“If Sun does not get its act together and light a fire under the JCP, it might find itself losing the tiny battles that make up its war with .NET. Letting Java stagnate will open doors for .NET that Java might never again be able to enter.” Read the editorial at NewsFactor by Vincent Ryan.
Is Java Finished?
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
Java is cross-platform, i believe it will survive just fine…
it is .net that will fall on its face, along with mickysoft…
What they seem to be missing is that largely no succesfull language survives getting features bolted on every other year. These kinds of things need stability, not everything can be Python (which appears to double in size every 18 months
Java is still the better technology, the more robust and mature technology.
Besides, do you think the entire OS community will ever adopt .NET, even if Mono doesn’t just fall off the face of the earth and Java does go away? No, the OS community will just develop something new and better.
Java may be more robust and mature, but it’s definitely not better technology. The good news for java developers is that .NET competition is providing incentive for Sun to correct some language features that they dropped the ball on.
As far as the the “OS community” comment goes, you seem to fall in the trap that many open source zealots fall into, which is that anything that open source does is inherently superior to proprietary technology. That’s just ridiculous and shows you’re just a fanboy. Developing some “new” technology from scratch to compete with .NET would take years and years to complete the underlying technology, languages, libraries…
Personally, I don’t understand what the hell Java was useful for before .NET came along (other than to write cross platform apps that were extremely slow).
But now, it’s like we gotta keep Java alive as a contender to .NET. But seriously .. I have to sit back and wonder if the disease in this case is really worse than the cure …
Truly, this is a lose/lose situation for users. The only people that win in this case are programmers who are too lazy to write cross-platform apps natively, and the rest of us will suffer because of it.
Java compile to native please!
You’re right, that whole internet thing is a fad anyway. No one would need to write programs for it.
JAVA was never meant to be used for every application, it was meant to be the ultra in crossplatform, and it is.
java and flash could both die for all i care
Any app that uses 300+MB of RAM and 100% CPU time has got to go. (Multiple applications using Java 1.3.x on multiple platforms. I believe that I still have screenshots too.)
Compiling Java to native code has been around for sometime now: <a href=http://gcc.gnu.org/java/>http://gcc.gnu.org/java/
The only benefit is startup speed – the new JVMs that SUN distributes actually compiles freq. used code to native and ‘caches’ it and it does it quite well. Comparing run time speed difference between compiled and byte code in Java is almost indistinguishable. So, like I said – compiling java is only good for startup.
is it just me – or does someone else find the title of this thread somewhat stupid. Would you ever say .. “Is C++ Finished” – NO, stuff is constantly added to the STL etc.
java is one of my favorite programming languages, it can be used to develop an app that will look the same on every OS and with javascript you can make xml powerful. as far as the 300 megs of ram and 100% cpu, i could write a c program that does the same, poor coding is poor coding on any platform.
Personally, I don’t understand what the hell Java was useful for before .NET came along (other than to write cross platform apps that were extremely slow).
Obviously you are a) not a developer, and b) don’t have a lot of experience with Java. Actually, it is unfair for me to pass judgement on you based on a one sentence comment, so I apologize for that, but the truth is that people use Java everyday and don’t even know it. That’s how it should be. Users should just use the apps and shouldn’t know, or be concerned with what it’s written in. Java may not be the best tool for making desktop applications (although it is a thousand times better at it than it used to be), but as many before me have said, Java really shines on the server, which is where most people deploy it now days.
But now, it’s like we gotta keep Java alive as a contender to .NET. But seriously .. I have to sit back and wonder if the disease in this case is really worse than the cure …
So, is .NET the disease or the cure? Since C# is such a blatant clone of Java, I get their roles mixed up all the time.
Truly, this is a lose/lose situation for users. The only people that win in this case are programmers who are too lazy to write cross-platform apps natively, and the rest of us will suffer because of it.
It doesn’t have anything to do with laziness, it’s about picking and using the right tool for the job, in my opinion.
With the speed of computers these days, and the tremendous amounts of memory that they come with, I really don’t see a need, nor a benefit, to writing everything natively in C or C++ anymore (libraries yes, but full apps no). Clearly this is my opinion and one that may not be shared by others.
java is one of my favorite programming languages, it can be used to develop an app that will look the same on every OS
One of the main problems I have with Java is that it DOES look/feel the same in every OS, instead of looking/behaving like a native app does/should – it just doesn’t integrate well with the OS. I could be running 10 different apps, 9 native and 1 Java – the Java app will stick out like a sore thumb. This is a big prob with Java apps, even more so than speed. Even compiling them natively would not solve this.
running limewire takes up on average 1% of my cpu, the spikes max out at 8% for me. running amd 2100. nothing wrong with java.
@Clinton
I completely agree with everything you said. I personally love java. I have never understood why people don’t understand why Java is so great. True multiply platform independence. Great libraries. Great documentation. Overall speed good. Easy of development (why do people constantly insist it is so hard??? only want-a-bee developers would say that).
Oh … did I mention great libraries.
The real battle is IBM java/eclipse/websphere vs. Sun javabean. And IBM is winning that one.
Java’s a good language in terms of clashing with the Industry’s braindeadness. For example, garbage collection — the 2nd oldest surviving language had it (lisp). But it wasn’t popular until Java; for half a century people sat around allocating and deallocating memory by hand.
The type system is also pretty sound. No buffer overflows with Java, assuming you run a sound JVM.
In terms of clashing with .NET… whatever. This is uninteresting bullshit that you read in the newspaper.
Yes, while I’d like to agree that it is an application issue upgrading to 1.4 resolved the issues. Some of the other issues I would have were application instability no scroll wheel, all sorts of weird stuff. Seems v1.4.x resolved these as well. While Limewire is a great example, it’s by no means a complex enterprise application.
So, you are saying that MS can develop a new technology just about overnight, but the OS community cannot?
Fanboy? Gotta love that comment. Shows your ignorance. Did I say it would be ‘inherently’ better? Inherently implies context, given source. No, I said it would be better because that was has historically come out of the OS community.
Back to the topic at hand. Java, being more robust and mature, not to mention reliable, secure and scalable DOES make it the better technology. I am not sure what “criteria” you use to determine the best technology, but you must not use the same criteria that developers use.
The writer of this article forgets how many that matter hate the monopoly that is ms.
Haven’t we heard stuff like this for years? I remember back in ’97 hearing all sorts of predictions that Java would ‘die’, ‘fail’, and what not. Hasn’t happened yet, has it?
There is a lot of code floating around that is written in Java. Most universities now teach Java to students. Like it or not, Java is a popular language. Decades down the road, there will still be a need for Java programmers. Its going to be really difficult to ‘finish’ Java. I mean, take a look at COBOL…..
Java is set-top box technology that was dotcommed to run on servers and PC’s, environments that Java was never designed to work in.
So of course today we find Java works well on phones and nothing else.
By the time Microsoft has .NET 3.1 shipping, no one will be using Java anymore. The language is limiting, it’s an old and flawed design, and it is owned by Sun, a company that has no clue about making software.
Java is simply not made for anything except slowing down hardware, requiring tons of expensive consultants, requiring more modeling and other tools than any other language, and being dumbed down enough to enable software to be offshored, something Sun really loves to do
Java’s peak of hype was in the dotcom era. Java is over, slowly dying. Everyone except for Sun can see it.
One of the main problems I have with Java is that it DOES look/feel the same in every OS, instead of looking/behaving like a native app does/should – it just doesn’t integrate well with the OS. I could be running 10 different apps, 9 native and 1 Java – the Java app will stick out like a sore thumb. This is a big prob with Java apps, even more so than speed. Even compiling them natively would not solve this.
@Darius
Not if you write you applications correctly
see the below link for more info:
http://java.sun.com/products/jfc/
This has been around for a LONG time. The only thing that is new is GTK and WinXP look/feel.
from a developer’s perspective, the problem is not so much Java, but with Sun. they put a lot of effort into hot-topic libraries (telecoms, for example) and marketing (what the hell is SunOne? and why?).
on the other hand – they leave and let rot bit of Java they once thought would be a good idea. I’m currently trying to do some graphics with the Java Adcanced Imaging. By virtue of OOp, its nice … when it works. Else its full of bugs and has been in a beta state since years ago. and the mailing lists are dominated by @sun types who berate any criticism.
A language is built on foundations. A tall building may be built – and Java can certainly go high with JAIN, J2EE, and all that fancy stuff… but if base is rotting… that’s bad.
Some thing are pretty basic and need to be fixed. Why cast to an Object type when the VM should really know what object type it is … (ObjectA) list.get(10)….
as someone who has used a variety of languages… i find that its not C++ vs Java. They both occupy different domains in problem space. Different tools for different jobs.
No-one can save Java, except Sun. And they need to stop believeing their own hype that Java will save the world, recognise where it is weak, swallow some pride and do something about it. If not – someone else will.
This article is FUD both ways, but the thing I find most amusing is the perception that .NET is some kind of turbocharged Visual Basic, and that developers just point and click and fill in the blanks and voilà, an app.
Rubbish. In the article, the author quotes someone who says:
Java’s philosophy of development is to expose low-level system interfaces to give developers greater control. Microsoft simplifies the development process; the developer has less control — but the tools are easier to use.
In regards to .NET, this is one of the most ill-informed statements I’ve ever read. It may have been true of MS before .NET, but the .NET Framework exposes a set of libraries that are very much functionally equivalent to Java’s.
I like both Java and .NET. But .NET is not some kind of Java For Dummies. It’s an environment every bit as rich, with APIs every bit as “low-level” as dipshit indicated for Java.
Howdy
Some thing are pretty basic and need to be fixed. Why cast to an Object type when the VM should really know what object type it is … (ObjectA) list.get(10)….
This is now fixed in Java 1.5 :0)
The main problem with java is that it does unfortunately seem to have bit rot, why i`m not sure but the focus is definately on new features and not removing bloat and bugs.
The speed of Java is often mis-reported as being quite slow but in fact it is not in many cases, bad coding will destroy an app written in any language you care to mention.
Apart from bad programing Java compilers/JVMs have a long way to go in terms of maturity and optimisation, just take a look at what happened with a natively compiled eclipse, this should be the focus of Sun and not just new features.
As for Java vs .NET, does it even matter ? honestly we now have Mono (not the disease yuch!), .GNU, .SUN and .WHOEVERELSE in the end it`s all the same, someone will write a wrapper allowing one thing to talk to another why loose sleep over it ?
One of the main problems I have with Java is that it DOES look/feel the same in every OS, instead of looking/behaving like a native app does/should – it just doesn’t integrate well with the OS. I could be running 10 different apps, 9 native and 1 Java – the Java app will stick out like a sore thumb. This is a big prob with Java apps, even more so than speed. Even compiling them natively would not solve this.
You say Java, but you’re talking about a particular toolkit for Java, Swing. You’re not forced to use to use Swing when creating a Java application, there’s also SWT (IBM’s toolkit), wx4j (wxWindows bindings) and others. SWT even uses GTK2 on Linux. Also Swing has a pluggable look and feel, programs don’t have to use the default metal (Limewire doesn’t for example).
Java compile to native please!
Where’s the point in that? The very nature of Java is crossplatform compability.
How many times is Java being reported dead or dying now? This is getting really boring.
People don’t understand the power of Java because they actually don’t understand what kind of development Java is suited for. All these kiddies want to write a cool irc-client, mail reader, etc to show to all their friends, and these programs have to look, execute and behave like native windows programs. They don’t understand the concept of using the right tool for the right job.
Javas strengths lies (amongs other things) in enterprise-wide development. Java does not do very well for desktop applications IMO, at least not for people that expects windows natives.
“”So, you are saying that MS can develop a new technology just about overnight, but the OS community cannot? “”
Corporate startup time vs OSS startup time is going to be better.
Eg MS can just throw a few hundred developers onto a project and design can begin immediately. An OSS project is either gonna have to actually go out and hunt down competent people to join the project, or have _extremely_ talented founders, drawing up the design if they want to match that startup speed.
Over the long haul though, they probably come out around even.
***
In other news: “Is C finished?” :>
From my exprienece Java is more robust stable and sclalable that .net. We have tried .Net and .Net falls short just like VB it is still 5 years behind Java like windows is always behind Unix/Linux.
>By the time Microsoft has .NET 3.1 shipping, no one will be using Java anymore.
That explains why my FORTUNE 25 company has just begun moving our whole formerly MS Based shop running VB, VC++ etc.. to Java Technologies using IBM Websphere and BEA Weblogic. Yep…Java is dead.
———–
That explains why according to Gartner, Java is the #1 language in the world taught to students. Yep..Java is dying..
A significant development for Java is the recent decision by The College Board that the AP (Advanced Placement) Computer Science curriculum be revised to include object orientation and to use Java as the delivery language for the AP Computer Science Examinations, beginning with the 2003-2004 academic year. Yep…Java is dead.
———–
techies.com, an Internet IT recruiting site, recently culled through its database of job openings and came up with this list of the top 10 programming skills most often cited:
1. C++
2. Java
3. HTML
4. SQL
5. JavaScript
6. C
7. Perl
8. XML
9. VB Script
10. PL/SQL
Where is C#? Yep…Java is dead..
———-
According to TODAY on Amazon.com… the most popular Computer Programming books being purchased RIGHT NOW are:
1. C++ How to Program (4th Edition)
2. Java How to Program, Fifth Edition
The ***first reference to ANYTHING .NET *** or Microsoft on Amazons best seller list occurs at #17 – Programming Microsoft Visual Basic .NET (Core Reference) which is even 2 behind #15 – Programming Perl.
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/new-for-you/top-sellers/-/book…
Yep.. Java is dead.
I assume the point of compiling Java is having lower memory footprint, especially when running multiple Java apps.
Java is popular now. But I said nothing about now. I am talking about the future.
And the crystal ball says Java will dry up and blow away over time. It will be very clear in 5 years that Java is not the best choice.
It is easy and cheap to laugh at Microsoft when they are just beginning something (Windows 1.0 / .NET 1.0), but when they get going, they are unstoppable.
If Microsoft conformed to standard rather than creating their own API on the run then we *COULD* have multi-platform applications without too many issues. If I write an application for Linux/GTK, I can move it to Solaris, HP-UX, IRIX, UNIXWare, OpenServer, and MacOS X w/ X11/GTK, however, when it comes to Windows, well, lets put it this way, trying to get it running would be like seperating heaven and earth.
I assume the point of compiling Java is having lower memory footprint, especially when running multiple Java apps.
No all java programs are compiled, they are compiled into whats called byte code, this is completely platform independant and runs in a Java virtual Machine (JVM).
Natively compiling it is totally different, there is still a JVM in there for memory handling but most code is directly compiled to machine code and runs directly on the processor.
Note: this is a glossed over version, if you want to learn more google for it :0)
No all java programs are compiled, they are compiled into whats called byte code, this is completely platform independant and runs in a Java virtual Machine (JVM).
Yes, I am aware of the difference and used loose terminology. The diff between “compiled code” and interpreted is rather fuzzy though; Java sourcecode is compiled into bytecode, which is then interpreted. Just-in-time compilation complicates the issue further, since it can be regarded as an interpretation optimization.
So notions of compiling and interpreting are thrown out the window if you’re talking about the whole process.
Natively compiling it is totally different, there is still a JVM in there for memory handling but most code is directly compiled to machine code and runs directly on the processor.
Yes, the point is that IIRC, JVM-sharing isn’t implemented yet by Sun for stability or other reasons. Therefore, the footprint of 10 bytecode java apps will likely be larger than 10 natively compiled apps, since there isn’t much sharing.
Yes, the point is that IIRC, JVM-sharing isn’t implemented yet by Sun for stability or other reasons. Therefore, the footprint of 10 bytecode java apps will likely be larger than 10 natively compiled apps, since there isn’t much sharing.
This is definitely not the case. Try running a Natively compiled app, and watch Windows Task manager. See the memory usage grow *more* compared to an app running under a JVM.
I think as Anonamoose mentioned, there is a JVM being linked in with each application. However, because it isn’t linked as a runtime library, there is a copy in each executable. So much for natively compiling for a small footprint.
All the info above is based on my experience with Excelsior-JET. It is arguably the best native compiler for Java out there, and quite frankly, I’m not impressed. Java has its performance flaws, but I’m pretty sure natively compiling application isn’t going to solve anything.
I think as Anonamoose mentioned, there is a JVM being linked in with each application. However, because it isn’t linked as a runtime library, there is a copy in each executable. So much for natively compiling for a small footprint.
Ahh, now I see his point. Thank you both.
I suppose I could write an app server to execute stuff in a single JVM, if I wanted to play loose. I’d just have to make sure to catch all those exit() calls using the security manager. As well as deal with any other global things.
Does any one know if the Sun JVM saves the resulting native code in a disk cache ?
There was talk of this a while ago and also i remember something about it maybe in C# ?
It looks like Java is a lot healthier than .Net IMO.
Most windows developers still use VBscript & ASP, like in the
“old days”, in some kind of compatibility mode. They could
run it in old Win98 and WinNT4 as well.
DG
Gotta give the trolls something to talk about besides BSD!!
What is this with MS programmers so afraid of Java?
Look, if you learn the new VB.NET and C#.NET,
then you can easily cross over to Java with no difficulty.
So, if Microsoft loses the Java/.Net war,
you will still be able to get a job.
Java is not going to go away.
It’s a solid stable high productivity solution used by the largest corporations in the world. Companies that value mainframe and micro stability and a Long Term return on investment.
Even in your worst nightmare, .Net losing, Microsoft can just pick up the phone and ask SUN if they can get back on the bus. It’s not like SUN is going to turn down Microsoft from returning to the pack. They need the money.
The world is a changed place.
With the latest Slammer and Blaster worms,
companies are more and more questioning what the get from Microsoft software. Using Java allows them to develop expensive systems, with the assurance that they can move to another platform if Microsoft can’t or won’t resolve it’s security issues.
Here’s the real problem with Microsoft.
My company has an 10’s of million dollar investment in a VB6/ASP/com solution. Converting to .Net is an expensive time consuming endeavor, that will yield my client Zero return on investment. We have external imposed deadlines we must meet with the product. There isn’t time to pause and do a .Net rewrite.
– We don’t appreciate MS stopping VB6/ASP patches and fixes, to say the least.
– We don’t like MS betting the company and completely changing the technology we depend on.
If we do Upgrade, Java is a serious contender, because
it’s been STABLE, the bug fixes are released, upgrades are not revolutionary. They do spend a Lot of Time in Design in the JCP. That’s a huge advantage, in that the quality of the design will exceed the MS alternative. Also, it won’t be outdated by a “newer” design.
Using Microsoft software, seems to show MS uses two design teams, Team A and Team B. Team A does design 1. Three years later Team B rips out Team A’s work with design 2. Then team B comes back and changes the design again. ADO is a good example. This yields me Zero productivity improvement. It’s just Database access code. I need database access code to stay the same for years.
On a personal note,
when I do my development, I’m not looking for the latest cutting edge solution, so I don’t expect there to be problems with software and concepts that have been out for at least 2 years. With Microsoft, I always run into serious flaws, untested and unworking code. With Sun I never do.
No, 1 serious bug in 5 years.
In Canada, Microsoft actively “donates” money to schools/universities that will teach their programming languages. There was a huge uproar at University of Waterloo when the President agrees to change to C# from C, for a First year engineering course for one million dollars. Luckily for them, the course change failed to go through the proper academic channels (i.e. no one asked the professor).
At my college, they were teaching Java the year before this occurred. Then they too suddenly switched to C#. Why? The college never said anything but its easy to read between the lines.
Look, if you learn the new VB.NET and C#.NET,
then you can easily cross over to Java with no difficulty.
C#.NET yes, VB.NET no. Java is highly object-oriented.
C#.NET yes, VB.NET no. Java is highly object-oriented.
VB.NET has been greatly updated. It is a real object-oriented language now, just like C#. Only the syntax is different. Just take a look at the example code provided by MS.
I suppose I could write an app server to execute stuff in a single JVM, if I wanted to play loose. I’d just have to make sure to catch all those exit() calls using the security manager. As well as deal with any other global things.
There’s something called Echidna, which can be found at http://www.javagroup.org/echidna/ . It allows you to run many Java programs from a single instance of the VM. Pretty cool idea, and I wonder why Sun hasn’t adopted it yet.
RE: Struggler (IP: 65.196.111.—) – Posted on 2003-09-06 14:42:09
Here’s the real problem with Microsoft.
My company has an 10’s of million dollar investment in a VB6/ASP/com solution. Converting to .Net is an expensive time consuming endeavor, that will yield my client Zero return on investment. We have external imposed deadlines we must meet with the product. There isn’t time to pause and do a .Net rewrite.
– We don’t appreciate MS stopping VB6/ASP patches and fixes, to say the least.
– We don’t like MS betting the company and completely changing the technology we depend on.
You have to understand the Microsoft metality. For some reason they assume that businesses can suddenly, out of the blue, upgrade form Windows 2000 to Windows XP without ANY justification, they also assume that suddenly coders can whip out a ported version of the VB6 code 100% free of bugs.
Microsoft unfortunately lives in a reality distortion field. Whilst you guys are coding your behinds off, Microsoft is thinking of the next buzz word compliant gadget which they hope will stun CEO’s so much that they will deploy it immediately without any consideration in relation to the benefits it may bring.
If we do Upgrade, Java is a serious contender, because
it’s been STABLE, the bug fixes are released, upgrades are not revolutionary. They do spend a Lot of Time in Design in the JCP. That’s a huge advantage, in that the quality of the design will exceed the MS alternative. Also, it won’t be outdated by a “newer” design.
Assuming that your company is of a reasonable size, there is nothing stopping you from actually JOINING the JCP process so that YOUR concerns are heard rather than being told by Microsoft to buzz off and don’t come back until you have a turn over of $100billion and spend money rediculously on unneeded software.
Using Microsoft software, seems to show MS uses two design teams, Team A and Team B. Team A does design 1. Three years later Team B rips out Team A’s work with design 2. Then team B comes back and changes the design again. ADO is a good example. This yields me Zero productivity improvement. It’s just Database access code. I need database access code to stay the same for years.
One would ask, what is wrong with ODBC? or its Java equivilant, JDBC, or would that be way to logical for Microsoft?
Regarding to .NET deployments, I have yet to see one substaintial deployment of .NET. Telstra? J2EE, Air New Zealand? J2EE, Telecom NZ (and a Microsoft “partner”)? J2EE. The list goes on and on and on. Why do people want Java? because it isn’t trendy, it isn’t marketed as the “hip” and “cool” alternative, it is marketed as a solution that works and delivers REAL results no market buzz word speak such as, “agile business”, “1 degree of seperation”, both which make absolutely no sense what so ever.
Microsoft is all about smoke, mirrors, MSDN conferences with mega bass music and a hyped up “technology evangelist” jumping around the stage like a teenager at a rave on speed. Worst still, CEO’s who have apparently meant to have skills to be able to look beyond the hype are sucked into this reality distortion field. Who gets all the praise *IF* the transition is good? the CEO, if everything turns to sh*t, the IS staff are the ones who get blamed EVEN IF they warn management of a potentially high failure rate.
Just FINISHED my Java project. Oh wait, that isn’t what they are saying.
Funny that http://www.dice.com has twice as many Java jobs than C++ or .NET.
Why does Osnews post stupid articles like this?
Funny you say that. I for one am all in favor of using the best tool for the job.
Every new project should have an analysis stage before design commences to determine which language is best suited feature-wise to the project or product deployment and functionality. If your project is potentially worth millions of dollars it is worth the time. If you’re just making small applications, stick with what you know.
A lack of objectivity illustrates ignorance and bias. Something which a lot of the people on this forum are doing themselves.
Java is a better choice than .Net, end of story.
It is possible to criticize both Java and .Net for not incorporating generic programming into the original design of the classes, especially the containers and algorithms. Because of this, Standard C++ is still the cutting edge language (for advanced programmers).
It’s possible to replace both Java and .Net. IBM could do that, but it would be a lot of work, however IBM does have the open source community backing it up. IBM has the most talent on it’s team.
Whoever thinks that Java is dead, especially if they think that it is replaced by .Net is just plain stupid.
—-So of course today we find Java works well on phones and nothing else.
Oh, boy, from where you finally found your ‘SO’?
no thing else? please do not show your dirty butt to cry for beating.
—-By the time Microsoft has .NET 3.1 shipping, no one will be using Java anymore.
Who are you? Whom do you think you are? Are you dreaming or threating or promising? Will you fire a atmic bomber at that time?
you should know MS is just FOLLOWING JAVA, its most powerful weapon is windows, which you seems really love but you do not know.
—-it’s an old and flawed design.
Your words show your shalow brain. Java is time-tested, and practice-proved. Java has been redesigned. Why not you shout at your father, just because you are younger, he should die at your birth? and you can get his money!
—-Everyone except for Sun can see it.
You must be learning in the beforeschool. It is not your fault do not know, but it is your shame to expose your fault to public without using your white brain—which was wasted.
It’s obvious to me that many of the people posting are either clueless or have never used a recent version of Java.
Java is an excellent programming language. It will only see more use. C# is not bad, either, but the itch has already been scratched – I do not see Java going away because of a little competition.
-Erwos
It does seem that people who actually program and aren’t die hard unix weenies that just love things to be hard, the ‘computers are meant to be difficult to use’ crowd, see that Java is a useful and very satisfactory language to use for many applications.
Thank you to everyone who sees sense and doesn’t just slam a language they probably have never even used.
They use java in their phones
for games and apps
Maybe is a joke that java is dead but microsoft gonna try to push the .net in that space (mobiles phones) too , you know Orange is gonna sell msphones and there will be .net on thouse i think .
http://zdnet.com.com/2100-1104_2-5071669.html
So there is some heat for java but is far to be dead ™