“The rift between IBM and Microsoft over Web services widened further over the weekend when Web services evangelists from each company clashed over the relative merits of .Net and Java 2 Enterprise Edition (J2EE) for building applications that can talk to each other over the Internet.” Read the rest of the story at ZDNews.
IBM, Microsoft Clash Over .Net and Java
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
FROM THE ARTICLE – “…Microsoft’s stance is that one language does not fit all. “We are letting third parties build support for Cobol, Java and all the other languages in .Net,”
That’s retarded. All of their langugae support is compiled down to CLR so in essence they are doing nothing more that pascal to C, and other such converters have done for a long time. They just make it automatic. Whooptydo. Besides, for what it’s worth (nothing in my opinion) there are many more languages supported by Sun’s JVM than MS is currently supporting.
Who wants to write web crap in Cobol anyway?
ALSO FROM THE ARTICLE – “…C# is not difficult to learn since it is based on current languages.”
Yes, Java. Just learn a couple of different keywords and off you go.
I will freely admit, however, that I do like the way C# deals with threads.
…Two computer industry behemoths engaged in a contest today, both claiming to be able to piss farther than than then other…
Sorry, I’ll put my money on Microsoft.
“The IBM approach, he said, is that companies need to build Web services on an open framework that can be completely extensible.”
So, uhhh .. what if you’re not building web services, then what? I guess you’re shit out of luck?
Speaking from an end user’s point of view, the last thing I want is for all my desktop apps to run off of some friggin’ web page. What happened to just ordinary .exe files that ran straight from your computer? Is that going the way of console apps? And if not, can you use Java to program these kinds of apps with full-featured GUIs and have it run at a respectable speed on all platforms? Can Java really be the solution to everyone’s problem(s)? Can one language really do it all?
But, perhaps I’m just misinformed about all this new technology, which is probably the case.
Aside from an easy way to build web services, .NET gives developers a much more powerful platform to build desktop apps as well. More out-of-the-box functionality than Windows devs have ever seen.
’nuff said
“But, perhaps I’m just misinformed…..”
M$ clients are ALWAYS misinformed.
Though I am not a big fan of Microsoft, I am a fan of Visual Basic and I learned BASIC programming from it some years ago. Of course I now use REALbasic to write Mac and Windows programs (working on one now).
Of course I am still in the fog with this whole .NET thing… but one thing I think that Microsoft is not realizing that Java has already made a foot hold in the programming world and is taught in computer science at colleges and universities. Java is alo getting excepted widely by the whole computing industry. I ran accross a website that is even building interfaces for mission critical systems with Java, something a couple years ago I would not even take serious, but it is happening!
I think once Microsoft can get away from it’s selfish attitude and be more of a team player in the industry (without throwing around its monopoly fists) then the industry might adopt whatever they got to offer… Microsoft is very good at further developing programming languages, now just play fair with the rest of the kids huh?!
how about this…
Though I am not a big fan of Microsoft, I am a fan of Visual Basic and I learned BASIC programming from it some years ago. Of course I now use REALbasic to write Mac and Windows programs (working on one now).
Of course I am still in the fog with this whole .NET thing… but one thing I think that Microsoft is not realizing that Java has already made a foot hold in the programming world and is taught in computer science at colleges and universities. Java is also getting accepted widely by the whole computing industry. I ran accross a website that is even building interfaces for mission critical systems with Java, something a couple years ago I would not even take serious, but it is happening!
I think once Microsoft can get away from it’s selfish attitude and be more of a team player in the industry (without throwing around its monopoly fists) then the industry might adopt whatever they got to offer… Microsoft is very good at further developing programming languages, now just play fair with the rest of the kids huh?!
spell checking and grammar anyone he he 🙂
… 6 months to 2 years for all the VB programmers to write their apps in .Net. Really, if I were a VB programmer, and thank god I’m not, and I were writing console apps. Why would I spend 6months to 2 years learning a newer version of the language, instead of just sticking with vb6, since ms will probably be supporting it for a long time coming anyway.
#… 6 months to 2 years for all the VB programmers to
#write their apps in .Net. Really, if I were a VB
#programmer, and thank god I’m not, and I were writing
#console apps. Why would I spend 6months to 2 years
#learning a newer version of the language, instead of just
#sticking with vb6, since ms will probably be supporting
#it for a long time coming anyway.
anyone needs 6 months to pick up a new language when he/she already knows one programming language should abandon programming altogether. Admittedly, C# is a very clean and sufficiently efficient language. It should take those who already know a programming language less than a week to be able to write nift code in C#.
I asked my friend who’s employer uses MS products if they are considering migrating to .NET and he said: no, we still have our priority of getting current things fixed and customer support.
the thing is that Java got right in the .com boom and established itself among the programmers, and now those programmers just won’t go to .NET
it’s like choosing to build a building with brick –> you won’t migrate to stone right in the middle
In contrast to Java/J2EE/etc, which are closed proprietary standards owned and controlled by Sun, .NET consist of a set of open standards (not owned or controlled by Microsoft but by the ECMA – http://www.ecma.ch).
Having the ability to choose the language you prefer not only shortens the initial learning curve but also makes it possible to reuse large chunks of existing (tested and debugged) code.
Java/J2EE/etc does not give you platform independance (it IS a platform itself) but it (in theory!!) gives you vendor neutrality which in practice means nothing:
– works only if you use the bare minimum of the spec (I still need to see a developer that does not us (ie) WebSphere specific features)
– I still have to see a company actually switching Java/J2EE vendor… companies normally stick to their platform anyway… so, in the case of J2EE, they pay a very high, upfront cost for an option (vendor neutrality) they will NEVER use…
People so just move on to .NET (or Mono http://www.go-mono.com)
In contrast to Java/J2EE/etc, which are closed proprietary standards owned and controlled by Sun, .NET consist of a set of open standards (not owned or controlled by Microsoft but by the ECMA – http://www.ecma.ch).
But they didn’t standardize the whole enchilada (and there are MS PATENTS out there to deal with). Mono is developing based on the standards, but if MS decides to change what they still DO control, Mono won’t be compatible to some extent after that. Will that be a problem as far as the open source folks are concerned? Any of you Linux programmers like to comment?
Hey everybody claiming that .NET is open …
What is the benefit of open standards when the (major) implementation is owned by a company?
Someday (eventually) they see that mono is accepted they could go out and create an open .NET2 standard.
Downwards compatible? – sorry dear customers, in order to give you most functionality you have to use the newest version – and they will buy it again
sorry dear customers, in order to give you most functionality you have to use the newest version – and they will buy it again
And the people said, “ba-a-a-a-a-ah”