Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 29th Apr 2008 08:21 UTC, submitted by Jason Slack
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RE[10]: Like in Denmark..
by Thom_Holwerda on Tue 29th Apr 2008 18:38
in reply to "RE[9]: Like in Denmark.."
And when you do, could you please explain the fundamental difference between "state-sponsored murder" and "state-sponsored imprisonment" in the framework of everyone being equal and no person having the right to decide over another person's freedom.
The fact I have to explain the difference to you between murder and imprisonment says enough. A prison sentence may not be reversible in case of court errors, but at least the person gets to live. If he gets murdered by the state, falsely, the damage cannot be undone.
In addition, state-sponsored murder punishes the perpetrator's family and friends much heavier than a prison sentence.
RE[11]: Like in Denmark..
by tomcat on Tue 29th Apr 2008 19:13
in reply to "RE[10]: Like in Denmark.."
I'm opposed to capital punishment, as long as the state can keep the person incarcerated and prevent them from committing more crimes. For me, it's a moral quandry. I don't like the idea of state-sponsored killing; particularly when there's a reasonable (albeit expensive) alternative. But that's the price for living in a civilized society. One additional advantage is that, in the rare circumstance that an innocent man goes to prison, at least he can live.
RE[11]: Like in Denmark..
by A.H. on Tue 29th Apr 2008 19:15
in reply to "RE[10]: Like in Denmark.."
The fact I have to explain the difference to you between murder and imprisonment says enough.
What does it say exactly? If it's so blatantly obvious and already being discussed many times before, could you please copy/paste it for me or give me a link?
A prison sentence may not be reversible in case of court errors, but at least the person gets to live. If he gets murdered by the state, falsely, the damage cannot be undone.
I dunno, sound kind of weak to me. I mean, you start off with "The Dutch constitution states in its first article that everyone is equal - the principle of unconditional equality.". It is such a strong statement, I can almost picture tens of thousands of demonstrators marching down the streets with "Unconditional Equality" written on their banners. And then, a few minutes later, your argument is reduced to something along the lines of "well, at least they get to eat soup". I mean, equality is equality, especially the UNCONDITIONAL one, so how come it's acceptable for the people to imprison people but not acceptable to execute them?
Again, your whole argument against death penalty is based on making it sound that if death penalty exists then I will be applied to everyone from serial killers to parking offenders, although I am repeatedly, in every post, stating that I think it should only apply to extreme cases where there is undisputed independent evidence of the accused being guilty of MULTIPLE deaths.
In addition, state-sponsored murder punishes the perpetrator's family and friends much heavier than a prison sentence.
So, it's wrong to "punish" relatives of a mass murderer, but it's ok to take money from victims' relatives and use that money to cloth, feed and shelter that murderer? I mean, this money could be used for cancer research, or to feed hungry kids, or to provide care for elderly.






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2005-11-11
In addition, there are moral issues, of course. The very concept of state-sponsored murder makes me sick to my stomach. How people can be so utterly barbaric and uncivilised is beyond me.
Sorry to hear that, hope you feel better soon. And when you do, could you please explain the fundamental difference between "state-sponsored murder" and "state-sponsored imprisonment" in the framework of everyone being equal and no person having the right to decide over another person's freedom.
Edited 2008-04-29 18:09 UTC