OSNews

Not a bit of it. If a site such as "OSNews" were to simply hold different Operating Systems to the same standards of criticism, then I would be happy.

I cannot see any point in criticizing Linux for an area where it actually leads the pack. There is a far wider variety of supported hardware and better quality drivers for Linux that there is for either OSX or Vista.

Why should OSNews continue to post topics which hint towards the exact opposite of reality? That is, assuming no hidden agenda is at work ... which more and more one suspects to be an invalid assumption.

Edited 2007-10-28 04:58

The article questioned the quality of linux drivers, not the quantity, and that's a valid point. I think the author did a decent job of clarifying the point with his examples.

Aside from the author's point about drivers not being able to support the full functionality of hardware, there is also the issue of drivers that become stale in the kernel because they have no maintainers and suffer regressions when other subsystems change in the kernel, in part due to the "we can change the internal API's at will" mentality of the devs. This is a point that Andrew Morton himself brought up, that many of the devs work on newer and sexier projects rather than the grunt work of maintaining the older stuff and the number of bugs and regressions is increasing because of that.

I commend the kernel devs and respect the work they have done with providing drivers, particularly when they require reverse-engineering, and I'm certainly grateful for the ability I have to run linux on most systems I install it on. That level of development support is something that is so far above my own ability to contribute towards that I won't dare judge. I also understand the challenges they have with hardware vendors not releasing specs, or not even having access to the hardware that users are requesting support for. Their challenges are going to become even more apparent as development efforts move towards things like power efficiency, which is difficult to implement without vendor support. So don't take this as condemnation of the effort and work the devs have done to this point, that's not my intent.

But pretending the problem doesn't exist doesn't make it go away. Yes, linux may support more hardware than Windows does, but Windows (and OSX) generally has better support for hardware than linux does. There is a difference. It's not criticism of linux or praise of Microsoft/Apple, just a reality that we need to figure out how to best address.

The "pack"? How do you define "the pack"? OSX and Vista? Is there some reason we should be content to aim for mediocrity? What's your agenda?

I'm wondering if you actually bothered to read the article. I didn't find it to be excessively negative at all, and I think the writer has good examples and valid points. What are we supposed to do, pretend this issue doesn't exist? Exploring the issue and honest criticism will only serve to make the Linux platform stronger. Sometimes it's hard to accept, but this isn't an arena for shrinking violets.

Lol seriously, show some numbers otherwise shutup. What you are saying is ridiculous. Windows has more market share (meaning more 3rd party developers want to develop for it) and in addition it doesnt require developers to open source drivers (i.e. there is a relatively stable ABI they can develop with against) again meaning they will want to produce drivers for Windows and less so for Linux. What I have said is just common sense.

If a site such as "OSNews" were to simply hold different Operating Systems to the same standards of criticism, then I would be happy.

I never understood the idea that if someone likes Coke they have to put down Pepsi. No one is trashing Linux. Criticism such as this exists because people want to make Linux as good as possible. It's not always about Microsoft. if you don't like Vista, don't use it, but if you want Linux to succeed, then look at it's warts as well as its fine points and try to make it as accessable to as many people as possible.

"I cannot see any point in criticizing Linux for an area where it actually leads the pack. There is a far wider variety of supported hardware and better quality drivers for Linux that there is for either OSX or Vista."

I agree with you as far as Vista goes, but OS X has no need to support the full range of hardware Linux and Windows needs to support, because OS X is not supposed to be used on anything other than Apple hardware. On Apple hardware, the supported devices usually work better than anything else you'll find, under any operating system.

Edited 2007-10-28 12:33

I totally dig it. Stuff like this really got my back up too.


What in the world do you want? Anything short of an article saying "Linux is perfection itself" is an attack to some people.

The problem is not quantity. Linux supports way more stuff out of the box, but that's not the point. The point is that if I find a device somewhere buried in my collection of computer crap, I'm 90% certain I can get it working on Windows XP, and about 80% sure I could get it working on Windows Vista [well, seeing my Vista laptop's battery and charger died, I won't get it running on Vista at all ]. I can just go to the manufacturer's website, and most likely, I can find a nice driver installer there et voilà.

With Linux, it's a hit and miss thing. If it isn't recognised by default, I'm kind of in trouble. There's a big chance the manufacturer's website won't list Linux as an option at all on their driver page, and even if they did, driver installation on Linux is STILL a total pain in the ass. You have to have the right module for your kernel type, load it in, set it up to load automatically, etc.

The first problem (the hit-and-miss situation) is not Linux' fault at all, of course. The Linux devs have done an amazing job at supporting all my modern hardware, but obviously, if device manufacturers don't help out, it's an ever continuing battle, with no end in sight.

The second problem (driver installation and kernel compatibility issues) is of course the full responsibility of Linus & Friends, and until they get this utter mess sorted out, the first problem will remain.



Ah the usual OSNews-eats-babies-and-kills-panda-bears accusation. Couldn't you have posted this at the beginning, so I wouldn't have had to waste my precious time on writing a reply?

Edited 2007-10-28 12:33 UTC

Mmm, mmm - love that minced-words pie!

oh noes! Eugenia and Thom are out to single handedly destroy Linux's reputation by posting only articles criticizing it! They never post articles criticizing Windows or OSX or the BSDs!