Linked by Eugenia Loli on Fri 7th Dec 2007 06:25 UTC, submitted by poundsmack
Qt Jambi ships as a single Java library, or JAR (Java Archive) file, plus a handful of tools, including an interface layout and design tool, and an Eclipse plug-in. Trolltech uses its vaunted Qt C++ library as the GUI engine and puts Java wrappers around it. This approach uses the JNI (Java Native Interface) to call the necessary functions from Java. More here.
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RE[9]: Unconvinced
by mikeurbandz on Fri 7th Dec 2007 21:25 UTC in reply to "RE[8]: Unconvinced"
mikeurbandz
Member since:
2007-10-29

> Oh right. So I can open Netbeans or Eclipse
> or whatever, create a new project called 'Gnome
> Control...

You are backpeddling and trying to change your requirements now though. You never said "Can I open my IDE and create it having a ready made framework for me". You flat out said it couldn't be done. And it CAN be done.

And actually, if you wanted to write a plugin for NetBeans or Eclipse that had support for that project type, you could even do it the way you want. Select "GNOME panel applet" as the project type and then just fill in the blanks.

> 1. It's taken them ten years to get anywhere near
> it.

So? You are changing your story again. You never said "it took to long to get there" you said "It can't be done". And you were wrong. That's all there is to it. You were wrong.

> They are Java applications with some inherited
> look and feel, which isn't hard to do. Creating
> an application or applet on the 'Java Desktop
> System' goes a whole lot deeper than that.

I know it does. And that is where JDIC comes in. JDIC IS using the native desktop environment. That's the point of JDIC.

> No, you just don't understand what I'm talking
> about.

Yes, I do understand what you are talking about. But you haven't ever heard of JDIC. That much is obvious. Because you are making technical claims about it now that aren't correct. JDIC DOES use the native desktop environment. That is why you are able to write GNOME panel applets and such using it.

> So for the first couple of points in this
> comment, you're confirming they're both a no then?

No. I am saying YES. And I am telling you that you are the one who doesn't understand. Not me. JDIC != Swing L&F emulation. JDIC is a different animal altogether, that actually does integrate with the native desktop environment to allow to to write things like panel applets in Swing that you could not otherwise write using just straight Swing.

Edited 2007-12-07 21:30

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[10]: Unconvinced
by segedunum on Fri 7th Dec 2007 22:17 in reply to "RE[9]: Unconvinced"
segedunum Member since:
2005-07-06

You are backpeddling and trying to change your requirements now though. You never said "Can I open my IDE and create it having a ready made framework for me". You flat out said it couldn't be done. And it CAN be done.

That's exactly what I meant, and in your zeal to get in there and 'prove me wrong' you've made yourself look like an ejit. Too bad.

I asked if I could create a Gnome Control Panel Applet or a Systray Applet - in Java, meaning pure Java and Java tools, all-in-one. The answer is no.

And actually, if you wanted to write a plugin for NetBeans or Eclipse that had support for that project type, you could even do it the way you want.

Yer. It can't be done. There's only so many ways you can say this. If I'm writing a desktop application within a 'Java Desktop System' I'm not interesting in writing plugins Sun should be giving me anyway. As a developer I'm disinterested already.

You are changing your story again. You never said "it took to long to get there" you said "It can't be done".

Yawn. I haven't actually seen any Java 6 apps yet, and not ones that use Swing. What's going to be done for all the legacy applications, and people still developing with Java 2, 1.3, 1.5 etc.? Here's a taster:

http://forums.java.net/jive/thread.jspa?messageID=227915

As far as I and many developers are concerned, that means 'can't be done'. That's what you don't understand. You can either do it there and then, or you can't. You can't keep saying "Well, upgrade to this version and use this add-on and if you write this plugin......"

But you haven't ever heard of JDIC. That much is obvious. Because you are making technical claims about it now that aren't correct.

JDIC is exceptionally poor and limited, and again, it's not a part of Java as-is, and it's something I have to go hunting around for as a developer.

In the real world of development, if you can't do something like Project -> New Project -> Control Panel Applet, it can't be done. The Java Desktop System, quite frankly, is not any kind of Java Desktop System.

No. I am saying YES.

You just told me I'd have to resort to JDIC and Java Gnome beyond that - and handle that in my deployment and installation.

Desktop integration. Sadly, few seem to get it apart from Microsoft.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[11]: Unconvinced
by mikeurbandz on Fri 7th Dec 2007 22:32 in reply to "RE[10]: Unconvinced"
mikeurbandz Member since:
2007-10-29

> That's exactly what I meant, and in your zeal to get
> in there and 'prove me wrong' you've made yourself
> look like an ejit. Too bad.

No. I have not. And all you are doing at this point is digging yourself a deeper hole. Cause you are trying to backpeddle even further.

> I asked if I could create a Gnome Control Panel
> Applet or a Systray Applet - in Java, meaning pure
> Java and Java tools, all-in-one. The answer is no.

No, the answer is still YES. All you have to write is Java code. You don't have to write any non-Java code.

Now if you want to play this game, I'm going to argue that ultimately you can't create anything at all in any language higher tham writing machine code directly.

The fact remains, you as a developer, can create a Gnome panel applet writing ONLY Java code. And nothing else.

> Yer. It can't be done. There's only so many ways
> you can say this. If I'm writing a
> desktop application within a 'Java Desktop System'
> I'm not interesting in writing plugins Sun should
> be giving me anyway. As a developer I'm
> disinterested already.

So? I'm disinterested in writing code by hand in C that any good Java IDE will write for me automatically. Find me any C IDE that can even pretend to try to compete with Java in that department. If you want to play the "I have to write less code argument" and you want to pit C against Java? Trust me. You will lose.

> Yawn. I haven't actually seen any Java 6 apps
> yet, and not ones that use Swing. What's going to
> be done for all the legacy applications, and
> people still developing with Java 2, 1.3, 1.5 etc.?

Legacy applications will pick up the new theme automatically as long as you are running them under Java 6. It doesn't matter whether I developed them on Java 5 or Java 4. As long as they are using the system look and feel, they will pick up the native look and feel in Java 6.

That thread you pointed out only proves that again, you know nothing about Java. It's a non-fatal error. (and it was quite clear about that). However, take that same application, run it on Java 6, and it will work fine. With no recompile or anything required.

Once again, you prove you know almost nothing about Java, or how it's byte code files work.

> JDIC is exceptionally poor and limited,

Says who? You? Ad-hominem. Logical fallacy. you haven't even tried it. You didn't even know what it was. Now you are just making an off the cuff remark you can't even pretend to back up.

> it's not a part of Java as-is, and it's something
>I have to go hunting around for as a developer.

Oh come on... You have to hunt for a hell of alot more stuff to do development in C or C++ than you do in Java. I'm seriously starting to wonder if you have done development in any language at all much less Java.

> In the real world of development, if you can't
> do something like Project -> New Project ->
> Control Panel Applet, it can't be done. The
> Java Desktop System, quite frankly, is not any
> kind of Java Desktop System.

You don't live in the real world. You live in a fantasy world. Development tools for Java are light years ahead of development tools for C or C++. So I guess since you can't do "Project -> New Project -> New Word Processor", it's not possible to write a word processor huh? Can't be done.

> You just told me I'd have to resort to JDIC.

You've already proven you don't know what JDIC is, how it works, and then proceeded to make logical fallacy attacks against it.

> and handle that in my deployment and installation.

Oh wow... You have to bundle ONE .so file with your application... Whatever will you do?

Edited 2007-12-07 22:47

Reply Parent Score: 3