Home > Zeta > New YellowTAB Zeta Screenshots New YellowTAB Zeta Screenshots Eugenia Loli 2004-04-08 Zeta 35 Comments YellowTAB has updated their screenshots with new shots from the upcoming Zeta 1.0, while IsComputerOn reports about the YTAB plans to attend the BeGeistert 12 gathering. About The Author Eugenia Loli Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker. Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli 35 Comments 2004-04-08 7:37 pm If I buy this, do I have classic BeOS or some sort of derivative? 2004-04-08 8:01 pm who can’t seem to install Zeta? It keeps telling me to insert the CD…but if the Zeta boot loader loads up, doesn’t that mean the CD is in? Hmm…. 2004-04-08 8:05 pm Before BeOS sold all its assets to Palm, it allowed Yellowtab to liscense the BeOS code. Palm is merely fulfilling this obligation to allow Yellowtab access to the agreed upon code. Basically what they got is part (maybe all, we’re not sure how much they actually got) of BeOS 5 and BeOS 6 (Dano beta) code that they have added to. Basically they worked on the dano code to get it up to release quality and changed the tracker to use SVG. Aside from that they have packaged a lot of software with it, similar to what Linux distros have done. It is like R5 in many ways but includes the dano network stack which fixes a lot of problems with network drivers and webcams (wether that’s from the network code or not, idk, but dano has better webcam/usb support) and a few other things. Hope that Helped clarify some things. Personally I think they are asking too much for it (~$100) and encourage support for OpenBeOS. Right now it is still quite buggy (though it’s only a Release Candidate) and if you just want to try out BeOS try out BeOS 5 Max edition. God I hope Max 3.1 comes out soon, been dying for it! http://www.beoxmax.org/main.php 2004-04-08 8:07 pm the url should be: http://www.beosmax.org/main.php 2004-04-08 8:17 pm > Before BeOS sold all its assets to Palm, it allowed Yellowtab to liscense the BeOS code. That’s speculation > includes the dano network stack which fixes a lot of problems with network drivers and webcams DanO,Zeta don’t support any USB webcams AFAIK 2004-04-08 8:20 pm Before BeOS sold all its assets to Palm, it allowed Yellowtab to liscense the BeOS code. It allowed them to distribute BeOS, not access the code. And there’s no sign of a more recent agreement either. YT keeps on patching. 2004-04-08 8:29 pm That is what I had heard from numerous places, though I can’t think where at the top of my head and took them for fact. Anyways, I just wanted to add that the new screenshots are in some wacked up size: 700 X 506. Who runs their computer in a format like that? Or don’t they know how to scale images properly? Just weird stuff. I’ll try to find where I heard about the Zeta deal. 2004-04-08 8:30 pm and changed the tracker to use SVG. Actually, they bought the SVG tracker, they just fixed bugs in it. Btw, it’s not R5 with Dano-code on top of it. It’s a modified Dano, no more no less. And they still don’t have access to the code. 2004-04-08 8:38 pm According to the Yellowtab company page ( http://www.yellowtab.com/company/history.php ), they say this: “The focus shift was the beginning of yellowTAB. Since Be, Inc. wouldn’t be able to refocus on BeOS, the idea of sourcing code was born. The yellowTAB concept was started by 10 people in Stuttgart, Germany, who were not willing to give up BeOS and still saw a market for it.” Sourcing code, could be a bad translation (they are a German co.) and that they were asking for the source code? They then go on to say: “Before Be, Inc. sold its assets to Palm, Inc., we managed to close a deal allowing us to distribute the PE version and had started negotiations over the future of the Pro version.” So I am seeing 2 different things and it is subject to interpretation. 2004-04-08 8:42 pm > It keeps telling me to insert the CD…but if the Zeta boot loader loads up, doesn’t that mean the CD is in It is your SiS chipset the culprit. I have the same problem on my Linare PC with Zeta. YellowTAB told me they will try to solve the problem by 1.0, but for now new SiS mobos are unsupported. 2004-04-08 8:43 pm [i]”Sourcing code, could be a bad translation (they are a German co.) and that they were asking for the source code?”</i? Or maybe they wanted the code, but only got the rights to distribute? This makes sense coming from what rain has said. I guess I am answering my own thoughts, I’m sure you guys are all but too enthused to listen to me ramble on instead of just keeping my thoughts to myself. 2004-04-08 8:46 pm Zeke, try to use common sense here. YT has not tried to fix a single one of the relevant flaws in BeOS, like the RAM limit. They are simply using patches created by the community. Also, the source includes a widget compiler. If YT has access to such a tool they would surely change the widget styles(since skins seem to be their main focus). The source also includes drivers that aren’t present in Zeta, like the Matrox Marvel driver. There is absolutely no sign of evidence that YT has access to the source code. Or could you think of something? 2004-04-08 11:11 pm I think it’s pretty clear that yT doesn’t have access to the source. If they did, they’d fix a lot of the problems that could be easily fixed with as access to the source, also they wouldn’t dance around issue in their faq like they do now. Honestly, it’s not even clear that they have the legal right to distribute zeta. If they licensed the right to distribute pe or dano, that doesn’t give them the right to modify it and distribute it in a different form. Until yT comes out an explicitly says what their rights are, I wouldn’t consider their beos distro be any more legal than beos max edition or dano or phos. 2004-04-08 11:32 pm Unfortunately, it seems that sad prediction, IIRC made also by Eugenia about BeOS in general, are going to be fullfilled in case of Zeta too. I mean hardware evolution. Disks above 130 GB – problem. Processors above 2 GHz – problem (32 bit counter used somewhere inside for clocking) RAM above – 1 GB (imageine feeling of proud WinXP user at new machine who will see in best case of hacked by Euan’s method Zeta machine that it has only 512 MB instead real 2GB) And such configuration are quite common nowdays. (Drivers are different story, and may be provided by third parties, though). So, i’m afraid that for time of first release Zeta may appear to be unsuitable for 80% of computers in shops. This may be fixed with access to sources and all that investments and efforts had put until today in some funny things instead, but i doubt it is the case And i’m unsure that OBOS guys can save YT in this case again… Also sad thet there is no any light shed on YT/Be/Palm agreements. Maybe Be/Palm promised to open access to sources in future in case if YT shows itself as good marketing power? 2004-04-08 11:56 pm i thought zeta was the new BeOS, I thought yT had access and could fix the problems. What is the bloody point in BeOS now??? Palm is stupid for not competing with microsoft on this front. If your competeing with windows on one level why not do it on all levels, hurt them in other ways. Arrgghhhhh Palm should just give BeOS away for free and hurt microsoft that way but no.. Palm wants to only make an “embedded desktop OS”.. arrrr Eh, I’ll be switching to SkyOS. Oh, how I will miss BeOS. Peace 2004-04-08 11:58 pm can someone ask yT themselves and have them clarify? 2004-04-09 12:10 am About access to the source you mean? Well Benrd has been confronted with the question a lot of times and he has so many different aswers for it he has publically said certain thing and other things in private. I would never trust that man. Bring back my JLG! at least he was cute. 2004-04-09 12:51 am If you are only running Be on an old box or if you had to stop using it because you bought a new PC, Zeta is your chance to use it again. Even if it is not brand new it is still more up to date than any copy you have. You do not have to buy the 100 dollar copy of Zeta you can get the 30 dollar version and just download or purchase the software you need. The 100 dollar version just has a nice software bundle for those who want it. Blue Eyed OS, Free Be and the type are still a ways away (possibly years) from an official 1.0 release. Also when they are released they really will be a snapshot of BeOS 5.X and it will be a while after that for them to evolve in to something more modern. Do what you want, I think I’ll give Zeta a chance. 2004-04-09 12:51 am BeOS5 (as well as BeOSMAX, and the Dev edition) install just fine on my computer…what is YT doing with the OS that it would go backwards like this? 2004-04-09 3:22 am “Blue Eyed OS, Free Be and the type are still a ways away (possibly years) from an official 1.0 release.” So is Zeta. Release candidates and patch patch patch what wasn’t broken before. If you get Zeta, you are a beta tester. Don’t pay to be a beta tester. Get something that works. There are other BeOS “versions” out there. Don’t belive the hype. Zeta is by no means more up to date than what version I’m running. Show me something in the OS that is more up to date and better- not worse. New isn’t always better. Not trying to be pessimistic. Trying to be real here. 2004-04-09 9:26 am Curious. What are the advantages of BeOS compared to Linux or Windows? Also, in terms of applications, why doesn’t YT use popular cross-platform apps like GIMP and OpenOffice? (can’t find these apps in the screenshots) 2004-04-09 11:49 am Well, stability isn’t such a big advantage these days since windows is pretty much as stable. The two biggest advantages for me is the desktop environment and the filesystem. The DE is really easy to use but still powerful, I have everything at my fingertips. The filesystem is a 64bit journaling filesystem with a huge advantage: file attributes. While these are offered in other filesystem I’ve yet to see a filemanager that takes advantage of it in an easy way, except for BeOS’s Tracker. Perhaps Longhorn will change that. Some of the advantages are actually hard to describe, they are little things that just makes it wonderful to use(at least in my opinion). It feels like an extension of my arms, if you know what I mean. It’s light and responsive. About the apps you mentioned, here’s BeOS disadvantage. Some of those apps are rather hard to port due to the limitations (differences?) in the BeOS design. It’s possible to port them but it requires a lot more effort than a simple “make”. However, BeOS has native alternatives to the GIMP, like Refraction for example which is although not as feature complete as the GIMP a lot easier to work with. There are also Becasso and ArtPaint(now opensourced). As for office suites, there’s GoBe Productive 2.0. Featurewise that app is a bit dated, but if you don’t need all those features GoBe Productive is a wonderful app, simply the easiest office app I’ve ever worked with. I suggest that you try it out if you have the hardware to run it on, because it’s worth the experience. 2004-04-09 1:16 pm Wow, those look great! 2004-04-09 3:27 pm Okay, I’ve had enough of this. Those pictures of Catherine Zeta Jones are obviously not licensed for use at all, let alone for promoting Zeta or yellowTAB. I’ve brought up issues of copyright with Bernd several times now and he just doesn’t get it. Icons, copyrighted photographs of people who have nothing to do with his company, the OS itself. There’s no further need to discuss the validity or professionalism of yT because it is self evident. I know no one else cares, but, damn it, I do. I’m an artist of several types of intellectual property (photography being one) and I do not abide by this kind of behavior. 2004-04-09 5:04 pm I was thinking about buying Zeta a while ago, but I put it on hold. Like eComStation, this OS too seems to be worse than the “original” one. Did they get that anti-aliasing just by resizing the screenshots? I really wish these guys good luck, but I wish they could do the following; Hire a good graphics artist. He/she will hopefully help you to look more professional, because now you guys come out as a bunch of amateurs! Don’t make the same mistake than SkyOS on behalf of the GUI. 2004-04-09 5:34 pm That’s matter of taste, e.g. i like new icons, especially in preferences a much 2004-04-09 5:53 pm http://www.rumela.com/albums/catherine_zetajones/zetajones07.jpg make your own better zetawallpaper 2004-04-09 5:57 pm I know no one else cares, but, damn it, I do. I’m an artist of several types of intellectual property (photography being one) and I do not abide by this kind of behavior. I care about it. It was the first thing I tought of when I saw the screenshots. It would have been one thing if it was a community site where people posted screenshots of their desktops, but this is clearly promotion and they shouldn’t use copyrighted images without permission. Also, they should try to stick to one theme, branding is an important thing. 2004-04-09 6:08 pm That’s matter of taste, e.g. i like new icons, especially in preferences a much The icons are generally good. Some are bad some are awesome, most of them are just modern versions of the old ones though. However, the window decors are just horrible. No it’s not only about taste it’s about usability and professionalism. Their menlo decor for example is just way too bright to fit as a default decor. The default GUI needs to have good contrasts and neither be too bright nor too dark. Also consistancy is a big problem for YT, since they don’t have access to the source code they can’t compile new widgets. They have to use the sketchquality ones that came with Dano, and they don’t really go along well with any of the decors YT has created. 2004-04-09 6:53 pm It doesnt matter what you’re complaining about, there is one fact: BeOS was never up to date and so are BeOS MAX and DevEd… There is always something that does not work. And so is Zeta, nut in other issues. So you can choose between three different ways: 1) Developing apps and drivers for BeOS and trying to keep BeOS alive until OpenBeOS is done and ready to bring BeOS to a new stage…very unlikely due to the fact that the developers might not keep up with the speed of the development of other OSes. 2) Using Dan0 and PhOS brings NO advantages to anyone except looncraz’s (or how is he called) ego. The usage of Dan0 and PhOS is illegal causing a lot of damage to the whole community. 3) Supporting (=>buying NOT sharing) Zeta and hoping that the cooperation between YT and OpenBeOS is as good as it seems in order to keep BeOS/Zeta alive, accountable (e.g. for companies), and bringing the community to a number of members, where we dont have to worry about how many developers we have that make apps and drivers for us. In my opinion the third way is the most promising and I hope thats the way we all are heading for. Everything else causes the self-destruction of the whole BeOS(-community). FaBE (I am not standing in any relation to YT, just supporting Zeta and BeOS) 2004-04-09 10:14 pm IMHO publishing OBOS news under Zeta logo breaks rights of both sides – YT and coming OBOS organisation. 2004-04-10 6:30 am What we need to keep alive until OBOS is done? BeOS didn’t have a great heap of professional software. Anyone who develop for BeOS should do it for free because nobody can earn money with BeOS Products. Every good piece of BeOS software also runs on BeOS R5 and 100 Euro you would pay for Zeta you better invest in a native supported Pentium 3 PC with R5. Its not buggy well documented and you can’t see a great speed difference because BeOS is also speedy on a Pentium 133. Zeta isn’t a flagship product for BeOS. Why they sell a complete new system if they want to keep BeOS “alive” they coud code a native Browser, a CAPI Port driver, a Hardware OpenGL Layer or a Video Editing Tool. No, they didn’t nothing what could be usable for the community. YT only has got the distribution rights o old piece of BeOS Beta Software and sold it out with beBits stuff for 100 Euro. Why should we keep them alive? To see new Dano skins? 2004-04-11 1:13 am @snyd What you describe in your first paragraph is more or less… stagnancy. BeOS has a small base of developers not comparable to the Linux community. With such a small number of developers that work for free it is not possible to achieve major break-throughs, thus you have to hire people who develop sofware. Now to your second paragraph. I think you totally underestimate what YT is doing. They dont just gather software together from bebits! They implemented USB 2, they work on a native browser, they try/tried to implement HardwareOpenGL, they developed some additional apps, they localizied Zeta, and they’re improving the SVG-Tracker. And the most important thing, they are somehow the successor of Be. Thus, companies that want to develop BeOS-software have a partner they can refer to and ask for support. I am not a developer. I am a BeOS-user. But I dont help BeOS just by using it…I will buy Zeta R1, because I think, it is worth the price. You dont have to agree with me in that point, but what you said above is simply not true. 2004-04-11 1:41 pm You need a professional partner if you have a professional system. Zeta isn’t a pro system its a hobby product for a great amount of money. There are no pro apps for zeta and BeOS. This OS don’t need a company because nobody use zeta as a pro. All the things you described aren’t finished but they sell the system now. If i understand you right, i invest with the money in the future of YT. But what do i get now for my money? A beta system with bebits apps, a beta mp3 player, a usb2 driver and a language kit. What have they done in the last three years? If this was it all, they need 6 or 7 years to complete the things you’ve written. 2004-04-11 6:42 pm I guess it COULD be a pro system. There COULD be pro apps for Zeta and BeOS. If we wanna see it to become a pro system then we need companies that provide support, further development,… And even if we have OpenBeOS, we still need companies. You’re right, the things I described arent ready yet. We cant even be sure if we will get these things in Zeta R1 (e.g. Hardware OpenGL). And thats another point: yeah, you pay 100Euros in order to buy a RC, not a finished release. But by paying 100 Euros you ensure that they can continue their work. And it has also something to do with your last question: “What have they done in the last three years?” Do you think it is easy to make a company like this? Do you think they called Palm or JPG and just asked about use their code, and that was a matter of minutes to discuss whether or not it is okay. I dont think it is that easy. And even if you have the licence or the code – it doesnt matter in this respect – you still need money and you have to look for investors, and they dont stand in line in front of your door. So I guess that took up at least the first year. Additionally, I think they suffered a setback. Because there was a report about YT in German TV years ago and they called Zeta “BeOS Next Generation”. But I just can assume this. Furthermore: what do you expect from a company that had less than 15 employees until this spring?? I guess Be Inc had more and still, they needed alomst 10 years to develop BeOS. As a conclusion: I dont care how long it took them to get there where they are now. We dont know what ups and downs they had in this company. I pay 100 Euros in order that it doesnt take 6 to 7 years. Otherwise I could wait for OpenBeOS.