Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 24th Mar 2009 18:02 UTC, submitted by google_ninja
GNU, GPL, Open Source Eric S. Raymond is one of the three big figures in open source, together with Linus Torvalds and Richard Stallman. During a talk for the Long Island Linux User Group, he made some interesting statements about the GPL, namely that the GPL is no longer needed due to the way the open source movement works.
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RE[4]: ESR is a libertomoron
by JeffS on Tue 24th Mar 2009 23:43 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: ESR is a libertomoron"
JeffS
Member since:
2005-07-12

Good links that prove your points (more or less).

Especially the IQ thing. Only a racist would jump on IQ tests as proof of inferior intelligence of a discriminated minority, conveniently dismissing the influence economic and social conditions can have on said IQ scores.

Thus, ESR, while certainly not the blatent KKK type racist (by any means), appears to be more of a pseudo-intellectual, self describing non-racist, but really a
subtle racist.

The link on the Wiccan thing was interesting. I actually share some of ESR's experience in terms of scepticism for religious dogma, or organized religion in general, and finding some Eastern mysticism somewhat sensibile. But I certainly don't share this wiccan thing.

So, okay, ESR is a Witch (self described, card carrying), and a (subtle, but actual) racist (that he won't admit to others or himself). Add to that gun nut, and hardcore libertarian, and open source advocate.

But one things for sure - he is interesting.

Reply Parent Score: 2

Bill Shooter of Bul Member since:
2006-07-14

No, not really. His views are not the first I want to read on any subject. Nor are the collectively that unique or thought provoking.

Reply Parent Score: 2

google_ninja Member since:
2006-02-05

Yeah, he's also a fantastic writer, which is why I've read most of what he's written. I used to regularly read his blog until that post actually, which is when i jumped off board. I don't even know if he even is a racist, but he is ready to jump on any half brained bandwagon and ride the hell out of it without doing much questioning. I think that is what this whole thing is about, he's just realized the GPL is in direct opposition with his free-market libertarianism, so now he's gotta come up with a way to make it all fit. A few years ago he used to say that the GPL makes sense everywhere except for when you can make a strong business case against it, and even then it makes sense to gpl some bits, and keep the rest proprietary.

Unfortunately for him, the reactionary parts of the the linux world will probably totally despise everything he says for now on, and they are the ones that tend to form user groups that pay for people like him to come and talk.

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[5]: ESR is a libertomoron
by Denbish on Wed 25th Mar 2009 15:10 in reply to "RE[4]: ESR is a libertomoron"
Denbish Member since:
2009-03-25

Especially the IQ thing. Only a racist would jump on IQ tests as proof of inferior intelligence of a discriminated minority, conveniently dismissing the influence economic and social conditions can have on said IQ scores.

Thus, ESR, while certainly not the blatent KKK type racist (by any means), appears to be more of a pseudo-intellectual, self describing non-racist, but really a
subtle racist.


Sigh...Human biodiversity scientists claim that, after adjusting for economic and other disparities, There is still an IQ difference between particular ethnic groups that is too large to be statistical noise. There are still debates about the validity of General IQ as a measurement, but it's largely political since it actually corresponds really well with success across any ethnic group. There are still debates about if the statistical difference is genetic (it may be an unaccounted-for demographic characteristic.) There are not debates that intelligence is largely heritable, it is. There is general agreement that "races" are a social construct, but that ethnic groups are genetically distinct is not controversial.

People smarter and more qualified than us to debate the topic have serious disagreements about the issue. But one thing that does suck is that studying the link between IQ and genetics is going to put you dangerously close to breaching a social taboo, perhaps the worst in Anglosphere culture, being accused of being a "secret racist." Unfortunately even many scientists haven't avoided the oversocialization that causes them to question even the motives of someone interested in these topics, which just means that anyone legitimately interested in the topic is not likely going to be willing to risk their reputation over it. "Free Inquiry" indeed.

Reply Parent Score: 1

RE[6]: ESR is a libertomoron
by JeffS on Wed 25th Mar 2009 16:46 in reply to "RE[5]: ESR is a libertomoron"
JeffS Member since:
2005-07-12

What adjustments? And how were they applied?

Also, to make the theory, or data or stats, valid, it has to tested in different ways.

For instance, the IQ thing is saying African Americans score lower on IQ tests than say, Whites.

But does it take into account comparing IQ tests of Whites living in middle class or afluent neighborhoods as opposed to whites living in lower class areas?

It would be reasonable to suspect that the whites living in the lower class areas will score lower than the ones in the higheer class areas, due to different social, economic, and educational nurturing, conditions.

Same goes with African Americans. I would not be a bit surprised that blacks living in higher class areas score higher than blacks living in lower class areas.

There are many, many, other scenarios to take into account.

I also think that IQ tests have as much to do with how much an individual knows (accumulated knowledge), as with actual intelligence. Social context has huge influence as well.

Of course, that could all be BS, and perhaps these so called "scientists", or whoever these people are that are coming up with these stats, have taken all of that into account.

Thus, I think it's ridiculous to jump on these "studies" and start thinking that they show that certain ethnicities are inherently more or less intelligent than other ethnicities. I think doing so demonstrates a very subtle form of racism. I also think doing so is completely useless, because it can only lead to offending people or discriminating people. It can also lead to "tags" being put on people, and stunting their potential.

So you're best off dropping it. So is ESR.

Sorry for the thread hijack. ;-)

Reply Parent Score: 3

wanderingk88 Member since:
2008-06-26

You're more of an idiot if you really thinks IQ represents anything, or that intelligence is some sort of universal biological trait.

Most respectable sociologists and scientists wouldn't even be able to explain to you what intelligence actually means on an trans-subjective level, so how the hell do you propose to measure it in the first place?

Reply Parent Score: 1