Linked by Thom Holwerda on Fri 12th Jun 2009 13:55 UTC
Internet Explorer Yesterday, Microsoft dropped a bomb by announcing that all versions of Windows 7 released in Europe would ship without Internet Explorer pre-installed. This was in answer to the EU antitrust investigation currently under way regarding possible illegal bundling of Internet Explorer with Windows. The first reactions to this news are coming in, with Opera and the EU both lamenting the move.
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RE[2]: What does this tell us?
by sbergman27 on Fri 12th Jun 2009 17:14 UTC in reply to "RE: What does this tell us?"
sbergman27
Member since:
2005-07-24

1) Web statistics are obviously quite unreliable (and I'm not using w3c, but NetApps) - but you imply that they only cover home usage - which is nonsense,

I made no such claim. My claim is that you put too much credence into them. This point goes well beyond questions regarding the accuracy of the numbers. It extends to just what this sort of data is able to tell us at all. While business usage of public sites is no doubt covered... what do these statistics say about what happens after the employee logs into their warranty service provider account over at http://www.warrantycentral.net and starts trying to file warranty claims? Absolutely nothing. Have you even thought about that?

2) Your post makes a very grand assumption: namely, that companies want to change. This is of course very debatable, as companies are notoriously slow when it comes to change or adoption of new technologies,

My claim makes no such assumptions. The inertia of the companies providing the service started out as a symptom of the IE-domination problem, but has now become a very real and integral part of the total problem. But first things first. We need to address the root cause, i.e. IE-by-default, before any permanent fix at the level of the service provider is going to have a chance of happening, and more importantly, of sticking.

You are making it ever more apparent that you are not actually one of us folks in the trenches fighting and reporting on this battle. In fact, it seems that you want to deny that there *is* still a battle at all, because Chrome (mostly) works OK for you on your home desktop.

Edit: BTW, OSNews.com's textarea widget for editing a post is only 2 lines high on my webkit based browser. So I suppose I am posting on a site which is, itself, a part of the problem.

Edited 2009-06-12 17:20 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 3

Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

I made no such claim. My claim is that you put too much credence into them. This point goes well beyond questions regarding the accuracy of the numbers.


I don't see where I'm putting any credence in them being accurate - in fact, I quite clearly stated that they are not a very accurate way to measure this stuff. Still, they indicate trends, and all of them agree: IE's share is dwindling FAST.

It extends to just what this sort of data is able to tell us at all. While business usage of public sites is no doubt covered... what do these statistics say about what happens after the employee logs into their warranty service provider account over at http://www.warrantycentral.net and starts trying to file warranty claims? Absolutely nothing. Have you even thought about that?


So there's an IE-specific site. Sure, it's stupid, but how often do you encounter it? Maybe America is running behind or something, I don't now, but the rest of the world is pretty much free of that nonsense now. Maybe some insignificant ones, but that's it.

The inertia of the companies providing the service started out as a symptom of the IE-domination problem, but has now become a very real and integral part of the total problem. But first things first. We need to address the root cause, i.e. IE-by-default, before any permanent fix at the level of the service provider is going to have a chance of happening, and more importantly, of sticking.


This is EXACTLY what is going on RIGHT NOW. IE is no longer "the default" browser people use. It comes installed by default - yes - but the amount of people disregarding it is huge, and growing every month. Companies will follow through, but give them some time.

You can't change this simply by snapping a finger. This takes time. Have some patience. There is no magic instant cure.

You are making it ever more apparent that you are not actually one of us folks in the trenches fighting and reporting on this battle. In fact, it seems that you want to deny that there *is* still a battle at all, because Chrome (mostly) works OK for you on your home desktop.


Will you please stop being so arrogant and condescending? It detracts from your otherwise usually good arguments.

Reply Parent Score: 2

sbergman27 Member since:
2005-07-24

So there's an IE-specific site. Sure, it's stupid, but how often do you encounter it?

https://www.4emweb.com/Default.asp
http://warrantycentral.net
http://www.servicechannel.com/sc/login/client_login.asp
http://www.ajantunes.com/stores/roundup_food_equipment/
http://servicebench.com
http://manage.cpostores.com

Just a few business critical sites (off the top of my head and hardly a comprehensive list), that 60 of my users at just *one* of my customer sites have to worry about... oh... every working day.

Chrome works for you on the sites you like. And if a site doesn't play well, you have the luxury of saying "f--k'em" and not visiting that site. And based upon that you declare victory on behalf of us all.

But you keep missing that point, and mistaking my strong disagreement with your cavalier, overconfident, and complacent attitude, based upon my substantial first hand experience, with "arrogance".

Thom, there is a whole world on the web that your experience obviously does not bring you into contact with. And it is one which Microsoft cares a lot more about than what you use to browse Twitter and Blogspot.

Edited 2009-06-12 18:17 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2