Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 21st Apr 2011 21:59 UTC, submitted by Martin
Apple There's a bit of a stink going on - even in major media - about something iOS 4's been doing. Apparently, iOS 4 has been storing a list of locations and timestamps to a hidden, but readable file in a standard database format. The locations are triangulated using cell towers, and generally aren't as accurate as for instance GPS. Still, the file is stored without any form of protection on both your iPhone as well as your desktop.
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RE[7]: why wait?
by Not2Sure on Sat 23rd Apr 2011 19:45 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: why wait?"
Not2Sure
Member since:
2009-12-07

That explain it well enough?


Nope. That explains the need to require the last known location. Not the last 100, 1000 etc, and again that would be an application use case not an OS one.

You are obviously without a clue how AGPS works on the CDMA/GSM networks. Go troll somewhere else.

Ask for a fanboi response, get one I suppose.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[8]: why wait?
by JAlexoid on Sat 23rd Apr 2011 21:35 in reply to "RE[7]: why wait?"
JAlexoid Member since:
2009-05-19

"That explain it well enough?


Nope. That explains the need to require the last known location. Not the last 100, 1000 etc, and again that would be an application use case not an OS one.

You are obviously without a clue how AGPS works on the CDMA/GSM networks. Go troll somewhere else.

Ask for a fanboi response, get one I suppose.
"

Technically, the last N entries for locations of WiFi hotspots and cell towers leads to lowered traffic to the same geolocation servers.
This lowers traffic considerably when you are stationary at a intersection of many cell towers, because you may switch from one to another every few seconds. Imagine the traffic to the geolocation servers in that scenario....

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[9]: why wait?
by Not2Sure on Sun 24th Apr 2011 06:01 in reply to "RE[8]: why wait?"
Not2Sure Member since:
2009-12-07

Can only imagine, PDE magic provided by the carriers remains such a closely guarded secret.

So at best I think you are arguing for a transient cache, which I could also see as being useful to decrease load on upstream carrier servers but that load is already guarded by access controls and I really doubt Apple/Google were responding to carrier reports of load with this "feature." I think it's pretty clear what they are doing and it is in their own best interests.

And in any case that is not what we are talking about here. For both Android and iOS we are talking about persistent, uniquely identifiable information being held and transmitted off the device. I really don't see it as justifiable.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[8]: why wait?
by galvanash on Sat 23rd Apr 2011 23:07 in reply to "RE[7]: why wait?"
galvanash Member since:
2006-01-25

Nope. That explains the need to require the last known location. Not the last 100, 1000 etc,


I NEVER said there was a need to store the last 100 or 1000, just enough to compute an approximate location (at most 5-10 towers I would think)... I'm not defending what Apple is doing (i.e. long term logging of the information) - I was simply explaining why there is a valid reason to log _some_ of it. You said you could not think of a single valid reason to keep any of this data - I gave you one.

...and again that would be an application use case not an OS one. You are obviously without a clue how AGPS works on the CDMA/GSM networks. Go troll somewhere else.


How can you say this is an application use case when applications on iOS/Android cannot access either GPS hardware or Cellular radio hardware directly (and therefore could not log raw data themselves)? The apis expose your coordinates, not those of nearby cell towers. You could not log such data even if you wanted to - there is no way to get it (without going around the OS anyway).

I was sincerely just trying to answer your question, and you go all flaming assh*le on me? I've written softare using location apis on iOS and blackberry (haven't done Android yet) and I know enough to tell you have no idea what the f*ck you are talking about...

A-GPS is NOT the same thing as cellular triangulation (which is what I am describing). A-GPS does not eliminate the need to do triangulation, it speeds up GPS locking by giving the GPS hardware information about the closest satellite and can enhance accuracy, but it still relies primarily on GPS and GPS is both slow and power hungry...

Cellular Triangulation is done by the OS using data logged from the network and the reason to do so is so that you can do it when the GPS hardware is turned off. UTDOA (Uplink Time Difference on Arrival) data is used on GSM networks to do this - it has absolutely nothing at all to do with GPS or A-GPS. The UTDOA data is what is being logged in these files everyone is talking about (at least the cellular data part).

Ask for a fanboi response, get one I suppose.


Glad I could help ;)

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[9]: why wait?
by Not2Sure on Sun 24th Apr 2011 05:55 in reply to "RE[8]: why wait?"
Not2Sure Member since:
2009-12-07

Please allow me to inform you how incorrect you are.

http://developer.android.com/reference/android/telephony/TelephonyM...

Unless of course this reference documentation is from the future! MCC+MNC+LAC is also available in iOS.

Just stop.

Reply Parent Score: 1