As reported at MacCentral, Apple CEO Steve Jobs will preview Mac OS X 10.4, codenamed Tiger, in his keynote speech at the upcoming Worldwide Developers Conference (WWDC) this June. More details on Apple’s website.
Jobs to Preview Mac OS X Tiger at WWDC
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and I’m more than happy to pay it.
“and I’m more than happy to pay it.”
ditto…
Whoo hoo! I’m always looking forward to the newest OS X release.
I wonder how long they’ll go with OS X before dropping the G3. I hope it’s not too soon, besides my work machine all my macs are G3 class.
Has there been an estimated release date for Tiger?
grrr… rawr!
can’t wait to see the next cat from apple. hope it rocks.
Maybe they will offer real 64-bit support now then? And I’m sure they’ll add a funky filesystem, so that they can compete with Longhorn etc.
Jaguar was releases on August 24 2002,Panther was released on Oct. 24th 2003…so is Apple remains predictable you can estimate …..
Well, Apple probably won’t get my money. Something has to tweak my interests in order to convince me to buy an OS upgrade. In fact, the only reason why I’m using Panther is because it came with my new computer — though the availability of Safari, a PostScript viewer, and X11 in Panther were selling features for the new computer.
That said, I was poking around WWDC events and stumbled across this contest:
https://designawards.apple.com/scripts/show_page.php?contest=perform…
Now I’ve only seen demos before, but nothing on a modern machine. I expect to be blown over.
A new filesystem would rock. Hopefully hiring Dominic Giampaolo has paid off. I always liked BFS and I have his book.
The description for session 108 cites “upcoming enhancements to the file system”: it’s time not to regret anymore BeFS.
Despite appearing by number to be minor version upgrades, they are most definitely major changes, and to me at least are worth paying for.
gee….people who like their platform not minding to buy an OS for it!! holy cow!!!
so are you saying that the same is a fault with windows users?
what Suse users?
..of course you are….you and all the other people I know that get “copies” of the OS….not realizing that you are hurting the company that you Love so much every time you get a “copy” of OS X!
Hmm …
Do not see the problem with users that actually want, and do pay for their software. I do not know many people wanting, and likeing to pay for their Windows versions. I certainly did not like to pay for my Windows versions. But I am more than happy to pay for a new version of OS X.
do you like looking foolish?
this is not any different than Microsofts release versioning or the major linux distro versioning.
major updates are point releases, major structural changes are major number changes, patches are double point releases and are free.
apple charging for 10.4 is no different than MS charging for ME or XP or 98. (those were all point releases)
Absolutely ditto. I eagerly await and happily pay for real innovation.
If you search on froogle (or any other price search site) you’ll see that there are update editions available if you have the previous edition, and these cost about $40 less than the full release. They just don’t publicise this fact very much.
Now to persuade my manager that getting the upgrade would be good for my productivity :o)
Damien
If you do not want to buy the new software, do not.
You have got a choice. No one is forcing you to buy anything. If your current version of a piece of software is good enough for you, then do not buy the new version.
It is kind of simple. No. It is not. It _is_ simple.
Paying for Tiger is no different than anything else.
Don’t forget that XP is officially NT 5.1 – a point upgrade from Windows 2000, which was NT 5.0.
Many SuSE users who bought 9.0 will buy 9.1.
Lots of Mandrake club members bought 9.1 and then bought 9.2 (and then 10.0 Official).
Red Hat sold boxed versions of every point upgrade for the last several years.
> Yeah I dont think so. Your just another mac shill that cant
> handle the fact that the only way apple can stay in buisness
> is to abuse their user base. Im sorry but I wont be one of
> stevie job’s whores.
Maybe people are willing to pay for the OS as it is better than any of the alternatives? Sure, there are problems, but having used them for some time I’d say that Windows and Linux et al have even more, which is why I use a Mac at work and want one for home.
So get off your high-horse and try the OS, and use a decent mouse too (the Logitech MX 310 is awesome).
Damien
(recent MacOSX convert)
I’ll pay $129 for it, and I hope I’ll be running it on a PowerBook G5 by the end of the year! But I’m not holding my breath…
To be fair here, I think many of the windows users here pay for their copies and have no problem paying for them. Same as I see no problem paying for a OSX update. Hopefully soon I will have a reason to buy a OSX update. There is just a certain group of people that tend to use a certain OS/GNU that don’t get it, or just want something to go off on. Most people connect time and effort with money. If something improves our lives we are willing to pay for it. 130 bucks isn’t much. Apple brings out such a release once a year, maybe thats begining to stretch out some. Thats not even 3 bucks a week, if it saves me just a tiny bit of time, or has one feature I start to use or enjoy a good bit it has paid for it’self. Or another way to look at it, if I buy 2 less cokes from a vending machine, or pass on a extra or two at lunch each week, I paid for it.
130$? a little expensive for me being a college student, but to me its worth the cost. I only hope others agree, I prefer to pay people who write fantastic programs, because it’s their job and they deserve it.
Even open source projects deserve to be contributed to, to quote RMS its ‘Free as in Freedom’, not because the people writing the code do not deserve to be payed for it.
Even number upgrades are free, odd numbers you have to pay for. Tiger will be free.
Jaguar was 10.2 and it wasn’t free.
This is pushing even the limits of the Mac faithful, who routinely plonk down $$ for anything that says Apple on it.
Some journalists need to start publicizing the fact that you do not need to ride the upgrade express.
You don’t appear to a Mac faithful. How would you know what thier limits are?
Apples new realeases are no scam. Can you prove that it is a scam?
If apple provides good value with thier new products, as they continualy have with thier OS upgrades, and they don’t force people to upgrade. Where is the scam?
If you are not an Apple user and don’t pay for the upgrades, you have no right to pass judgement on the process.
Being a college student you should be able to get it for around $70.
Now, with the near-monthly upgrades… come on guys, so far I paid C$179.00 and had hmmm 3 service packs so far and we’re waiting for a 4th…
We’re part of a ever-improving OS… one that’s actually moving… Yeah, I’ll pay da money…
Apple has taught me that an OS can improve… Win has taught me to be very afraid of an upgrade…
Jb
Howdy,
I expect I’ll buy 10.4. But, it will be when 10.6 or 11 has come out and 10.4 is being closed out. I don’t have anything against people who buy the latest and greatest. They keep Apple going. I just don’t have the budget for it.
I have been thinking of upgrading to a Blue and White from my Beige G3. Is there any word on whether 10.4 will still support the Blue and Whites? They seem to drop one class of machines with each new OS release, so I am kind of expecting B&W support to go. But, I hope not.
Good day,
p.s. BTW, it is pretty silly to say that getting a copy of the OS hurts Apple. If you were not going to buy anyway, which is how I took the previous message, Apple is no worse off. I don’t believe in using pirated software, but I do not exagerate its impact.
I think $130 per year is to much, just to have my OS updated. I dont mind paying, but thats too much.
Yeah.. I guess are you are right. $130 IS too much.
That’s why when I need a new graphics card every year to play the latest games, I just jack the store. Saved me paying $499 a year EASILY.
I figure the hardware manufacturers can pay for their bills, food and familys education, all with my inflated sense of well being. And they _KNOW_ I care about them.
considering no one has seen the feature list here, how can you say how overpriced it is?
i feel like they are getting above the sweet spot, but i’ll probably pay for it if it offers some new goodies. panther (10.3) was worth it to me, it instantly made all my macs at least $100 better than they were under jaguar (10.2). faster, prettier, more convenient, more compatible, etc.. i would happily give apple $60-$100 a year to keep OS X on the current rate of progress. in 4 years they caught and even passed windows in many areas, just like MS did to apple from 93-97. remember, you don’t need to buy multiple copies either, apple is cool with their licenses.
the main thing i DON’T like about this is apple seems to be killing older versions of OS quicker than before. now that OS9 is as good as gone they seem to be pushing the iLife products by making them depend on the newest OS. i realize that OS X is a moving target, but i didn’t like when i had to leave one of my machines ‘off the OS grid’ and leave it at jaguar. within months i started to come across important software that was panther only.
to: —.59-203-24.mc.videotron.ca
“..of course you are….you and all the other people I know that get “copies” of the OS….not realizing that you are hurting the company that you Love so much every time you get a “copy” of OS X!”
Uh, no. I am not a thief, thank you very much. I make a regular wage, nothing special, but I don’t mind paying (that means “purchasing” as in with my cold hard cash) for the updates to OS X. I have bought each one so far and it has been worth it. I am not a mac zealot, shill, or fanboy. I don’t think SJ walks on water. There are lots of things Apple does that annoy and aggravate me to no end. But, at the end of the day, for me, the upgrades to OS X are woth the price. The additional features, speed increase, etc. are worth it. I save up $10 a month and I’ve got it paid for when it finally comes out. No big deal.
If you don’t want it or need it, don’t get it. I don’t mind paying for it, that’s all.
of any of the new features? Links please please.
and I’m more than happy to pay it.”
“Unfortunately, an all too common characteristic of many mac users.”
And might i add Microsoft users!
“130$? a little expensive for me being a college student, but to me its worth the cost. I only hope others agree, I prefer to pay people who write fantastic programs, because it’s their job and they deserve it.
Even open source projects deserve to be contributed to, to quote RMS its ‘Free as in Freedom’, not because the people writing the code do not deserve to be payed for it.”
Advice,,,,,,,,,,,,use your EDUCATIONAL discount on ALL software from Apple.
i spread truth
i used macs for 19 (1984 to 2003) years. i no longer pay the toll.
i have suse linux 9 and windows xp pro installed in my home.
xp pro and windows server 2003 running at my office.
Where is the slander?
If you don’t want to pay $130 to upgrade your OS then don’t.
Nobody is sticking a gun to your head telling you to upgrade.
If you are happy with what you have, don’t upgrade. I know plenty of people that skipped Panther because they were happy with Jaguar.
is software ships with only support for 10.3 and you can expect the same with 10.4 after releases.
you pay or you lose functionality in apps
including in the free apps from apple themselves.
pay the toll or you lose functionality.
i spread truth
I was wondering what was your goal exactly, now I understood. You’re an evangelist. You have sinned for years, you have seen the light, and you want to save us all now…
Thank you. God bless you.
OS X upgrades are cheap when you compare the windows equivalent upgrade (Windows XP Pro upgrade).
OS X upgrades run $130 while XP Pro upgrade runs for $189.
On top of that, OS X is a reference release, you don’t need ANY version of OS X in order for it to work while XP Pro upgrade DOES require a LIMITED set of Windows versions to upgrade.
So, I say again, quit bitching.
For reference:
http://shop1.outpost.com/product/3063029/
Sure its always nice to have the latest and greatest OS. With it comes more security holes and bugs, not to mention certain applications and devices that won’t run correctly.
Its not mandatory though, none of these upgrades are. If you have the money great. If not, stay will a more stable version with more support. One of the greatest features of OSX is its stability. It will run fine like a workhorse as long as you let it be. When upgrades get added into the mix it can become a real issues, as many of us know.
Currently I’m running 10.1 on my pismo and 10.2 on my G3 beige and ibook without any problems. And have no intention of upgrading unless its worth while.
Thats my 2 cents.
I only paid $65 for Panther with my gov’t discount. You can get it for $70 with student discount. Charging $130 does seem like a lot but really if you save some money for a few weeks, really it isn’t much.
…apple will get to calling their OS Garfield or Catbert 8)
try again xp pro full version oem is $133 with free shipping
http://www.newegg.com/app/viewProductDesc.asp?description=37-102-14…
xp home can be had for about $80 if you dont need to connect to a domain or need remote desktop (a $200 value that XP Pro has compared to buying something like PC Anywhere)
>> You don’t appear to a Mac faithful. How would you know what thier limits are?
visit any mac message board.
>> Apples new realeases are no scam. Can you prove that it is a scam?
YES I CAN! there, my reasoning is now only slightly less flimsy than yours.
>> If apple provides good value with thier new products, as they continualy have with thier OS upgrades, and they don’t force people to upgrade. Where is the scam?
minor tweaks. additions of smallish accessories. security updates. even Windows users get these for free.
and Apple does not force people to upgrade? uh tell that to multiple generations of Mac owners who have seen their hardware or software “end of life’d” by Apple. Apple is the absolute worst in the industry for stranding their users. Even Microsoft provides better back-support for old code. please go into any mac message board site and try telling them that Apple does not force upgrades.
>> If you are not an Apple user and don’t pay for the upgrades, you have no right to pass judgement on the process.
??????
i didn’t know i had to be granted rights to comment. let me guess – you’re in charge of dolling out these rights?
” since March 2001: $407 ”
this is high to you? over 3 years for 407 bucks. Thats pretty damn good. Hell I think when winxp pro first came out it was 400 bucks. Also it’s hard to say how many mac users were along the osx ride the whole time. I bet most who used it made the jump around 10.2 . Also many of them probably have bought a new mac since then 2001, so the probably missed some versions.
I don’t even own a mac yet, but this is not bad price at all for what you get. The hardware may be a bit steep but the software is very reasonable. Also hardware last longer then software and doesn’t get dated nearly as fast.
This has been mentioned, but it is continually glossed over. If you are connected to an educational institution in virtually any way, you can get substantial discounts (like almost 50%) on Apple goods. This includes grade school and higher ed. I have purchased all of the OS X versions and I have never paid more than $70 for any of them (first as a student, then as a professor). The discounts also extend to hardware, although they are not as deep. You should certainly check it out in the Apple store if you have a connection to an educational institution. (I’m not sure if this applies outside of the US. Perhaps someone can comment.)
consider mac users rarely upgrade their hardware to accommodate game requirement cause therere no games for them.
besides apple is counting on 8million osx users for them to survive.
i bought a powerbook few months ago for fun. great system. i still wish apple would release on wintel box so the world could able to embrace such a wonderful os.
xp pricing was never $400 dollars. full version at full retail has always been $299 for those silly enough to pay it. fact is you can buy a full version for $133 (see above).
pricing hasn’t changed since it was released.
xp shipped october of 2001. so in 2.5 years you have paid once for an os. all updates and enhancements since have been free.
since ms says about another 1.5 yrs before longhorn, you pay to upgrade every 4 yrs. compare to the annual subscription you pay apple and it is no wonder why apples numbers keep shrinking.
$400—- I can buy a whole computer for $349 that includes XP.
get real.
“is software ships with only support for 10.3 and you can expect the same with 10.4 after releases.
you pay or you lose functionality in apps
including in the free apps from apple themselves.
pay the toll or you lose functionality.”
And what apps fail to function unless you upgrade?
I have only seen requirements as high as 10.2…nothing thuse far for 10.3
Further, you argument also applies to Windows. For instance, Word 2003 requires Windows 2000 service pack 3 or XP. On the other hand, the forth coming Word 2004 for MacOS X only requires 10.2, not the latest, 10.3
well, I have not seen any panther only software, but who knows some shareware might be taking advantage of new Panther services.
all the apps I have seen in the stores and the shareware I have tried out have only required Jag.
also, understand that fact above. when Apple adds a service for Developers to take advantage of, people take advantage of it. if your OS does not have the service, you can’t run the app. it is not like all the apps are broken and need to be panther only.
that is how much MS is messed up. there is no new OS service in any of MSs OSs from 95 on. XP did have a few things that could break a program, but I have not run into any. some people think that is great, but I think that is sad. all that means is that the OS has not moved forward at all.
Wish list:
1) I am looking for increased MS Exchange support in Mail/Address book/iCal
2) Free remote desktop that somehow tunnels pdf so that it gets rerendered on the client side without using bitmaps graphics (and Windows terminal service support via rdesktop)
3) Wine (win23 api) for porting software
4) Relational database file system :0
5) X86 server version :}
6) More!!!! audio/video formats for iTunes/Quicktime with full screen playback vidio (mplayer)
7) A real commercial SQL database with developer tools
8) Real Basic like development system, for non-guru developers. Just like most Windows programmers in my IT department!
kinda like the mac os from 1984 to 2000? 16 years on the same base? is that why apples share fell so hard? anyone had enough of extensions yet?
xp pro and windows 95 were 7 yrs apart and are radically different. to say otherwise is kinda silly.
you are so full of it.
first, all software compiled for jag works on Panther, second, backwards compatibility is a bad thing. if it is MADE FOR PANTHER it is using a new service panther has. by keeping backwards compatibility of new features in panther to a minimum, you make the OS more stable.
there is no problem with commercial software, and 99% of all shareware runs on jaguar as well.
no crap it cost less now. I’m pretty sure it was 400 at one time. 100 for home upgrade, 200 for pro upgrade, 300 for home full, 400 for pro full. I could be wrong, but i’ll wait for others to respond.
yeah, you haven’t paid since XP since ms hasn’t had a release since then. We are still at 5.1 there hasn’t been a 5.2 and 5.3 over that time period. MS is going right to 6.0 and that gap was frankly to big. XP was great when it came out but has fell behind. No one wants a new release ever month. But having a new one every year would be very nice. Just for things like having updates and service packs and so forth rolled into a newer version so you don’t have to go through them every time you re-install. Or say SATA drive drivers. I still need to hook a floppy in to get the OS installed on my drive. Because XP came out before SATA, yeah you can do a slip stream and such for some of this, but just having it taken care of in a new realease and get more features would be better.
RE: XPp “all updates and enhancements since have been free.”
yeah… SERVICE PACK ONE which had NO enhancements… just fixed a few things that didn’t work… we’re still waiting for SP2…
At least with OSX we see improvement MANY times per year not one in 2 years… (security updates don’t count).
try again bojo.
all the hit games are available for OS X.
oh poo, none of the garbage games are though…darn.
of and I don’t need a 3 GHz CPU to run it well, a 1 GHz CPU does very well, though you do need a GFX card with at least 32 MBs, so even games are forcing GFX upgrades, but I can get a nice ATI for 150 bucks (it pisses me off that ATI gouges though)
XP Home does not have nearly the same cpapbilities as X, thus XP Pro is the closest (for instance, web server capabilities are in XP Pro and OS X, not XP Home).
Additionally, the link you provided was for the OEM version which requires the purchase of hardware.
Now using the web site that you gave, I found Windows XP Pro UPGRADE costs $197
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=37-102-14…
qt 6.5 requires os 10.2.6
filemaker 7 requires 10.2.8
dvd studio pro 3 requires os 10.3.2
motion needs 10.3.3
shake 3.5 needs 10.3.3
final cut pro hd requires 10.3.2
we need not go on or we could fill a page….
so if you bought os 10.04 and havent upgraded at all you have tons more that won’t work or if you are at 10.1 a little less….yes 10.2 is close to full coverage but you get the point.
on the other hand though is the fact that if you do upgrade, how much patching will you be doing to all of your apps and haxies (if they still work at all).
“kinda like the mac os from 1984 to 2000? 16 years on the same base? is that why apples share fell so hard? anyone had enough of extensions yet?
xp pro and windows 95 were 7 yrs apart and are radically different. to say otherwise is kinda silly.”
No No, XP and 95 were never apart, the 9x series is a hack that ran nearly as long as pre-osx did. The NT series XP is made from started in the late 90s. It was around before win95 and was improved. winXP is a evolution of at least 10 years. MS did not make the same kind of jump as Apple did. They had two active OS strains going. They just killed one off and kept riding the other, they didn’t drop one and start new like apple.
Also where is the radical differance from 95 to XP? sure differant kernels underneath, but from the user standpoint they are nearly identical. I can be pretty sure a app I had for win95 will run in XP without a problem.
if you consider GUI upgrades steps forward, then …good for you.
yeah the kernel changed, but the OS stayed the same.
GUI art and kernel != to the OS. the OS is the entire package. all MS did was make the OS more stable and better looking, everything else was the same. no forward movement at all.
But then Panther came out and the Mac world shifted into top gear, leaving Jaguar coughing and sputtering in the dust.
You see, I was one of those who had a grudge AGAINST Panther, right from the very beginning. I didn’t like the box with the plain silver X on the black background. Know what it reminded me of?
Malcom X
Gangs
Wasn’t Malcom X part of a gang called the Panther’s at one time? Maybe I’m getting stuff mixed up. I dunno.
Anyhow…
I was mad because as soon as it came out, it seemed like Jaguar was instantly shovelled to the bootom of all conversation. Everything was “Panther” this and “Panther” that. Ooh, it made me unhappy, ’cause I’d just bought Jaguar a month or two before! It was like, overnight, I owned an instantly obsolete OS!
At any rate, after finally hearing about how it was BETTER and FASTER than Panther (gee, if only Windows could follow suit, we’d REALLY have something to be scared of), I finally bought a copy on eBay…
…and I’ve never looked back since!
A herd of stampeding Mustangs couldn’t get me to go back to Jaguar. Not for a second. Jaguar was so instantly obliterated in my mind, you could just as easily put me back to a 56K modem (I’m running 3Mbps cable nowadays) to give me equal misery!
Panther is a huge leap beyond Jaguar. We can only imagine even more of the same in Tiger!
And I hear that all the windows and apps will have a new appearance, replacing the brushed metal of before. Pine, Oak, Mahogany, Poplar, etc.
They call it “Woods”.
Hehehehe! Gotcha! Get it? MacOS X 10.4 “Tiger” + “Woods”?
Tiger Woods!
Bwahahahahaha!
Luposian
oops make that late 80s for nt
if you dont need ms phone support and buy a mouse or a cable for .50.
damn.
if you want support from ms you can spend $50 bucks more.
you get the choice…or you can get Home for even less.
yes xp home has other features lacking. i dont know many home based run of the mill users needing web servers or even remote desktop for that matter. if you need it, buy it.
ms gives you the choice to fit your budget and needs.
“$400—- I can buy a whole computer for $349 that includes XP. “
I’m sure that machine would run real swell too.
“Also where is the radical differance from 95 to XP? sure differant kernels underneath, but from the user standpoint they are nearly identical. I can be pretty sure a app I had for win95 will run in XP without a problem.”
I can’t say that I’ve had the same luck.
a $1000 mac does. and it even plays half life.
so please stop yer whining!
I used to run OS 9 (came free with my mac) up until jaguar came out!
soooo lets recap:
Start in 2000 end in 2004
OS 9 : cost- free
MacOS X pubic beta: cost – 29 USD
Jaguar: 130 USD
Panther 130 USD
Total Cost: over 4 years: 290 USD
Well… THAT AINT BAD!
I CHOSE not to buy 10.0 because it did not have the features I wanted and it did not have the application support that I wanted
I CHOSE not to buy 10.1 for the same reasons
I CHOSE to buy 10.2 because it satisfied me as a consumer
I CHOSE to buy 10.3 because of the same reasons as 10.2
I will buy 10.4 IF AND ONLY IF the features it adds are essential to my work, if they are not I will skip this upgrade until the next one comes out and the re-evaluate my position.
No one is asking anyone to buy anything.
“No one is asking anyone to buy anything.”
Exactly.
is based on next and bsd…16yrs old and older and counting.
xp is of the nt line and had consumer windows features added.
x has no technological advance on xp and tiger will not add one.
give us a list of the new power each of these new os releases from apple has given us. you will produce a list of features that xp and windows has had for yrs. can anyone say netmeeting and how long windows has had voice and video chat?
adding icons and cool colors is no technological advancement it only makes teenagers happier to be hip.
To clarify a few things:
XP Pro cost 299 on day 1. I was using this crap since the beginning of the Whistler days, I followed it every step of the way, I used the “Devil’s Own ” gold disc months before the XP release, and my company bought XP Pro as soon as it came out. It was never 400 dollars, and furthermore, I don’t know of any “Home Full” and “Pro Full” editions. Home is pretty much Pro without the networking portions.
XP was designed to be the (non-literal) merge of the NT and 9x editions. I remember using it in mid 1999 with the “Professional” theme (sometimes called Blackcomb in Stardock). They introduced the “compatibility mode,” because there were lots of apps that didn’t work, like Fireburner and Adaptec Easy CD Creator 4.
Now, back on topic, Tiger is clearly going to be worth the money. The question is, is it worth it to someone who has already sunk 130 a year for the last 4 years into Apple OSes? That’s an individual choice. My complaint with Apple stuff has always been the lack of perceived responsiveness, and hopefully, Tiger will address that.
But please everyone, stop complaining about worth it or not. I’d like to read more about what features people want to see.
“x has no technological advance on xp and tiger will not add one.”
Not so sure about that
“give us a list of the new power each of these new os releases from apple has given us. you will produce a list of features that xp and windows has had for yrs. can anyone say netmeeting and how long windows has had voice and video chat?”
OK
http://www.xvsxp.com/final-score/
I have yet to run into anybody who actually uses netmeeting, but I would think that the same capabilities are largely available to iChat…I could be wrong though.
“is based on next and bsd…16yrs old and older and counting”
so you expect developers to rewrite the kernal as part of their new years “THINGS TO DO”???
you seems to be like proMS me too. but stop bashing apple. they have had certain features that windows user are dying for!
“adding icons and cool colors is no technological advancement it only makes teenagers happier to be hip.”
talking about windowsXP??
“you will produce a list of features that xp and windows has had for yrs”
hmmmmmm. BSOD??? or Driver Dependacy hell??????
I hear 10.4 is going to be based on Linux 2.6.X and that Apple from now on is only going to charge full price for even-numbered operating system releases.
” Security, out-of-the-box osX=9 winXP=3 ”
well that tells the difference i guess!
ichat came out when? last yr?
netmeeting had voice and video chat and whiteboard over 7 years ago.
tens of millions of people have used it for a long time. because you dont know anyone doesnt make it not real. its been a feature of windows for a very long time.
Our dear Anonymous says he has SuSE Linux and Windows XP. Now does he pay $90 each time* a new version of SuSE Linux is released? How much would that cost over 4 years?
6.4, 7.0, 7.1, 7.2, 7.3, 8.0, 8.1, 8.2, 9.0 and 9.1 = 10 * 90 = $900!
That would mean
– either that he complains about $400 for OS X but does not compain about $900 for SuSe Linux, thus that his comments make no sense,
– or that he doesn’t buy SuSE each time, meaning that he also wouldn’t buy upgrade OS X each time, thus that his comments make no sense.
The latter point of me does make sense. For the latest Mac software you need the latest OS X, and likewise you need (in most cases) the latest version of your Linux distribution to use the latest Linux software – we all know how difficult it is to install software that is not part of your distribution.
a $1000 mac does. and it even plays half life.
And your $400 PC even plays Pacman, right?
* For the boxed full-version, of course, as Anonymous isn’t interested in upgrade versions.
website that starts at page one saying that it is a review for designers is not telling us about the technology in os x that we have paid $130 per year to attain.
Isn’t there something about MacOSX covering installation on 5 machines where a WinXP license only covers one?
Suddenly the price seems very cheap if you upgrade more than one Mac at a time…
Hmmm… found it at apple.com: Single user license is 129$. 5 user license is 199$. Still seems pretty cheap?
“Wah wah I want a Mac but since I’m a free software hippie douche I can’t afford one, because I don’t have a job. I guess rather than getting a job, which would therefore let me afford Apple hardware/software, I’ll sit around and troll the OSnews message boards and try to convince the Mac bigots they’re wasting their money, thus making them more like me, a free software hippie.”
GET – A – LIFE
suse linux for free if i dont need/want support.
sorry wrong again. it even is available for free on a “live cd” so i can demo it for folks on their own hardware for free….without disturbing their base os.
try another direction….
“because you dont know anyone doesnt make it not real”
Did I at any time imply that it was not real? I don’t think so.
Given that MS is considering ceasing development of netmeeting though, I only question how useful of a feature it really is. Of course if you would like netmeeting funcitonality, you can always pay for Office 2003 which has the same abilities.
iChat actually came out when OS X was first released. The video conferencing features were the only addition. Further, there are other open source freeware apps that have the same capabilities that run on X just fine.
if more than 3 homes in the whole world had 5 macs in it.
does not aplly to business use, only home.
most families skip vacations for a yr after buying a single mac let alone having 5.
a marketing campaign is all that is.
ichat didnt ship with os x at launch.
you need to bone up on your mac history.
ms messenger has had nearly all the same features as netmeeting for some time as well. you dont need to buy office. spread fud elsewhere.
came out a month ago and was automatically installed.
who cares.
Uh…iChat did exist on OS X 10.2 Jaguar
iChat AV is from 10.3 Panther.
Perhaps you are the one who needs to bone up on their mac history.
http://www.thinksecret.com/features/jaguarichat/
No, YOU spread FUD elsewhere.
There have been chat and even video chat clients for Mac since long before OS X. I’ve used several of them.
Now, Apple introduced their OWN chat client with Jaguar, but that doesn’t mean there wasn’t one before that.
Secondly, you seem awfully willing to cut corners for other operating systems when you won’t for OS X. If you’re willing to go on the OEM market to buy your Windows XP upgrade, I might as well go on Ebay for my OS X discs. Or I might look on Amazon where I see a used copy of Panther for $90. When I got Panther I used my educational discount to get it for $70. Or if I have multiple Macs, I’d get the $199 5 license pack, which is a really good deal.
The point is that if you are entitled to cut corners when pricing XP, then I am equally entitled to cut corners when pricing Mac OS X. Which is why when sensible people debate pricing they do it on the list price, not on what cut-rate prices they can find in obscure venues.
are not obscure
nearly all online vendors have oem prices.
edu discounts are fully available for ms products as well and are not obscure to students and edu staff.
ms offers deals to edu, govt, non-profits etc.
ms offers many choices to main stream buyers too
xp pro or home
full or upgrade
retail or oem or pre-shipped on a new pc
or volume licensing
take your pick
oem pricing is not obscure and is availabe to all buyers.
“iChat actually came out when OS X was first released.”
now you say….
“Uh…iChat did exist on OS X 10.2 Jaguar
iChat AV is from 10.3 Panther.”
which is it?
did ichat exist on os x 10.0 when it was released?
and yes we all know about third party solutions. that is not the discussion here. if you have to buy an audio and video chat solution that just adds more coals on apples head. its been free on windows for over 7 years.
suse linux for free if i dont need/want support.
Sure you can, but if you don’t want to look at upgrade versions of Mac OS X, then why on earth should I look at incomplete download versions of SuSE Linux? It is not supported. It doesn’t have all the software that comes with the boxed version, and it doesn’t include the amd64 port. It isn’t even released at the same time the boxed version is.
So let’s keep things straight – you say full version of Mac OS X, I say full version of SuSE Linux.
that i can download is available in a boxed product?
manuals?
support?
i can get all else online via my net connection.
but i dont care to debate suse linux. its less expensive than the mac os but that is about all it has on it.
What kind of music do you like?
Hip-Hop you say? NO! You don’t. I like Techno and now you do too! The music I listen to is obviously far superior to what you like, so you are going to have to like it too. Sorry.
Do you sit in designer stores all day telling everyone they can get their shit cheaper from the market down the road? I don’t think so.
You know. Trolls are a curious species.
Obviously, you work for Microsoft. You don’t? Well what the fuck are you defending them for? You make no money out of it, you get no letter at the end of the month from them saying “Hey, good job on stopping people buy OSX. If it weren’t for you I don’t know what we would do.”
Why even bother? Why don’t you run off to some Windows XP board and help people out with their problems, and leave this thread to discussing what new features might be in Tiger.
Thank you.
i am sharing my experience and thoughts on oses
i have a good deal of experience with macs and windows and a little with linux.
something wrong with sharing information?
i like to be helpful. i am not working for anyone or looking to get paid.
just sharing information as i think it relates to the news story.
why so defensive? if you dont agree you can post another side to the arguement. if you dont care you can read and move on. if you agree you can share that too.
the thread doesnt have a disclaimer saying we can only discuss what tiger will have for new features does it?
$130 is nothing compared to what you get out of it each and every time. Quite whining you cheap bastages.
So does anyone think that Tiger will contain ‘Piles’
any other guesses as to what is to come?
Maybe support for running Windows apps without VPC???!!!!
(oh please, oh please, oh please)
“130$? a little expensive for me being a college student”
There is an educational price you know.
try again xp pro full version oem is $133 with free shipping
“must be purchased with hardware ” dumbass.
Well, they’re just have to announce something cool to do with the filesystem. Since they hired Mr. BeFS guy and all. It will be interesting to see what he has come up with.
Whatever it is, it’s gonna have to play well with HFS.