Tuesday, we linked to an interview with one of the creators of AWK, over at ComputerWorld. From the same series comes an interview with Chat Ramney, maintainer of BASH, the Bourne Again Shell. BASH is the default shell on most UNIX systems, and has been ported to Windows, MS-DOS, the Amiga, and just about everywhere else.
To read all comments associated with this story, please click here.
Member since:2005-07-06
Member since:2005-07-06
Member since:2006-10-08
I think you made some valid points here, allthough they may be off-topic.
First: The topic is titeled "The A-Z of Programming Languages: BASH". Users don't care about programming languages, not about their nature, their purposes, their syntax or even their pure existance. So letting the user enter the field of discussion is not useful. You could attach this kind of statement to nearly any topic at OSNews: "The user doesn't need to know about the OS, he just uses his applications."
Second: Using bash is about optimizing your work, making it efficient, wasting less time, gaining knowledge, learning. These are things that do not matter to a user.
Third: Users insist on UI applications. That's completely okay. They do use what a programmer (see first and next idea) gives into their hands. They don't do enything beside that.
Fourth: Programming is about ceativity. Users don't create, they use. NB: It's worth mentioning that they do create things using their applications, but they do not create things releated to these applications. Oh, by the way... Forth is a programming language, too. :-)
Fifth: Using bash may not be required to use a computer, but it may be more useful than using given GUI driven applications if certain reasons can be applied. This is a "can statement", no force. You can see it the same way as you see tools: It's not required to use an electric drill to put your pictures on the wall. You can use gaspipe pliers to beat a nail into the wall, or you can use glue. But on some walls, the electric drill is the best solution.
Sixth: Using bash is not about making things "more difficult"; having the last iead still in mind, using anything than bash could be seen as making things "more difficult", e. g. applying postprocessing rules to a described set of image files under certain conditions (bash: iteration, conditions, call to program "convert" with certain parameters).
Just some ideas.
Having used different programming languages over the years, I may say that I took the chance to learn more about this topic. I gained more and more knowledge about how things work, beginning with algorithmic considerations and ending in how to write a certain piece of code. This puts me into a position where I can offer a solution an "average GUI guy" falls into a state of agony because it's too difficult for him. And in most cases, the solution is very simple - you just need to be able to see it.
If everybody would think the way you mentioned that nobody would be using computers anymore, because they are "too difficult." :-)
Edited 2008-05-30 22:06 UTC
Member since:2005-07-05
It certainly isn't required, but BASH makes some tasks much easier; especially repetitive tasks.
I think it is funny to see Windows users at work spending large amounts of time manually dinking around with large numbers of files, for instance, and being able to accomplish the same task with a simple for loop using BASH.
Member since:2006-09-19
Recently, I read about zsh. I tried it for a few seconds, but I preferred bash' tab completion better than zsh's. Still, I should give zsh a better try. Are there some users here who can elaborate on zsh vs bash? This summer, I want to learn my girlfriend to use Linux and a *nix shell, and I have to choose between bash and zsh. Zsh is more modern, but bash is included in the default install of most distros.
That said, I am very happy with bash. It never let me down, it's easy to use, and more advanced uses are possible too. Thumbs up for bash!
Dude, there are better things to do with a girlfriend.
But if a good bashing is what she wants then so be it.
Member since:2005-07-06
Maybe you should look for a relationship which contains more than sex. It's fun!
She is studying medical subjects and preparing for doing biomedical research. I feel that persons who want to do research, and have to work with computer tools and lage quantities of data, should at least have some minimal understanding of their tools. Some basic programming, knowing the parts of a computer, and understanding of the "filesystem" and "encoding" concepts are important. Working from a command line gives control and understanding, and sometimes is faster and easier than working with a GUI.
That's why advanced medical researchers work with S or R (command line programmable statistics packages), and not with SPSS which has a nice GUI but is more suitable for beginners.
Edit: A few days ago, she mailed me a few microscopy photo's from her professor. It was a powerpoint file. Yes, copied and pasted in powerpoint and mailed that way. That's what you get by keeping users dumb.
Edited 2008-05-30 11:11 UTC
Member since:
2005-07-06
No week passes without using bash. I use bash very often, although it is mainly for issuing simple commands like cd, rm -r, find -i foo* and vi.
Recently, I read about zsh. I tried it for a few seconds, but I preferred bash' tab completion better than zsh's. Still, I should give zsh a better try. Are there some users here who can elaborate on zsh vs bash? This summer, I want to learn my girlfriend to use Linux and a *nix shell, and I have to choose between bash and zsh. Zsh is more modern, but bash is included in the default install of most distros.
That said, I am very happy with bash. It never let me down, it's easy to use, and more advanced uses are possible too. Thumbs up for bash!