“In an email to Red Hat Network customers, the company has announced today that it “…will discontinue maintenance and errata support for Red Hat Linux 7.1, 7.2, 7.3 and 8.0 as of December 31, 2003,” that “Red Hat will discontinue maintenance and errata support for Red Hat Linux 9 as of April 30, 2004,” and that “Red Hat does not plan to release another product in the Red Hat Linux line.” This should not come as a surprise to NewsForge regulars who saw this story on October 23, but less-prepared Red Hat users seem shocked by the idea.” Read the article at NewsForge.
Red Hat Tells Customers: ‘No More Freebies’
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
I never would have thought that giving away free software would eventually chip away at financial resources to the point that the need arose to start charging cash. Is this a precursor to what might happen to other OSS companies? you decide.
No biggie…this is what Fedora is for.
http://fedora.redhat.com/
In fact, I applaud this decision…community support on the low end and commercial support on the high end. Sounds like winning combination to me. (Can’t wait til we have official apt4rpm support from a RedHat project…yeah Fedora!!!)
Is “Fedora Core 1” what they are calling the Fedora/RedHat release? (i.e. is Fedora Core 1 basically what they would have called Redhat 10.0 or 9.X?)
“i.e. is Fedora Core 1 basically what they would have called Redhat 10.0 or 9.X?”
Yes.
1. There is Fedora, which is not mentioned in teh said article.
2. People forget that Redhat has basically been providing these things for free, and no one has been buying. I am sure Redhat analysed their accounts and found that a negligible number of people actualy bought and installed Redhat from them. They didn’t buy support. Why should Redhat continue to incur costs for people who want to avoid costs at all costs. I think I overused ‘costs’ there.
3. SuSE, Mandrake and the rest shall follow suit. Ther are already a few distribution you can not download anyway, like Xandros, Lindows.
4. Last I heard, Redhat is going to make something available at a lower price point. It seems this was not available in the original plans, but it seems they are listening some anyway.
People think that Redhat, Mandrake et al are charities, and owe them something. They owe you nothing. They just have to make source available, and Redhat does that in the spirit of Open Source. Guarantees have to be paid for. You cannot expect Redhat to provide you with a free service year after year and not pay. People failed to respond to the goodwill, so Redhat is withdrawing some of their goodwill and making you bear some of the risk. They still provide Fedora, and there are plans, quite advanced, for a Fedora Legacy which tracks security issues and all. So not a big problem. But no guarantees. Some people probably have issues with this anyway, but then, they should go buy Redhat.
Sigh. The issue is probably too subtle for you to understand.
Until now, RedHat’s enterprise and consumer distributions were composed largely of the same software. They made most of their money from their enterprise product. Since they had to maintain the enterprise distro anyway, it cost them little to take out some specialized tools and the support contract and repackage it as the consumer distro.
However, there is a problem with this model. Enterprise users want very stable, mature, slowly-changing software. Consumers want to distro to include the latest software. The result was that, to keep both sides satisfied, RedHat needed to maintain two distros — a mature, easy to support one, and a quickly-evolving, consumer-friendly one. Since the latter one couldn’t carry its own weight, they spun it off as a community project.
The result of that is Fedora. Fedora is the continuation of the desktop version of RedHat Linux. RedHat helps fund the project, provides organizational resources, and improvements flow in both directions between Fedora and RedHat Enterprise Linux. Its not commercially supported by RedHat, because its not profitable for them to do so, but in that way it is no different from any of the other non-commercial distributions.
I wonder how much the Enterprise workstation product will differ from Fedora in the actual software.
Dear anyweb,
Thank you for being a Red Hat Network customer.
This e-mail provides you with important information about the upcoming
discontinuation of Red Hat Linux, and resources to assist you with your
migration to another Red Hat solution.
As previously communicated, Red Hat will discontinue maintenance and
errata support for Red Hat Linux 7.1, 7.2, 7.3 and 8.0 as of December
31, 2003. Red Hat will discontinue maintenance and errata support for
Red Hat Linux 9 as of April 30, 2004. Red Hat does not plan to release
another product in the Red Hat Linux line.
With the recent announcement of Red Hat Enterprise Linux v.3, you’ll
find migrating to Enterprise Linux appealing. We understand
that transitioning to another Red Hat solution requires careful planning
and implementation. We have created a migration plan for Red Hat Network
customers to help make the transition as simple and seamless as
possible. Details:
****************
If you purchase Red Hat Enterprise Linux WS or ES Basic before February
28, 2004, you will receive 50% off the price for two years.[*] (That’s two
years for the price of one.)
****************
In addition, we have created a Red Hat Linux Migration Resource Center
to address your migration planning and other questions, such as:
* What are best practices for implementing the migration to Red Hat
Enterprise Linux?
* Are there other migration alternatives?
* How do I purchase Red Hat Enterprise Linux WS or ES Basic at the price
above?
* What if my paid subscription to RHN extends past April 30, 2004?
****************
Find out more about your migration options with product comparisons,
whitepapers and documentation at the Red Hat Linux Migration Resource
Center:
http://www.redhat.com/solutions/migration/rhl/rhn
Or read the FAQ written especially for Red Hat Network customers:
https://rhn.redhat.com/help/rhlmigrationfaq/
Sincerely,
Red Hat, Inc.
[*] Limit 10 units. Higher volume purchase inquiries should contact a
regional Red Hat sales representative. Contact numbers available at
http://www.redhat.com/solutions/migration/rhl/rhn
–the Red Hat Network Team
There is no subtely involved. It is black and white. They offered a product for nothing and after so many days/months/years you can only get nickled and dimed so far. The finality of it was they were not making money off the product and ANY effort that went into the product was lost money no matter how “easy” it was to produce. Add in marketing, server maint, bandwidth costs.. it all adds up. It’s not cheap by any stretch of the imagination. Eventually the money tree gets picked clean.
Lindows and Xandros got it right from the beginning. Screw the leechers who want everything for free and who whine and whine like crybabies when they see a price tag attached to something, and make your product only available to those who are willing to pay for it and recognize the value of your product. SuSE seems to be headed this route as well. While their distro is still available via FTP, it’s a bit of a pain, and it’s i386 only, while the ones they sell in boxes are i586.
Jack – paid owner of LindowsOS 4.0, Xandros 1.1, and SuSE Professional 8.2.
SuSE seems to be headed this route as well. While their distro is still available via FTP, it’s a bit of a pain, and it’s i386 only, while the ones they sell in boxes are i586.
There is a bit more than that.
Last week, I’ve gone in a library, here in Germany, and I had the choices to buy a SuSE :
* the library had the official CD pack for SuSE 8.2 for 75 euros
* or, the DVD edition for SuSE 9.0 was shipped with at least two magazines for ~= 5 euros
PS: I don’t care about the price. If the average Windows programer thinks he can charge 30-45 euros for his shareware crap, I can’t estimate the real value of a <SuSE,Redhat,your favorite distro here>
Not free as in beer means cheap in the Libre/Free Software world.
What I do care about, is that this distro is free as in speech, so I prefer Redhat/Mandrake over SuSE or Lindows (which is to the Libre/Free Software world, what AOL is to the internet ;-).
(I don’t know the status of Xandros)
So Linux – the open source free software – is basically not free anymore? Mandrake requires you to be a member and Red Hat and Suse want you to pay up. So does that mean we can just blow off Linux entirely now? I mean, if I have to pay – OS X seems like a heckuva lot better deal to me. I mean I get the Unix gig and photoshop and quake 3 all running seemlessly. None of the others got that going on.
</>”I mean, if I have to pay – OS X seems like a heckuva lot better deal to me. I mean I get the Unix gig and photoshop and quake 3 all running seemlessly. None of the others got that going on.”[/i]
Well, not entirely true. Linux supports Photoshop through Wine, and Quake3 natively, as it was released with Linux binaries. What you do have is photoshop natively though, so better then under wine. Still cheaper when looking at the price of a Mac to run OS X on.
“Mandrake requires you to be a member…”
Incorrect.
“I mean, if I have to pay – OS X seems like a heckuva lot better deal to me. I mean I get the Unix gig and photoshop and quake 3 all running seemlessly. None of the others got that going on.”
Incorrect. I can run Photoshop in Crossover and Quake3 in WineX and it’s still cheaper then one version of OSX. However seeing as Photoshop is not worth it and Quake 3 is a bad game, I don’t do either.
There is Fedora, which is not mentioned in teh said article.
Fedora is mentioned at the very bottom of the article.
Suse:
What About
http://www.suse.com/us/private/download/suse_linux/
m?
FTP installl – free download…
Mandrake:
http://www.linux-mandrake.com/en/ftp.php3
mm..
RedHat Linux — a download -like adition aka Fedora [from now on]
http://fedora.redhat.com/
Linux is still free…
You seem to forget that Linux, whatever the distribution, is made up of a mutlitude of packages. The packages are written by hundreds of thousands of programmers, mostly for free. Along comes Red Hat and creates a distribution out of other peoples blood sweat and tears. I dont mind them making a buck, but dont make it seem we are ripping them off like a bunch of software pirates. After all, they are a corporation making millions. I am just a single user. I expect the software to be free since it was written to be that way in the first place.
The thing that gets me is that RH 9 will be barely a year old when they stop support. THat isnt very old for a server install. I run RH 9 on all my servers and come march there won’t be any security updates. Who knows if Oracle will support Fedora? This is really putting a monkey wrench in my summer plans.
“NO-ONE” wants to pay for software especially the linux zealots. I’ve seen countless number of posts in forums, where every one urges each other to the download a free distro. BUT not once has ever mentioned, or suggested to someone that if they like the software they should buy it or buy some support.
If you linux zealots want linux to survive that you guys should be willing to support the companies that provide you with these great easy to use linux distros. Otherwise the distro companies will close down without any revenue and go bye bye. And then big bad billy boy will continue to hold that 99% marketshare in desktop os’es.
okay, i run debian, i bought crossover office and plugin, quake 3, i’m buying doom 3 when it comes out (for linux), and i plan to donate to the SPI after i get out of college. as far as downloading a distro: i recommend people to download a distro to try. if you like the product support the project. that would be cash, mirrors, etc.
… are still free distro’s out there, enough for 1 a week so whats teh big deal? There are all each one of the same with different bell’s and whistles.
There is always FreeBSD
Anything that is worthwhile is going to cost money, if it is free well all the extra bugs and no applications software. This is Linux in a nutshell.
There are a lot of Linux distros that you don’t pay a dime for. In fact, I use one of them. And in my opinion, it’s way better than most of the commercial offerings available. Of course, we as humans are impatient, want to be spoon fed, want the shortcuts in life, and need to be associated with a commercial vendor to feel secure.
I would *never* pay for free open source software. I will donate money to all the developers contributing to open source and also contribute however little myself, but I will never pay for the so called “support and service”. It defeats the purpose of the community of open source. If I was to quantify in dollar terms the support and help I’ve got from IRC, Google, Forums etc, it will well run into thousands of dollars if I signed up for a similar service with commercial vendor or distro.
I can understand its purpose for corporate businesses. You’d really have to be extraordinarily ingenious to make money out of something free. And you’d really have to insult the intelligence of those you’re making money of in the process.
Can some body tell me more about freebsd
I know, it a UNIX, it’s Linux/Birary compatible etc…
I had had FreeBSD 4.7 it was really hard [at that time] for me to configure it, so i’ve installed linux and was happy
CAN SOMEBODY TELL ME THE DIFERENCES BITWEEN Linux And FreeBSD
Can FreeBSD be a Desktop OS [like my Slack 9.1]???
You werent paying for the “right” to use and install RedHat, only for there service. As it should be gosh dang it..
We are not whiners. We just dont want to pay for something that is free. Why is that so wrong. I wouldnt mind continuing to pay for their Network and Support service, but apperently they dont want my cash as they are shutting those services down.
IM not a freekin whiner. Its just that some of you will just NEVER get it through your brain that our money should go to physical property and services, NOT a license to access information.
I would pay for a Linux.
And i would be happy with the fact that i OWN that piece of software. [BIN+SRC]
It’s still better than to RENT software
Well, this was going to happen, Linux on the desktop is not a serious venture. It is too fragmented, shellshocked and just overall to buggy. I think Redhat should refund the money to the people who paid for the software. They would be saying it if it was MS Windows. But since it is Linux it is ok to throw money out the window?
You get what you pay for and it sounds like to me, so you got the bugs and no updates for your linux.
Wow, that’s a stupid thing to say
If you want Oracle, then paying for Redhat is probably the least of your financial worries. You probably want the peace of mind and guarantees that come with Enterprise Linux. How much do you think Oracle would cost you.
Yes, open source software is free, but Redhat is under no obligation to give you that software. They only have to give those who buy it from them. They could put one lousy machine on the internet with all the tarballs they use to create their distro and be in compliance with the GPL, but they actually go out of their way to make it convenient for people anyway. If you want the support then pay for it. That is the service model as intended by the GPL.
They have GPL’d all their contributions, or put them under the appropriate license, and that is as far as their obligation goes.
RedHat is doing us a BIG faivour [bad english]
For putting almost-all redhat-programmers-writen software under GPL and including it in the Download edition of redhat
They could make a distro with the Linux Source and GNU/Tools
[and some libs] GPL’d only. Then u wouldn’t have a distro to download. Only the GPL stuff
Of course redhat was merely providing a service. Isn’t that the supposed method companies were *supposed* to be making money from Open Source.
They provided a service to easily obtain and manage a linux-based operation system and associated applications. Very few end users were willing to pay for this service, so they dropped it. It’s all well and good. The linux kernal and most of the applications are still all there somewhere, waiting for you. Redhat has in no way affected the ‘freeness’ of linux.
Corporations were willing to pay, so voila…they get to keep their redhat.
@ME – yep I will never understand this notion of ‘access to information’ verus services and physical items. I make software for a living, and I want to be paid for the work I do. Sure if source code is a part of the selling package, all the better, but i would still *demand* to be paid for it…not for servicing or for the physical cd on which the software is packaged upon.
Yamin
Redhat is still free. As was mentioned above, it is still a rehdat project the only diffrence is now support is not there. By Support i mean timely package updates when a flaw is found in software supported by the distro.
Btw i am enjoying fedora, it is suprisingly fast. We can talk about stability though after its 1.0 release -=P
This is nightmare. From this day i hate RedHat!!!!!!
So why not as well pay the SCO tax on top!!!
I switch to freeBSD –> OSX
ciao baby
You know, everytime OpenBSD comes out with a new version (every 6 months) I buy a CD set. Not because I really have too, I still can do a ftp/http install anytime. I most of the time end up installing it way before I get the CDs. Why do I still do it? Because I love this OS, it’s easy, secure and it’s light-weight. I do it to support those guys, so that they can keep writing good software. What’s 100$/year for that? Nothing.
By the way, the “free” software is not free as in free beer. It’s free as in freedom. Stop whining.
Anything that is worthwhile is going to cost money, if it is free well all the extra bugs and no applications software.
So, according to your logic, since Red Hat is now charging for Linux, then it means that it’s worthwile, right?
Meanwhile, this seems like a good time to remind you that Linux is free as speech, not as in beer.
This poster is a proud owner of two Mandrake Linux boxed sets, and has donated over 250$ this year to wortwhile, open-source projects (who all and all seem less buggy than some proprietary software he’s bought in the past).
Don’t bother with Deak, he’s your basic anti-Linux troll. Some of his messages seem copied verbatim from MS press releases. He once claimed that OpenOffice messed up his data in a spreadsheet, but when asked to back up his claim he just changed the subject…
Has anyone else tried Slackware 9.1?
Slackware 9.1 + Dropline Gnome + Swaret = BEST DISTRO EVER!
This Red hat thing is no big deal. There will still be plenty of Linux distros to download, even Red Hat’s own Fedora Linux. So I don’t see what the problem is??
Just because they’re not calling the free version “Red Hat” anymore doesn’t mean it’s dead. They’re doing it because Red Hat is a recognizable brand name, to a lot of people Red Hat *is* Linux.
They do need to earn some money over there. Red Hat is a business… And they’ve also done the right thing by supporting Fedora.
And if people are uncomfortable with the whole Red Hat / Fedora thing, just go and download or buy another disro. Last I checked there were quite a few of them around.
Or heck, you can even join the Fedora project and help make it as big as Red Hat once was.
So I don’t see this as a problem at all. It’s just a natural evolution. All things must evolve or face extinction…
Amen brother. That’s exactly how I feel. On an unrelated note, it’s really too bad that the Royal Bank has invested that much money in SCO a couple of weeks ago, just as they try to go after the GPL (and after that, free software in general). I know you most likely have nothing to do with so I sympathize with you.
No… I haven’t tried Slackware 9.1 yet… but last night I did install Slackware 9.0 and dropline Gnome. I love it!!
It’s so less bloated than Red Hat and Mandrake, and also faster!
I did a minimal install of Slackware and just dropped dropline ontop of it. It’s beautiful! I’m so happy with it!
And Swaret looks like a nice feature to have, I’ll have to install it tonight.
I bought Redhat 5.?, 7.3, and 8.0 at the store. I’m not a CS person but just one that hates MS and monopolies. Mostly I read the internet on my computer. I guess I will try to down load and install Fedora when it is time. If I can get it to install I will use it. If I can’t I will buy SUSE or something that I can use. I will not use MS.
First, I think Fedora Core is a very silly name for a distro. Something like Red Hat Linux Lite would be better. Red Hat is a very well known name in Linuxland, naming the free version something else will only make their target market less aware of their brand.
Notice how when Windows 98/3.1x went off of the Microsoft Support list, that numberous people bitched about it? These were almost 8 year old OSes at the time that they ceaced support. But RH will discontinue support for all RH branded items on April 30, 2004. RH9 is less than a year old, and will still be less than a year old when it ceaces support. Yet people do not care, or just think that RH can do what it wants. Well, so can MS. However, if I am still entitled to a certian amount of support due to contractual obligations, I am entitled to recive that support.
If I make you a ladder, and you purchase it from me with no explicit warrenty or service plan, I am under no obligation to support your use of the ladder, or to replace it if it fails. You had a chance to dicker before you purchased it. Likewise, if I do include a 5 year warrentty and service agreement, but you do not use it, or come to me 5 years and 1 day after the service agreement lapses, and want free repairs, or a new ladder, I am still under no obligation to give one to you as you had prior knowladge of the service agreement upon purchase. Likewise, if I do sell you the ladder with the 5 year warrenty, and you come back in 6 months and need repairs, or a replacement ladder to replace the defective model, I cannot legally say that I have changed my mind, and the contract does not mean anything. I would be sued for breach of contract, and would be legally required to compensate for you loss as specified under the warrenty/service plan.
Well I think that RH is playing fair, they are selling a supported product based on open source software, and at the same time support, a free community project, this is better (IMHO) than SuSE or Lindows, that only sell packaged distros, in this way you pay support for a stable distribution, if you want a bleeding edge distro for free, you can CHOOSE the fedora project.
Seems fair for me
“NO-ONE” wants to pay for software especially the linux zealots. I’ve seen countless number of posts in forums, where every one urges each other to the download a free distro. BUT not once has ever mentioned, or suggested to someone that if they like the software they should buy it or buy some support.
Check again with my posts. I buy not only my Linux distros, but as well I purchase my games from companies like Tux Games in order to support Linux. I have suggested that others do the same.
Your “you get what you pay for” attitude is absurd. The price of something very often has more to do with hype and perception than with quality or usefulness. Generalizing that something free must also be worthless is simply flawed logic.
As for Linux on the desktop — where are all these bugs you’re talking about? I live with seven people. There are three Linux desktops in our home. I’ve spent countless hours this past year solving problems with the house’s numerous Windows machines, and almost no time with the Linux ones, because they are stable, anything but buggy, and almost never screw up. I’m not responsible for the house’s server (running some version of suse), but as far as I know it hasn’t rebooted since our last power failure. God knows when the last time was before that.
As for lack of application software — the fact that what exists isn’t perfect doesn’t mean it is horrible, not quite good, etc. And that, too, is getting better rapidly.
The problems you seem to have had with Linux are so far outside my own experience that I simply have to wonder — perhaps the problem isn’t that Linux on the desktop isn’t or can’t be a serious venture; maybe you’re just not very serious about it or don’t have the time or self-discipline to learn something new. There are many, many thousands of people who seem able to deal with desktop Linux; some of them are not programmers or cs students or employed in IT. If they can do it without running into a million bugs, and somehow manage to find applications adequate to their needs, why can’t you?
PUH-LEASE.
Sure RedHat’s making money… but think about it for a minute.
If RedHat’s going to go through the work of setting up all that free software, providing updates, etc., don’t you think they deserve a little money? And if it’s so terrible to buy something, why not get a free distro, like Debian, and do the consequent work (I’ve used Debian before, you know… Apt is great, really, but Debian is not for me.)
IF you don’t want to pay ANYTHING for Linux, roll your own Linux distribution. If you want security updates, no one will complain, just do it yourself. Want to run Oracle? Want LSB compliance (not certified, of course… not for a hand-rolled distro 😉 I pay RedHat to have that done FOR me. Even that work, is a service; so it support, even if you don’t need support.
If RedHat is no longer an option, go and get Debian, or mabey Slackware (I’ve tried it, it’s also good), or Gentoo, or a BSD, or SuSE. Every one could probably fit your needs just as RedHat always did (depending on what you want to do with them.)
I bought RedHat Linux 9, and I’m going to buy the new Professional Workstation, because to *me* it’s worth it. No need to bash any Linux distribution.
Can some body tell me more about freebsd
I know, it a UNIX, it’s Linux/Birary compatible etc…
it is out of the topic tho well FreeBSD is based on 4.4BSD and it is not linux compatible in binary. It just has linux binary emulation layer.
I had had FreeBSD 4.7 it was really hard [at that time] for me to configure it, so i’ve installed linux and was happy
Which part of the configuration was difficult for you? have ever read the FreeBSD Handbook? it’s a bit different from the one of Linux. Do not expect it to be exactly same!
CAN SOMEBODY TELL ME THE DIFERENCES BITWEEN Linux And FreeBSD
Read it from FreeBSD website : http://www.freebsd.org/ Its gonna to lengthy to write down here and it’s out of topic anyway
Can FreeBSD be a Desktop OS [like my Slack 9.1]???
Yes! Of course! I use FreeBSD as my main desktop. Listen to musics, surf the web, watch DivXs, chat on messenger, rip DVDs, record CDs, take webcam shots, download pics from digital camera, write down things on office suites or on vi, share the internet connection and so on. the list goes on.
What double standards. Redhat gives five years support for its existing customers to keep their OS. Right now, people who were on Redhat Advanced Server and their other enterprise offerings can upgrade to the newest, no problem. When was the last time Microsoft offered you that sort of deal. Go to http://www.redhat.com/software/whichproduct/ to see for yourself.
No Licensing 6 please. Anyway, Redhat is providing a free distro for enthusiasts. Last time I checked, Microsoft does not do that. Redhat is very clear about their support policies. They do not say 5 years and mean 6 months. You are actually telling mistruths here. They do not pledge to support it for any longer than they say, and how does that become illegal. They make it very clear Fedora has no support from them, because you do not oblige them by giving them any money.
can be done with OpenBSD. Countless persons told me it wasnt possible. Well I proved them wrong. I run kde 3.1, and all the latest programs they run on their <insert distro name here> systems. Sure it’s not as “userfriendly” as redhat. But then again, that’s all relative.
Simple rules for keeping it Free!
1) A GNU DISTRO: use Slack, Debian, Or BSD.
2) Save the CD’s in a nice Safe place to save the Distributors some Bandwitdh and
3) Copy CD’s for your friends.
4) Mostly: Send the GNU Distro Of your Choice 5 bucks. To keep the thing going Don’t be a Cheap B@stard!
-N
“And Swaret looks like a nice feature to have, I’ll have to install it tonight.
”
Theres also emerde. Its basically a port of Gentoo’s Portage
http://freshmeat.net/projects/emerde/?topic_id=41%2C147%2C8…
I havent tried it yet but I will tomorrow.
” As a Desktop OS Windows XP,kicks ass on Linux,in every possible way.”
How? What does Winxp have that linux dosent?
I not sure why any of this is a surprise to anyone… Redhat announced dicontinuation of support months ago – if I hadn’t prepared for that it would be my own fault wouldn’t it?
I’ve paid for a couple of boxed distros in the past with one thing in mind: what I’m buying is not the multitude of packages that make up a linux distro, I’m paying for the assembly of those packages into a coherent whole… ease of install and the piece of mind that someone else is looking after the updates. Now I run something I haven’t paid for – I dont get any of those intangibles, I don’t trust the updates as much as I used too, and stuff breaks a whole lot more often, but it’s my choice
new apps and addons to download, enhancements, fixes, free security updates (better and better week by week), all to be downloaded at super fast speeds (red hat as we all know can’t afford a very fast pipe), free programming tools, free power toys….the list goes on in amazing ways!
only $138 and you get free shipping and no taxes in most places! http://www.newegg.com/app/viewproduct.asp?description=37-102-143&re…
lotsa other places closer to home have for similar pricing!
anonamous wrote
So Linux – the open source free software – is basically not free anymore? Mandrake requires you to be a member and Red Hat and Suse want you to pay up. So does that mean we can just blow off Linux entirely now? I mean, if I have to pay – OS X seems like a heckuva lot better deal to me. I mean I get the Unix gig and photoshop and quake 3 all running seemlessly. None of the others got that going on.
Mandrake does not require u to become a member.
Mandrake gives out the distro for free. the free verson
does not come with any proprietary software.
the free verson equals 3 cd’s of software. if u have
been downloading the free version in the past u will
find that u dont get quite as much free stuff as u did
before.
this is because KDE and Gnome have grown and there is
not room for more and more free stuff on the free
download cd’s.
the powerpack comes with 7 cd’s. this includes more
of the free stuff and the proprietary stuff and just
generally more stuff.
u get the source for the kernals which used to be in
the free download versions.
and yes u can still get the source for kernels for free
by downloading them.
hope i cleared this up.
thanks
The closer Linux gets,to becoming a viable desktop alternative,the more assholish and mercenary they become
I’m confused: who becomes more assholish and mercenary? They? You mean RedHat? Surely you can’t mean the kernel(s). Version 2.6 is many things but assholish. That’s not even a real word.
Perhaps you mean the Linux developers? Or developers of programs who run on Linux? The users?
Which is it?
Bill Gates ain’t so bad,he just got there,the firstest,with the mostest.
I’ll make a statement here, and you can quote me on that: I have nothing against Windows. It’s just an OS after all, one which I know well, having used it since 3.0, all the way to Win2K (and a little XP). I’ve installed it many, many times. I’ve come to know it pretty well from a user point of view, and a little from an admin point of view. I’ve descended into the registry a couple more times than I would have cared for, but I can’t say that I particularly dislike Windows. After all, I’ve got some great computing memories with it – and I still use Office on my Linux box.
So that’s Windows. Not a great operating system, not a bad one; it’s there. I’m personally having a more fun with Linux, but that’s me. I don’t feel the need to disparage the Windows capabilities – they are good enough for most people, it seems. Anyway, putting down an OS – an older version of the console flamewars you’ll find on gaming sites – really feels like a waste of energy. So I’m fine with Windows.
Microsoft, now. Well, I do in fact have a problem with Microsoft, the company. I think it is a predatory company that bases its entire business model on preserving a monopoly, which can never be a good thing – the only acceptable monopoly, in my opinion, is a state monopoly, and even that’s usually pretty rotten. Computing is simply too important to leave it to Microsoft and its satellites.
I believe in competition, but I believe in playing fair – and by refusing open standards while being in a monopoly position, Microsoft just ain’t.
What if GM made 90% of all cars? How fun would that be?
The only reason they gave Linux away for years,is because no one would buy it.
Repeat after me: free as in speech, not as in beer.
You’ll still be able to redistribute all the free-as-in-speech bits in RedHat. You could make your own distro based on RedHat if you wanted. The day I can do that with Windows, I’m switching back, I promise.
As a Desktop OS Windows XP,kicks ass on Linux,in every possible way.
If XP is anywhere near Linux’s ass, it’s only because it’s lagging behind! 😛
Seriously, XP is a good OS, its stability comes close to that of Linux and with some add-ons it comes close to KDE in usability and customizability. And of course you can run some great free software on XP: Mozilla, OpenOffice, Apache…Unfortunately, XP is made by Microsoft, a company whose bad corporate practices have led me to use my only retaliatory measure as a customer: I’m boycotting them (in the sense that I’m not buying any more software from them – I’m still using Office 2000).
I’m comforted in the fact that Linux is a more-than-capable contender for XP in everything but for some games – something which I don’t care much about, gaming mostly on my PS2 and Xbox (the MS boycott excludes the Xbox). Even then, the more popular PC games are often playable in Linux through WINE, which usually offers excellent performance, when they’re not available native outright (can’t wait for Doom 3!)
Ever since I’ve switched, I’ve never looked back. If Microsoft changes and embraces open standards, I might change my mind. Then again, I might just try the BSDs…
Theres also emerde. Its basically a port of Gentoo’s Portage
That’s kind of funny, ’cause in french emerde sounds exactly like “oh sh*t” (“eh, merde!”).
Developer humor, or just coincidence? 🙂
The point is not why RH is not free but why the RH is SO EXPENSIVE?!!
“For small to mid-range servers…_Starting_ at $349.00” – I mean, cmon, why $349? Why not $50 for example?!! No way in the world I’m buying it for $300+ – it’s just not cost-effective for my bussuness :[
What do u ppl think, what would be the fair price for RH?
“Redhat is providing a free distro for enthusiasts. Last time I checked, Microsoft does not do that. Redhat is very clear about their support policies. They do not say 5 years and mean 6 months.”
Correct, given the proper amount of time, and bandwith anyone can download RHL 7.3-9.0 for no cost, but for those people who do not have a broadband connection, or belive in actually supporting a manufacturer of software that is found usable, the OS is purchased. I happen to fall into both of those catagories, and I own RHL 7.3 Professional. I have still not registered it, and according to the manual, I am entitled to 30 days free on the RHN once I do. If I were to register my software on December 31, 2003 23:59:59, would I only be entitled to 1 second of my entitled 30 days to the RHN? If so, that is a rip-off. If they do honor the 30 day RHN membership, then they have fufilled thier obligation.
“Redhat gives five years support for its existing customers to keep their OS. Right now, people who were on Redhat Advanced Server and their other enterprise offerings can upgrade to the newest, no problem. When was the last time Microsoft offered you that sort of deal. Go to http://www.redhat.com/software/whichproduct/ to see for yourself.
No Licensing 6 please.”
OK, discounting MSv6 Select Lisencing, you can join MSDN for only $1600/year. Not only are you entitled to free versions of Windows when they are released, but you can also get betas of many of thier software for free, current retail applications, any previous version of WIndows or DOS that you desire, development tools, access to the MSDN library, and you also get the MSDN CDs every month. If you do not have a fast enough connection to take advanage of it, you can have the desired application/OS shipped to you for absolutly free. Sounds like a pretty good deal to me.
“They make it very clear Fedora has no support from them, because you do not oblige them by giving them any money.”
OK, that is just fine. But what if I wish to have a boxed copy of Fedora 1.0 when it is released? Since RH no longer goes through retail channels, I would have to order it directly from RH. Also fine with me. However, once I get that boxed software set, I would like to have some support. Even if that support is only for 30 days after purchase, it would be on par with RH 7.3 support, and more than adequate.
If there plan to stop releasing new distro, then for those that partition their working Linux for easier upgrade, then we probably can switch to a different distro without any problems, for instance you can run Mandrake.
$1600 a year doesn’t entitle you to free releases, betas, shipping, or anything else. It entitles you to $1600/yr. releases, betas, shipping, etc. No?
The point is not why RH is not free but why the RH is SO EXPENSIVE?!!
“For small to mid-range servers…_Starting_ at $349.00” – I mean, cmon, why $349? Why not $50 for example?!! No way in the world I’m buying it for $300+ – it’s just not cost-effective for my bussuness :[
What do u ppl think, what would be the fair price for RH?
AUS$550 incl GST (US$349 excluding GST) for a server operting system that allows unlimited number of users to connect to it vs Windows which is how many thousand for a basic 25 user pack.
IMHO, this is a ripper of a deal. I say, “go you good thing!”. If Red Hat keeps making it easier to administrate and keeping it at this price, Windows will not stand a chance in the small business world. If Joe Small Business Owner can buy a server operating system and not have to worry about how many users are connected to the server and whether he has the correct licenses for it.
If Red Hat teams up with small business solutions vendors, IMHO, Red Hat could mark their territory. If they team up with MYOB to get a native version of MYOB and Corel to get Printshop (a large number of small business owners make their own brochers and so forth) on their WS edition, you’ll see small business owners choosing to run Linux over Windows.
Let me get to my most important point. Fedora is crucial to Linux getting adopted by more people. RedHat would not allow people to say “RedHat compatible” or “Based on Redhat” or “Free Redhat”. They also stopped other people from using their Logo (goto linuxiso.org for instance). LSB, and United Linux really aren’t taking off. Mandrake is no longer “compatible” with redhat because they add mdk to all their RPM’S (apache-2.07.mdk.rpm or similar to that).
Now, with Fedora, anybody can say “Fedora Compatible” or “Based on Fedora” or “Fedora like” etc. They can use a fedora logo or someting like that. Fedora could become a standard so that more distros are compatible. Talking Points believes that this will help the community as well as business and consumer adoption of linux. If we splinter anymore than we have, well, you remember the story of Unix.
Redhat has also contributed a great deal to the community as others have stated. For example Ian is using RedHat’s Anaconda in a debian based distro.
The difference between RedHat’s support cycles of 1 year and Microsofts is this: Redhat allows free upGRADES after the free upDATES have lapsed. Notice the difference between upGRADES and upDATES. Once 6.1 is no longer supported you are forced to upgrade to 7.x or 8 or 9, but you can download that for free. After 9 is gone, Fedora will be free. Redhat will contribute a lot to Fedora.
Also, I’d like to mention Fedora has rpms and source rpms for packages that I couldn’t find anywhere else such as rpms for Scribus. Actually I did find Scribus rpms on apps.kde.org, but being the cheapskate I am, I didn’t sign up. Also, I haven’t figured out scribus quite yet. And that’s ridiculous.
Finally, to the guy complaining about the free 30 day support, you actually could have used (and probably still can) the Redhat Network for free. The demo account allows you to get updates for free but you have to fill in a survey every 60 days.
as a lot of people have said, this is old news, RH told us about this a lot of times and made Fedora, which gave RHL wings.
The problem is – there are too many “if”s in your post. Put it this way:
IF RH there is a native MYOB or other accounting packages AND
IF Dreamweaver is available as a native app AND
IF there is no dependancies hell
THEN I’d be buying RH for US$349.
For now I’ll stay with Debian or anything else, thanks RedHat, but no thanks. Have a nice day, as you say in the US
I think that people who are donating money to some Linux distro like it was some form of charity are going to feel very disappointed when they finally realize that the freebies of today are just for creating market for the Linux business of tomorrow.
>That’s kind of funny, ’cause in french emerde sounds exactly >like “oh sh*t” (“eh, merde!”).
>
>Developer humor, or just coincidence? 🙂
I have seen the readme file, and there’s some Italian phrases in it.
So, I would say just coincidence.
c’mon ppl, it’s an old news, and there are alternatives …
if you are using RH just as desktop machine at home, you can allways switch to fedora … without any problems.
and for servers, there are great alternatives, more stable alternatives, faster alernatives … freebsd !
M.
I thought that the GPL meant that anyone using free code (linux) would have to keep it free. I thought all linux distros were required to always offer a free version of their product. Or am i mistaken? Is it only that they must keep the code open??
let me say just one word: Debian.
Ok, to clear the air here. RH will stop supporting there operating systems that don’t tie in with there “enterprise” moniker and then offer to consumers that still want to download it the “Fedora Core” tree. Which will be supported by community and thats it?
am I right on this or are they going to just cut the free download tree all together as far as a distro goes?
I thought that the GPL meant that anyone using free code (linux) would have to keep it free.
Free as in speech (i.e. source code available, no restrictions on redistribution, etc.). You can still charge for it. Of course, since you can’t prevent anyone from redistributing it, you can’t charge too much for it unless you offer a plus-value (support, etc.), or someone will just re-package you distro and sell it for less.