Linked by vodoomoth on Fri 24th Sep 2010 22:56 UTC
Java Oracle has made some decisions about Java: in order to release JDK 7 in the middle of next year, they have decided to change priorities and specifically, postpone three features: Jigsaw, Lambda and Coin.
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RE: No thanks to Java
by kaiwai on Sat 25th Sep 2010 00:51 UTC in reply to "No thanks to Java"
kaiwai
Member since:
2005-07-06

I've tried learning Java, but the lack of properties (C# does this so awesomely), lack of lambdas, and to be frank, a lack of LINQ, makes it so I just can't stand it as a language.

C# is more like a staticly typed Python. Java is like C++ with a garbage collector.

I have to agree with this guy: http://day-to-day-stuff.blogspot.com/2007/12/demise-of-java-long-li...

Java is dieing, the JVM is still solid, but give it a few years, and Clojure, JRuby, Jython, and others will kill it off, IMO.


On the desktop it died a while ago; Apple killed off their Cocoa bindings for Java - when you consider these:

1) Objective-C 2.0 has garbage collection, and in the future that'll arrive on iOS.
2) Silverlight and .NET are the platform of choice when it comes to WP7 development in the future.
3) Multilanguage nature of Android.

The 'need' (if there ever was one) to write in Java has pretty much died. It is going to survive but I'd say as more of a niche product in the enterprise with the largest customer being Oracle itself for their own projects.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: No thanks to Java
by Tuishimi on Sat 25th Sep 2010 03:51 in reply to "RE: No thanks to Java"
Tuishimi Member since:
2005-07-06

It's still faster and more efficient for large website engines than many web development platforms. I'm not particularly fond of it, but we've been using it for 8 years now. A recent, internal project I've been assigned to uses RoR/Hobo. While I enjoy developing with Ruby/Rails, it is slow in comparison to a Java-based site (even using JRuby) because of the chatty data management model it uses.

Trade offs. But Java hasn't quite died yet.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: No thanks to Java
by kaiwai on Sat 25th Sep 2010 04:16 in reply to "RE[2]: No thanks to Java"
kaiwai Member since:
2005-07-06

It's still faster and more efficient for large website engines than many web development platforms. I'm not particularly fond of it, but we've been using it for 8 years now. A recent, internal project I've been assigned to uses RoR/Hobo. While I enjoy developing with Ruby/Rails, it is slow in comparison to a Java-based site (even using JRuby) because of the chatty data management model it uses.

Trade offs. But Java hasn't quite died yet.


But in terms of complexity how does RoR when compared to Java? The argument might hold that it is cheaper to get gruntier hardware than having to deal with the complexity of Java - that the cost of developer time is more expensive than just having a more heavy duty server. Thus the big argument is between efficiency versus throwing a bigger server at it - that something might be more efficient but if it requires specialised skills to get it to function properly then any gains are negated by the additional development costs.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[2]: No thanks to Java
by moondevil on Sun 26th Sep 2010 06:26 in reply to "RE: No thanks to Java"
moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08


On the desktop it died a while ago; Apple killed off their Cocoa bindings for Java - when you consider these:

1) Objective-C 2.0 has garbage collection, and in the future that'll arrive on iOS.
2) Silverlight and .NET are the platform of choice when it comes to WP7 development in the future.
3) Multilanguage nature of Android.

The 'need' (if there ever was one) to write in Java has pretty much died. It is going to survive but I'd say as more of a niche product in the enterprise with the largest customer being Oracle itself for their own projects.


Apple only introduced the Cocoa bindings for Java, because in the begining they were unsure the developer community would pick up Objective-C. So they were offering both languages to see which would gain momentum.

I would agree that you will hardly find any software package at the local shop developed with Java.

But on the corporate world Java is pretty much alive in the desktop.

Regarding your points

1) Outside MacOS no one cares about Objective-C
2) .Net is only a choice when targeting Microsoft systems and the sucess of the WP 7 is still uncertain
3) Not sure what multilanguage you mean. C and C++ besides Java? Anyway android is only used in mobiles.

Java is pretty much alive in the enterprise. There is no language out there good enough to replace it.

.Net is only an option if you are deploying Windows only solutions. Don't even talk about Mono to .Net guys, it is always seen as a kind of toy.

C++ has already lost its position to applications that require lots of performance out of the systems, and does not have the tool support that Java and .Net enjoy.

The only scalable, performance and multiplatform language currently available in the enterprise world is Java and it won't change in the near future.

Sure the community is not enjoying all these delays, but they aren't nothing, compared to the time C++ developers will need to wait for a 100% C++0x fully compliant compiler, across multiple platforms.

Reply Parent Score: 4