Linked by Thom Holwerda on Thu 9th Jun 2011 18:51 UTC
Internet & Networking It's official now. The signs had been there for a while now. While the west bangs on about the importance of freedom and democracy, they don't actually want anyone to have too much of it. The US, France, and the UK have jointly pretty much declared war on freedom on the web.
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RE[7]: Goofy duffas.
by jabjoe on Fri 10th Jun 2011 20:08 UTC in reply to "RE[6]: Goofy duffas."
jabjoe
Member since:
2009-05-06

Right..... You know you are using god knows how much copyleft software right now right? Linux might be a copy of Unix, but there is a lot of innovation going on there all the time. It's left the other Unix kernels way behind. Right now on the desktop GUI on Linux there is a lot of innovation. I think much of it is barking mad, but it's still innovation. There is loads that started in the free software world and was only noticed when the closed world repackaged it. Apple are masters at this. There is plenty of cases where the closed world is playing catch up with the open world. There is also some great stuff happening under Creative Commons (not least Wikipedia!). Jamendo is really cool. Where copyleft can't be competed with is in incremental improvement. The freedoms it gives ensure it can't be sat on to go stale. But there is still revolutions on something instead of evolution. It could well be where I'm looking, but it's plain copyright that seams to be where the stale stuff is. This is just beginning to leak out of computers into other fields. Exciting times. :-)

Edited 2011-06-10 20:08 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[8]: Goofy duffas.
by pantheraleo on Fri 10th Jun 2011 20:37 in reply to "RE[7]: Goofy duffas."
pantheraleo Member since:
2007-03-07

Linux might be a copy of Unix, but there is a lot of innovation going on there all the time. It's left the other Unix kernels way behind.


Oh really? I'd argue the SunOS kernel is still way ahead of the Linux kernel. And most of the so called "innovation" in the Linux kernel was actually developed by Sun and graciously released under an open source licence that allowed Linux to implement it. DTrace would be a very good example. I would also argue that ZFS is a better file system than anything currently available for Linux. Once again, a port of ZFS to Linux is in the works. But it's not ready yet. And even when it is ready, like DTrace, Linux didn't innovate anything. They just copied (legally because Sun allowed it) innovation from Sun Microsystems.

Right now on the desktop GUI on Linux there is a lot of innovation.


Really? I'd argue that GNOME is currently around five years behind Windows, and at least seven years behind Mac when it comes to the desktop. When Windows 8 and OS X Lion come out, I'd argue that gets closer to 10 years behind. KDE is doing a little better than GNOME. But not much.

There is loads that started in the free software world and was only noticed when the closed world repackaged it.


Like what?

Apple are masters at this. There is plenty of cases where the closed world is playing catch up with the open world.


I'll ask again. Like what?

There is also some great stuff happening under Creative Commons (not least Wikipedia!).


Sure. Wikipedia is great project. But it's not innovative. It's not like new and fascinating research is being published on Wikipedia. It's just a public repository of existing information. It has the advantage that it can be updated instantly, and there are a ton of contributors. But that's both a blessing and a curse. There's a lot of inaccurate and uncited information Wikipedia. (personally, I think Wikipedia should just delete when something isn't cited instead of say [citation needed], and they should delete "some people think" statements instead of saying [who?]. But that's an argument for another time)

Where copyleft can't be competed with is in incremental improvement. The freedoms it gives ensure it can't be sat on to go stale.


There's a ton of copyleft software out there is very stale and hasn't been updated in years. Many of the authors simply got bored and moved onto other projects and such. And there's some that just plain doesn't work very well anymore.

Tried installing Ruby on Rails 3 on OS X 10.6 lately? Try that if you want a major exercise in frustration. It's really sad, given that Mac was, at least at one time, the platform of choice for Rails developers. A commercial company selling traditional copyrighted software couldn't get away with that. They'd have to make it work for me because my business support contract with them requires that they do.

Edited 2011-06-10 20:43 UTC

Reply Parent Score: 2

RE[9]: Goofy duffas.
by jabjoe on Fri 10th Jun 2011 22:51 in reply to "RE[8]: Goofy duffas."
jabjoe Member since:
2009-05-06

I'd argue the SunOS kernel is still way ahead of the Linux kernel.


Well, your wrong. If you even try and keep up you will see there is a constant flood going into Linux. Yes features of other OSs get copied in, and that's good. The latest is the dcache changes which is pretty neat.

Gnome3 and Unity are way out there is newness. However, I still prefer old Gnome2 and Xfce, for me a simple old fashioned desktop is what I want. I don't want it reinvented.

Most of OS-X is lifted from free software, ok not copyleft, but free software. The App store is nothing but a half baked package management with a nice GUI and paying system. In fact package management can do for both examples. I don't think their is anything that is closed that is close to Debian's system wide package management.

You must have seen the studies comparing Wikipedia accuracy with other encyclopaedias. It comes out well, so the model does work.

Of course this bad and/or stale copyleft software. But on the whole, it's winning. It owns the small (embedded, phones, GPS, routers, settop boxes, etc) and the large (server, supercomputers, etc).

Any got to go.

Reply Parent Score: 2