Windows and the next release will be even better. The Linux community keeps improving Linux. By the time Windows gets a new release, most Linux projects will have gone through five or six – we’ll probably see features announced for Longhorn available for Linux before it comes out (such as a database-like filesystem). MS XP Pro is rock solid, it still retains the desktop majority Actually, it has desktop plurality (about 35%), just above Win98 (30%). It all boils down to hype of the Linux community. How can you say this with a straight face after a week of continuous hype coming from Redmond? Also, Evolution is slow loading, With the same kind of preloading trick used by MS, it takes about the same time to load as Microsoft Outlook. takes a ton of memory Not really. Memory management is treated differently under Linux, so your estimate may be skewed in that regard. and leaves a lot to be desired. Such as? I have used it and was very disappointed, Well, you don’t exactly come up as being very objective about this in the first place. I’ve tried it and I think it’s actually better than Outlook – though personally I’m partial to KMail and Kontact (I use KDE). plus it is buggy. Try a stable release. It is less buggy (and less of a security risk) than MS Outlook. What more would you expect from the the wonderful world of ‘free’ stuff. NO functionality other than some cute icons and screensavers. You want functionality? Apache. Samba. KDE. Gnome. OpenOffice. Of course, you’re totally biased against Open Source, bordering on the fanatical – what I’d call an MS zealot. But at least this time you stayed away from xenophobic remarks. 2003-10-29 10:37 pm Anonymous I’m going to have to agree with Great Cthulu here. Linux IS ready for the business desktop most of the time (There are still a few circumstances in which it can’t be used due to some apps not being available, for instance something like Simply Accounting.). If you put Windows and *NIX side by side, you’ll be astonished at the leaps and bounds *NIX has made, while windows has only advanced a bit. Look at the *NIX world in 98, and then look at it today. It’s a completely different world, and it only took 5 years. Meanwhile, Windows 98 did make progress to XP, but nowhere near the amount of growth has occurred compared to the *NIX world. I’m not a Windows bashing, I’m not a *NIX zealot, I just think that it IS ready for the business desktop, and countries in south america, europe, africa, and asia are showing that this is true. 2003-10-29 11:06 pm Anonymous Like it or not Microsoft is not going away. Linux does not have any REAL applications other than some ‘free’ stuff that does not work half the time. If a person wanted to take a chance on getting skewed results from importing from MS office to Open office then losing money or losing data. Then use the untested and ‘free’ software. Meanwhile the REAL business world uses MS Office. As always, if you disagree with someone on these crummy linux apps, anyways it is a waste of time. I don’t really care these ‘free’ apps are going nowhere fast. MS Office rules the market and will continue to. Lastly, the USA remains the best place on earth. 2003-10-29 11:22 pm Anonymous (I know you shouldn’t feed the trolls, but eh, I’m bored.) There are myriads of professional, non-free applications for Linux if you really feel that money automatically equals quality, but what do you call things like Apache? Apache is the number one webserver in the world, and guess what, it’s completely free and open source. And I’ve never, ever, had it not work for me. What about PHP? It’s free, and it’s one of the most popular scripting languages for web sites around. Why, just look at osnews. Once again, Evolution is much cleaner and easier to use than Outlook, and doesn’t have nearly as many security holes for viruses to slip in through. You can’t debate that, Outlook just isn’t as secure. Staroffice and Openoffice are, in fact, viable alternatives to business. You may seem to have some problem importing spreadsheets, but I can assure that for the many times that I’ve done it, I haven’t had a single problem. I know many, many businesses that use Openoffice, and even more that don’t use it, but don’t use MS Office either. They prefer things like Wordperfect. The fact is, Linux is a real operating system that is mature and useable in todays environments. But according to you, all those hundreds of major corporations which put Linux in their datacenters and run secure linux servers must be ‘crazy’ to use such ‘crap’. 2003-10-29 11:22 pm Anonymous Its about €20 more expensive if you buy it directly from suse.co.uk I bought mine off amazon.co.uk and it cost me €80 with shipping which is a bloody good deal, mind you its been ordered 3 days now and it still hasn’t shipped 2003-10-29 11:24 pm Anonymous .. for preferring to purchase quality. 2003-10-29 11:40 pm Anonymous Lets not forget that anybody with a PC can buy the Suse OS, we are talking PC’s from 5 years ago to top of the range beasts. What can you install Panther on other than a mac? Deak, you are a troll, your comments lead me to believe you don’t know history well enough, politics or how MS came to power, it wasn’t through “the best product wins” practice. Oh yeah lay off watching Fox news and turn on a real news channel. You comments make me think you didn’t know there was an outside world outside the US because you thought the US WAS the world. No not Jealous…sick and tired would be better to describe it. 2003-10-29 11:42 pm Anonymous There is absolutely no reason to bring politics into this discussion. I’ll gladly discuss issues of technology with you, but there’s no need to bring national politics into this. Please stay on topic. I do not even live in europe, but rather Canada, so I see the US firsthand. There have been many, many arguments proving that Microsoft did not ‘define’ the desktop, but rather did exactly what Linux is doing now – copying ideas from before, and changing them. Would more innovation in Linux be welcome? Yes. But because there are people like you (No offense) who demand things be a certain way, Linux is being steered in the direction that MS went in terms of usability. You want things to be a certain way, so please don’t complain when you get your wish. Microsoft could be making the best server software in the universe, but 21 MILLION Apache says something about the usability to free software. 2003-10-29 11:44 pm Anonymous I meant to say ’21 Million Apache servers‘, I apologize. 2003-10-29 11:47 pm Anonymous Your trolls were slightly believable at first, but now you’re just going overboard. 2003-10-29 11:50 pm Anonymous If a person wanted to take a chance on getting skewed results from importing from MS office to Open office then losing money or losing data. Still waiting for proof on this one…Hey, the other day, MS Office bit me! I swear! Linux does not have any REAL applications other than some ‘free’ stuff that does not work half the time.[…]Lastly, the USA remains the best place on earth. You do know that the U.S. army uses Linux for quite a few applications, right? Recently, they chose Linux for their “Land Warrior” program, as explained here: http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/10/27/2238233&mode=nested&tid… Also, Linux is used in a variety of governmental agencies. It also serves the White House’s web site: http://uptime.netcraft.com/up/graph/?host=www.whitehouse.gov So, you were saying? 🙂 2003-10-29 11:52 pm Anonymous It has no functionality for me, well if I liked to use one of the bloated X-windows gui apps. Or I would like to spend hours trying to fix dependencies, or having segmentation faults. What about playing multi-media? There are no players available, well there is but spending hours configuring them and dealing with errors, no thanks. It is ready for the desktop, as a paper weight and besides I thought it was ‘free’. It will be a very cold day before I shell out $60 to $100 for linux distro’s every couple of months to get some new wallpaper or icons…. Good luck, you will need it. 2003-10-29 11:56 pm Anonymous “”no US software on my machine anymore!”” Take a look at the list of contributors to Linux/BSD/Whatever OS you’re running. Then take another look at your “no US software” machine :>. The UK results might be skewed for a reason. Internet use, and in particular Internet shopping, isn’t as big as in the States. So amazon uk might be getting a slightly more computer savvy customer group. Final note: God put the English Channel there for a reason…we are NOT Europeans :> 2003-10-29 11:56 pm Anonymous What about playing multi-media? There are no players available Mplayer plays more file formats than any Windows Media player: it plays Quicktime (including Sorensen), Windows media file, Real Player files, etc. It plays Quicktime movies better than Apple’s own player and runs circles around WMP. Also, no configuration required if you dowload the rpm from PLF. You install them, they work. End of story. Aren’t you tired of making such erroneous statements? Oh, I forgot, you think FAUX news is fair and balanced…so I guess you do believe everything you hear. 2003-10-30 12:01 am Anonymous “”Mplayer plays more file formats than any Windows Media player: it plays Quicktime (including Sorensen), Windows media file, Real Player files, etc. “” This is something I’ve been curious about for a while actually. Quite a few of the formats MPlayer supports are proprietary and actually require licenses. Do the MPlayer developers have licenses for them? Or are they just praying like hell that nobody comes knocking on the door in the middle of the night? 2003-10-30 12:02 am Anonymous Why dosent a mod just get rid of this guy? For the record I am an american and I am an avid linux user however I MUST use XP for my college classes. Once MS loses its hold over universities with office and some other programs I guarantee that they will begin their great fall. MS knows this as well. Anyone with a brain knows this. SuSE is a wonderful linux distro and my distro of choice. It is rock solid on my Toshiba Satellite, it installs faster and detects BETTER than Win XP (gets every but my winmodem, but auto installs my printer). Also your fox news comment made me laugh. I really doubt you are serious with all you have said… 2003-10-30 12:09 am Anonymous :))) Damn. Some people are soooo stupid. 2003-10-30 12:13 am Anonymous Do the MPlayer developers have licenses for them? Or are they just praying like hell that nobody comes knocking on the door in the middle of the night? Codecs are installed as a separate package, so it’s not actually Mplayer who’s taking the risk, but rather PLF. With a name like “Penguin Liberation Front”, I don’t think they’re that concerned… 2003-10-30 12:17 am Anonymous OHH PLEASE!! europeans are jealous of the US? LMAO… maybe a few years ago… let me tell you my good friend/troll, the way europeans see the US is getting worse each day.. if you knew just the bad fame you guys have in here LOL 2003-10-30 12:45 am Anonymous Deak R. You really have time to post and post this nonsense here. Who force you upgrade every month , why u should pay if u make upgrade ??? Do u really know anything about how linux distro works ? Tell me example of “worthy application” and we can compare , but i am sure you already know answer? How did u say – “this crap” “free mess”. Go and study little bit before posting here. 2003-10-30 12:51 am Anonymous Nice with some tailwind – for Linux and SuSE. Thinking of the takeover-by-Novell rumor – I hope SuSE remains a European company. Software and hardware is one of the few area’s where Europe is not ahead and letting SuSE go is the wrong direction. I’m not sure it would not also have a defusing and negative impact on European intiatives such as MySQL,Qt,Opera,KDE,Reiserfs,Knoppix,etc. SuSE is probably a very small company today (as opposed to SAP) but who knows what the next 10 years could bring? In an opensource friendly Europe. http://news.com.com/2100-7344_3-5097569.html?tag=nefd_top. On the contrary. BusinessWeek predicted recently that AMD is doomed on its current track. AMD already has a factory in Dresden. Now, if Europe (the Germans) bought AMD … with government aid if that’s what it takes. The incentive would be Intels current 50% profitmargin, jobs and the benefits from co-leading tech (someday the chinese will join). Consumers would not have one but 2 choices. Wintel and Linamd (doesn’t sound good). And if you were to choose an American company as support then what comes to mind? IBM. Who already supports AMD. And SuSE. Ideally the market should have more than one strong player. Just as on the GPU market with ATI and NVidia. How the canadians did that the Europeans could learn from. But that Chrysler turned out to be a money blackhole for Mercedes-Benz does not help. 2003-10-30 12:58 am Anonymous Deak, I am a pharmacist from Chicago Illinois (not a computer programmer/admin/et cetera) who uses Linux on the desktop. I am currently running SuSE 8.2 on my desktop, Yellow Dog 3.0 on my laptop, and run Win95/98/2000/XP in the three pharmacies I work in/between. I manage three pharmacy inventories that total over 5 million dollars on a daily basis. To do this, I use StarOffice6, StarOffice7, and the Microsoft office suites daily and have NO problems with data loss with conversions when moving from one platform to another or one suite to another. This includes using the various caclulations and formulas I do to figure out where things are headed. I use MSOutlook when I manage my email at work a combination of Evolution and KMail outside of work to manage both my personal emails as well as to send my reports to my home office in Nebraska every night.. Having come from Eudora on Wiindows (which I miss sometimes), I find the relative safety from MS oriented viruses that plagued my work servers/email accounts with Outlook a blessing. The load times for many of the progrmas you mention are irrelevant and highly subjective, especially if you have proper RAM and your hardware is up to snuff. I have used both Outlook and Evo on my 1 gig RAM box at home and notice negligible difference in load times. I HAVE timed the loads, and they average less 1/2 to 1 second difference on my Casio Ironman chronograph. (This number changes with my workload, however, such as playing hearts online, et cetera). Statistically (P>=.05) I can say that this measured difference is negligible upon reproduction with multiple work loads and applicatioins running in the background. I come from a long and strong Microsoft background (I can post it here if someone likes) and find that a number of your rants are unfounded. You might be better off showing some data and explaining how you collected it rather than spouting subjective dataless rants. For that matter, this is OS news. Perhaps you might do a comparison on your hardware at home with a stopwatch and write a comparative review. People here are interested in all OSs and probably have their favs, but why not share your observations with the community in such a way that we all might engage in a discussion of entertaining interest rather than that of name calling. The advantage of Linux stability in my highly mobile environment outweighs the lack thereof present in many of the windows platforms (XP is a step in the right direction). As a result, I find it more than ready to handle the desktop. If Longhorn could take on Linux in a stability test and win, I might even convert: I am loyal to what works and nothing more. And of course KDE eye candy is always fun…gottalove Mosfet…:-) Dr. Matthew F. Borgeson 2003-10-30 1:34 am Anonymous Lastly, upgrading Linux at $80+ a two or three times a years results in $200 or more. I’m using Mandrake Linux since 8.0 (three years) and I’ve bought two boxed sets (8.0 and 9.1). Meanwhile, I’ve downloaded for free versions 8.1, 8.2, 9.0 and 9.2. Please tell the truth. 2003-10-30 2:20 am Anonymous I believe having to pay money for Linux and constantly having to upgrade to new versions that are hardly more than a face lift with any other functionality is ridiculous. So use a “free beer” distro like Mandrake. 2003-10-30 2:25 am Anonymous Lastly, the USA remains the best place on earth. What does Linux have to do with American nationalism? Do you dislike SuSE just because it is German? There are commerical American distros like Red Hat and Slackware, you know. Or do you just dislike Linux because it has developers worldwide and some foreigners prefer it over Microsoft simply because it _isn’t_ American? 2003-10-30 2:40 am Anonymous This has taken an interesting twist of events. So your machine has 1 gig of memory, the ‘average’ home user does not have that much memory much less a need for it. Correct me if I am wrong I thought the whole point behind Linux was that it could run on older hardware. That ‘theory’ has gone out the window; we all know that X-windows take a lot of ram for it to work at a reasonable speed. Lets compare apples to apples, if you take lets say a P2 with 128 meg of ram, and try to run SUSE on it, most of the memory is consumed and the swap space is being used. I have tested it and I know. The same machine with Windows XP Pro is night and day difference in speed and launching applications. The functionality of Linux is highly subjective; if you have the latest hardware and a lot of memory (1 gig) it will load applications quickly. BUT not Open Office, it is the slowest loading application I have ever seen, and you say it loads in a second then you are not using it. Lastly, these alternative applications are just an ‘alternative’ when it comes down to productivity, functionality and getting the job done. Well, let’s say Windows is by far the better choice, but if you want to be fanatical then you can pretend you are a pharmacist and play with Linux. 2003-10-30 2:58 am Anonymous Lol ive been using linux for 2months(no unix background) and even I know more than you. “SUSE on it, most of the memory is consumed and the swap space is being used. I have tested it and I know” Um you mean the swap partition on the HD, not the RAM dummy. “The same machine with Windows XP Pro is night and day difference in speed and launching applications. ” Maybe you can explain why I have to restart my comp every 1hr because WinXP steals all my RAM(256mb) and becomes unusable. I keep my Slackware comp up and running 8hrs a day and have consistant performace(still 256mb) “Lastly, these alternative applications are just an ‘alternative’ when it comes down to productivity, functionality and getting the job done. Well, let’s say Windows is by far the better choice” How? Oh I guess you have to be more productive so you can work faster before your computer crashes due to the last virus/worm and you loss all you work. LOL 2003-10-30 4:13 am Anonymous OMG you are seriously the worst troll ive ever seen in osnews.com (even annoytroll had some good points) “Windows XP does not consume all the memory, it sounds like you need basic computer lessons. ” Your the one that needs training. You cant even see how badly WINDOWS leaks RAM. “MS Windows has about 90% of the desktop market, you need some professional medical help….” LOL I need medical help? Im not the one thats going around acting like a complete idiot. Im sorry but maybe you should stop being such a sheep. 2003-10-30 4:48 am Anonymous BUT not Open Office, it is the slowest loading application I have ever seen, and you say it loads in a second then you are not using it. With preloading – the same technique used to make MS Office load faster – Open Office Writer opens in about the same time as MS Word. 2003-10-30 7:10 am Anonymous An american version of Moulinneuf 🙂 2003-10-30 9:28 am Anonymous > used to be third or 4th world country in this industry, like Africa, like Peru, like Germany, like France, like Europa France and Germany third world countries? I don’t think so. Germany is the biggest economy in Europe (bigger even than the UK) and France isn’t far behind. 2003-10-30 9:29 am Anonymous In my experience as a job on help desk not to long ago supporting broadband for a major ISP, the majority of people in the UK are running 1Ghz+ with between 256-512MB Ram so to me I now see that as a average home user box 2003-10-30 3:03 pm Anonymous Sorry, but you won’t recognize satire even if it would strike you with a bat… 😉 2003-10-30 3:50 pm Anonymous >> Lets compare apples to apples, if you take lets say a P2 with 128 meg of ram, and try to run SUSE on it, most of the memory is consumed and the swap space is being used MS-Windows may treat memory and swap as consumable resource, Linux however utilises memory and swap as a renewable resource. What on earth is the point of having lots of RAM if your computer never uses it? That would be like have an empty shop floor and making your customers wait whilst you go to the store room. 2003-10-30 5:52 pm Anonymous Deak, when did you last install linux ? did you ever install linux ? or did you get a look at your mates pc with it on ? mozilla and openoffice by default are slow to load compared to ie and msoffice… so what ? can you not remember the court case against microsoft ? the one that they lost, about including calls into the operating system that made things look like 3rd party software ran slower ???? did you hear about that case ? no ? didnt think so. you either heard about it and discarded the info from your brain, or there was not enough room in there in the first place, as it is full of all your wishes to be like bill. What do you actually use your pc for ? you almost gave an example of importing a spreadsheet from office into openoffice, but what other uses do you put your pc to ? I had a read through all your posts, and some were very funny, (I have an amazing talent for spotting true sarcasm), and there is one thing that separates YOU from all the other trolls around here. This one thing is something I don’t think anyone else here noticed…….. You said you have actually tried linux. Most trolls slag off linux and have only ever seen screenshots, or looked at it running, but you tried it, nice one. If I was a psychologist, (which I am not), I would conclude that you tried linux because, deep down, you are not happy with Win XP. Why would you try linux otherwise ? A QUICK MESSAGE TO ALL OTHER MS BOYS……… If you want to troll about linux being crap and windows being great, then at least try it for a while so that at least you will know what you are talking about. Otherwise, sit there, enjoy your dozone and shut your mouths. Cheers Dave DOZONE: (pron: Doh – Zone) – An area of inpenetratable, invisible, tasteless, odourless substance that completely surrounds stupid people, and blocks all good ideas and common sense getting to them. 2003-10-30 6:17 pm Anonymous next time an article is written. a bit more thought can be put into it. amazon rankings change everyday… (if u know anythin bout amazon) go check ur links right now… and ull see that panther is above suse even at amazon.co.uk….. ….well done…… 2003-10-31 4:23 pm Anonymous The tables have turned and SuSE 9 takes a dive. And you *actually* thought it would outsell an OS based on BSD? HAH!