Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 22nd Dec 2012 16:12 UTC
Window Managers In the final years of my high school career, more concerned with going out and drinking three times a week than with actually doing anything meaningful at my supposedly posh gymnasium, I rediscovered my love for computing - a love lost during the onset of aforementioned going out and drinking. Realising I would hit university soon, I saved up 2000 guilders, ordered the parts for a brand-new computer, and thanks to this then state-of-the-art computer, old flames were rekindled. Since this pun is burning a hole in my pocket - it was an enlightening experience.
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RE[3]: Linux Mint
by rklrkl on Sun 23rd Dec 2012 13:34 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Linux Mint"
rklrkl
Member since:
2005-07-06

> If you are telling me that it's not possible to install a framework and a set of apps with an installer then you must be relatively new to computers.

Of course, it's "possible", but on Linux platforms it's highly "undesirable". This is because, unlike Windows, it actually has a common installer (rpm or dpkg) and repo system (yum or apt-get) already, so to be frank, anyone writing their own installer for Linux binaries should be taken out around the back and whipped to within an inch of their lives :-)

What devs need to do - and they often epicly fail at this - is to actually make it easier for the distro maintainers to build an RPM/.deb/whatever out of their source code. This means making sure that everything installs into the appropriate trees, including necessary package config files (e.g. .spec files for RPM) and so on.

Having said all this, it does highlight one of the majorly broken issues of package installation on Linux - there needs to be *one* binary package format and *one* repo format before this mess ever gets properly cleared up.

It would also be nice if everyone agreed the same install trees too - if all of the above happened, we might see the day where everything in Debian, Ubuntu, Fedora, CentoS/RHEL and openSuSE is completely interoperable/installable. Sadly, the chaos we're in doesn't look like sorting itself out any time soon.

It should be noted that Windows is actually worse mess - no central repo across all apps (Windows Update is MS products only, which is ludicrous) and there are literally hundreds of different installers written out there which have wildly variable behaviour.

Custom binary installers are *not* the way to go and yet Windows people seem to happy to use them. The problem with those installers is there's often no easy way to tell what or where they've installed or if they've left anything behind on uninstallation (which they often do). It's exactly why Windows PCs get into a mess as they go through installations and uninstallations of third-party software.

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[4]: Linux Mint
by FreeGamer on Mon 24th Dec 2012 02:45 in reply to "RE[3]: Linux Mint"
FreeGamer Member since:
2007-04-13

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't this the purpose of OpenSuSE's factory service? (To make it easier for developers to make the latest releases of their software available for install via yum.)

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[4]: Linux Mint
by Wafflez on Tue 25th Dec 2012 11:52 in reply to "RE[3]: Linux Mint"
Wafflez Member since:
2011-06-26

Confusing.

Select one of the myriads installers for Windows - it will work for Windows.

Select one of myriads repos (or w/e) for Linux - it will work for Linux (Debian) but not for Linux (Fedora, SuSE, Arch, Gentoo, etc).

And Linux also becomes a mess - leftover log, configuration files. Same as Windows. Doesn't work any slower, you just lose some kilobytes of space from your storage which has more than terabyte.

Central update - well duh. That isn't how Windows software works. I just cannot fathom how quality software could be upgraded via free of charge to newest version. When Ubuntu will be able to upgrade my Photoshop, Visual Studio, Sony Vegas or w/e via apt-get upgrade, then this "central" thingy argument might work. Right now - woo new updates for some random libraries that a non factor programs uses and I don't get any new features/performance. Woo exciting indeed.

How Windows is a mess again?

Edited 2012-12-25 11:57 UTC

Reply Parent Score: -1

RE[5]: Linux Mint
by Soulbender on Wed 26th Dec 2012 05:46 in reply to "RE[4]: Linux Mint"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

When Ubuntu will be able to upgrade my Photoshop, Visual Studio, Sony Vegas or w/e via apt-get upgrade, then this "central" thingy argument might work.


Except none of those even run on Linux in the first place so why would the upgrade work? Logic, you fail it.
That's like complaining that Windows can't update my Linux e17 installation.

Reply Parent Score: 2