Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 21st May 2010 06:49 UTC
Legal Let the spreading of FUD begin! Known patent troll Larry Horn, CEO of MPEG-LA, is clearly feeling the heat - a heat that might set fire to his company's license to print money. After a decade of empty threats towards Theora, the company is apparently putting its it's-impossible-to-create-a-video-codec-that-doesn't-infringe-on-our-stuff attitude into practice once again, by assembling a patent pool to go after VP8. Google, in the meantime, is not impressed.
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What a Joke
by Headrush on Fri 21st May 2010 10:56 UTC
Headrush
Member since:
2006-01-03

Article after arcticle just ripping the MPEG-LA and references that it's all just FUD and all they are are patent trolls. Yet here we are the VP8 backers just doing the same thing and making just as many vague and unproven opinions and trying to pass them off as facts.

The industry support for WebM and VP8 is already quite extensive, and I don't think the companies that make up the MPEG-LA are willing to anger all those big boys. This is probably nothing more than a Microsoftian attempt to get companies to pay for a VP8/WebM license from the MPEG-LA that Google already stated quite clearly they don't need.

I especially like that. They assembled these patents but they're afraid of upsetting these companies, come on people.

If we truly want a free, open and patent free video codec for the web, we want this to go to the courts. It's the only way for sure to finally put any of these issues to bed.

We can't really on the "I don't think it's in violation", or "Google says they think it's OK", or "So and so thinks...". Isn't this the same thing we have been ripping the MPEG-LA for also?

Whether we agree with it or not the MPEG-LA does have an incredibly vast collection of video and audio patents in their pool. That is simply just an undeniable fact. The sooner we find out legally, the better for all of us.

Reply Score: 3

v RE: What a Joke
by tf123 on Fri 21st May 2010 12:00 in reply to "What a Joke"
RE[2]: What a Joke
by Thom_Holwerda on Fri 21st May 2010 12:03 in reply to "RE: What a Joke"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

He is a patent troll. Apart from his job as CEO of the MPEG-LA, he is the CEO of a patent troll company owned by the MPEG-LA. The link is right there. There is nothing "FUD" about that. It's plain old fact.

This thread proves we can have trolls about everything - even the MPEG-LA. I think we might have to shut down OSNews.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE: What a Joke
by outpost_759 on Fri 21st May 2010 13:10 in reply to "What a Joke"
outpost_759 Member since:
2010-04-23

While I expect it to happen I don't see how this matter ending up in a legal battle could be a good thing. Imagine if somehow - not likely, but heaven forbid - MPEG-LA and co. won a legal battle against the VP8 codec. Something like that could set an awful precedence that any or all free-and-open codecs to come will be found to violate MPEG-LA's patent pool. This is serious stuff; we're talking about having restrictions placed on our rights to create, send, receive and access (video) information on the Internet and/or via other mediums. How dare anyone restrict yours or my rights to freely do that!

What I can't understand is why there are seemingly no significant combined lawsuits (class action?) launched by (for example) big software, Internet-service and hardware companies against the governments that facilitate these 'crazy' software patent arrangements (no FUD, seriously search and you'll find evidence). I say this not just in the context of video codecs but for all elements of computing and information that are covered here at OSNews.

How dare anyone be allowed to propagate social inequity.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: What a Joke
by Headrush on Fri 21st May 2010 21:08 in reply to "RE: What a Joke"
Headrush Member since:
2006-01-03

I'm not suggesting I want the MPEG-LA to win, but what's to stop the MPEG-LA from threating lawsuits against companies using VP8 if they make the claim there are violations? So aren't we then in the exact same problem as with H.264?

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE: What a Joke
by l3v1 on Fri 21st May 2010 13:46 in reply to "What a Joke"
l3v1 Member since:
2005-07-06

Yet here we are the VP8 backers just doing the same thing


This is so funny, it's beyond sanity limits ;) You really don't see a difference between gathering troll power with the goal of running down the enemy, and gathering troll power to protect against being run down by the enemy? If so, then hey, why does any of this even matter to you? Maybe this is not the final best solution for open video on the web, but at least we see someone trying to do something besides the Theora community. Trying to open up a video technology and building up a patent portfolio for keeping it open is the only option the software patent environment has left open. Claiming that this is the same thing as the opponents gathering patent pools to counteract this move is not sympathetic to say the least.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[2]: What a Joke
by tf123 on Fri 21st May 2010 14:31 in reply to "RE: What a Joke"
tf123 Member since:
2010-01-28

"troll power"? is that like soul power? A troll is a troll is a troll. The enemy is what you think is the enemy, not everyone agrees with you.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[2]: What a Joke
by Headrush on Fri 21st May 2010 21:22 in reply to "RE: What a Joke"
Headrush Member since:
2006-01-03

"Yet here we are the VP8 backers just doing the same thing


This is so funny, it's beyond sanity limits ;) You really don't see a difference between gathering troll power with the goal of running down the enemy, and gathering troll power to protect against being run down by the enemy? If so, then hey, why does any of this even matter to you?
"
You're missing my point entirely. The FUD part is preaching that come 2015 the MPEG-LA could sue every user in the chain of use, yet turning around and saying VP8 is the answer. We hope so but we can't be sure.

There are claims that parts of VP8 infringe on patents held by MPEG-LA. Whether true or not I don't know but this still creates an environment of uncertainty and we still have the possiblitiy of legal action against VP8 users just like with H.264. So things are still unclear.

My comments had absolutely nothing to do with not seeing a difference and was neither for or against VP8. Some of the responses show that people get lost in the reteric and thinks its you're an Apple/H.264 fanboi or VP8 supporter and everything you say must be towards that.

IMHO if we are going to worry about what the MPEG-LA could do in 2015, we should be just as wise to find out what issues we could be in for if VP8 could be infringing on patents in MPEG-LA's pool. If there are the situation hasn't necessarily improved and "Google says its OK" isn't good enough for me. We see crazy things in those Texas courts.

Reply Parent Score: 2