“I’m tired of reading on an almost monthly basis articles asserting that Linux isn’t yet ready for the desktop. Nonsense! Linux is about as ready for the desktop as Windows is. It’s simply a matter of corporate and user inertia that’s keeping Linux marginalized.” Read the editorial at NewsForge.
Linux not Ready for the Desktop? Give me a Break!
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
Why i have to pass through 4 or 5 menus to burn a iso in xcdroast?
You don’t have to.
1. Insert a blank cd
2. Open up Nautilus(file manager ie Home)
3. Go=>CD Creator
4. drag and drop your iso into the window
5. press the “write to cd” button on the toolbar
your done.
People don’t like to work with vi, emac, or pico
Here is what you do
1. open terminal
2. su
3. password
4. type: gedit /etc/rc.d/rc.local or just gedit
you get a nice looking GUI editor
5. make changes
6. push the “save” button.
7. close the application
your done, no more vi commands to remember.
only distro that does it in a clean way is Mandrake.urpmi looks easier than apt-get, at least in its GUI incarnation).
The a GUI for apt-get
1. open terminal and log into root
2. type: rpm -Uvh apt-getXXXXXX.rpm
3. type: apt-get update
4. type: apt-get install synaptic
5. type: synaptic (also in start-menu => system setting => synaptic)
you get a nice looking GUI for apt-get
6. select the application you want to install
7. click on “install” button on the bottom
8. click on “proceed” button on toolbar
your done, all your dependencies are meet automatically.
there is also distro update button and upgrade all button so you can update all your applications.
How about accessing Windows share
1. open terminal
2. type: su and then password
3. type: apt-get install samba-client
4. Open Nautilus
5. type on location bar: smb\user:password@servername sharefolder
Your done.
Thousand more, what if i told you u can autologin with username and password.
how about autologin plus auto application launching at startup
I realized something yesterday. Most people who bash Linux do so because they don’t understand. They come from a Windows world where they were the go to guy; gurus that helped newbies. They are highly pissed off at Linux users who aren’t any better than them technically, ranting and calling them noobies. And when Linux users says, “look Linux is so easy.” You can tell they lose their mables.
Unless you can from a UNIX background, Linux is very difficult in the beginning. Stick with Linux for 2 years with minimal reboot into Windows. If you can’t do that, then don’t even install it because it’s not for you.
PS, if you use Linux like Eugenia, you will never be happy with Linux. Don’t even try or you’ll be bitching like Eugenia about every little silly details:)
“Let’s face it, the average user is a moron …”
Matthew, Mate, have you ever caught a plane? Do you drive a car? …. has any pilot called you a moron? Or are you a moron just because you can’t fix your car yourself? What about cutting hair or build a house? Are you able to do it as well as any trades person? Perhaps you are a lawyer, physicist, engineer, builder, surgeon …. so i dare call you a moron since you are an expert in ALL trades and professions.
have fun
moron
I just came to a realization. There is no way in hell Linux is ever *leaving* my desktop. When I moved to a laptop, I started to realize that a 15″ screen had nowhere near the amount of real estate of my previous 19″-er. So I decided to go on a jihad against extra pixels. The ultra-powerful customization possibilities in KDE have allowed me to reach streamlined nirvana. The tweeks:
1) Toolbars customized to have only essential icons.
2) Extranous toolbars removed entirely.
3) Status bars hidden in every app that will let me.
4) Auto-hide panels (all three of them
5) Auto-hide menubar (think OS-9 uni-menu, but auto-hidden).
All these tweeks together have bought me about a good 30% extra screen space. Most of these tweeks just aren’t as possible in Windows, because Windows doesn’t have a unified toolbar customization mechanism that all apps use (like KDE does). The last one, something I’ve never seen any other OS do, and I was absolutely floored when I saw the patches on the kde mailing lists.
So Microsoft: The question of the day is: Is you’re little Windows ready for *my* desktop?
Adi Wibowo, Xavier is right. Do you understand what “corporate desktop” means? I think you don’t. Yes, in the businesses (“corporations”) they do run MS Office, VB etc.
Yes, I am affraid I understand.
You are talking about microsoft corporate desktop environment.
I hope write it clear, because english is not my main language.
At “my corporate”, we don’t use MS Office, VB or Delphi. So we are not corporate enough? Or may be there could be one kind of “corporate desktop”?
I have to agree, lose the command line or at least hide it or make it so that you never have to use it again and standarize on install and uninstall format, point and click install and then talk to me about being ready for the desktop.
Yes, I agree with you, especially with install and uninstall thingy.
Most of the people using computers are using them as employess of corporations and organitzations/institutions. Some fraction of these people also have computers at home. Another group exists which can be described as computer enthusiasts. Yet another group exists and this consists of self-employed persons who use computers to earn their livelihood. There are many other groups-and there is a lot of overlapping between the above listed groups.
Each of these groups use computers differently, for different tasks and have different criteria by which to judge whether this or that particular OS is best suited for there needs.
If a corporartion or organizational entity(ie. institutions etc.) choose to switch to linux their employees will have no choice but to use it- employees have never had any say, whatsoever, in what they use for performing their paid-for work, which in most cases is work for their empolyer. The overwhelming majority of corporations and organizations can use one or more of the linux distro’s in their current incarnation- for linux does perform well in most of the day-to-day uses for which office PC’s are used(word processing/email/financial analysis etc.)
Companies which need specialized software for specialized products and specialized services are dependent upon the available software and hardware which the market dictates. Autocad is such an example, as is Maya and Adobe products. Where such specialized software is needed linux in its current incarnation is not yet ready.
For self-employed computer users their needs are even more tightly dictated by the availability of certain software and hardware which the market dictates. Self-employed computer users who use computers to earn their living are not interested in whether or not this or that linux app is almost as good as windows app-their livelihood is dependent upon their productivity and they must carefully assess which software and which hardware to use, which dictates which OS will be used, because they have to finance this themselves and this economic decision is itself the basis of their finances.
Computer enthusiasts can and do use a plethora of differing OS’s. For them thequestion of whether or not linux is ready is a moot question- ready for what, for me, for what I do, for what I enjoy ?
The economics of open-source are profound. If our government agencies and institutions were using linux for their day to day work we would have more money available for programs,research,stipendiums,projects etc. and/or less taxes. If corporations were to switch to linux more money could be used in R&D and/or more and better customer support or the products and services we buy would become less expensive and/or the workers could earn more money.
Self-employed computer users who use computers to earn their living want people to pay them for their computer work and as such tend not value anything “free”-as such represents a direct or inderect threat to their own ability to legitimately earn money for their services. Although there are some members of this group who profit from open-source,ie. in the rare case where suffcient quality specialized software tailored to the needs of a niche market exist, freely, by and large this group tends to be anti-open-source and anti-linux.
Computer enthusiasts can profit from open-source in that they have more money available for better and/or more hardware when they have to spend less money on software, although the vast majority of these users are accustomed to using pirated software, and as a result thereof, are not likely to see the real advantage of linux and opeen-sources software, because there version of Corel 10, or Word, or Photoshop was also *free*. For such users the OS of choice is the Os which comes with the most *free* software, and that is of course windows and to a lesser extent apple.
There is also a group of people known as computer proffesionals. These people tend to also be members of one or more of the above listed group. The tend to have an interest in maintaining the status quo because otherwise their skills are no longer marketable. Their OS preferences tend to be defined by their skills. They tend to be threatened by talk about replacing windows machines with linux machines and “switching” from windows to linux. They know this means they can be “replaced” and that the company will simply “switch” employees and/or contractors leaving them economically unviable. The economic uncertainty of the times as regards the IT sector and it’s radical devalutation as experienced in the last 5 years, leaves many of these people, not unlike the self-employed computer users who use computers to earn their livelihood, in a position of great insecurity which tends produce outright reactionariansim and general fear of change.
Open source advocates have nothing against making money with computers or computers being used to make money-but not with the operating system and/or application software- and this is where member of these groups make their money-as such diametrically opposed interests- or a conflict of self-interests. ut open-source enthusiasts really enjoy what they do and do not want make their oppurtunity to work with computer dependent upon the economic value of such work- in fact true open source enthusiast do not view what their doing as “work”, because they want to do such whether or not someone is paying them.
For all but those for whom open-source represents a direct economic threat, Linux is ready for the desktop.
and for these people linxu will hopefully never,ever, be ready
>We will just be ants in the desert if we were without balls to speak up.
And you ask -other people- to tell you what they’re talking about? Do your balls talk to you, Eugenia?
Broken english jokes aside (though there are so, so very many), there’s nothing controversial about OSNews. That’d be like saying two kids on a playground calling each other “snothead” is controversial..it’s not the same thing. OSNews is a childish, unprofessional site with incompetent contributors. _Especially_ you, Eugenia. You don’t even try to hide it. You get the flame-fest started, you mod down the people you -really- don’t want to hear, and to the rest of them you just spew out the shitty comments and insults, making sure to warn them not to take it “personally” that you just called them an idiot, or told them their operating system of choice sucks.
OSNews is about as controversial and important as a carnival side show. Everyone comes to look at the freaks, but no one really cares what happens to them when they go home.
AntiEugenia what a troll.
Don’t read the site then you snothead. :->
Also, your post is really ironic and silly looking right after the detailed and well thought out post from Infwis above. BTW, I do not agree with everything he says because my company uses a lot of open source software to create our own proprietary software and profit doing it. Not only that but we just paid the maintainer of a rather common project a consulting fee for improvement we wanted in the code as a configure option so we support the community as well.
However, your point looks so very hollow in that context.
There are many discussion that turn into stupid my OS has a bigger tool than yours discussion but the jewels are worth it.
Only trying Linux is far more than sufficient to be sure that …[it]… is everything _but_ ready for desktop…
I don’t think you realize the stupidity of that statement
Please stop posting such comments here.
Your doing yourself no favours and are not in any way swerving people over to your oppinions, in fact quite the opposite.
Excuse my bad english …
The biggest problem with linux is that there are a strong and well-disseminated Windows presence and the natural inertia of people and software makers.
If there was no Windows or if Windows piracy was erradicated completely AND if there was sufficient offer of professional programs, people would use linux in desktop without many problems.
If you have more than 30 yars old, you used Apple II, Sinclair, TRS-80, MSX and many CLI-based computers. Secretaries used Wordstar and companies used Visicalc. The same people used MS-DOS and then Win3.1 and Win9x, even with all the problems associated with them.
But:
1) People are lazzy and they don’t like to move your butts to learn new things if there are no advantage. Windows is already disseminated and use by home users because it come pre-installed with your computer or a “friend” installed a pirated copy on it. These people will use linux only if they are forced to pay the real price of this “wonderfull world of Windows” by some mean. May people use a legitimate copy of Windows, but they use a pirated copy of M$ Office, Corel Draw, AutoCAD, etc and they never registrate your sharewares like Winzip, etc. Windows doesnt’t even include a single programming language !
Home users are not paying the real price of this “worderfull world of Windows”. The problem is that these people are addicted with these pratices and want to force their employers to do the same (but paying for all licenses).
We see these problem in third world. Companies of these countries are desesperated with anti-piracy campaigns and they are migrating to linux and free softwares for basic desktops (for browsing, email, typing documents).
This is the reason why M$ difficult piracy by activations and with BSA and it “gives” “leaked” corporate licenses of Win2003 for addict people. M$ incetivate piracy for home users ! And this fact is the main obstacle to the popularization of Linux.
2) Software makers are not making linux ports of their softwares. The only exceptions are scientific and high-end softwares, like Matlab, Oracle, Maya, Kylix, Maple, etc. Everyoune that already used Matlab or Maya on linux knows that are no important differences of the windows versions.
If Corel, Adobe, Autodesk and other popular software houses do native linux ports of their softwares we would not see statements like “linux is not ready for desktop”. KDE and Gnome have now all the necessary features for “mouse” users. You can have cut, copy and paste files with mouse without use any CLI shell.
The conclusion: there are no techical reasons to not use linux on desktop. The real reasons are piracy of home users and lack off offer of the professional proprietary softwares.
the articel never said that linux is redy for the desktop if you are a homeuser. but that linux is redy for the coporate desktop. you never have to se the commandline if you are a desktop user and coporations have techis that handel hardware issues and sutch. so if you have a thech that fixes all the settings and so on you never have to fiddel
everyone knows aol sucks, and that only morons use it.
it’s the same with windows, it’s an idiots’ os.
linux is ready for the desktop… if you have 2 brain cells to rub together, that is.
I fully agree with your analysis of the installer issue.
Haven’t seen any Windows installer as convenient as apt.
Installing one package on Windows is ok, installing more in a row is inconvenient.
Although I have to admit that my Windows knowledge ends at Windows2000, so perhaps WindowsXP finally offers a comfortable way to install common software packages.
Stop talking and just do it. Point me to a distro that installs as easily as windows, gives me no text files to edit, has all the drivers I need, doesn’t require me to touch the commandline at all, has all the applications I need which work atleast as well as it’s windows counterparts, has specialised applications I need in a corporate environment, is foolproof and throughout consistent.
Stop talking and just do it. Point me to a distro that installs as easily as windows, gives me no text files to edit, has all the drivers I need, doesn’t require me to touch the commandline at all, has all the applications I need which work atleast as well as it’s windows counterparts, has specialised applications I need in a corporate environment, is foolproof and throughout consistent.
If you want all these features, why don’t you keep using Windows?
I have myself said for years that a piece of software is “ready” when nobody does any development for it any more.
That what “ready” actually is. Nothing to do any more, all done.
My sincere hope is that Linux Desktop never becomes “ready”.
On the other hand, if the writer means that Linux is not useable enough as a desktop OS for any serious business use, he is unfortunately wrong since our company is using Red Hat Linux desktop OS for all the work we do – all the way from graphical works to documentation, software development and networking. The saving we get through this is transferred directly to our prices that are lower than those of our competitors without our effectiveness and productivity being hurt by Linux in any important way.
So at least for us Desktop Linux is useable enough already and will get more useable as time goes by.
Lets face it, the average user is a moron, they want to do the least amount of learning and hopefully, fingers crossed, everything works out right and if it doesn’t, of course they’ve got a silly pr*ck like me willing to scoot around to their house and “repair” their computer when ever they feel they need to ask, even on the bloody weekend, oh, btw, I now charge these “people” who ask for help.
Lousey attitudes like this are exactly why people hate working with computers and tech people. They are completely justified when they say “I hate computers” or “Computers make me feel stupid!” It’s attitudes like yours that have made things the way they are. Get your head out of your ATX case and pay attention: People should NOT have to be technically oriented to USE a computer. They are told that they don’t need such knowledge when they buy one. Don’t slanderize “users” because they don’t know what you know. Just because you may have spent years of your life learning all the niggling details about computers and operating systems does not make you better than anyone else. You have specialized knowledge, that is all! Withholding that knowledge or using it to set yourself above others just makes you an arrogant jerk who needs to be beaten down. So many geek-turned-tech-jockys use their newfound value to get revenge on the people who made them feel small and unimportant in the days before “computers are kool!” Grow up.
I remember working on a PC in an engineering department once. The guy who’s machine I was working on was all apologetic and told me “what an idiot he was with computers.” I pointed to his math and engineering degrees and diplomas and awards on his cubical wall and told him “No, THAT stuff makes ME look like an idiot.” It all depends on what you’ve specialized in.
Computers began as electronic geek toys. Back THEN, yes, computers were only for geeks and specialized knowledge was required. TODAY computers are marketed at normal flesh and blood people who don’t know about technical jargon. Therefore, computers should NOT REQUIRE such knowledge.
Do you think it is fair for your car dealership to prance around all arrogantly declaring how stupid and idiotic you are because you don’t know your sparkplug gap, your tire pressure, what a timing belt is, and what weight of oil you need all off the top of your head??
Stop bashing people for not knowing all the millions of reasons computers don’t do what they WANT them to do.
This attitude is bad enough with Windows-oriented environments. It is FAR worse with many Linux people who think that everyone else should know what they know. It is not a bad thing that Windows makes basic computing tasks easier than a Unix or Linux. It is not bad that Windows and Mac OS try to hide technical BS from the user. It is not bad because all the technical BS shouldn’t BE THERE any more!
They are given documentation and what they don’t know they make up…you think they know what a timing belt is? my tire pressure? my sparkplug gap??
I do…because I do that majority of the things I need that are for basic tuneup to my car. I haven’t been to the mechanic in three years.
Of course, in the windows world, people are told they don’t know shit without an MCSE…in the linux world…there isn’t an industry standard Certification that says you know linux…sure there are some around, but they aren’t known about my most HR people.
I got most of my jobs before the buzz word caught on, I walked in, fixed some problems, they hired me.
I walked into a windows interview and didn’t get past it because I didn’t pay microsoft a couple grand for a cert…
Seems like the windows world is more closed to possibilities unless you get certified.
——————————————–
“Stop talking and just do it. Point me to a distro that installs as easily as windows, gives me no text files to edit, has all the drivers I need, doesn’t require me to touch the commandline at all, has all the applications I need which work atleast as well as it’s windows counterparts, has specialised applications I need in a corporate environment, is foolproof and throughout consistent.”
————————————————-
I think that you are not talking about Windows but about HALL from the computer from the 2001 – A space odissey movie … 🙂
Windows only has drivers for hardware older than Windows version. If you buy a barnd new hardware you depends of drivers made by the hardware vendor that comes within a CD.
Windows is not foolproof. Let a child play with a Windows 9x or a NT/Win2k/XP with FAT partition (or logged as an advanced user) and see what he can destroy deleting all important files…
Windows have all applications you need and you cannot pay for them… A single copy of “standard” applications (M$ Office, Corel Draw, Adobe Acrobat, M$ Visio, M$ Visual Studio, etc) can have a price higher than your computer.
Consistent ? There are Win 3.1, 3.11, 95, 95, 95b, 98, 98 2nd ed., Me, NT 3.x, NT 4.0, Win2k, Win2k Server, WinXP Home, WinXP Professional, etc… There are many programs that don’t run on all these variants…
If you want all these features, why don’t you keep using Windows?
I’m guessing he does, since Windows IS ready for his desktop, and a larger proportion of users currently.
Consistent ? There are Win 3.1, 3.11, 95, 95, 95b, 98, 98 2nd ed., Me, NT 3.x, NT 4.0, Win2k, Win2k Server, WinXP Home, WinXP Professional, etc… There are many programs that don’t run on all these variants…
Consistent? There are 130+ Linux distributions. How many do you think are binary compatible? NT does in fact run Windows 3.1 apps, and has a emulation mode for older applications. I bet if you grabbed 50 apps each compiled in 1995, for Windows and Linux, you would have close to 90% success on Windows, and less than 10% on Linux (if any).
Windows have all applications you need and you cannot pay for them… A single copy of “standard” applications (M$ Office, Corel Draw, Adobe Acrobat, M$ Visio, M$ Visual Studio, etc) can have a price higher than your computer.
They aren’t intended for people who can’t pay for them. Just like Linux isn’t intended for people who want a computer to be an appliance. They are for developers, and people who can pay for them. Deal with it. There are applications available for Linux that I can’t afford, so fucking what?
Windows only has drivers for hardware older than Windows version. If you buy a barnd new hardware you depends of drivers made by the hardware vendor that comes within a CD.
Just having a driver is 100x better than no driver at all. You get drivers for Linux from one year prior to the release date of the distro, and even then only if you’re lucky and with half of the features.
All of the things that you mentioned just prove that Quicktime, TurboTax et al. aren’t ready for Linux, not that Linux isn’t ready for the desktop. Here’s a hint: none of those things were available for Windows when it had Linux’ marketshare either. In fact, a lot of those things were available for Windows until it had a verrry large marketshare.
Linux will be ready when it’ll offer:
– usabability without a hitch (the simpler the desktop the better)
– one click install/uninstall system coupled with powerful dependancy management
– one predominent window manager (GNOME or KDE) that looks and behave the same across all distros.
– a decent graphical configuration center as a viable alternative to any geek command line.
– a strict minimal set of software and tools to be installed when the user doesn’t care to choose explicitely what to install.
– a better hardware support, especially for new PC.
– an office suite as good as Ms Office (OpenOffice is in the right track)
If you want all these features, why don’t you keep using Windows?
Guess what, that’s what I’m doing as there is no alternative right now.
I think that you are not talking about Windows but about HALL from the computer from the 2001 – A space odissey movie … 🙂
I talk about Windows and Linux. You seem to not understand what I say and apart from that try to name HAL from 2001 into HALL.
Windows only has drivers for hardware older than Windows version. If you buy a barnd new hardware you depends of drivers made by the hardware vendor that comes within a CD.
Your point would be? As a matter of fact I get drivers for every piece of hardware, be it with drivers coming with a piece of hardware or integrated into the OS. I don’t care where drivers ceom from for LInux, but if they aren’t there, Linux ain’t ready.
Windows is not foolproof. Let a child play with a Windows 9x or a NT/Win2k/XP with FAT partition (or logged as an advanced user) and see what he can destroy deleting all important files…
I wouldn’T let a child on my PC regardless of what OS I’m running. Nice to see that you had no answer to the others points I brought up and had to resort to such a lame comparison.
Windows have all applications you need and you cannot pay for them… A single copy of “standard” applications (M$ Office, Corel Draw, Adobe Acrobat, M$ Visio, M$ Visual Studio, etc) can have a price higher than your computer.
I have all the sonftware I need and paid for it. Hod did the saying go if you ass-u-me the onlything that happens is that you make an ass out of yourself.
Apart from the small but indeniable fact that Linux misses applications replacing the above mentioned ones in functionality, userfriendlyness and compatibility.
Consistent ? There are Win 3.1, 3.11, 95, 95, 95b, 98, 98 2nd ed., Me, NT 3.x, NT 4.0, Win2k, Win2k Server, WinXP Home, WinXP Professional, etc… There are many programs that don’t run on all these variants…
Which was not a problem for me. All I have brought along in termns of data over trhe years I can use without troubles. But can I toss a 5 year old binary from my old PC onto a new Linux installation? Guess not.
In total, you had no answewrs to most of my points and I dismissed the ones you tried to refute. Looks bad for you.
You guys are totally clueless. If you have applications that won’t work in any environment than Windows, then STAY THERE! Don’t complain that it’s not ready for the desktop because it’s not ready for YOU, it just makes you look like a MORON to the 10 million + of us that KNOW Linux is READY for OUR desktops!
I can hundreds of things on Linux that I can’t do in Windows, and hundreds of things in Windows that can’t be done in Linux. Grow up already, all of you!
Point me to a distro that installs as easily as windows
# apt-get install kppp linuxconf webmin apache sodipodi koffice …
Tell me an easier way to install 10 or 20 apps at once on Windows?
gives me no text files to edit
It is YOUR choice whether to edit or not text files!!!
has all the drivers I need
I have all the drivers I need (Debian)
doesn’t require me to touch the commandline at all
What’s wrong with the cmd line?
has all the applications I need
name few apps so I can get an idea what are you looking for.
Thank you for using a real descriptive name for yourself. Unlike you, I have no illusions of grandure. I admit, I am a moron when it comes to things such as engines and so forth, however, I don’t go around blaming everyone one else for my short fall in knowledge.
Every bloody time someone has a problem with Linux, oh, its EVERYONE ELSES FAULT, not mine, good lord no, the fact that I might actually have to pick up a bloody book and read is completely beside the point.
Taking the angle that you and most morons take, “engines suck, they should be made easier so that I can give it a complete overhaul without the need to know one thing about the motor!”, or my person favourite, “why should I need to get a driving license, why can’t cars be intellident and easy to use?”
Yes, the average person IS a moron. Grow some balls and handle it otherwise stick with the namby-pamby woofter and wowser forums where the likes of you talk about the latest wizz bang GeForce 3trillion and how by hooking up an endothermic reactor you’re able to squeeze and extra 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 000000000000000001 fps out and claim that somehow you’re “smarter” than intel.
At last! Someone said the magic words: “Action”. I couldn’t agree more Nicholas.
Action guys! We need action! Not argues! We need action to spread the word about Linux. Instead of spending our words and our energy here arguying all the time, why not invest our words, energy and good will to advertising GNU/Linux? And you know, the best type of advertisment available in this world is the one *YOU* guys can provide: the “person-to-person advertisement”. Truth. It’s a fundamental principle of advertizing. Don’t believe your enthusiasm is so powerfull? Ask the expert: The advertiser. He will say exactly the same thing. Spread the word. Try to *transmit your enthusiasm* about what *WE* have. What *YOU* have is important. Talk about it with all your enthusiasm. Enthusiasm is transimitive. People’s response to it is amazing! Do you think 90% of the people will get to come in touch with Linux for logic? They will take their chances with it for the FEELING of it guys! Because they saw YOU being happy and contend with it. Then they will keep on using it for it’s stability, for being able to ticker it/play with it and most importantly for the feeling of being a part of a community and not just “a client” or “yet an other guy in the row”. Maybe some apps will throw a SIGSEGV now and then, maybe there will be some difficulty in traversing in the file system … (you name it) – No problem. If they are sentimentally attached to our beloved system the way most of us are, will they pay attention to these newbee problems? We don’t. Almost all my friends did not even *think* of quiting M$ windoze a couple of months ago. Now, most of them are using linux and those who don’t, are looking forward to *nuke* their FAT/NTFS partitions with one of the latest Linux distros. Amazing! Talk about what you have guys! It’s of major importance! And each and single one of YOU is important. Most computer users don’t even know what Linux is all about. They don’t even know it’s there. The “big-three” do not seem to understand these and even if they do, they don’t have the money for a good enough advertising campaign. And even if they had the money for such a campaign they still wouldn’t be able to advertise themselves as well as we can advertise them – Remember that the BEST way of advertising is the one YOU give: the “person-to-person” one – Please ask about it. So, if we don’t advertise what we have, who is going to do it for us? The bloody M$ ?? Think about it.
We are meant for good. We have power. Let’s use it to break “the loop” guys.
Yours till the sun turns black,
Kyriakos
P.S.: Oh, and please remember: we are meant for good but hassling people for using Windows is not the best thing we can do. Talk about what you have, not about what they don’t have.
This is more fun then reading Unix haters Handbook
Point me to a distro that installs as easily as windows
# apt-get install kppp linuxconf webmin apache sodipodi koffice …
and already you managed to violate one of the other points I raised as mandatory: never having to touch the commandline. try again.
Tell me an easier way to install 10 or 20 apps at once on Windows?
gives me no text files to edit
It is YOUR choice whether to edit or not text files!!!
has all the drivers I need
I have all the drivers I need (Debian)
lucky you
doesn’t require me to touch the commandline at all
What’s wrong with the cmd line?
nothing, I just don’t want to read endless man pages all the time.
has all the applications I need
name few apps so I can get an idea what are you looking for.
Photoshop, MIPS, MS Office (no, open source alternatives have proven to not be alternatives as they don’t handle the kind of documents I deal with, something breaks all the time or is outright not supported), an application to pull data of an AS400 and send the result as a formatted PDF via mail automaticly. That would be pressing applications I need and haven’t seen counterparts for on LInux.
Thank you for using a real descriptive name for yourself. Unlike you, I have no illusions of grandure.
You sure act like you do. And, good grief, did you just use a 6-year-old child’s “I know you are, but what am I?” comeback?
I admit, I am a moron when it comes to things such as engines and so forth, however, I don’t go around blaming everyone one else for my short fall in knowledge.
Not having such specialized knowledge does not make you a moron. You’re painting with far too wide a brush.
Every bloody time someone has a problem with Linux, oh, its EVERYONE ELSES FAULT, not mine, good lord no, the fact that I might actually have to pick up a bloody book and read is completely beside the point.
No it isn’t. You are MISSING the point. That’s the problem. People aren’t complaining about problem solving; they’re complaining about BASIC FUNCTIONALITY and are sick of being told that they need to posess specialized knowledge, or do endless research just to utilize the basic functionality of something.
Taking the angle that you and most morons take, “engines suck, they should be made easier so that I can give it a complete overhaul without the need to know one thing about the motor!”,
False argument and false analogy. We’re not talking about users having problems overhauling or upgrading their computers. We’re talking about USING them for BASIC FUNCTIONALITY during DAILY activities. In car-talk, that’s DRIVING the car, not overhauling the car’s engine. Try making a valid parallel.
or my person favourite, “why should I need to get a driving license, why can’t cars be intellident and easy to use?”
Goodness, you’re despirate to sound like you’re making a point. This is the most badly written part, too, indicating that you don’t much care to construct valid sentences, let alone valid arguments. No one has ever suggested that operating any device, be it a computer, a VCR, remote control or a car does not require some working knowledge about what it does and how you’re supposed to operate it. Computers use mice, keyboards and monitors while VCRs use remote controls with buttons and a TV; cars use pedals and a steering wheel. You’re going to such rediculous lengths with your attempt at making a valid analogy, or to simply bash people who’s perspectives you do not understand and therefore must refuse. By the way, the reason you get a driving license isn’t to instruct YOU how to drive (or to overhaul the engine for that matter); it’s to prove to the government that you have competance with driving. Driving (at least in the USA) is a privilege, not a right. It is carefully monitored (some say not nearly enough) to protect other civilians. Operating a computer requires no such certification. Even less, in fact, according to the marketing of most computer systems and software.
Yes, the average person IS a moron.
In what way? Do you mean generally? I think 90% of the human population of this planet is a bunch of loud-mouthed, mindless, selfish, elitist jerks, personally. However, you can’t go around treating everyone like that. You can’t automatically assume everyone is a moron. I do not assume that my customers are morons just because they know nothing about compiling, shared libraries or interrupts. If you do, then you’ve got an attitude problem, or simply an inability to demonstrate compassion and empathy.
Grow some balls and handle it
Ahh… the tough-guy come-back. You’ve graduated from the 6-year-old’s combacks to the 17-year-old’s comebacks. Apparently you think that the answer to all problems is testosterone and brute force. Who are you so angry at and why, anyway? You call people morons. Then you get upset about being called a moron. THEN you call YOURSELF a moron. You seem to think that people with specialized knowledge have delusions of grandure. Then you go off on a rant about how people who don’t have specialized knowledge are morons and that they need to “just deal with it.” Do you even HAVE a position of any kind on any of this or are you just barking?
otherwise stick with the namby-pamby woofter and wowser forums where the likes of you talk about the latest wizz bang GeForce 3trillion and how by hooking up an endothermic reactor you’re able to squeeze and extra 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 000000000000000001 fps out and claim that somehow you’re “smarter” than intel.
What is this supposed to be about? If you think you’re making some kind of progress here in your vitriolic prattle, I recommend you take a deap breath and re-read everything you’re being so reactionary about and figure out exactly what your problem is.
You guys are totally clueless. If you have applications that won’t work in any environment than Windows, then STAY THERE! Don’t complain that it’s not ready for the desktop because it’s not ready for YOU, it just makes you look like a MORON to the 10 million + of us that KNOW Linux is READY for OUR desktops!
I can hundreds of things on Linux that I can’t do in Windows, and hundreds of things in Windows that can’t be done in Linux. Grow up already, all of you!
Well, you should strike some zeros from your 10million linux user figure. If an article talks about how Linux is ready for the corporate desktop yet apart from desktops for some asocial loonies it is clearly not aas it lacks specialised applications you just sound like a moron. now go dryhump your PC, won’t you?
http://www.linuxworld.com/linuxworld/lw-2000-08/lw-08-devnul_1.html
Check it out. It’s even from a Linux person. I knew there were thoughtful Linux supporters out there.
“Check it out. It’s even from a Linux person. I knew there were thoughtful Linux supporters out there.”
http://members1.chello.nl/~h.lai/immature-windows-elitists.png“>…
Why? I actually believe that that is a low estimate. Take a look around at all of the projects out there. Take a look at all of the hits all of the Linux sites get. If you think that number needs to lose digits, well just keep your eyes closed.
“now go dryhump your PC, won’t you?”
Gee, looks like we have another winner. Get a fucking life.
Why? I actually believe that that is a low estimate. Take a look around at all of the projects out there. Take a look at all of the hits all of the Linux sites get. If you think that number needs to lose digits, well just keep your eyes closed.
“now go dryhump your PC, won’t you?”
Gee, looks like we have another winner. Get a fucking life.
wow, 100 people reloading a site 1000 times equals number of users now?
Thanks, I have a life, unlike you who has the time to sit in front of your PC all the time.
“wow, 100 people reloading a site 1000 times equals number of users now? ”
Keep flying blind, it helps keep my wallet fat. It must be nice being as ignorant as you apparently are. To each his own.
“Thanks, I have a life, unlike you who has the time to sit in front of your PC all the time.”
Then why are you still here? LOL I have plenty of time to sit in front of the computer, yet still enjoy my wonderful life. You aren’t going to bring me down with your childish ways.
Grow up.
I don’t mind people who chosoe to run Windows. If you prefer using Windows and let it rest then so be it, however, I do take issue with those who don’t like Windows, looking for a alternative but complain because they’re too diferent or too “complex”.
in 1994/95 I moved from Amiga 500 to Linux (Slackware) primarily because I wanted something with a CLI that desembled the AmigaSHELL. Yes, it was hard but I was willing to learn.
The problem with the vast majority of people is that they want an alternative but don’t want to do the hard yards. There is an alternative, namely, MacOS X. Grab an eMac with MacOS and I am sure the vast majority would be happy. Most people don’t buy them because they are still under the impression that they’re “incompatible” with the rest of the universe. For example, I was chatting to a person who was looking at a new computer, I suggested an eMac, her reaction, “oh, but it won’t be compatible”, after asking what she did, namely, using Word, Excel, a bit of PowerPoint and some internet stuff, I pointed out that she could get Microsoft Office, swap files with work mates without any issues. She was surprised and wondered why it is such a hidden secret, I couldn’t explain why either.
Apple needs to push their product by advertising the fact that just because the computer is different doesn’t mean you’re isolated and can’t swap and interact with the rest of the world.
most of you are trying to change linux, and turn it into an advanced windows. ‘not ever using the command line again’, etc. please understand, unix and its variants were designed to provide functionality, stability and security, not to be user friendly. most of you are bored with windows and want a change, but think for a moment: do you really need linux? what for? why? keep windows, it was designed to be easy, and for people who need to use a computer, but probably don’t like them. you want to listen to music, play games, surf the net…well, keep windows, but don’t try to change linux (by the way, of course, all this can be made with linux). all of linux characteristics require you to pay a price: you have to learn or learn. if you are not willing to do that, and if you use your computer to write a letter or view images, then keep windows…there’s no need to change. if you want to USE your machine, and are willing to learn, then switch to linux.
command line is one of the best and developed features of unix, that’s were its power is. and it’s the only way to really learn what you are doing.
i want linux to improve, but not to change its essence. i want linux to get better, but not to please all of you windows bored.
most of you are trying to change linux, and turn it into an advanced windows. ‘not ever using the command line again’, etc. please understand, unix and its variants were designed to provide functionality, stability and security, not to be user friendly. most of you are bored with windows and want a change, but think for a moment: do you really need linux? what for? why? keep windows, it was designed to be easy, and for people who need to use a computer, but probably don’t like them. you want to listen to music, play games, surf the net…well, keep windows, but don’t try to change linux (by the way, of course, all this can be made with linux). all of linux characteristics require you to pay a price: you have to learn or learn. if you are not willing to do that, and if you use your computer to write a letter or view images, then keep windows…there’s no need to change. if you want to USE your machine, and are willing to learn, then switch to linux. command line is one of the best and developed features of unix, that’s were its power is. and it’s the only way to really learn what you are doing. i want linux to improve, but not to change its essence. i want linux to get better, but not to please all of you windows bored.
most of you are trying to change linux, and turn it into an advanced windows. ‘not ever using the command line again’, etc. please understand, unix and its variants were designed to provide functionality, stability and security, not to be user friendly. most of you are bored with windows and want a change, but think for a moment: do you really need linux? what for? why? keep windows, it was designed to be easy, and for people who need to use a computer, but probably don’t like them. you want to listen to music, play games, surf the net…well, keep windows, but don’t try to change linux (by the way, of course, all this can be made with linux). all of linux characteristics require you to pay a price: you have to learn or learn. if you are not willing to do that, and if you use your computer to write a letter or view images, then keep windows…there’s no need to change. if you want to USE your machine, and are willing to learn, then switch to linux. command line is one of the best and developed features of unix, that’s were its power is. and it’s the only way to really learn what you are doing. i want linux to improve, but not to change its essence. i want linux to get better, but not to please all of you windows bored.