"Opera Software filed a complaint with the European Commission yesterday which is aimed at giving consumers a genuine choice of Web browsers. The complaint describes how Microsoft is abusing its dominant position by tying its browser, Internet Explorer, to the Windows operating system and by hindering interoperability by not following accepted Web standards. Opera has requested the Commission to take the necessary actions to compel Microsoft to give consumers a real choice and to support open Web standards in Internet Explorer."
To read all comments associated with this story, please click here.
Member since:2005-06-29
"Without a browser, how can you go download Opera"
You can use a USB key or a CD-ROM, you can ask a friend, buy a magazine with a CD-ROM with Opera, etc... No need for a web browser.
"Furthermore, asking Microsoft to bundle something besides IE is just dumb"
That would be ridiculous, thank God, Opera didn't ask it. They're asking Microsoft to either fix their browser so that a web site that works in IE works in other browsers and to offer the user to uninstall the browser.
Member since:2005-09-13
Member since:2007-01-03
You're freaking kidding me right? Did you even *READ* the article?
Look, lifted straight from the article: Opera requests the Commission to implement two remedies to Microsoft’s abusive actions. First, it requests the Commission to obligate Microsoft to unbundle Internet Explorer from Windows and/or carry alternative browsers pre-installed on the desktop.
Member since:2005-11-29
Neither of those are healthy solutions. I think the best thing to do is offer a link in the shell (Most likely how Windows Live Services are tied into Welcome Center in Windows Vista) which allows the user to download the browser of his choice.
Still I see this as a cold day in hell though. Browser wars are fought by a very niche group of people, my grandmother doesn't care what the hell she's running so-long as the web page displays really pretty.
Do you really think unbundling IE will do anything other than cause grief? Those who don't want IE have already moved on to other means, the Web browser market isn't as cut throat as say the PC Market or the PMP Market.
I mean, there are legitimate arguments here. IE *should* be forced to adopt open standards, even if along side their own proprietary standards. However, unbundling IE from Windows is in my opinion a silly idea, and would give no real benefit to any competitor.
Member since:2006-06-21
Nobody said there shouldn't be a browser there when you start your new computer for the first time. But why should it be Internet Explorer? Why can't IE be removed, by the OEM who sold you the computer, so you can find Opera or Firefox or another browser in there?
For two reasons: (1) You cannot remove Internet Explorer, because Microsoft made it so it can't be removed; (2) If an OEM did that they would suffer at the hands of Microsoft.
This is not fair and should be corrected. In a normal world, based on fair competition, anybody should be able to strike a deal with an OEM and agree to bundle the browser of their choice in there. Canonical, for example, may want to pay Dell to bundle Konqueror on their Windows PC's. Why not? If Dell thinks Canonical offers a better deal why shouldn't they do this?
Because Microsoft has stomped down on any such chance and today it's simply not possible to do this. And this is fundamentaly unfair.
Not so. Microsoft sells Windows. They shouldn't have any say in what any other piece of software gets included, other than stuff that is truly essential to the operating system. If an OEM wants to ship Windows with Opera instead of IE, Total Commander instead of Windows Explorer and ZoneAlarm instead of Windows Fireall, they should be able to do so.
Don't kid yourself. Microsoft does all this on purpose. They're not the victim here, they're the aggressor. They give OEM's very low prices for Windows in order to include it with their PC's instead of Linux or other OS. They "punish" OEM's that dare to do otherwise by revoking their special prices. They strike down very hard if an OEM dares to even think about bundling a competing product with Windows. Did you ever see an OEM computer that came with something else instead of IE? Why do you think that is?
Member since:2006-06-03
Member since:2006-05-26
Member since:2006-02-16
Member since:2005-07-06
That's begging the question.
Why would you be in that situation in the first place? A much more plausible scenario is that you get a new computer, and you can indeed use it browse the web using whichever browser the OEM saw fit to include (possibly even as giving you a choice of browser software at purchase time). Or it would be a more plausible scenario, if Microsoft's OEM contracts didn't specifically prohibit pre-loading 3rd party browsers on threat of reduced OEM volume discounts.
Member since:2005-07-06
Member since:2005-10-02
Heh... ever heard of FTP?
Then of course the question would be: How do you download a browser/FTP-client when you don't have a browser/FTP-client?
In the old days they were installed from CD's, but I'm not sure browsers and/or FTP-clients are still distributed that way. Most magazines these days just give a code to a download area, and then we're screwed anyway.
Member since:2007-09-06
Nah, MS wouldn't need to bundle a copy of each other browser. In the end user's best interest, it would be ideal if MS offered installs for all the other browsers plus there own.
They don't need to go to that extent though, just provide a Windows that IE can truly be uninstalled from. This way you can connect to the internet (websites more accurately) right from a bare metal install then uninstall IE after replacing it with a browser of your choice.
I think the real issue here is that rather than competing based on product quality, MS is continuing to exploit the limited knowledge of there customers; "oh hey, there's a browser here.. why should I go find something different?"
Member since:
2007-01-03
but if I buy a PC, I'd prefer being able to browse the internet as soon as I unpack it. Without a browser, how can you go download Opera or w/e else you may need. Furthermore, asking Microsoft to bundle something besides IE is just dumb, they are a company and obviously will bundle *their* product on *their* operating system. The only solution would be for Microsoft to add Opera, Firefox, and every other Windows web browser available, only adding to the clutter of crap icons you see when you purchase a computer.
I feel I need to clarify my position after this post, I never use IE or any microsoft products, but this is just stupid.