Despite publicly saying that the top-line 17″ PowerBook would be available in February, Apple executives privately told dealers in a meeting at Macworld Expo on January 8 not to expect the product until mid-March, if not later into April — Apple’s fiscal third-quarter. Customers only in the last 10 days are now being told the same information. In an official press release dated January 7, Apple clearly states, “The new 17-inch PowerBook G4 is expected to be available in February…” This is a blow to many customers who have ordered the 17″ model 1,5 moths ago already, because the 17″ is intended mostly as a desktop replacement, so it is kind of urgent for most customers to have it on time.
ThinkSecret: Apple Knew New 17″ PBs to be Months Late in January
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
As I said in my “how to help Apple gain marketshare” posting, my number one item was:
Stop lying.
I’m surprised no one has mentioned the ATI Radeon 9700 which Apple has said will be “available soon” … for quite some time now.
You’ve got to hand it to those dimwits at Apple who designed that wonderful proprietary video connector… that combines a sensitive digital signal with a powerline.
–ms
Sounds like Apple is learning from Dell–once you have the customers money there’s a better chance they will wait than if you tell them to wait three months until you actually have a the product in stock THEN order it.
I waited about 2 or 3 months for my Inspiron from Dell without so much as an email saying it was going to take just a little longer than 7 to 10 days.
the estimated ship date of my 17″ says 4/1 on apples site. The other items have mostly shipped and the estimated dates have been dead on… I ordered it late january and just checked the ship date. still 4/1.
*shrug* i’d be pissed if the date went from 2/31 to 4/1 but they seemed honest on their site from the get go.
Actually, Micahel, do a little research. IBM owns the patent on the Apple Display Connector – power, USB, and video. And hey, it’s not like it’s analog video – you’ve been transmitting power and video on the same cords for quite some time. USB, firewire, etc. Gee. Don’t spout drivel.
Ben, when did you order yours?
Surprised anyone? I’m not.
Let’s just assume IBM owns the patent on ADC. By the way, in case you didn’t know, according to Apple, ADC stands for “Apple Display Connector”.
And in case you didn’t check your cables too closely, do you know who uses the ADC connector on their video cards and monitors? Let me give you a hint: It’s not IBM.
My oh my, it’s actually Apple using the Apple Display Connector!
IBM isn’t so stupid as to take the years of work that went into DVI and cobble it together with a powerline. IBM sells DVI digital LCD displays, not Apple Display Connector.
I didn’t know there was a sensitive digital video signal on my ANALOG video cable. And I still have yet to see an analog monitor that doesn’t have a power cable and runs solely off a VGA port.
And I didn’t know USB could do video? Really, I can plug my monitor into my USB cable? And Firewire too? Apple sure makes it easy. Use any damn interface and cable you want… alas… only in Mac-head dream world.
Oh if you want to use your fancy ADC monitor with a DVI video card, Apple will sell you their nifty $99 adapter… which has to digitally regenerate the DVI signal in order for it to work.
If Apple had just gone with DVI like they did before switching to ADC, they wouldn’t need to sell these fancy devices. And ATI and Nvidia wouldn’t need to take lots of time to create special video cards for Apple that utilize Apple’s proprietary ADC connection.
One thing we know for sure, Mac-heads don’t have a clue when it comes to hardware.
The biggest pack of liars in the computer industry. I mean, Microsoft is pretty bad with the privacy and cutting/killing the competition stuff they do, but Apple truly takes the cake with being underhanded, backstabbing, lying corporate criminals who just so happen to produce some pretty nice stuff.
I will say it again, just because they hide behind a multi-million dollar ad campaign that convinces the faithful that using a Macintosh will somehow make you as radical as Picasso or the Dalai Lama. Truth be told, Apple is a Asia explioting, freedom destroying, vendor lock in creating billion dollar corporate monster, who lies *more* than the average.
They dont call it Steves “reality distortion field” for nothing.
I think people have a right to be mad on this one. Personally, I think you should NOT annouce a product until it is shipping. Whats the point of saying you have a product intro for sale and no one can get it for a few months down the road? Makes me have flashbacks when they got shafted by motorola and have to bump the line back because they didn’t have enough supplies of 500MHz G4s.
And ATI is the blame on the ATI 9700. What is worse is they annouced the ATI Radeon 9000 Mac Edition almost a year ago. Then it was annouced at Macworld as shipping and I have YET to see one in the stores yet. So it seems a few companies have this problem of pre-announce before we have a product syndrome. LOL
“I waited about 2 or 3 months for my Inspiron from Dell without so much as an email saying it was going to take just a little longer than 7 to 10 days.”
bullshit. by law, dell is required to contact you (and does contact you) if the order will take longer than 30 days. if no contact is made, your order is cancelled out of the system. i worked for dell customer service for well over a year and this held true the entire time.
I waited about 2 or 3 months for my Inspiron from Dell without so much as an email saying it was going to take just a little longer than 7 to 10 days.
I had a friend experience the exact same thing. Dell lost his order, then claimed they didn’t get his check, and after receiving his check decided to stall for another month afterwards.
Of course, that doesn’t stop me from ordering Dell. I bought an LCD from them and recently bought a Dimension 4550 desktop. For the most part they’re a good company.
The said could be said for Apple. Every company has its good points and bad points. Focusing solely on the negative points is an indication of your hatred for that particular company/product/whatever.
Erik writes: Actually, Micahel, do a little research. IBM owns the patent on the Apple Display Connector
Michael writes: Let’s just assume IBM owns the patent on ADC. By the way, in case you didn’t know, according to Apple, ADC stands for “Apple Display Connector”.
I thinks it’s fairly obvious he knew that, considering it was in his first post… the one that came before yours.
I didn’t know there was a sensitive digital video signal on my ANALOG video cable.
I’m not sure what you’re saying specifically, but looking at a studio display it’s fairly clear (no pun intended) that it’s a non-issue. The RF noise from the power cable does not cause enough interference to disrupt the digital signal.
And I still have yet to see an analog monitor that doesn’t have a power cable and runs solely off a VGA port.
KDS LCDs embed the power cable in the same one as the video signal. Since the incoming signal is analog, this isn’t exactly a good idea.
And I didn’t know USB could do video? Really, I can plug my monitor into my USB cable? And Firewire too? Apple sure makes it easy. Use any damn interface and cable you want… alas… only in Mac-head dream world.
Have you ever seen a Studio Display? Or a high end monitor in general? Sun embeds a USB hub into their displays, including their LCDs. It’s expected that this is what you use to attach the keyboard and mouse.
Oh if you want to use your fancy ADC monitor with a DVI video card, Apple will sell you their nifty $99 adapter… which has to digitally regenerate the DVI signal in order for it to work.
Why would you be doing this? Apple realizes there are instances where this might be useful (attacing a Studio Display to a PowerBook) but it’s clear they would prefer you purchase a high end PowerMac to use with your Studio Display.
If Apple had just gone with DVI like they did before switching to ADC, they wouldn’t need to sell these fancy devices.
As I understand it, Apple released ADC displays before the standards for DVI were finalized. They’ve just stuck with it for the sake of intercompatibility.
And ATI and Nvidia wouldn’t need to take lots of time to create special video cards for Apple that utilize Apple’s proprietary ADC connection.
What’s your point? Apple is wasting ATI and Nvidia’s time? Does this affect you somehow?
One thing we know for sure, Mac-heads don’t have a clue when it comes to hardware.
Do you get a kick out of insulting random people?
Honestly, what are you arguing? ADC does not negatively affect video quality. The only time ADC/DVI would be an issue are if you’ve purchased a Studio Display and you wish to use it with a PowerBook or a non-Apple product.
Are you considering purchasing a Studio Display, or are you doing a bunch of theoretical whining about issues which don’t actually affect you?
Every big, profit-making company fudges the truth sometimes. EVERY SINGLE ONE.
So they are supposed to “never tell a lie” like some kind of boy scount, while meantime having to deal with the Microsofts’ and Dells of the world and Wall Street analysts of the world. Oh sure, right.
Jay, just checked, it got ordered on 1/17
So you mean to tell us that DELL would actually hire someone named “Piglet3000”?
I think NOT!
I helped start Dell, and we had a *strict* policy against hiring those with funny names.
is deserved. What a boneheaded thing to do.
– Mark
“And ATI and Nvidia wouldn’t need to take lots of time to create special video cards for Apple that utilize Apple’s proprietary ADC connection.”
What makes you think the ADC is the only thing that affects ATi’s ability to develop drivers for the Mac. Why aren’t you whining that if MS didn’t invent proprietary DX, GPU makers and game developers could focus on OpenGL and making porting and development of drivers much simpler. Instead the whole graphics world is fractured because MS wants to focus on games rather than industry standards.
“Apple == The biggest pack of liars in the computer industry.” How can that be when MS has been promising .Net Server for over a year and a half, they promised Entourage would be Exchange compatible six months in advance with no answer for how deep compatibility goes, etc…
“So you mean to tell us that DELL would actually hire someone named “Piglet3000″?
I think NOT!
I helped start Dell, and we had a *strict* policy against hiring those with funny names.”
yeah, like that is my real name. i worked at dell for over a year in the customer service division for home sales. dell outsources their customer service to many companies around the country to save on support cost. dell uses a called logging system called dps and there is an overlay for the system called dellserv. everything is run according based on performance metrics and not a rep’s ability to actually help a customer. in the logging system system dell uses, returns are referenced to as CRAs, exchangeas are EXG, refusals are REF, when money is given away the code is MCR. dell uses training done in poorly made power point presentations and put everything up on a page called livewire. i could go on like this for a while…
The trend on this site is to repeat nick de plumes (nice name eh?–get it wink, wink) speculations from think secret.
I would like to see this site also start posting HP’s latest gaffes, and Dell’s customer complaints to balance it out.
“i could go on like this for a while..”
You must be giving that Goole(tm) cluster a *real* work-out.
Is there any way that one could use an Apple display on PC’s or is there a way to use connect regular ‘PC’ monitors to a powerbook ?
I want to use a single monitor to connect to both an x86 laptop with secondary display capabilities and a powerbook with the monitor as a secondary display.
I don’t know much about this ADC and you guys seem to be very intimate with it.
You can BackGammon, but you need a DVI to ADC converter such as this one here.
http://drbott.com/prod/db.lasso?code=0111-DVAD
that apple would deliver a few powerbooks to drooling macheads a few weeks late
OR
that Windows 3.1 was as good as the Macd OS of the time?
OR
Windows Movie Maker 2 is better than iMovie 3?
OR
Palladium is really “just a way to protect you from viruses”
“I helped start Dell, and we had a *strict* policy against hiring those with funny names.”
Lol, this coming from someone who uses the name hahahaApple.
The ones that, of course, did not order one.
My guess is itsanother chance to bash Apple.
So predictable..
Apple came out with ADC *after* they were already shipping DVI monitors. There was no need at all to create a proprietary standard.
There are many obviously fake reasons for ADC. It exists to make sure Apple sells Apple monitors with Apple computers. Oh ostensibly because it saves a cable. Right.
To date, no other company is combining DVI + powerline.
For the analog monitors that support a USB hub, they take a USB cable for the USB hub. They don’t run USB on the analog video cable. Sheesh.
For example, Mitsubishi’s analog monitor the 2060u:
Signal Cable
1.8M (approx.) D-sub15 to D-sub15 cable
USB (Universal Serial Bus)
USB-ready self-powered USB hub,
3 downstream ports, 1 upstream port
(the upstream port takes a USB cable)
The idea is not to insult random people, but to reply in the same language that’s being spoken.
Ben, so you ordered on 1/17 and, right from the start, they gave 4/1 as the delivery date? Thanks!
No one cares that you hate Apple except you.
Dont like the products,dont buy em.
Spending time posting your disdain says alot.
This is what I’m talking about. The cover-your-ears and chant “na na na na” culture of Apple and Mac-heads… “we don’t listen to people who don’t love and adore the precious.”
I don’t hate Apple. Don’t try to turn what I’m saying into anything about hatred.
However, do try and actually listen. If you have objective facts about ADC put them on the table. That’s what I’ve done with everything I know about this proprietary Apple video connector.
The Mac-Heads have put a whole bunch of disinformation about ADC on the table and then finally turned to saying that I hate Apple.
Trying to discuss anything about Apple with a Mac-head is futile. If anything, that’s what I should get a clue about. Apple is a cult of low self-esteem fanatics with money to burn. These are not people to have a discussion with, you are right. Point taken.
yep, that is all correct
—“Objective facts”—-“There are many obviously fake reasons for ADC.”
“Don’t try to turn what I’m saying into anything about hatred. ….
Trying to discuss anything about Apple with a Mac-head is futile. If anything, that’s what I should get a clue about. Apple is a cult of low self-esteem fanatics with money to burn.”
Hatred, maybe not….but there sure is something going on in that brain of yours that sure ain’t objective
Well, it appears Apple quietly broke the news to those who ordered pretty quickly. There’s this controversy about Apple and the MacWorld conventions. Some say Jobs doesn’t like to be somewhat beholden to those two yearly events. He would like to do some of that at Apple Stores, etc. Perhaps he would have preferred to announce the PowerBooks closer to when they were/are ready. I don’t know, but it’s possible this is what he doesn’t like about MacWorld.
You mean to tell me that a computer company slipped a release date by (gasp) over a month?
First off, this article comes from a rumor site. Not just that, but a site that has a questionable history of accuracy. My favorite: http://www.thinksecret.com/news/mwsf03apple.html
0% – POWERBOOK/iBOOK RE-VAMP/SPEED BUMPS
Too soon. 1 GHz G3 processor in iBooks coming later.
Interesting. So, they bet everything on having no new PowerBooks at MacWorld. Instead there are TWO new models. Now *they’re* the ones saying that one was planned ahead to be delayed. VERY interesting.
Futhermore…John Brandon, specifically told those in attendance, “I realistically wouldn’t expect 17″ (PowerBook) units in your hands until mid-March at the very earliest.”
Retail dealers always get stuff in stock AFTER Apple has been able to fulfill the pre-orders on their web site.
Now, I’m not blindly defending Apple here. My Mac’s GeForce4 was about 6 weeks delayed, although I’m not convinced that wasn’t my dealers fault. A friend of mine has a 17″ on order and we just talked about how much of a bummer this will be today, as he absolutely needs it in two weeks or he won’t be able to get at it for another month. However, I feel that there is no reason to suspect this is anything other than an innocent supply issue. Intel, AMD, ATI, nVidia, and even everyone’s friend Microsoft is having similar issues. It sucks, but that doesn’t necessarily mean there was ill intent.
“You must be giving that Goole(tm) cluster a *real* work-out.”
try again. i worked for a company called microdyne (a part of l3) in augusta maine. they are currently moving operations to orono maine. microdyne handles a large percentage of dell’s customer service calls.
Hello,
I thought I would way in of this. I “think” the reason this
card is so late. (at leaset 4 months now) is the following
two reasons.
1.) Apple droped ATI to go with nvidia therfore all
development support dried up.
2.) ATI may be waiting for Open GL 2.0. They had to wait
for direct X 9.0 to ship and since Mac’s only use GL..
on the issue of the ADC. Lets face it DVI better choice. For
those who want an DVI connector buy the PC card and perform
an bios flash on it. Then it will be an Mac card.
Toodles
Leslie D.
Apple users are the whinniest bunch of losers I have ever seen. If you have so much trouble with Apple please do them a favor and buy your PC and move on.
“dell outsources their customer service to many companies around the country to save on support cost. dell uses a called logging system called dps and there is an overlay for the system called dellserv. everything is run according based on performance metrics and not a rep’s ability to actually help a customer. in the logging system system dell uses, returns are referenced to as CRAs, exchangeas are EXG, refusals are REF, when money is given away the code is MCR. dell uses training done in poorly made power point presentations and put everything up on a page called livewire. i could go on like this for a while…”
Way to go on releasing all that proprietary information. I’m sure it doesn’t violate the NDA you signed, or anything. The NDA? You know, that legally binding agreement that states you agree not to talk about information like that? Way to go.
There are many obviously fake reasons for ADC. It exists to make sure Apple sells Apple monitors with Apple computers. Oh ostensibly because it saves a cable. Right.
To date, no other company is combining DVI + powerline.
For the analog monitors that support a USB hub, they take a USB cable for the USB hub. They don’t run USB on the analog video cable. Sheesh.
Michael…
If you don’t understand the purpose of ADC, you don’t understand where Apple is coming from.
Apple is marketing simplicity. Simplicity of setup.
Perhaps you remember the advertizements?
http://www.apple.com/switch/whyswitch/
“Take a Mac out of its box, and you experience that hand-and-glove fit from the get-go. Plug it in. Turn it on.”
And it just works.
Part of Apple’s angle is that PCs are a big cordy nightmare.
ADC eliminates cords, and increases the ease of setup.
What’s the drawback? The intercompatibility issue you’re describing, but Apple isn’t exactly one to favor intercopatibility over ease of setup/use.
And I still have a hard time believing these issues actually affect you. I think you’re just trolling…
I wonder if the SEC (Securities Exchange Commission) got wind of this as some investors could have been misled on weather to sell or buy shares of Apple. I only wonder about this because Apple stock usually climbs a little during new hardware announcements.
Just a thought….
apple stock actually usually drops at macworld’s, even when they introduce new things, i believe it dropped when they announced the lcd imac.
Yes, I understand the Apple rationale of why ADC exists.
However, I don’t think that connecting cables has been the big issue for computer buyers. It is more Apple marketing, taking a non-issue and convincing people it is some real problem.
If Apple focuses only on those users who cannot connect more than one cable from their computer to their monitor, that makes for a very small target market.
And if Apple charges a premium for this part of the Apple experience, they are further reducing the size of their target market.
One might also argue that ADC works against Apple in the bigger picture. Many people don’t want wide aspect ratio displays. They’d rather have the vertical pixels as that is how most programs and games work best. So by making it more complicated to use a normal monitor with a Mac, Apple is reducing their market even more.
Furthermore, by going with ADC Apple takes a giant time-to-market hit. And it reduces Apple’s flexibility in the market, as every display they offer needs more engineering and testing to get to market.
And yes, you are right. These issues do not have any effect on me. Nor does the outrageous cost of a Mac, the one button mouse, the lack of non-Apple software, etc.
In the larger scheme of things, though, if Apple wants to grow their marketshare, as Fred Anderson says they do, all these things add up. And thus are legitimate topics of discussion.
I think Apple uses ADC because having fewer cables is one of Job’s obsessions. NeXT black hardware had the same kind of set up. That and, of course, it lends itself to people buying Apple displays.
“However, I don’t think that connecting cables has been the big issue for computer buyers. It is more Apple marketing, taking a non-issue and convincing people it is some real problem.”
It is an issue when you also have a mouse and keyboard cable to connect, power cable for the monitor and base unit plus the cable that plugs into the base unit, network cable, modem cable, sound cable and the power for the speakers.
My laptop was nearly as bad as well.
I’m looking for a system from apple and the LACK of cables is a selling point. I’m thinking of buying one of their laptops and then also a flat screen monitor so i have what i have now but with a smaller footprint keeping to a minimum.
So it is a real problem imo when a person wants something easy and simple to use offering least fuss. So many times have i (and probably others) needed to move my computers around and unplugging from a spagetti junction is a pain in the arse, I WANT TO PICK THE COMPUTER UP not 500 feet of cabling (i have 3 pcs and a laptop btw with a small network hub times this issue by 3).
I cannot wait for less cables and wireless net access… money talks and apples listening…
On the point of the ADC and DVI… to me its a non issue if i can buy an adapter. MS file formats annoy me more.
With an adapter apple is offering their ADC solution but also still supporting DVI/VGA…non issue, its not as though they have dropped it.
If I have a computer with 10 cables, saving one or two cables with ADC is not a big deal. I still have all those other cables to deal with.
One thing also with having separate cables, you get a lot of flexibility. I can unplug my USB without unplugging my monitor.
And I know what you are saying about the cable mess. I’ve got a monster of a tangle lurking behind my array of computers that is for sure.
The best thing that I’ve done for my laptop was to add WiFi to it. That totally changed the experience of using the laptop. However, I still need the 100BaseT for copying lots of files. Maybe this will change with the faster WLANs that are coming out these days.
Perhaps a better solution for cable clutter on the desktop is wireless keyboards and mice, not proprietary video connectors.
To suggest that the ADC is the most problematic or worthy area of discussion is simply ridiculous.
You seem to think everyone thinks as you do as well. Some of us love the ADC (I do), some of us do see a good reason for it…
Even when you are off on another topic, you make NO sense:
” I can unplug my USB without unplugging my monitor.” So can I–I don’t get this at all.
“Perhaps a better solution for cable clutter on the desktop is wireless keyboards and mice, not proprietary video connectors.” Got that too–don’t know how the two relate. Is their a PC manufacturer shipping bluetooth on the majority of the computer line? No–so why aren’t you whining about them.
Anyone, we all know you are trolling. I would just like to sincerely request you pick something more compelling to gripe about.
On that point…isn’t it a mac computer that can be controlled by a third party device for watchin DVD’s from a mobile phone?
Now just extend that across Apples whole line for keyboards and mice before it happens mainstream and not let MS take all the glory with their keyboard and mouse.
Maybe
On a Mac if you unplug your monitor, your USB for keyboard and mouse will not work, presuming you are using ADC to run USB from your computer to your monitor and have plugged keyboard/mouse into the monitor.
I’m not saying this is the #1 issue, as I’ve posted a number of times. It’s not even relevant to me.
However, as Apple wants to increase market share (even if Mac-heads don’t seem to want this), then moving away from proprietary standards that slow down growth is probably a good idea.
Logitech has been shipping wireless keyboard/mouse combos for many YEARS on the PC. Wireless mice are increasingly common for the PC. Wireless doesn’t have to be “Bluetooth” for it to exist.
http://www.logitech.com/index.cfm?page=products/details&contentid=5…
My apologies for belaboring a point that I feel is important. In this little venture into ADC-land, I’ve found many Mac-heads to be so ignorant of anything that is not 100% Apple that it is pointless to even bring up anything that requires critical thinking skills or broad knowledge of computers.
Late March/April? I’ve seen a PowerBook 17″ in a computer store today here in Italy, its price was 2699 € if I remember.
It would be a first for Apple to ship computers to Europe earlier than the US.
We’re still stuck with the same “4-6 weeks” that the store has shown for the past month.
so, maybe i’m missing the point, but why would i want to plug my keyboard and/or mouse into my monitor and then expect to use them after the monitor is disconnected from the box? it becomes null and void because the two, or any other peripheral that is nice to be able to see what is going on in the computer, for that matter, becomes useless. but for the sake of argument/devil’s advocacy. . .yes, i can connect my keyboard to my monitor so and depending on the length of my cord, i might even do that. . .but not if i’m unplugging my monitor. if you hadn’t read up yet, all desktop macs now shipping have at least 2 USB ports on the case itself, all else is just details for ease of access. (ie it is not always convenient to get to the back of your computer, so 2 on the keyboard and 2 on the monitor.)if you are one of the people who have a portable drive (USB), pda, camera and a digital tablet, that _attention to detail_would be appreciated (i am not one of those people by the way)
who says “Mac-heads” do not want apple to increase market share? if someone goes by “mac-head” then i’m guessing that they probably _want_ people to switch away from the “Dark Side” (as winxx.xx is lovingly known as) to save them from pain and agony so they can enjoy using a computer rather than an expensive, and generally ugly, paper weight. (yeah, i’m only slightly biased <grin>. . .but at least i know and admit it and listen with open mind to others opinions even if i don’t agree.) perhaps i would use it if i felt comfortable with and not constrained by the os, but neither of those happens to be true, so i will go on using a computer! smile
as far as being a part of the apple cult. . .you bet i am! but you would also be part of the same one if you strongly liked apple, as you seem to have issues with the company, you would belong to the anti-apple cult. the linux people belong to their own cult and if you are religious, or anti-religion, that is your cult. to each his/her own and strong support of one’s own cult.
nick
ps for those who wonder about that last part, cult is just a group of people who believe in the same thing and are enthusiastic about it. if you think it bad, check out the _oc_cult.
I bought a 17″ pb for college, I want to set it up and do some developing this spring/summer, but I have to wait another month. I didn’t order as early as ben, but 2/10 will still make me wait awhile…