Linked by Eugenia Loli on Sat 15th Dec 2007 06:17 UTC
Linux It seems that each distribution has found a niche: Red Hat and Ubuntu are the leaders in their markets, and SUSE is a comfortable runner-up. However, history has shown us that businesses are not content to stay still too long or play second fiddle. So, what will Red Hat, SUSE, and Ubuntu have to do in the new year to gain new ground?
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RE[2]: Now
by manjabes on Sat 15th Dec 2007 09:46 UTC in reply to "RE: Now"
manjabes
Member since:
2005-08-27

1) They are. Just up the "Buttons" value in your xorg.conf, and use a mouse button mapping program like imwheel http://legroom.net/howto/mouse

Yes, it is so easy. Just write Buttons:0x48,0x50=0x0004 etc. into your xbzzz.conf file; then compile the newest beta drivers for xbzzz-config that still don't know how to show the battery state of my BT mouse (windows does that!) but hey what the heck, it lets me move the pointer and double click; then configure the kernel sources and be sure to activate the gaagaa bit, then download the kernel patch to enable the gaagaa-guuguu extensions which are necessary for the buttons to work but which kinda don't work very well with the current kernel (kernel panic every 2 hours) but which the kernel developers do not support 'cause it's "tainted"; after you have patched your kernel sources, recompile the kernel and install the new kernel; now edit the initscripts so that xbzzz-gaagaa starts before xorg and after powersaved; then enter the sha256 checksum of your initrd to the xbzzz.conf file and restart xbzzz. Oh, and make sure to edit your grub configuration so that the parameter xbzzz=0x12231241342,0x312,0xaf3 gets passed on boot. Be sure to replace the 0x312 and 0xaf3 with the custom values necessary for your system.

I mean, what in the world could be easier!!! A toddler could do it in a split second!

Compare that to the awful mess that is in windows where i *gasp* download the drivers from the manufacturers website (or the driver cd), double click it, click next-finish a number of times and my mouse suddenly works. That is so complicated, i cannot even bear the thought, it's even more frustrating and agonizing than the extra button for detailed printing settings in the GNOME printer dialog. What horror!!

Reply Parent Score: 3

v RE[3]: Now
by Almindor on Sat 15th Dec 2007 10:15 in reply to "RE[2]: Now"
RE[4]: Now
by agentj on Sat 15th Dec 2007 10:48 in reply to "RE[3]: Now"
agentj Member since:
2005-08-19

So why people want to push linux everywhere e.g. on computers for ordinary users ? It's better to pay MS and get everything working that receive "HOW F- DARE YOU DEMAND SOMETHING?" for free crap.

Reply Parent Score: -1

RE[4]: Now
by renhoek on Sat 15th Dec 2007 11:58 in reply to "RE[3]: Now"
renhoek Member since:
2007-04-29

well, the nvidia guys definitely got paid. i'm trying to get xorg to display correctly on my tv-out. i do need to edit my xorg.config, i did it before, but i could not get it working. not with the ati drivers too, but it think that is because ati does not support tv-out (last time i checked).

the problem is the guys coding the drivers will easily fix their xorg.conf files, the guys who can not get their xconf correctly will not be able to fix the drivers. so the only thing left is complaining. getting comments like "rtfm!" or "don't complain, it's free" will not solve this problem.

for the record, i want everything autodetected! if you can write a driver, it should be just 10% more work to get everything working automaticly. why the hell do i need to specify the amount of ram, monitor size, refresh rates and all other kind of crap. i want to be able to override the autodetected values just in case, but i should not need to specify them in the first place.

ps. using caps/swearing won't make you more right.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[4]: Now
by Joe User on Sat 15th Dec 2007 11:59 in reply to "RE[3]: Now"
Joe User Member since:
2005-06-29

"Put up or shut up. Have you ever had to write a driver? Do you even know WHO writes the drivers for linux? Do you know if they even get payed? HOW F- DARE YOU DEMAND SOMETHING? You didn't PAY for it, so be happy for what you got, or get down and fix it yourself, or get up and shout to the manufacturer to provide proper linux drivers.

The problem isn't in linux, or the distroes, the problem is in people like you not knowing how things work.

The only thing you got right is the stupidity of xorg.conf which should've been dealt with 10 years ago, HOWEVER, you didn't help doing it, and me neither, so we don't have the right to demand anything here".


Not everybody has 30 years of experience in Assembly and C development. You clearly mean that Linux is for developers. This utterly contradicts the "Linux for human beings" motto. Oh, and you bash the average user the same way this poor guy might have been in Linux forums. Good luck gathering more users and convincing them to use Linux this way.

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[4]: Now
by Michael on Sat 15th Dec 2007 12:21 in reply to "RE[3]: Now"
Michael Member since:
2005-07-01

This has nothing to do with the guys who write drivers. It's the job of the distribution to ensure that graphics, and all hardware for which drivers exist, is automatically configured so that, for the user, it "just works".

In the cases of RedHat and SUSE, they do get paid, handsomely. If you want, you can pay Canonical for Ubuntu support. In each case, the consumer has every right to object when things don't work, or when they're asked to open up a text editor as root and edit a config file by hand. One typo and you've got a non-booting system. That's not what you pay for.

Reply Parent Score: 3

RE[3]: Now
by RIchard James13 on Sat 15th Dec 2007 11:31 in reply to "RE[2]: Now"
RIchard James13 Member since:
2007-10-26

Compare that to the awful mess that is in windows where i *gasp* download the drivers from the manufacturers website (or the driver cd), double click it, click next-finish a number of times and my mouse suddenly works.


Perhaps you take that issue up with your hardware manufacturers and not Linux. Seriously you can't expect Linux to magically work for all of your hardware if your hardware manufacturers are unwilling to work with Linux.

I mean if they treated MS Windows the same way they treat Linux would you be screaming why doesn't Microsoft fix this? Or would you complain to the hardware manufacturer?

Reply Parent Score: 6

RE[4]: Now
by kristoph on Sat 15th Dec 2007 18:43 in reply to "RE[3]: Now"
kristoph Member since:
2006-01-01

Perhaps you take that issue up with your hardware manufacturers and not Linux. Seriously you can't expect Linux to magically work for all of your hardware if your hardware manufacturers are unwilling to work with Linux.

I think the point here is that, even thought it is not the fault of Linux, the broad lack of such support will keep 'average' users from being able to adopt Linux.

]{

PS. I run Linux but, seriously, there is no way the vast majority of people could use it without geek support.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[4]: Now
by mk@tuco.de on Sat 15th Dec 2007 20:44 in reply to "RE[3]: Now"
mk@tuco.de Member since:
2007-01-23

Perhaps you take that issue up with your hardware manufacturers and not Linux. Seriously you can't expect Linux to magically work for all of your hardware if your hardware manufacturers are unwilling to work with Linux.


it is not beeing unwilling, it is a matter of profit.

From my point of view, any concept of bringing Linux to the masses connected with profit failed since 1992.

Reply Parent Score: 0

RE[3]: Now
by Vanders on Sat 15th Dec 2007 12:16 in reply to "RE[2]: Now"
Vanders Member since:
2005-07-06

Compare that to the awful mess that is in windows where i *gasp* download the drivers from the manufacturers website


So what you're saying is, it would be nice if hardware manufacturers supported Linux just as well as they supported Windows?

Given the level of zeal you wrote your post with I trust you've complained to your hardware manufacturer about their lack of support for Linux and that you'll purchase your hardware more carefully in future?

Reply Parent Score: 5

RE[3]: Now
by google_ninja on Sat 15th Dec 2007 15:50 in reply to "RE[2]: Now"
google_ninja Member since:
2006-02-05

IF your mouse is not set up automatically (it usually is), you can go into your xorg.conf file and change "Buttons" "2" to "Buttons" "3" or however many you have. It is simple and takes a few seconds, instead of trawling vendor websites.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[3]: Now
by pixel8r on Mon 17th Dec 2007 02:48 in reply to "RE[2]: Now"
pixel8r Member since:
2007-08-11

you think you need to do all that just to get 3 buttons working on a mouse? sure, you can make linux sound hard if you fill your post with a pack of lies.

I've not edited one config file by hand for quite some time. My mouse always works.

Lets look at what you just posted...

Compare that to the awful mess that is in windows where i *gasp* download the drivers from the manufacturers website (or the driver cd), double click it, click next-finish a number of times and my mouse suddenly works.


btw, good luck "clicking" next when your mouse doesn't work.

So in windows you would blame the manufacturer if it doesn't work yet in linux you blame linux? How is that fair?

Or maybe consider that my mouse works in linux with all buttons (not just 3) and I can scroll in any window without having to click (windows doesn't do that), and all of this WITHOUT having to download anything...

Which was the easier one again?

Maybe you need to check your hardware before expecting a free OS to magically support all of your obscure hardware. Until manufacturers start producing drivers for linux, this problem wont go away, and neither will people's ignorance on the issue.

Edited 2007-12-17 02:50

Reply Parent Score: 4

RE[4]: Now
by lemur2 on Mon 17th Dec 2007 06:24 in reply to "RE[3]: Now"
lemur2 Member since:
2007-02-17

I've not edited one config file by hand for quite some time. My mouse always works.


I had a logitec marble mouse. It worked automatically on first install of Ubuntu, but not all four buttons worked they way I wanted.

I did have to do a bit of research, and I did have to edit xorg.conf by hand. I found some posts on the web which showed me which text file to edit and how. I didn't have to actually type anything ... copy and paste from the web browser to the text editor worked just fine. It took about five minutes to research, and another five minutes to set up the way I liked. No command line involved.

Some bits of more obscure hardware take a little bit of configuration effort to accomodate on Linux. Nothing like what the OP posted, but all the same it would be nice if the manufacturer (Logitech) had included a Linux README file, rather than my having to research on Ubuntu forums what to do.

Reply Parent Score: 3