Novell is releasing SuSE Linux Professional 9.3 today. It includes the new desktop search utilty Beagle, and support for the iPod.
SuSE 9.3 Today
Submitted by Matthias Toth 2005-03-09 SuSE, openSUSE 53 Comments
Novell is releasing SuSE Linux Professional 9.3 today. It includes the new desktop search utilty Beagle, and support for the iPod.
Can’t wait to get my hands on it once it hits the ftps..
have they included all the “missing” stuff that stopped DVD and MP3 playback from 9.2
why is suse so sllllloooowwwwwwww compared to even mandrake ?
It maybe slow on your PC, but I found Suse to be quite speedy.
The stuff isn’t missing – it’s just not included due to licensing agreements. If they included it, they’d be breaking the law (I think).
I wouldn’t count on it. They took that stuff out for a reason.
It seems strange to me that they make no mention of the release on their site. (at least that I could see)
it has been slower on ALL the pcs I have tried it on compared to Mandrake and even slower than Xandros !
The problem with Suse is that their are 3 version : the box version ( CDs + DVDs ), the download version ( CDs or a single DVD ) and the FTP version if you want some application like Quanta Mp3/DVD/Movie support … You MUST have installed the box version or the FTP version !
Anyway Suse 9.2 FTP Rocks on Amd64 it’s kind of up-to-date and very stable.
Personnaly I was a Mandrake user for a long time because it was easy to install/update. WHen I bought my AMD64 Laptop, I turned to Suse 9.2 x86_64.
For now on ALL my PCs, I’ve switch to debian Sarge ! Really FAST, uptodate programs and kernel. It’s a little hard to install compared to Suse / Mandrake / Fedora installation process but it’s really impressive after !
From the Novell discussion board.
It is not true. No SuSE Pro 9.3 today, sorry 🙂
Novell Support Connection Volunteer SysOp
I thought Beagle was well integrated into the Gnome desktop. SUSE still defaults to KDE, right?
It felt indeed very wrong: SUSE in early March? With no previous warning of any kind?
>The stuff isn’t missing – it’s just not included due to
>licensing agreements. If they included it, they’d be breaking
>the law (I think).
That’s very funny! They don’t ship a f*cking MP3 codec, but they install Mono by default.
I still have home 8.1 & I am wondering about the new features.
9.2 brought nothing new except a newer kernel.I hope they haven’t sabotaged dvd playback this time.
I hope they don’t install or run beagle by default. We have it packaged for MDK and it’s fine to play with, but terribly unstable, easy to break and it leaks memory all over the place. It’s certainly a toy at this point. Any MDK users who want to play with it will find it in the contribs for current 10.2 betas and final 10.2 when it’s released.
I bet it’s another of those wrong or at least highly misleading stories by Ingrid Marson.
Geez, is it really all that tough to download a codec or two and mPlayer from Packman and get DVD playing up and running? I mean, it’s about a 5 minute proposition…and then all works perfectly. SuSe DOES rock…everything just seems to work!
About it being slow…I would agree that it is slower than some distro’s (such as Slackware, which is uncommonly fast), but it is also one of the BEST with the least FUSS to get things working. It really doesn’t bother me that much.
About the “9.3” thing…don’t know where that came from…but 9.2 DID bring some new things. More hardware worked out of the box, expecially for my laptop, where EVERYTHING is working and with 9.1 didn’t. It’s incremental, guys and gals…but I am just very happy to be rid of Microsoft.
Just my two cents
Not shipping libdvdcss is one thing, but crippling xine so it won’t work even if you *install* it (which 9.2 did) is a bit over the top. It’s still easy to deal with if you know the technique but it’s a bit pointless, if you ask me. Why not just ship a normal xine / mplayer without shipping libdvdcss? That seems to be good enough for every other distro vendor – even Fedora, the most paranoid about license issues, doesn’t cripple xine / mplayer.
I like Suse distros. But since I am getting a new hard drive for my Inspiron XPS I was thinking of having my older 60 gb 7200 rpm hdd to have either Suse or Debian on it and my newer 100 gb 7200 rpm hdd to have of course Windows on it cause I game. Not to throw the topic off or anything fellas but could you point me to a very nice tutorial on getting debian tweaked and just smoking on a machine with recompiling the kernel so on and so forth…? I have used Suse always previously and I just love it tho it is kind of slow unless your machine is extremely powerful….
Yeah! Suse usually gives out news a couple weeks before release at least. Either that or the author knows something we dont. 😉
Do you guys actually know what you are talking about? SuSE *has* and always *had* mp3-Codecs included *although* it is patented technology. They bought a license from Fraunhofer in order to be able to legally ship mp3-Codecs. Nobody has to install *anything* from packman in order to play mp3. Simply click on any mp3 file, and it will play.
DVD playback is something completely different. You *cannot* ignore that Germany adopted the stupid and insane US-American copyright laws some time ago, as well as many other European countries did. It would be *illegal* to ship libdvdcss. The multimedia lobbyists would *immediately* stop it and ask for compensation.
You *cannot* expect DVD playback for 90€ or even for free. Do you know how expensive it were to buy a license in order to ship a legal CSS descrambler? Linspire sells one, it is 40$. Would you pay 90€+40$ just in order to have a legal CSS descrambler? Nobody would be willing to pay 2/3 for Linux and 1/3 for a stupid and insane copyright law. Everyone who buys a distro or downloads it for free wants to pay either nothing or 100% for Linux.
*Forget* it. Simply forget the stupid and insane copyright laws and download an illegal CSS descrambler from packman, period. I am *definitely* not willing to support a technology that prevents me from using my DVDs by paying 40$ for it. *Never*.
The codec thing is similar. Every single DLL is copyrighted material, SuSE cannot ship them. SuSE bought a license in order to ship a legal MPEG1/MPEG2 decoder. SuSE *cannot* buy a license in order to ship a wmv decoder. It is too expensive. Turbolinux does it, and Turbolinux is 125$. Would anybody really want to pay 125$-90€ to *µicro§oft* (sic!) by buying Linux? I doubt it!
Get your multimedia stuff from here:
And you are done.
delete this false news pls… 😐
Yer – I was confused by this, as I’d expected OES to be out long before Suse 9.3. Then I looked at the quality of the story, and the references (or lack of them) and worked it out.
We’ve had an interview recently (no names) talking about Beagle and how it would be in Suse 9.3, and lo and behold we get an article that not only talks about Beagle being in 9.3 and how wonderful it is, but also somehow tells us that it is being released today. There are no quotes and no references in the article from Novell or Suse (just as there haven’t been in other articles related to Suse Professional releases – 9.0 and Ximian Desktop anyone?), so guess where this came from?
Just put 2 and 2 together next time and get 4? Unless you actually have a link to Suse’s website that describes the release of 9.3 don’t bother. There are those of us who’ve worked out a pattern in all of this over the past few years. Watch a flurry of news items come out now, pushing this one down the list .
As I said in the comments of that previous Beagle and Hula article at the time, I’ll wait for the official Suse announcement and release thank you very much .
You know my copy of windows XP didn’t come with DVD playback either. Microsoft wants me to buy one, how rude of them!
Seriously, enough griping, it isn’t legal to ship unless licensed.
Not talking about anyone *else’s* complaints, but *my* complaint is that SuSE’s xine and mplayer don’t play DVDs EVEN IF you install an external libdvdcss. They’ve intentionally hacked their xine and mplayer packages NOT to play DVDs even if you install the library. This is just going too far, IMHO, and it would be perfectly OK for them to ship stock xine and mplayer. They still wouldn’t play DVDs unless you installed libdvdcss from somewhere, but you wouldn’t have to replace the xine and mplayer packages just to get it working. As I said, this is how all the other vendors do it, it’s only SuSE who think it’s necessary to hack up the players for some reason.
As I remember, Linspire CNR members pay something like 5 bucks for the dvd player, or that’s what it costed one year ago..
You are asking me to read the complaints, but you are writing *nonsense* in the same sentence. SuSE cannot intentionally have hacked its MPlayer packages because these do *not* even exist. SuSE comes completely without *any* MPlayer packages.
I do not know whether or not SuSE has hacked its internal xine packages. I could download the src.rpm and have a look at it. Did you do this before accusing SuSE in order to verify your accusation? Anyway, I will *not* do this either because it simply does not matter.
If you are able to download and install an external libdvdcss package, then you are able to download and install external xine packages just as well. From the same website, i.e. packman. It is *not* that difficult and you get a newer version with additional features and bugfixes.
It *might* be true that SuSE people removed any CSS-related stuff from xine, but they did it *definitely* not in order to annoy you, but in order to *protect* themselves. Do you know that RedHat does not even ship Mono packages just in order to protect itself from patent issues?
Anyone who wants do decode CSS has to download and install an external package *anyway*, so there is absolutely no problem to replace xine at the very same time. And remember that companies like SuSE and RedHat have to protect themselves. They are doing this in different ways, but they have to, at least to some extent.
About DVDs, codecs and so on. SUSE. HAS. NOT. BEEN. RELEASED.
And today isn’t even the 1st of April.
> I bet it’s another of those wrong or at least highly misleading stories by Ingrid Marson.
well, all she said was it was “due out on Wednesday”, but she did not say WHICH Wednesday 😉
You are an ignoramus of the biggest proportions. Listen to what AdamW is telling you because it is the truth.
Suse breaks xine and mplayer, which is included on the professional CDs, so that they will not play at all even if you install libdvdcss on your own.
Stop defending that which cannot be defended. Red Hat doesn’t do this. Mandrake doesn’t do this. And the Linspire codec is $5, in case you actually care about truth in advertising.
I like Suse but we do not help ourselves or potential Suse and by extension Linux users by spreading misinformation. The truth is that DVD playback on Suse is a pain in the ass because you have to install unsuppported packages from third-party repositories using apt-for-rpm. And if you continue to use apt-for-rpm for any extension of time, you often damage your rpm database and end up with conflicts when you try to do security updates.
Suse, and the idiots who defends Suse’s crippling of xine and kaffeine, need to get their head out of their ass.
THERE IS NO LEGAL REASON TO DO WHAT THEY DO. Don’t claim there is. They don’t have to do what they do and they will end up just inconveniencing people.
It is also clear that Suse has a licensing agreement with WinDVD as WinDVD is shipped with the suse laptops sold by HP. And an official license isn’t that much for a company like Novell. It is about $50,000, hardly anything that is going to break the bank. If Linspire could do it, so can Suse.
At the very least, I hope Suse 9.3 ships with a working version of kaffeine and not a crippled one.
1. What AdamW is telling us cannot be the truth because no current version of SuSE includes MPlayer, therefore MPlayer cannot be crippled because it does not even exist. If you say that any version of SuSE 9.x includes a crippled version of MPlayer, you are saying something that is definitely not true.
2. I will not stop defending SuSE just because you are asking me to do so. I just downloaded xine-lib-0.99.rc6a-4.2.nosrc.rpm from SuSE ftp (although I told that I will not do so) and looked at the spec file. These are the most important parts of the changelog:
* Sat Apr 07 2001 – email@example.com
– make xine look for win32 codecs
* Tue Dec 11 2001 – firstname.lastname@example.org
– move dvd plugins to subpackage again
* Sun Feb 02 2003 – email@example.com
– review all codecs for legal problems, still unsure on some, which remain disabled
* Tue Feb 04 2003 – firstname.lastname@example.org
– install fonts, they are xine own property and freeware
* Thu Feb 06 2003 – email@example.com
– faad implementation is okay, but there are maybe other copyrights -> disabled
* Mon Feb 17 2003 – firstname.lastname@example.org
– update legal comment according gsm 06.10
* Mon May 12 2003 – email@example.com
– update to version 1.0-beta12 (sorenson support, but it is not distributable)
* Wed Sep 03 2003 – firstname.lastname@example.org
– add warning popup, if the user click on dvd button and has not sufficient support to play it
* Sun Sep 21 2003 – email@example.com
– do not try to open the dvd device at all, if needed codecs are missing (or a dead lock can happen) #30224
* Thu Apr 29 2004 – firstname.lastname@example.org
– use external libmad and libmpeg2
You see that many, many modifications have been done due to legal and technical reasons. If you still think that libdvdcss was disabled intentionally, then PROVE it instead of just saying that it were true while saying things in the same sentence that are PROVENLY not true. I do not have SuSE’s xine-lib any more and cannot find out whether it works or not with libdvdcss. If it does not work, this does not mean that this is intended, there might be technical incompatibilities because of all these modifications. None of the sources mentioned in the spec file indicate that they intentionally disable libdvdcss. These are:
PROVE your accusations now! Tell me which one of these patches is the one that disables libdvdcss.
3. RedHat does not even support MP3 and the version of xine that SuSE ships has so many features disabled that everybody needs the packman version anyway. We are talking about absolutely philosophical things here that are completely irrelevant because most people will need the packman version anyway.
4. You have to use external yast/yum/apt/rpm/urpmi repositories and risk making your system inconsistent on every distro because nobody can ship all multimedia stuff that people might want because this were plain illegal. This is the same for every distro. Do not tell us something else, this is nonsense.
5. Defending SuSE’s policy does not mean being an idiot, it means explaining to the idiots what is the reality today. Do not complain about the people that explain this, instead complain about the idiots in the Bundestag who made an insane copyright law that prevents me from watching my DVDs.
6. SuSE has absolutely no interest in inconveniencing people and it is still UNPROVEN that libdvdcss was broken intentinally, PROVE it or simply get a fixed package. It is completely ridiculous to say that SuSE inconveniences its customers intentionally.
7. If SuSE had a license that allows SuSE to distribute a legal CSS descrambler with the regular distro, then SuSE would distribute it. The fact that SuSE does not distribute it means that the license you are talking about is not sufficiently generic in order to distribute this software with the regular distro.
8. SuSE 9.3 will definitely not ship with better multimedia support unless the Bundestag makes a reasonable copyright law, which will never happen. This means that SuSE’s multimedia packages are nothing more than a placeholder for packman’s ones, so what? Install them and watch your movies.
… are not included, and they might have to look on the web for about a minute?
Oh, well. At least they’re not complaining about the colours.
I’m sorry after trying almost every major Linux distro 2 years ago Suse was the ONLY distro to recognize every thing and work flawlessly. Mandrake was at the top of my list until I experienced the random file system failures in VMware and on my new Dell box.
Now that is under the belt and does not relate to the subject being discussed. Please delete ASAP.
Is there a particular reason why you become so obnoxious when someone disagrees with you? Or are you always like that?I suggest to you that it does not help your argument, and that even people who might agree with will stop paying attention to you.
To err is human, to forgive divine.
Listen, I just get a little exasperated by people that want to spread misinformation. I like Suse and plenty of great things can be said about it:
*It ships with the best manuals.
*Yast is incredible. And the fact that you can use the same interface over ssh with the yast ncurses version is icing on the cake.
*It has the best profile manager that I have seen in Linux land for handling network and hardware profiles.
And the list goes on and on. But when Suse screws up, we have to take them to task. Otherwise, they will not improve and we will have this situation ad infinitum.
The DVD issue has no justification. Note how the anonymous defending Suse fails to own up to his claim that it would cost Suse forty or fifty dollars to ship a DVD-decoder because that is what he claimed that you have to pay to Linspire. When I proved to him, that the codec/library is only a few bucks, he did not respond.
When I pointed to him that Suse must already have a license, because they ship the HP laptops with DVD playback, he did not respond.
When I pointed to him that Suse is going beyond what is legally required and that no other distributor does this,he provides no rational or valid argument for doing this. Mandrake and Red Hat also sell in Germany. Not to mention, that Suse is now Novell, an American company, even though the situation on this side of the pond with regards to libdvdcss is no better than in Germany.
Once again, nobody is asking Suse to ship the decoder library. We are asking them to provide vanilla kaffeine and xine libraries.
Thanks for listening.
I understand the points that you make, but you stop one short. Try applying occam’s razor to your theories. Why does SUSE spend extra money in programming to make its products more difficult to use?
Still I prefer using Ubuntu after using suse 9.1 for 3 months. I found ubuntu more reliable and real complete suit for a desktop and server systems. I think suse folks need to take a look at success of ubuntu distro.
You people are giving the Ubuntu distribution a bad name. If you think you are doing anyone any favors, you are wrong. Ubuntu fans are getting to be worse than Gentoo fans. They jump on every freeking thread to proclaim the one “true Ubuntu” way.
Stop it or you’ll create such a backslash for the product you love so much that you’ll likely kill it.
I’m sure Suse has their team of lawyers looking out for their interests, and that they not only keep up with the present state of the law in their sales territories, they probably also keep up with proposed legislation as well. Perhaps they made an error; perhaps not. In any case, if you do not like Suse don’t buy it; there is no need to lose your temper over it. Also, licenses have been issued before with restrictions. Including the software on an oem (and expensive) platform is very different from releasing it to the consumer directly.
I am using SuSE and have been using SuSE for years and know exactly what I am talking about. There IS a law that forces EVERY distro to ship crippled multimedia apps:
The lecture you are talking about is indeed not necessary, but it helps people finding out why they cannot play DVDs. Whithout this lecture, people might think “Linux does not support DVDs”. This so-called lecture tells people the reason why this does not work out-of-the-box. This makes sense or at least it is better than letting xine show a stupid CSS related error message that nobody understands. I do not understand what is wrong about showing this lecture.
Why do you still insist on telling us that people have to use an unsupported third-party tool like apt-for-rpm in order to get uncrippled replacement packages? Nobody has to. Use yast, this is the primary and official tool on SuSE systems, it will resolve the dependencies for you. packman is a valid yast source. Or use plain rpm. Over-cautious people can download the packages and install them with plain rpm. These packman packages are neither better than worse integrated and tested than the corresponding packages for other distros. Every packman package is build for and on the specific SuSE release which it is labeled for. Do not let the identical release numbers and file names fool you. 9.1 means built on 9.1, 9.2 means build on 9.2, and so on. Compare them as binary if you do not believe me.
MPlayer was excluded from SuSE releases several years ago because it is hopelessly dependent on illegal stuff so that disabling all the illegal stuff would render it completely useless, even as a placeholder, so excluding it completely is the better solution.
Why would SuSE want to go beyond the legal requirements? Do you actually think that they want to scare people away from their own product? This is absurd. RedHat is over-cautious with Mono because of µicro§oft’s patents. SuSE is over-cautious with copyright laws. You are comparing over-cautiousness with bad intention, but these are not comparable.
And you did still not prove that libdvdcss was broken intentionally. I still doubt that this is true until it is proven. I posted the contents of the corresponding spec file and now it is up to you to tell me which particular one of all the patches breaks libdvdcss intentionally or alternatively to stop these accusations.
Anyway, why the hell do you insist on combining the original distro’s xine package with an external libdvdcss package? Is it really that difficult to replace xine and kaffeine along with installing libdvdcss or is it a philosophical question of keeping the original distro’s packages although they lack much functionality anyway, e.g. patented codecs? No, it is not, in fact, it is very easy and it is good practice to not combine packages that depend on each other from different sources, but to install packages that depend on each other from one single source, i.e. packman in this case.
@No Nazi Operating Systems:
Sei gefälligst still und behalte Deine verbalen Exkremente für Dich. So ein zusammenhangloser Sondermüll hat uns gerade noch gefehlt.
You really are grasping at straws, aren’t you?
I understand that English may not be your native language but go back and read again what I said.
Suse does NOT have to ship libvdcss. All they have to do is provide a standard build of Kaffeine and Xine. They do not do this. They toyed wit Kaffeine and Xine until they made sure that it would not play DVDs no matter what you do.
Is this so hard for you to understand?
They are shipping a broken build of Kaffeine and Xine. That’s the problem. Asking new users to search for some “pacman” site that they should be magically be made aware of is inane and ludicrous.
And I see that you failed to respond to my rebuttal about how expensive it would be for Suse to provide a working DVD decoder in their professional edition.
Do you work for Suse? I have not seen such blind support in a long time.
And if you do work for Suse, I love the product. Fix the DVD issue and all will be well.
I do not work for SuSE. If I did, my employer would cut my internet connection in order to prevent me from hanging around in forums and discussing things that do not matter instead of doing some serious work.
You are telling me repeatedly that SuSE hacked xine and kaffeine intentiously in order to make them incompatible with any external libdvdcss and I asked you (in a not so very polite manner, I have to admit) to prove it and to tell me which patches from the src.rpm are the ones that cause this incompatibility intentiously.
You did not answer this question, which is your legitimate decision, but under these circumstances I will tell you that I do not follow your speculations since unproven things are nothing more than speculations.
– SuSE’s xine packages are heavily patched in order to remove features that SuSE cannot distribute.
– Other distros’ xine packages are heavily patched in order to remove features that these distros cannot distribute.
– SuSE’s xine packages are now incompatible with an external libdvdcss (this is what you say, I do not know whether this is true and I will not restore SuSE’s xine packages on my system in order to find out).
– Other distro’s xine packages are still compatible with an external libdvdcss.
Does this necessarily mean that SuSE enforced this incompatibility intentiously? No, it does not, because all distros are heavily patching xine, but they are doing this in different ways that can result in different consequences. Will a heavily patched kernel still work with existing device drivers that were written for a vanilla kernel? Not necessarily. Maybe it will work, maybe it will not work. You see?
As long as you do not tell me which one of the patches from the src.rpm is intentionally responsible for this incompatibility, your accusations are pure speculations and nothing else.
And you are right, it is very hard for me to understand your point of view. You are telling me that it were ridiculous and even insane to send newbies to packman in order to get an uncrippled xine, but this sentence itself is absolutely ridiculous because they have to go there anyway in order to get libdvdcss! You are very right, I simply do not get your point.
I already responded to your question regarding a legal CSS descrambler. But I can repeat my answer more precisely, if you wish: A license was bought for the particular purpose of shipping a legal CSS descrambler together with a series of HP notebooks that had an OEM version of SuSE preinstalled, but I do not even know whether HP or SuSE actually bought this license and even if it were SuSE who bought this license, this does not mean that they are allowed to distribute this legal CSS descrambler whith their regular releases unless they license they bought were a flatrate, which I doubt because if this were the case, they would distribute it.
SuSE does not offer a legal CSS descrambler with its regular releases, period. If you want a legal CSS descrambler, you cannot use SuSE and must use Linspire instead. If you want to use SuSE, you must use libdvdcss and if libdvdcss does not work for you with SuSE’s xine and kaffeine packages, you must replace them with working ones.
By the way, I understand the English language very, very well although it is not my native language, this is correct. I would like to propose stopping the discussion at this point because I am disappointed with your answers and you are disappointed with mine. Please keep in mind that unproven accusations are not nice and I will keep in mind that SuSE ships poor multimedia packages, which I already knew before.
Is the whole thing only a hoax … no statement on the novell / suse site, now surely if they were shipping it today they would at least have a press release on their website …
Sorry to distract you from your rant with NLA, but why do you think SUSE spends time and money to cripple a software package?
Thank you very much indeed. Yours is the first sensible post in this thread. The expected SUSE 9.3 features made my mouth water!
If you read German this might be of interest.
EDV Buchversand has been the “official” online order handler for SUSE for quite some time. They don’t mention an exact ship date, but it can’t be too far off 😉
And thanks to you too, friend. Yes, I can read German.
I love this page:
I wish there was an English version of it. I’d put the link in my signature in various forums.
Looks pretty cool – i am surprised that they include Gnome 2.10, i though it would have been 2.8, usuallly they used to ship older versions of gnome with their distribution. The last Suse i haev used was 9.1 and i never really liked it … i guess their gnome support then was poor and i prefer Gnome. This looks more like it know i might give it a try. Having said that I like Ubuntu very much. I just wish they would support mono and mono related applications (beagle, f-spot, dashboard) better. In Hoary they still use mono 1.05 although 1.1.4 is recommended.
Bestellen Sie SUSE LINUX Professional 9.3 jetzt vor und erhalten Sie die Software automatisch mit Veröffentlichung Mitte April.
So, it would be released in April (normal release schedule for SUSE)
Yikes, they’re shipping f-spot by default as well. Seems the ex-Ximian guys are getting their evangelising in early. I’m not entirely sure using beagle and f-spot as default desktop apps is a smart idea yet, they’re both still immature if developing fast…