With GNOME 2.8 out the door, work on the next version, 2.10, is progressing nicely. There is some new and exciting software, and it’s looking to be pretty sweet. There are still many things to be done, though, and if you want to help, there’s a pretty good list with things just waiting to be done by you. Maybe even more important are the Nautilus bugs (over 1300 of them) and so its project leader is asking the community to get to work and fix as many as they can.
..getting that gtk+ fastpath rendering for western languages done.
font rendering.. so things like gnome-terminal aren’t slow slow. also, what can we do about the redrawing problem? its just sad at this moment
..getting that gtk+ fastpath rendering for western languages done.
Agreed, that would definitely be a great “new feature”.
Victor.
I want to get your attention on THIS – http://lists.gnome.org/archives/gnome-devel-list/2004-September/msg… I think it’s essential to be fixed.
Cheers,
gamehack
If the icons aren’t aligned, then you have probably got the “use compact layout” option turned on. With that option off, all the icons should be aligned to the grid. The option can be found on the first page of the Nautilus preferences dialog and defaults to off, IIRC.
the answer to your problem.
Printer management…
On KDE you can add servers to your browse list, edit printer settings, add a custom PDF printer, a FAX printer…
Please, fix gnome-cups-manager… it’s unstable, and lack lot s of functionality!
CD Burning…
K3B is awesome… I know that it will run from within Gnome, but… its really a KDE application. And Nautilus CD-Burning feature can’t compare to it.
That said, Gnome sleek, simple, almost spartan interface is great, I like it better than the bloat that KDE is… Hope the Gnome guys keep with the good work… and improve these two features, that IMHO, are essential for a good desktop experience.
(sorry my poor english)
It’s nice to know that Nautilus can work prety well even with a list of 1300 known bugs! Wow….
What ever happened to the GoneME project that was started out of spite of GNOME’s HIG direction?… I think you all remember what I’m talking about.
> If the icons aren’t aligned, then you have probably got the
> “use compact layout” option turned on. With that option off,
> all the icons should be aligned to the grid. The option can
> be found on the first page of the Nautilus preferences
> dialog and defaults to off, IIRC.
> the answer to your problem.
Nope, it still does it with compact layout – it’s just somewhat better. Images with previews created are the worst offenders, bumping off the entire row, but different caption lengths will sometimes do it too.
What happens to most projects that are all talk and idealism: nothing.
On a slightly related note… Gnome 2.10? What’s with that versioning scheme?
What’s wrong with the versioning scheme? GNOME releases:
2.8.x = stable
2.9.x = unstable
2.10.x = stabe
’10’ is the next even number after ‘8’, right?
>>>What ever happened to the GoneME project that was started out of spite of GNOME’s HIG direction?… I think you all remember what I’m talking about.<<<
That announcement wasn’t even worth the read, let alone the effort put for to dedicate a webpage to it. It was basically someone ranting.
>>>On a slightly related note… Gnome 2.10? What’s with that versioning scheme?<<<
I was wondering that too… I think they have to keep GNOME in the 2.xx series until GTK 3.0 is released…only then will it be bumped to GNOME 3.x. *just a guess*
I know that is amazingly low. The company I am contracting for right now about 10000 open bugs in their system now, and their product is about half the size of nautilus (based on lines of code). Based on the companies that I have seen contracting this number is around average for a product this size.
With names like “Volume Control: ALI 5451 (Alsa Mixer)” or “Bleeding Edge Search Tool”, all the HIG in the world won’t do any good. A little common sense would go a long way to making things usable.
’10’ is the next even number after ‘8’, right?
To most people, .10 is the same as .1. So the answer to your question is no, .10 does not come after .8.
Its kind’ve an ackward naming scheme, because most people will look at it as if it were ‘2.1’ rather than ‘2.10’ because most people don’t give a shizzle about significant digits post-decimal.
*slides on Java sunglasses*
Besides, man, Gnome 2.10 is 2.2 versions behind KDE 3.3! We gotta jump to Gnome 5, NOW!
Remember that the 2.4 kernel branch is at version 2.4.27
a.b.c
A change in the first number “a” denotes a major change in the project.
A change in the second number “b” usually denotes features being added or bugs being fixed. Even numbers are stable while odd numbers are unstable and to be used for testing only. Not all programmers use the even/odd system though(mozilla)
Any extra set of numbers is either a usually just a minor bug fix or a quick patch. Or if the second number is a project branch, then the second number is moved to the third. (Kernal 2.6.8.1)
Ideally a megacorp like Novell/IBM/HP would get behined X and GTK development a bit more. GTK rendering is really poor looking at the moment.
At the moment, all someone like me can do is file bug reports and cross my fingers.
>With names like “Volume Control: ALI 5451 (Alsa Mixer)” or “Bleeding Edge Search Tool”, all the HIG in the world won’t do
>any good. A little common sense would go a long way to making things usable.
It’s called Volume Control, so it’s not that bad. And BIG improvment over the old one I hope.
Who the heck can figure out:
<a href =”http://utelsystems.dyndns.org/pics/Screenshot-Gnome-volume-control….
>Ideally a megacorp like Novell/IBM/HP would get behined X and
>GTK development a bit more. GTK rendering is really poor
>looking at the moment.
Would be great. Sun is already there though.
>At the moment, all someone like me can do is file bug reports and cross my fingers.
What’s wrong with it ? Looks superb to me.
It seems the problem some people are having is that they assume the version is a number. It’s not 2 and 10 hundredths, but version 2 minor 10.
If you think 2.10 is wonky, you’ll flip over kernel-2.4.22 (wtf is that?!), Cisco CIOS 12.1.9aa and ClearCase Version 2002.05.00
“On a slightly related note… Gnome 2.10? What’s with that versioning scheme?”
That’s a misconception made obvious by this versioning scheme:
2.8.1.4.6.30.3
See the point? Those aren’t decimals showing a fractional result in decimal format, those are simply sub numbers, sub parts.
Don’t think float, think struct
.
While your at it… http://www.gnome.org/~jdub/blog/2004/09/20/
> I know that is amazingly low.
Well, Konqueror has 1800 bugs filed and that includes all those against the html rendering engine.
But we don’t need Gnome.
Since when did this place turn into GTK/GNOME/NEWS.com rather than what it really should be about?
I yesterday logged suggestions in Bugzilla that the MOTD should be displayed as the user logs in. With many people now booting directly into X WIndows, it would be good to diplsy such messages at this point in time.
Also, graphical interfaces for talk and wall would be good, provided that they do not become the active window by default. Nothing is more annoying than working in a wordprocessor when suddenly a window with a message or alert pops up and makes itself the active window, interrupting your flow of work.
It will be GNOME 2.A – can’t you people count?
oh and good to see a call for help, new blood is always good. Let’s make GNOME rock even more.
Since when did this place turn into GTK/GNOME/NEWS.com rather than what it really should be about?
Isn’t that hard to not read this article? Please read: http://www.osnews.com/contact.php
Our goal is to inform you about the latest news on a vast range of operating systems, from the well-known mainstream OSes, down to small (but also very interesting technically) hobby or embedded ones. Keep in mind though, OSNews is not just about operating systems, but anything techie/geeky or simply, interesting enough.
If you don’t like this goal, then just piss off.
>Also, graphical interfaces for talk and wall would be good,
>provided that they do not become the active window by default.
You care to file an RFE against Gaim for a talk protocol plugin ?
Would actually be a nice thing to have.
Version numbers aren’t decimals. They can’t be, considering that three-part or four-part version numbers are common (eg: OS X 10.3.1 or Linux kernel 2.6.8.1). All software is versioned this way, I don’t see what’s so surprising.
So is Beagle going to be included in Gnome 2.10? Also isnt Beagle depended on Mono? If so, is Mono goign to be included in Gnome?
Yesh. Not this again.
1) The “ALI 5451 (ALSA Mixer)” in the window name is the name of the card that is currently active. People can have more than one soundcard, and it’s a nice touch to know which one the window is currently controlling.
2) “Bleeding Edge Search Tool” is a temporary name because it’s *development software*. If that shows up in the final release, you can bitch then. Geez, it’s the “frobnicate” checkbox all over again…
Hello Anonymous, I actually filed them against Net-Tools, but possibly GAIM is a better solution.
>So is Beagle going to be included in Gnome 2.10?
No.
>Also isnt Beagle depended on Mono?
Yes.
>If so, is Mono goign to be included in Gnome?
No.
Isn’t this one of the things that people complain so much about in Windows? I guess it’s OK to complain until you decide to use it yourself.
Pop up notifcations are fine if they remain discrete, and do not use up large amounts of screen space. Provided that the window that pops up does not become active by default, if you are already working in another window, tehy are fine. However, if they automatically becoe the active window, that means the computer is “Driving the user” rather than the “user dirving the computer”.
Give it a rest!
Can we get off this stupid numbering subject? Leave it to the pseudo-geeks to get off the subject!
Beagle won’t be included because the RedHat folks are braindamaged about mono. Instead they’ll use some half-baked, gobject introspection, and some other half-measures that’ll take years to implement, will be buggy forever. In one respect, Mono is a pretty heavyweight package, but the redhat guys seem so gungho on java (except for their delusional licensing concerns) that its obvious that they just don’t like Mono for political reasons rather that sound technical reasons.
Maybe they should go with Lua as an official scripting language. It’s powerful and the whole libs, runtime, and compiler come in at about 100k.
Good thing Fedora is a community project then, the community has a say… oh wait.
But it seems a general trend with distros, Debian which had Mono lined up for inclusion in Testing has now yanked it (or rather a removal request was filed).
Mono might be technically excellent but as long as it’s politically controversial it’s not going to be used by anyone but Novell.
Beagle won’t be included because the RedHat folks are braindamaged about mono.
*sigh*
Instead they’ll use some half-baked, gobject introspection, and some other half-measures that’ll take years to implement, will be buggy forever.
if GObject doesn’t work then how does an entire desktop does?
In one respect, Mono is a pretty heavyweight package, but the redhat guys seem so gungho on java (except for their delusional licensing concerns) that its obvious that they just don’t like Mono for political reasons rather that sound technical reasons.
*sigh*
Maybe they should go with Lua as an official scripting language. It’s powerful and the whole libs, runtime, and compiler come in at about 100k.
Does it at least support GNOME, or at least Gtk+?
*goes to sleep*
Mono is an IP poison pill. Thank God it wont leak into Gnome proper.
I think that GNOME will be called 2.x until GTK remains at 2.x, when it moves on, GNOME will move to 3.x. Just my personal opinion.
-3BSD
…looks pretty cool!
I don’t know who submitted this, but neither of the features referenced in “2.10, is progressing nicely” are scheduled for 2.10.
The Notification Icon thing is just a mock-up. Beagle is nowhere near being done for 2.10.
That’s not to say GNOME 2.10 won’t rock, but the story is false advertising
Ignore Lamebug, he’s a .NET shill. Go figure, the core of GNU, and as result GNOME, is as philosophical as it is political. If you can’t stand that, just don’t use GNOME.
Mono will not be included in GNOME for political and philosophical reasons. Thankfully, there are several capable replacements as effective as Mono and more in tune with GNOME’s philosophy and politics(read:freedom, autonomy, no encumbrance).
We just don’t use any technology because Lumberg says it’s cool. Now shooo!
Personally I feel that gnome 2.10 is going to be really nice. Im currently using 2.8 and it “feels” faster than 2.6 and seems very nice. Im very excited about the upcoming GTK 2.6.x release as it will speed up GTK a lot. Im also looking foward to FINALLY being able to edit a menu in gnome on fedora without having to modify stuff and hack away to make it work. I also saw in the mailing lists that a lot of people are trying to do application profiling to check for ways to optimize a lot of parts in gnome as well as reduce memory usage. I remember using gnome 1.2 as my first *nix DE and also remember trying nautilus when it was pre1.0. When I look at how far it has come over the past few years I am simply amazed. The gnome team seems to take a lot of the best concepts from other DE’s as well as create some of their own and make a very nice and polished DE.
>> ..getting that gtk+ fastpath rendering for
>> western languages done.
(+1 excellent)
I like that idea.
Some heavy optimizatin for the pixmap engine wouldn’t be a bad thing either.
(the default Raleigh theme flies on my system, but pixmap themes.. well.. let’s say that Qt is just a ‘tiny’ bit faster with that *cough*)
I have to agree and disagree with both of you on this matter.
First off Lumbergh, I agree that mono is amazing and superior to java. I as well would love to see it shipped with gnome or at least with some integration similar to how evolution is integrated with gnome, not required but works great with it. Ideally I’d love to see Gnome 3.0 written in mono for most of the gui.
However due to the potential legal issues I have to agree with MyStillbeef that it shouldn’t be included with gnome.
The only way I would currently support the gnome project using mono would be if Microsoft signs a document that states that they will never sue anyone over the use of mono as long as it is free of MS code. If they sign a document that states that I would be 100% for it. The only problem is that it will probably be a cold day in hell before MS does this.
>>Thankfully, there are several capable replacements as effective as Mono
Such as?
For one thing, name me 1 replacement for Mono that is language independedent (Read: No need for bindings).
Screw the runtime. I don’t know where the silly idealogy that one needs a runtime to write a Desktop emanated from. Python, Perl and Ruby effectively replace Mono for RAD on GNOME.
If you want to develop your desktop with .NET use Longhorn. Oh, that’s right, it’s largely vaporware. So, wait, let me get this straight, let’s develop our free platform on a technology that has been unproven with regards to desktop development and that is possibly patent encumbered. Great!
.NET technology
Release in open standards then patent?
I see most people here can’t embrace change. They’ll be obsolete, or die behind like old companies who can’t adapt.
Mono is a pretty good programming platform. It targets major platforms which MS’s implementation may never target. It welcomes people to alternative software solutions.
<blockquote>technology that has been unproven with regards to desktop development and that is possibly patent encumbered. Great!</blockquote>
Yeah, The fact that its unproven makes it exciting. I like opensource, I like being on the bleeding edge. And if I see a bug, I’ll fry it with my BFG.
Its kind’ve an ackward naming scheme, because most people will look at it as if it were ‘2.1’ rather than ‘2.10’ because most people don’t give a shizzle about significant digits post-decimal.
Well if they tried to copy Apple and use product names with X in them to have you know the cool factor.
They could have called it GNOME 2.X.x = Cool
:B
Screw the runtime. I don’t know where the silly idealogy that one needs a runtime to write a Desktop emanated from. Python, Perl and Ruby effectively replace Mono for RAD on GNOME.
Put down the crackpipe. Python, Perl, and Ruby are all interpreted and in fact they don’t even have JITs. Look at the top story currently to read about a JIT for Ruby. What do you think Parrot is? They ALL have runtimes. The interpreter is the runtime. You don’t even understand the technology your talking about. Stop now before you embarrass yourself further.
How many language compilers are there for the Parrot, Perl, and Ruby bytecode?
If you want to develop your desktop with .NET use Longhorn. Oh, that’s right, it’s largely vaporware. So, wait, let me get this straight, let’s develop our free platform on a technology that has been unproven with regards to desktop development and that is possibly patent encumbered. Great!
Once again, you’re completely cluesless to anything you’re talking about. .NET is here now, desktop applications are being developed now and have been for quite a few years. This has nothing to do with Longhorn.
is this point where I remind you once again that it’s packaged in Mandrake?
Your comments are filled with contradictions, that I doubt you were thinking coherently when you posted them. If you can’t see the relationship between .NET and Longhorn, then I’m not going to waste my time with you. And .NET desktop applications? Yeah…I see them, look…they’re everywhere!
hope they get rid of this
http://gnomesupport.org/forums/viewtopic.php?p=37164#37164
why not copy osx a bit, the osx dockbar rocks, many things have to run more fluently, and a good! X.org config tool,
like sax, never got my Monitor to run the same way in linux than under windows
…that you can have keyboard layout change from window to window, from app to app and have a nice keyboard shortcut to change it. Having to press a switcher with mouse everytime I change my window is just a royal pain.
The developer that implements this feature on Gnome gets tons of beer (or whatever drink he/she prefers), a visit to Istanbul and a hundred of bucks from me. Yes, I am sirious
Why not just use gDesklets?
http://gdesklets.gnomedesktop.org/categories.php?func=gd_show_app&g…
We need favorite places in Spatial, and they should be the same for spatial and browse.
atm:
because i killed my fedora,
nearly every programm gives me a memory acces error
and i didnt found any official 2.8 repository for fc2
http://mail.gnome.org/archives/usability/2004-September/msg00180.ht…
these are real major bugs that need fixing asap.
Is it time to remind you that I do not support KDE pimping distros that keep GNOME one version behind?
I realize that’s not fully what you want, but you can configure gnome to have different layouts and switch between them with a keyboard shortcut. It’s not on a per window basis , but at least it doesn’t require a mouse.
In the keyboard preferences, add the layouts you want to use to Layouts, then go to Layout options and choose one of the “Group Shift/Lock behaviour” shortcuts to switch them. I use Alt-Shift to switch between german and us layout and it’s working fine.
Thanks pal, that is definitely what I needed. For some reason I cannot add new layout because it gives me an Xserver related error (common issue, no fix yet) so I could never investigate that layout options tab you mentioned. I have Gnome 2.6 for now, will try to update asap then.
Cheers
Ruby, Python, and Perl are fine… until you need a library that only has a wrapper for Python, but your project is using Ruby. Oh noes!
>Pop up notifcations are fine if they remain discrete, and do not use up large amounts of screen space. Provided that the window that pops up does not become active by default … However, if they automatically becoe the active window, that means the computer is “Driving the user” rather than the “user dirving the computer”.
Totally agree, I think that the notification in Firefox when all your downloads are complete is a good example of a pop-up that fufils your criteria, and is not at all annoying because of it.
Rayiner nailed it:
“Version numbers aren’t decimals. They can’t be,”
of course they can’t, they don’t have a comma in them
Mandrake is DE agnostic. Both KDE and GNOME are one version behind in 10.1, due to release cycles; Mandrake was in feature freeze way before KDE 3.2 and GNOME 2.8 were released. Mandrake in no way promotes GNOME development over KDE development; I use Mandrake and I’ve never used KDE as my primary desktop. Mandrake’s GNOME packaging is excellent, and the main packager – Frederic Crozat – is a great guy who is easily accessible to users.
obviously, I meant KDE 3.3.
Gnome is all about HIG and that stuff and x.y.z has proven agin and agin to be too confusing for people. I’d suggest they call the next release GNOME-2-10-0 or GNOME-2:10:0.
2(10(0))… nah… 2_10_0… no not that (!) AH! GNOME[2][10][0]?
G2R10-r0 !
maybe g_2_10 ?
That person likes mono a lot, as do many people in the gnome universe. Mono will become a major development platform for gnome, is there really any doubt?
Screw the runtime. I don’t know where the silly idealogy that one needs a runtime to write a Desktop emanated from. Python, Perl and Ruby effectively replace Mono for RAD on GNOME.
Yay, Pentium 100 speed on a brand new Athlon64. Anyway, there’s probably not enough memory on Earth to run a whole desktop in Python…
I understand that these languages are quite useful sometimes but I don’t think they are very suited for a desktop environment, ressource-wise. Especially if you have to run some parts of the DE in Python, others in Ruby…
I don’t think Java or Mono are any better in that regard.
you guys try out windows first. see why its menus are so cool, modular and easy to configure…eg. shortcuts key combi for fast program launching.
Someone will have to explain to me how using an ECMA standard is going to get you into patent problems. I don’t see anybody worried about ECMAscript or Eiffel. I understand that the non-ECMA parts, such as ADO.net, Windows.forms, etc., are not (yet) safe but they are not a requirement for being useful as a development platform for GNOME.
Python, Java, Ruby , etc. are wonderful languages. There is/will also be nothing stopping you from using these languages with .NET. Python and Java are well underway. Being able to use a library written in python from your c# or Java program is simply ideal. I’m only aware of Jython that does this for Java but there may be others.
If Java were completly open sourced I’d say that would be the best track to go for GNOME.
Bottom line: GNOME needs a high level platform such as .NET or Java. I love Python but I’d hate to see a program like GIMP running on top of the python interpreter.
I’ve been using it for a while now and am quite happy with it.
my $0.02
Someone will have to explain to me how using an ECMA standard is going to get you into patent problems
—
ECMA has a RAND policy incompatible with free/open source software which means that even ECMA standards can be under patents and royalty demanded
There are 10 kinds of people in the world – those who understand binary and those who don’t.
http://www.gnu.org
to follow up on anonymous above, RAND terms mean you are allowed to take out patents and demand royalites; but the royalties must be reasonable – i.e. they must be an amount someone would actually want to pay to use the technology, not just set so high no one would ever license it – and non-discriminatory, which means the same terms must be applied to everyone. This is not good enough for free software.
RAND terms mean you are allowed to take out patents and demand royalites; but the royalties must be reasonable – i.e. they must be an amount someone would actually want to pay to use the technology, not just set so high no one would ever license it – and non-discriminatory, which means the same terms must be applied to everyone. This is not good enough for free software.
And the RAND for .Net (the ECMA parts) is $0. Google for it.
And the RAND for .Net (the ECMA parts) is $0. Google for it.
All I’ve seen is a posting on a message board by somebody involved with .Net development and claims from Miguel. If there is some official statement by MS that the ECMA portions of .Net are RAND and royalty free, I’d love to see it.
Even with RAND and royalty free, there are still some issues (sublicensing restrictions, etc).
http://techupdate.zdnet.com/techupdate/stories/main/0,14179,2887217…
According to Herman, third parties will have to enter into a reasonable and non-discriminatory (RAND) license agreement with Microsoft. “But,” says Herman, “while RAND sometimes means there could be a financial obligation, [Microsoft] …will be offering a conventional non-royalty non-fee RAND license. We’ve always made that clear to anyone who has asked.” In other words, there will be no financial obligation.
Typical Gnome user. I prefer sleek spartan Gnome but can you please make it do what bloated KDE does. You idiot.