“Apple’s DVD players are subject to restrictive rules laid out by greedy Hollywood studios that don’t really care if they piss off Apple’s customers, since that’s Apple’s lookout. However, I’ve just discovered, to my amazement, that Apple imposes its very own restrictions on its DVD players over and above those imposed by the studios: that’s right, Apple voluntarily treats its customers worse than the studios say it has to” says BoingBoing in their editorial. VLC does not seem to be a stable idea either (v0.8.x doesn’t play my VCDs where v0.7.x could, and many times DVD audio and picture are out of sync).
Apple restricting DVD region-changes – voluntarily?
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
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Apple is a for-profit company. Period.
But that doesn’t explain why they are more zealous about DVD region switching than other companies. Unless this also occurs with other computer manufacturers.
This is theft, pure and simple. On the part of the movie studios, because I bought and paid for the player and the media, don’t tell me how to use what I buy. If I want your opinion on how I want to be entertained, I’ll give it to you.
Apple disappoints me. They should not be in cahoots with people who steal from their customers. The only thing that will end this is a constant barrage from Apple users to Apple demanding this policy changes. It works.
I haven’t bought a DVD in years, for this very reason.
funny about that VLC thing. Both my Linux and Windows VLC ports works flawless on the computers i have….hmmm weird
just for the record i have :
– One laptop with a SimplyMEPIS partition and a Windows XP partition.
– One workstation with SimplyMEPIS.
– The last workstation with Windows XP.
Maybe its a Mac related problem?? (im not intending to be a troll, a Mac looks cool and if i had the money, i would buy one
)
VLC works perfectly here on Mac OS X 10.3.7.
Steve Job owns Pixar, nuff said.
It doesn’t stop people who know what they’re doing from copying DVDs or downloading movies from the internet. It just hurts legitimate customers who buy DVDs and use the players as intended.
Steve Job owns Pixar, nuff said.
I was just about to say that.
However, if you read the ending credits to Finding Nemo (yeah I read those, I’m addicted to that movie), you’ll come accross this:
Final rendering: Sun Microsystems, Inc.
🙂
I have yet to have playback problems with dvds of any region or any other files I’ve tried to play back on VLC for OS X. Yes, my experience does differ from the author, but having used VLC for Windows as well, I can definitely say that the Mac version plays as well, and looks a hell of a lot better.
Oh, you can easily remove the region lockout in Apple’s DVD players, by the way. A quick search on rpc1.org will give you links to updated firmware, and Region X will take care of the software part, allowing you to watch DVDs from any zone on your Mac.
(which is a very good thing for me, since I watch a lot of imported R1 anime DVDs from the US)
on my thinkpad with debian testing, vlc was buggy, mplayer proved to be superior
I think it is a valuable critique for people who are not ‘wise’ where computer are concerned. I think some of his assessments are hyperbole (e-mailing VBscripts to co-workers does not strike me as a reasonable expectation since a: the mini is for Home users and b: VBscripts won’t run on Mac anyways [unless I am mistaken]) but may be there for an obvious reason: burst people’s expectations bubble:
This is not a Windows PC it is a Mac PC and they are not the same.
Mac Mini looks interesting, but not worth it for what I would want to do with it: music.
There is always Mplayer for Mac OSX, if VLC doesn’t work for you.
This is so true. It got to a point where I went and found out how to dupe DVD so I can play the ones I bought on any of my players without a problem.
VLC on Mac is all I use. For me, it works perfectly and I use it even when I haven’t got a non-region 4 DVD because it seems to be more resistant to skipping.
Totem w/ Xine on GNU/Linux however is _always_ out of sync, but that’s a whole ‘nother thread.
Yes, my experience does differ from the author, but having used VLC for Windows as well, I can definitely say that the Mac version plays as well, and looks a hell of a lot better.
If you are talking about the GUI; VLC is skinnable and the Mac version uses someones ripped off mac skin as the default.
…this doesn’t surprise me the least. Another reason NOT to buy into the hype… 😉
I think this guys ramblings are inane. Honestly, I can’t explain why the movie industry decided to place region restrictions on dvd’s, but I’m sure they have there reasons. I’m sure that this guys unfortunate predicament of moving from US to Europe was not one of the intentional effects, but it happened. In life you have to deal with stuff like this. So tommorow you find out you have to travel to the moon? What, your powerbook doesn’t work in one sixth the gravity of the earths?? Apple refuses to fix it???? How dare they…
I’m not intentionally trying to defend Apple, but I fail to see how its explicitly their fault. So they wouldn’t reset the counter? Stop using there hardware then. Hey everybody, I just bought a Ford Focus and everytime I take it to the dealer to change the oil they punch me in the face! I could just do it myself, or buy a different car, or take it to a different dealership, but instead I’m going to sit here and complain about it.
I also fail to see how DRM restrictions are considered “theft” as mentioned above. I’m pretty sure that there is no international conspiracy regarding DVD regions. How they work is plainly documented. Region 1=US, Region 2=Europe, etc… Don’t agree with it? Good, don’t buy them.
All that aside, here are your real solutions:
1.)Hack the firmware for a permanent solution
2.)Buy DVD recording/ripping equipment and “de-regionize” your discs
3.)Buy a cheap $35 dvd player from walmart/ebay (or as many as you need for as many regions you have) for TV use.
4.)Buy a slightly more expensive external dvd player for the region(s) of your choosing to use on your Macintosh.
The article is just wrong. The person talks about Apple like they are being “evil”. Apple’s own documentation shows that there is no way to reset the region count other than resetting the PRAM. They gave him that information. In fact, Apple did way better than the restrictions because that can be used an infinite number of times rather than just 5. Now, Apple does seem incompetant on this issue (probably because he is the only one that goes to a store asking for the region count to be reset), but there is a difference between not being able to or knowing how to do something and refusing to do it.
All of the theories about Jobs owning Pixar and Apple being evil are crap from Apple haters.
Yeah, I knew someone would say that. Nevertheless, the default skin is a lot nicer, and a lot more useful on the mac version. I use both, I simply prefer the mac’s.
They do something new which is evil.
I somehow love OSX and think Apple do great designs and lovely things in many ways. But when I think about how they treat things like DVD+- and stuff like Itunes (Awful program which doesn’t allow third party codecs etc etc)… I just get pissed off. This is probably the biggest reason to why I’ll prefer MS anyday compared to Apple…
I don’t understand what he is complaining about. What is he going to do after the 25 times the Hollywood guys allow?
A simple solution would be to buy an external dvd drive and set it to one of the regions and leave the internal one at the other. There is no need to send the powerbook in to have the stupid counter reset even if Apple allowed it.
just flash it and then you’ll find easily the right utility to have a region-free DVD player.
Flashing drive is quite easy.
Ludovic
—
http://perso.hirlimann.net/~ludo/blog/
Last time I checked my old Creative 12X Dvd drive only allows the region code to be changed five times as well. And the HP Dvd drive in my work PC also allows 5. Just a thought…..
this is pretty much normal. And its only a problem for people who import movies from other counties, so most customers will not be hurt by this.
Do yourself a favour and actually *read* the article. All drives allow for five changes. The point is that the representative quoted in the article states that vendors are allowed, and supposed, to reset that counter up to four times, giving you a total of 25 changes. Apple refuses to do this for their drives, which is the complaint here.
as for brandeis.edu, the documentation shows nothing of the sort. It simply mentions a procedure and says that it doesn’t work on newer drives. It neither states nor implies that there is *no* procedure that would work on newer models.
I can’t talk for MAC, but VLC on Windows is the worst app ever for viewing videos (mpeg, avi, wmf, etc..) under Windows. It displays most videos very poorly (choppy, poor image quality), but the same videos can be viewed nicely on Media Player. MPlayer works surprising well under windows, but sadly I haven’t found a way to run it without using a command line.
QuickTime is also pretty decent, but I have some small peeves with it that are not worth mentioning here (small bugs that seem to continue from version to version).
Thanks
Apple refuses to do this for their drives, which is the complaint here.
If you read the blurb from the article where is mentions the 25 times rule.
Apple would have to send the drive to the manufacturer of the drive. And have them update the counter.
May be Apple isn’t equipped to manage the firmware update process and have to rely on the manufacturers of the DVDROM drive themselves.
90% of the IDE/ATAPI optical drives in the market don’t adhere to any spec for firmware updates like SCSI drives do.
And all of them have DOS based firmware download tools. So Apple would have to pull the drive out mount it on a PC run the manufacturer’s firmware flasher and use a firmware that has the counter reset. It is also possible that the firware flashing tool doesn’t overwrite the part of the PROM where the counter resides.
Apple may also have a contract with the drive manufacturer that any defective drives would be returned, sort of a manufacturer to manufacturer support contract that porhibits them from doing the reset.
Before painting Apple to be this evil company, all little perspective is in order.
I think most manufacturers including dell, IBM and others would have similar policies.
Just a thought.
I was in the very final moments of decision as to whether I should buy a Mac, but this has indeed disappointed me.
I am strongly in favour of globalisation and worldwide free-trade, the illeberal DVD regional restrictions are already against this philosophy of equality and competition. To go and add additional restriction over and above that is extremely disappointing.
regional restrictions should be illegal as it is against competitive free-trade. I need multiple DVD players to watch the movies I buy from India, UK, and the US. What a waste of material.
I just cancelled my Mac Mini order because of this. Apple can keep their crap.
> I just cancelled my Mac Mini order because of this. Apple can keep their crap.
Are you getting rid of your PC as well? Wouldn’t want to be biased on this issue. It only encourages them.
Apple isn’t doing anything different from all of the other computer and drive manufacturers.
Can the writer of this article produce a document stating that computer manufacturers are allowed to reset the counter so that the region can be changed 25 times? I don’t care what some bozo at AOL/Time Warner (it’s just Time Warner by the way, they dropped the AOL a while ago) says.
For those who used this article to decide whether or not to buy Apple products, you’re too easily influenced. Do a little research and apply the same thinking and you’ll never buy from any computer manufacturer again.
This doesnt affect like 99% of all people, who simply go to the store and buy dvd’s. The only people this seems to affect are the ones who know how to get around it anyways.
the case of CSS is often cited in texs and papers as a bad exmaple of security through obscurity.
but this whole region-changing thing breaks another security principle – that of “psychological acceptability” – security measures should not be so inconveneient that people don’t use them or even prevent them from getting work done.
the problem generally is that the wider public are not technically savvy and don’t know or care about region locking or switching. and as such the manufacturers/film industry can get away with it. the re-ROMers, the hackers, the mod-chippers are only a tiny tiny percentage of customers.
having sais that – the person who signed such a twisted backwards scheme off should be dragged through the bushes with no clothes on. if intelligent aliens observed this scheme they would laugh their green little appendages off!
If you’ve read the article, you’d understand that. I buy no DVDs because the US ones wouldn’t play on my iBook (since I use it to watch European DVDs I have bought and payed for).
There is not even a hacked firmware available for my combo-drive (yes, I spent a fair amount of time looking for this illegal way to watch legally bought DVDs).
In effect, when I want to watch a movie, I have to use illegal filesharing, since it provides me with a nice, free-to-use high-quality (divx usually) version of a movie. I would pay for a movie-download service, but it really seems that the MPAA doesn’t want me to be their customer.
And I’m really thinking about not buying another Mac because of this. I’ve heard that some other DVD players don’t have the stupid region-coding, but obviously I already payed for my iBook, so I won’t buy another one!
What is the problem? Just flash your P-ram….
sorry, wrong comment. no flashing.
Why are people complaining about the computer makers. We should be complaining about the industry that created these zoning issues to start with. It doesn’t affect me because I made sure my DVD player supports every region and then I can buy my DVDs where I want to and watch them where I want to. If they’re worried about people from the UK buying cheaper DVDs from America then they should either increase the price in America or decrease the price in the UK. Problem solved.
Welcome to the less than 1% of people who care. If you are going to buy foreign DVD’s than you should expect to not be able to play them in all players. Either buy all DVD’s from the same region, or buy 2 players.
I totally agree with Micko. The only guilty here, is the MPAA. You should blame them, not Apple.
First off, all new DVD drives have region encoding built into the firmware, which at best requires flashing to remove. Second, some drives are not flashable.
Third, even if Apple’s drive IS flashable, and they are refusing, I don’t see how it makes a whole lot of difference. Region encoding is stupid whether you get 5 or 25 changes. Its only purpose is so that the studio’s can milk richer countries more than poor ones.
What happens if you build your PC yourself? Who are you going to take your drive to in order to get it flashed? The manufacturer? Seriously… you people are bashing Apple for little reason. The real problem here is the music studios.
What are you talking about? You can install 3rd party codecs! There is a ogg vorbis codec for iTunes, and I’m sure there are many others.
If you want you can install different visualizers too..
Stop the FUD…
“I cancelled my Mac Mini order because of this”
(as if the order really existed in the first place)
“I’m so disappointed in Apple because of this evil act”
(lets count the babies murdered, shall we?)
“I just firebombed the local Apple Store because of this”
(uh…)
Get some perspective, people! It’s not evil. It’s a stricture imposed on them by the DVD industry. As Apple are retailing the hardware and software, they’re required to make their drives comply with industry requirements. Just like when you buy a Dell you get a few region changes and then you’re locked in. Windows does this too. Buy a DVD from Amazon UK, US or wherever outside your own region, and you’ll get a warning to this effect.
The fact that third-party freeware apps don’t implement region checking is a good thing – a bit of a bonus – but it is a line that the DVD industry could crack down on if they chose to. That they don’t is also a good thing, but it’s not a situation that anyone can guarantee will last.
Are regions a good thing? Absolutely not. They are viciously anti-competitive and a form of price fixing imposed on the entire world by a few wealthy companies. They should be outlawed as soon as possible. Until they’re recognised as the consumer wrong that they are, equipment and software manufacturers are meant to comply.
GaryP
Did you read article ?
just stop the FUD
If memory serves me correctly, the reason why ‘region coding’ was implemented in the first place was not due to ‘milking the public’ as some have stated (although that IS a fortunate by-product for the MPAA), but rather different launch dates for movies.
When the DVD standard was being created, movies were launched at different times of the year in different parts of the world. For example, I live in Australia and we used to get our movies about 6 months after they were released in the US.
Basically, this was to coincide with the summer holiday period in each country. The US have their big releases mid-year…ours are at the end of the year. By region coding the DVD’s, their intention was to stop people from buying DVD’s from one region to see movies before they were released in others.
Obviously things have changed since then and all movies are released pretty much at the same time worldwide now, but back then it kinda made sense…for the film studios of course. Now it’s just seen as a money-grubbing dirty tricks campaign…which it is/was/will continue to be…
Like others mention, stop attacking apple over this. Also it effects so few people and for what it’s worth just get a second dvd drive if you move.
Keep in mind the only reason stuff like this exist is because the movie industry knew from the start their would be a bootleg industry, so they tried to slow it by putting in some very basic stopping features like region codes. They know it’s not going to stop things, but it’s a good start. Like any protection they know it won’t stop it. But it sure as heck slows it. Just cause people can get around it doesn’t mean it doesn’t work. Just like encryption and such, everyone knows you can never make a setup that can’t be cracked, it’s just a matter of computing power. But it sure as heck does a good job even though it’s not perfect. If anyone could copy a dvd easy as pie, there would be a much bigger problem, same for region codes. The only reason things like DRM happen is because there are people out there who can’t just live with some simple ethical rules, thus they have to go nuts and we end up where we are.
Oh and for those who buy dvds from other countries, at this point you don’t even have the MPAA to blame, blame distributers and such for not selling what you want in your country. It’s not the job of every company out there to bend over for the demands of some small group. Sometime your just going to get left out. Get over it.
That make their drives region free.
“Stop the FUD”?
I’m *reacting* to the FUD that people are spreading around here. It’s so thick that trowels must have been used.
Apple are not unique in this.
From Dell’s site (notes in the Dimension4700 specs, a quick but not thorough Google search away):
“2 The DVD region code can be changed up to 5 times and will then be locked on the final region code selected.”
Looks like Dell say that it’s permanent for that machine. Let’s go out on a limb and assume that they wouldn’t specialise for one machine though, and that all Dells have the same restriction.
The DVD Copy Control Association (the horse’s mouth, if you like) note that resetting is allowed, but only four times. I know this was mentioned in the article, but I like to see some online ‘proof’ of thing sometimes before I believe them.
http://www.dvdcca.org/rpc.html
“Phase II, in contrast, allows the region of the computer-based DVD playback system to be reset by the consumer but requires that the manufacturer of the DVD Drive implement the RPC functions in firmware in the drive itself. In general, this means that the consumer may reset the region of his/her DVD Drive 5 times (and may have this 5 times resetting capability re-established by an authorized service center an additional 4 times after purchase).”
So what we have here is an Apple policy that goes against the CCA ‘official’ policy, but hasn’t been communicated well and is most likely the result of some manager taking the safer option because they weren’t sure. Dell don’t make it clear either. Or is there a Dell.com link someone can provide where they explicitly state that you can reset the region coding 5×5 times?
We definitely see no-one but the EFF advocating region-free DVD players. And the EFF is right to do this – it’s good for the consumer.
Is it evil? Is Apple an evil corporation? Should we all stop buying Apple products right now and burn down their corporate HQ? Were people overreacting somewhat in earlier posts?
So what do we do? We make Apple aware of this. We ask that they change it to get into line with the (slightly) greater consumer freedom the DVD CCA allow and we flame them after they refuse. The article shows a few attempts by one guy to get Apple to notice and then everyone else flames Apple.
What percentage of people who work on computers spend the day watching DVDs on computers?
I suppose if we all had 30 in Cinema Displays it would be more likely, but as many have pointed out, most people go to the store, rent a DVD or purchase the DVD and watch it without concerning whether or not they might have to deal with country codes.
Either we’ve got countless jet setters who are traveling all-over the world and thus borrowing other people’s regional DVD players or this is about FINDING THE CHEAPEST DVDs via the Internet and discovering that being outside the US or Canada they discover this is not such a great deal.
Here is a solution: One Unified World Currency. Then everyone will stop bitching about the exchange rates and how only Apple keeps fucking them in the ass.
Grow up, buy the fucking DVDs or blackmarket movies and deal with them not fucking working.
You people always assume that everyone who gets hurt by region-codes must have illegal imports or something like that.
I moved from Europe to the US, but had to make the choice between dumping all my old movies or not being able to watch US DVDs. I chose not to buy any US DVDs.
Also, consider that many people might use their Powerbooks to travel (!!!!) and they might want to buy DVDs in Japan, that plain aren’t available on the US market, or they might a US movie, or an independent European movie. Or someone moves from one country to another, like me.
Region-codes are stupid, because obviously I could buy another DVD player with the dedicated purpose of playing US DVDs, yay!!! Why then not just allow my iBook drive to play all DVDs in the first place?
If the MPAA has a problem with Europeans importing US movies before they are released in Europe: that’s globalization, folks! Live with it! What about just releasing the stupid movie in Europe at the same time? If the translation to German or French takes some time, who cares? They could play a movie in English first and then release a pun-free translated version for non-English speakers later. No need to force *all* Europeans to that pun-free movie with awkward translated dialogues.
Sorry, I did some typing errors.
5)”My Office 2003 CD would not install, despite claims I had heard from Mac fanboys that OS X is compatible with Office.”
Now, it may seem hard to believe but you must buy a Mac version of OFFICE. Now, if I tried to use the Linux or BSD version of VIM on Windows, does this mean I can complain that they system is defective? Come on now.
Is totally bogus, because bootlegs dont have region codes.
The movie industry does this for price fixing reasons, and they openly admit it (well the second argument
was that they dont want to hurt the cinemas overseas with dvds flooding from the US, which is bogus either thanks to bootlegging)
So what they do is a blatant attempt of price fixing, which might even be problematic in the light of WTO treaties…
Because very few people ever move to a different country, or rather a different continent as would be the case with region codes.
Furthermore as has been said before, all you needed to do is take your US dvd player with you, or buy one there and set it to region 1. So you need 2 dvd players, wow, what a horrible thing, end of world really.
Next to be traveling in a different country and deciding to buy a dvd there puts you in even smaller group of people. Most don’t go to other countries to buy dvds. You are really stretching to come up with a good argument here. Also as was mentioned, watching dvds on computers is a pretty overrated thing.
How many people here even have ever watched a dvd on their computer? Most I would think much prefer watching movies on something like a 27 inch tv while sitting on the couch with friends. Oh, and you can buy region code free DVD players to hook up to your tv. Some makers have apparently said screw the rules. About the only time i know of people using their computers is in dorms.
I swear people will make a big deal out of something and act like it’s the end of the world when it’s something that effects maybe 14 people in the world.
Sorry, but I just can’t help myself…
a) You’re commenting on the wrong subject – Mac Mini: The Emperor’s New Computer is the one you’re after
b) David Adams states in the intro blurb “Note: read the whole review before rushing to judgement. If you read it carefully, you might be able to discern the author’s hidden adgenda.” …musta missed that one…which leads to…
c) You DO realise this article was tongue in cheek right? …hmm…maybe not.
Everybody is making reference to how easy it is to flash your drive, but nobody is actually posting any links on how to do it. So let me point in a friendly direction:
1) http://www.powerbook-fr.com/dossiers/dezonage/indexGB.html
2) http://superdrive.cynikal.net/
The second page of alternative firmwares was originally intended to unlock the full burning capability of the SuperDrives. The software you’ll need after flashing the drive is called RegionX. They also provide the original Apple firmware if you care to revert.
<quote>
But when my Powerbook was ready for pickup, Apple left me a voicemail saying that they couldn’t reset my DVD player, that doing so would void my warranty.
When I went into the Apple Store in London to get the machine, I asked about it. I wanted this in writing: if they had a policy that said that they couldn’t fix my region-counter, I wanted to be able to tell Dean Marks about it the next time we went to the Copyright Office and ask him why Apple thought it couldn’t reset my counter.
Apple refused to put it into writing. They refused to let me record them telling me they couldn’t fix my Powerbook. They wouldn’t even put in writing that they were referring me to the legal department. Eventually I spoke to the manager, who promised to get back to me the next day.
The next day, he did. He told me that he’d spoken to legal and that they wouldn’t put anything in writing. However, they did have some documents on their website they printed for me that talk about DVDs.
</qoute>
So Apple IS wrong here and they KNOW that themselves. Why else would a company behave so cowardly refusing to confirm anything in writing and to allow the author record them saying what they say? You see, Apple is full of sh*t here…
The regional coding is anti-competitive against free-trade, I have DVDs from the UK, Japan, India, and the USA.
Why do I need multiple DVD players?
This whole thing is anti-competitive and against free-trade. I’m very fond of the free-market economy so I am very disappointed with regional coding. (“Divide and Conquer” has successful been used by hollywood against free-trade, competition and globalisation.)
Its also a waste of hardware (& bad for the environment) having multiple DVD players as I do, which are needed to play my DVDs.
I think mileage may vary on vlc. My friend would always refuse to upgrade, but I never had a problem with the newest version.
I don’t know if this was said anywhere(because I don’t want to read all 57 posts), but you can sync video and audio yourself using a delay, in the vlc settings.
HP would not reset my counter, and Dell would not reset my buddies counter… hmm… well, it looks like PCs suck too… how about just say “DVDs suck!!!”
Like others mention, stop attacking apple over this. Also it effects so few people and for what it’s worth just get a second dvd drive if you move.
Maybe you are partly right,however no points for style this time.I wonder if you would buy that $1399 professional media suit the problems still apply.
I don’t care for the region coding scheme of DVDs. I think that it can create an undue burden on the consumer.
If I was BoingBoing author, I might consider picking up an external firewire combo drive and using that for playing the region 1 movies.
Also, he might want to give Trans Lucy a try.
You can get tons of region free software for both PC’s and Linux. Not only that, you can find Region free firmwares for you DVD drive and not have to worry about it. Would that void the warranty on your DVD drive, there is a good chance of that, but seriously, they don’t check that. I have been doing support for 10 years, and not once have I or any company I worked for checked a firmware version like that.
Two possibilities leap to mind as to why Apple behaved in that way:
* the people dealing with the Boing Boing guy are unsure of the situation themselves and didn’t want to be legally held to something they weren’t certain of
* Apple has a policy of screwing their customers and this is just one manifestation of that policy
Wouldn’t Occam’s Razor sort of require the first explanation be dismissed before we resort to the second?
And as I discovered on Dell’s site, and others are reporting here, PC manufacturers may or may not reset the region coding in the way they’re meant to. Why don’t we hear similar attacks on Dell, Compaq and other PC manufacturers?
It seems more clear to me that the computer industry never took the time to understand what the DVD CCA set out, but then does the DVD CCA have the reset procedure as a *requirement* or a suggestion? If they do not require the resets, then any manufacturer can choose to reset or not and the consumers are left out in the cold.
The phase II note I linked to earlier also uses the word “authorised” to describe who can perform this reset. It doesn’t say what that actually means or how much it costs to become “authorised”. Do the computer companies count, or is it a special certification? Are the drive manufacturers “authorised” or can the computer company also be “authorised”?
Who pays for the technician’s time (to do a reset) anyway? Is it a warranty repair (ie – the price is factored into the original purchase price of the drive itself) or something the customer should shell out cash for?
Suddenly, the simple “why can’t Apple just do the reset?” question seems more complex.
But hey! Let’s take the Slashdot approach and just flame Apple without knowing the whole story! Who cares if it’s not a trivially simple issue? We read the article! The customer is *always* right! Just ask anyone in tech support.
Jwhazel wrote:
I think this guys ramblings are inane. Honestly, I can’t explain why the movie industry decided to place region restrictions on dvd’s, but I’m sure they have there reasons. I’m sure that this guys unfortunate predicament of moving from US to Europe was not one of the intentional effects, but it happened. In life you have to deal with stuff like this.
You are “sure they have there (sic) reasons”? What kind of moronic passivity is this? Yes, they have their reasons. They want to restrict legal users of something the bought for MORE MONEY.
People that sell heroin school kids also have “reasons”. The exact same reasons as the media moguls above. MORE MONEY.
So what?
In life you have to deal with stuff like this.
Really? So you are ready to bend in order to “deal” with whatever someone or some company tries to impose to you? What a lame answer!
AR wrote:
A simple solution would be to buy an external dvd drive and set it to one of the regions and leave the internal one at the other. There is no need to send the powerbook in to have the stupid counter reset even if Apple allowed it.
A SIMPLE solution?!!! To shell out MORE MONEY in order to watch DVDs you have PURCHASED LEGALLY?!!! To add a SECOND BLOODY EXTERNAL DRIVE in order to do that? Another one ready to bend over!
Anonymous wrote:
The article is just wrong. The person talks about Apple like they are being “evil”. Apple’s own documentation shows that there is no way to reset the region count other than resetting the PRAM. They gave him that information. In fact, Apple did way better than the restrictions because that can be used an infinite number of times rather than just 5.
No, apple’s documentation show that that method only holds for a specific make of a G3 powerbook. Read the BLOODY ARTICLE.
how about you also take a chill pill.
try reading up on other computer makers… this is an industry wide problem. Dell HP and Compaq all will not reset your Drive’s counter.
get some prospective and be pissed at the real bad guys… the movie industry.
>>>If the MPAA has a problem with Europeans importing US movies before they are released in Europe: that’s globalization, folks! Live with it! What about just releasing the stupid movie in Europe at the same time?
Besides, dubbing into other languages takes time — there is also an issue with different holidays around the world.
Even now, only the year’s top 10 movies are open at the same time around the world — the other 99% of the movies are open different times of the year. Regional coding protects the remaining 99% of the movies released each year, not spiderman or star wars that are given simultaneously worldwide release dates.
If you watch last 2 weeks’ Australian Open tennis on tv, those people were in the middle of their summer holiday. School kids were out of school down under.
Jackie Chan movies are always shown during chinese new year in Hong Kong and China. Chinese New Year is their big holiday, NOT christmas time.
Only the US (and Canada) celebrates Thanksgiving and debuts movies during the Thanksgiving weekend.
You can’t ask 1/4 of the world’s population to not celebrate chinese new year. You can’t ask the southern hamisphere to take their family out to watch a movie in the dead of THEIR winter.
That’s what region-coding supposedly is for (in reality it just exists to piss us all off).
But NOTHING hinders anyone from importing a new US movie and watching it on his new extra DVD player, bought to watch DVDs with US region code (remember, your computer already has another region code).
To those people who claimed that no one ever buys DVDs from other countries: aha, so in reality no one ever does business travels, that’s why there are no airplanes on earth. No over ever crosses continents for business reasons. And everyone ALWAYS buys their CDs, DVDs and clothes in the mall in the next town, did I get that right? So I’m the exception that I bought some stuff in NYC over New Year’s (clothes, two CDs), even though I live in Wisconsin. Also, I met some Europeans there who also contributed to the American economy somewhat (and took their stuff home).
Also, to those people above who claim that no one ever watches DVDs on their computer: so you bought another DVD player to hook up to your TV? How bloody stupid!! I hook my iBook to my TV; no need to buy another DVD player.
Also, I think I’m entitled to watch ANY DVD I want on my computer, since I paid for the DVD drive, and therefore for an MPEG licence and all…
how about you also take a chill pill.
Will it help? People are moronically “chill” about the matter. What we need is ANGER!
try reading up on other computer makers… this is an industry wide problem. Dell HP and Compaq all will not reset your Drive’s counter.
Did I said anything good about the other makers’ policies? I don’t think so.
get some prospective and be pissed at the real bad guys… the movie industry.
They are the bad guys, alright, but they also pursue their interests. You don’t get pissed of at them (the enemy), you just fight them.
But people on our side of the fence, that deliberately give up their rights and justify the movie industry. That’s what pisses me off. And you can’t fight people on your side of the fence. You just have to bring them to sense.
did you say anything good? no, you said nothing at all….
omission of other parties who are equally “bad” produces, among the less savvy folk, an assumption on their part that Dell would never do that to them. just look at the first 30 posts on this thread.
“Keep in mind the only reason stuff like this exist is because the movie industry knew from the start their would be a bootleg industry, so they tried to slow it by putting in some very basic stopping features like region codes.”
Region codes have precisely nothing to do with piracy. If you can pirate the disc, you can get rid of the region code, so there’s no way they’d ever do anything about piracy. No. Region codes are designed to protect the bizarre staggered release schedules the movie industry uses. Films come out first in their country of origin (or sometimes, the U.S., even though they were made elsewhere) and then come out later everywhere else. This made sense in the 1930s, when there were only a few reels of each movie and they had to be physically transported around the world, but it’s completely ludicrous now – nevertheless, it persists. The gap is so large that, often, the DVD of a movie is out in the U.S. before it’s released in theatres elsewhere. This would obviously present a problem if the U.S. DVD could be played in the players of other regions – hence region coding. I don’t honestly *know* why the movie industry is so wedded to the system, still, but it is. That’s the only reason why region codes exist – to inconvenience customers for the benefit of the industry’s weird desires. Not a thing to do with piracy.
It doesn’t even help with release schedules.
Just buy another computer or DVD device, switch it to US-region code and; voilà , you can watch US movies.
A friend of mine bought Shanghai Knights on ebay a week before you could watch it in German theaters…
“Because very few people ever move to a different country, or rather a different continent as would be the case with region codes.
Furthermore as has been said before, all you needed to do is take your US dvd player with you, or buy one there and set it to region 1. So you need 2 dvd players, wow, what a horrible thing, end of world really.
Next to be traveling in a different country and deciding to buy a dvd there puts you in even smaller group of people. Most don’t go to other countries to buy dvds. You are really stretching to come up with a good argument here. Also as was mentioned, watching dvds on computers is a pretty overrated thing.
How many people here even have ever watched a dvd on their computer? Most I would think much prefer watching movies on something like a 27 inch tv while sitting on the couch with friends. Oh, and you can buy region code free DVD players to hook up to your tv. Some makers have apparently said screw the rules. About the only time i know of people using their computers is in dorms.”
I found this whole post kinda funny…because I’ve done all three. I’ve bought several DVDs on holiday – why do you think this would be unusual? – I moved from the UK to Canada in June, and I’ve been watching DVDs on my PCs for years now. I still do, as I use my PC as an HTPC, it’s connected to my TV and serves as DVD player, music player and general video player. Basically, without region free players, I’d be screwed. BTW, if you think people who need to play DVDs from several reasons are so rare, why do you think multi-region DVD players are so popular?
for everyone referring to ‘the boing boing guy’, he’s Cory Doctorow. He’s quite well-known, y’know.
the idea is that most people won’t bother. It’s like CD copy protection schemes, it’s not intended to stop everyone, just enough people. How many people would buy a second DVD player / drive just to watch other discs? How many people would flash their player / drive to region 0? Not many. Before big stores started selling cheap region free players made by Chinese firms who cheerfully ignore the whole region coding thing, the system worked well enough for the industry to be happy with, and region-free was a niche pursuit.
>>>Films come out first in their country of origin (or sometimes, the U.S., even though they were made elsewhere) and then come out later everywhere else. This made sense in the 1930s, when there were only a few reels of each movie and they had to be physically transported around the world, but it’s completely ludicrous now – nevertheless, it persists.
As I stated earlier, going to the movies is a communal event and you take your family out during the holidays or when the weather is good.
Only US and Canada celebrate thanksgiving. Only the western countries celebrate christmas. For the chinese, chinese new year is the big holiday. Between thanksgiving to chinese new year — that’s like 2-3 months.
You don’t take your kids to see a movie in January with 3-4 feet of snow on the ground. Neither would the people in the southern hamisphere take their kids to the movies in June/July during the dead of the winter (maybe even during their kids’ midterm exams).
Lord of the rings trilogy, matrix trilogy and star wars prequel are all filmed in Australia or New Zealand. Suppose they premier down under first in January during their summer holidays — would you line up under 3-4 feet of snow to watch them in New York.
Drives were not required to be RPC-2 until Jan 1, 2000. So most were RPC-1 with the region codes only being implemented in the player application/operating system. However, the MPAA required that all drives manufactured after Jan 1, 2000 to be RPC-2 compliant which limits the drive to changing 5 times before the manufacturer reset. The secret way to reset the NVRAM for the older Macs was for the RPC-1 drive based Macs. To fix the newer ones you would probably need to both replace the firmware and probably do the NVRAM clear as well, since it will most likely fall back to tracking the changes at the OS level when it sees an RPC-1 firmware. You can also get around the software protection on Windows via various applications that can fix the application/OS counter. Linux is particularly nice in this aspect since open source developers don’t give a shit what the MPAA thinks and so have not implemented RPC in software, merely replacing the firmware on the drive will allow Linux to play any region DVD.
would we? heck yes we would. not everybody has the summer off or has vacation at the same time in the US.
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