The question was asked recently on a FreeBSD mailing list, “What will be new in FreeBSD 5.0?” The thread discussed several ways a person could obtain such information, one good source being the latest release notes. The first developer preview of 5.0 was released on April 8th. The final release is targeted for the end of this year. Robert Watson offered an interesting summary of items to look forward to in FreeBSD 5.0, including: SMPng (“next generation” symmetric multiprocessing), KSE (improved scheduling), devfs (automatic /dev management), Firewire support, and much more. Read on KernelTrap for more details.
What’s New In FreeBSD 5.0
About The Author
Eugenia Loli
Ex-programmer, ex-editor in chief at OSNews.com, now a visual artist/filmmaker.
Follow me on Twitter @EugeniaLoli
isn’t BSD dead?
“isn’t BSD dead?”
Far from it.
If anything, BSD is on the upward trend.
“If anything, BSD is on the upward trend.”
If anything, BSD is on the virge of dethroneing Linux. After all, with Microsoft throwing their support behind FreeBSD and porting .NET and C# to FreeBSD. A lot of Linux zealots will probably downplay this and try to say it won’t matter. But Linus himself seemed to be concerned over it (remember his childish comments and his temper tantrum he threw after Microsoft announced they would support FreeBSD with .NET and C#.)
Of course, Apple is also using BSD in a very big way.
Couldn’t have said it better.
Having used C# on Windows XP and getting ready to install the CLI on my FreeBSD machine, I would definitely say things are looking very good for BSD.
Since FreeBSD is still the backend for Hotmail, I wonder if MS selecting FreeBSD as the “open source” OS has more to do with putting .Net/C# code behind Hotmail.
Shouldn’t it be included by now, or did Sun screw ’em?
They are still working on the JDK 1.3.1 port..it’s definitely taking longer than they thought.
I’m not sure if the Java port has been accepted by Sun yet, but I’ve heard that Sun’s certification IS the main holdup.
“They are still working on the JDK 1.3.1 port..it’s definitely taking longer than they thought.”
I think there might also be some lack of motivation to work on it. Basically, the Linux Java SDK runs so well under FreeBSD that its sometimes hard to convince people that there should be a native port.
If anything, BSD is on the virge of dethroneing Linux.
*snicker*
It works well unless you try to use the swing stuff. SWING on freebsd is *real* slow. You can see the frame backgrounds redrawing.
“It works well unless you try to use the swing stuff. SWING on freebsd is *real* slow. You can see the frame backgrounds redrawing.”
Good point. Swing needs all the help it can get I guess. (Swing is slow on everything, even when the SDK is running natively.)
>Swing needs all the help it can get
Unfortunately the fast SWT isn’t accepted widely enough and might be hard to port to all platforms
“Unfortunately the fast SWT isn’t accepted widely enough and might be hard to port to all platforms.”
I’ve pretty much decided to go with Python for most of my programming projects instead of Java anyway. Python supports more platforms than Java and I can write applications in Python significantly faster than I can in Java. Also, I have found that Python programs seem to be faster at many tasks than Java programs on my Win XP box. The Tkinter toolkit also produces interfaces that look a lot better than the ugly Swing interfaces in my opinion, and Tkinter automatically generates a native look and feel depending on the platfor it is running on. (I know AWT can do that. But AWT has some problems).
No offense, but here’s my opposing opinion.
If anything, BSD is on the virge of dethroneing Linux.
No it won’t. I like BSD as well as the next guy, but it just isn’t there yet.
For people like myself, a command line install is no big deal. All my favorite OSs have them. This is exactly why my favorite distros and BSD aren’t as popular. They aren’t very accessible to the average user.
Any moron can install Mandrake or RedHat and use it to some degree, but BSD is much more difficult for the average user. Most average users can’t even figure out how to create a partition during a BSD install. Also, configuring your system is still easier under Linux.
Until BSD has all the flashy knobs and buttons of distros like Mandrake, BSD will never dethrone Linux. Not even if it does support .NET.
After all, with Microsoft throwing their support behind FreeBSD and porting .NET and C# to FreeBSD.
Does this mean that no programming languages exist now except for .NET and C#? Have you actually used either of these things? Hey guys, C#’s out now, so we can all start coding!
C# is a great replacement for VB (but then again, so is a gutted fish), but it doesn’t come close to being a one-stop dev tool. ASP.NET is better than ASP in performance, but it still doesn’t compare to the power offered by other technologies in the internet programming space.
The Windows programming world has not been revolutionized or revitalized by C# or .NET (if anything it has become more irritating). It won’t be any different with BSD.
Besides, .NET is more marketing and hype than anything else. The main purpose for its existance is to generate revenue for MS. Not only in people buying their dev tools, but they want to move to a subscription based model and .NET is what will help them do it.
This doesn’t make sense in the BSD realm (except to MS because they hope BSD users will buy Office.NET when it’s released). I really don’t think .NET will receive more than a sideways glance in this arena. .NET doesn’t offer anything that can’t already be done anyway. It may make it easier to accomplish tasks, but that’s about it.
A lot of Linux zealots will probably downplay this and try to say it won’t matter.
Nice way to invalidate any opposing point of view before they are even made. Demonize your opposition to invalidate their opinions. You must be a politician.
But Linus himself seemed to be concerned over it (remember his childish comments and his temper tantrum he threw after Microsoft announced they would support FreeBSD with .NET and C#.)
You obviously haven’t seen Bill Gates or Steve Balmer in action. Gates especially can roll around on the floor kicking and whining like a 3 year old if he doesn’t get his way. Why did you think his hair is always so messed up?
Anyway, in the end, .NUT is still a closed, proprietary technology. To think that it is going to take an open community by storm is either wishful thinking or ignorance.
“Any moron can install Mandrake or RedHat and use it to some degree, but BSD is much more difficult for the average user. Most average users can’t even figure out how to create a partition during a BSD install. Also, configuring your system is still easier under Linux.”
This isn’t an issue for the majority of market we are talking about. We are talking about servers and corproate environments. The average user couldn’t care less about .NET or C#, but it will be very important in the corporate environent.
Interoperability and compatibility is also very important in corporate enterprise environments. Therefore, if corportations adopt .NET and C# and they want their UNIX servers to interoperate, FreeBSD is going to be far more attractive than Linux.
“The Windows programming world has not been revolutionized or revitalized by C# or .NET (if anything it has become more irritating). It won’t be any different with BSD.”
I disagree. The Windows programming world will undergo serious change because of .NET and C#. Not because there is anything spectacular about these technologies, but rather because Microsoft has a virtual monopoly on the Windows programming world. Almost everyone doing serious programming for Windows is using Microsoft tools to do it. Since Microsoft has a virtual monopoloy in this area, they can pretty much shove .NET and C# down developer’s throats, and that appears to be what they are doing. VB, C++, C#, Access, etc., are all being assimilated into the .NET borg.
“Nice way to invalidate any opposing point of view before they are even made. Demonize your opposition to invalidate their opinions. You must be a politician.
”
Like it or not, Linux users are responsible for their own reputation as rabid packs of wild dogs. Say anything bad about Linux in anything you write, and you can count on your inbox being flooded with irrational email telling you how stupid you are and that Linux is superior to Windows in every way shape and form. I didn’t create the Linux zealot / rabid dog reputation. Linux users created it themselves. Granted I know a lot of this email comes from script kiddie teenage hacker wannabes who think running Linux makes them cool. But still, it doesn’t change the facts.
“Besides, .NET is more marketing and hype than anything else. The main purpose for its existance is to generate revenue for MS. Not only in people buying their dev tools, but they want to move to a subscription based model and .NET is what will help them do it.”
It’s called “planned obsolescence”. Basically, Microsoft will force Windows developers to adopt .NET by gradually phasing out alternative development tools.
“Anyway, in the end, .NUT is still a closed, proprietary technology. To think that it is going to take an open community by storm is either wishful thinking or ignorance.”
Why do people continue to insist that the average corporate user cares one bit about open source? They don’t. They couldn’t care less about it. All they care about is that their system works and their support costs are low. Like it or not, Windows is a very common technology in corporate environments. Because Microsoft controls virtually all of Windows development, .NET will also become a very common technology in corporate environments. Therefore, corporations that want interoperability between their UNIX and Windows environments are going to want a UNIX platform that supports .NET.
“Why did you think his hair is always so messed up?”
Gates may have messy hair… But he does have more hair then Linus does. Looked at pictures of Linus taken recently? He seems to have a lot less hair these days than he did in his early pictures… Is he pulling it all out? :p
on the subject of C# and .net i wonder how mono’s comming along these.
Personally, I don’t like the idea of .NET all that much. Sure, its “great” to have services and such in one place but, why is it all Microsoft? Why not other companies as well? Any way I look at it, I can’t seem to like it very much. Yeah, it may do a lot but… Currently, I guess I can’t be “bothered” to like it.
FreeBSD 5.0.
You know, I’ve never tried out BSD, and I’m not much of a knowledgeable Linux guy myself but, I like alternate OS’ just as much as the next guy but, why do we have to start this argument of BSD is sooooo much better than Linux or, Linux is soooooo much better than BSD?
If there’s one thing that’s gonna kill the OpenSource community, its the OpenSource community. We bicker so much about which system is better. We fight so much about which liscence is better. Look at the .deb v .rpm fights.
I personally think that Linux doesn’t have what it takes _RIGHT NOW_ in some area’s to beat out FreeBSD, nor FreeBSD have what it takes in _other_ area’s to beat out Linux. I think they both happen to complement each other in many ways.
Think about it. FreeBSD = Cool in many ways. Linux = Cool in different, yet some of the same ways. Both are OpenSource. Both try to achieve somewhat of the same thing.
And most importantly. _BOTH ARE UNIX_
I disagree. The Windows programming world will undergo serious change because of .NET and C#.
Only because Microsoft will stop supporting their other technologies. Contrary to popular belief, however, there are technologies outside of MS (many of them better) and there are many people who, regardless of which technology is better, will always choose the non-MS way to do things.
Say anything bad about Linux in anything you write, and you can count on your inbox being flooded with irrational email telling you how stupid you are and that Linux is superior to Windows in every way shape and form.
Well, if you read the negative remarks about Linux, 60% of them are based on a complete lack of knowledge on the subect, 35% of them are from Microsoft’s PR machine, MS hero-worshipers or employees, and the other 5% (mostly about UI quirks) are accurate. When someone writes something in ignorance, they deserve to have the record set straight.
I used to hate Linux. My friend has used it since Linus sent out his first post regarding Linux. As of the first release of Slackware, he has never run Windows since.
I used to make fun of him all the time. Why? Because I didn’t know Linux and found it difficult and foreign. I made fun of him out of ignorance and a lack of knowledge. I think most people who speak negatively about Linux fall into this category. Just look at their posts. Linux sucks because I couldn’t get <insert problem here> to work.
Because of this attitude of the negative talkers, I can understand the rabid dog reaction.
Why do people continue to insist that the average corporate user cares one bit about open source?
I don’t think BakaSmack said that at all. His point is valid. You stated that BSD was going to dethrone Linux. Such will not be the case. Linux biggest supporters and advocates are NOT corporations, but rather those people who like free software (both in the beer and in the speech senses). Therefore, corporations are irrelevant to your dethroning statement. BSD can’t dethrone Linux because the majority of Linux users are not going to switch to BSD simply because .NET is being ported to it.
You are twisting your original statement as well as BakaSmack’s response.
Gates has more hair than Linus
Forgive me if I’m wrong, but last I looked hair loss had absolutely nothing to do with mental maturity, competance or intelligence. Besides, Bill Gates is as bald as a baloon (like Steve Ballmer), Bill just has hair plugs. You would know that if you ever talked to him in person.
…why do we have to start this argument of BSD is sooooo much better than Linux or, Linux is soooooo much better than BSD?
We don’t. Such arguments are stupid since both *BSD and Linux are the coolest and most accessible operating systems on the planet.
…Look at the .deb v .rpm fights.
Well, those are valid. RPMs suck!
If one thing, the Linux and BSD camps should not get into silly pissing competitions, and certainly not because of MS. MS will just love that, having one open source camp argue with the other.
“Personally, I don’t like the idea of .NET all that much.”
I don’t like it either. But that doesn’t change the fact that Microsoft has the power to force it down developers throats, and it appears that is exactly what they are doing. Most professional programmers don’t have the ability to choose what platform they develop on. Hobby OSS programmers can choose whatever tool they want and whatever platform they want. Professional programmers supporting an organization are locked into whatever platform their organization has standardized on. Unfortunately, that is usually Windows. (I feel their pain because I am in that situation. I’m a UNIX guy who learned programming on UNIX but now has no choice except to develop for Windows and learn the MFC library damn well).
“Only because Microsoft will stop supporting their other technologies.”
That’s exactly what I said in my post. Microsoft will shove .NET down developers throats. They will force organizations to adopt .NET by phasing out other tools.
“Well, if you read the negative remarks about Linux, 60% are based on a complete lack of knowledge on the subect…”
The reverse is just as true, if not more so. The vast majority of people who flame people for saying something bad about Linux are completely clueless about Linux. Like I said, that’s one reason I think most of them are probably hacker wannabes with giant teenage egos to fill. They think because they know a little bit about UNIX, they are smarter than any Windows weenie and they sare going to prove it. In the end all they end up proving is how little they know about IT in general much less the system they are trying to defend.
“I used to hate Linux. My friend has used it since Linus sent out his first post regarding Linux. As of the first release of Slackware, he has never run Windows since.”
I used to love Linux. I used it for almost everything. But the Linux “counter-culture” (which is a relatively recent phenomena in the history of Linux) turned me off to it. People like RMS for example, give Linux the image of a radical group of social software extremests. That turned me off to Linux. Then I discovered FreeBSD and found it was technically superior to Linux and didn’t have the Linux counter-culture “Free software for everyone, make Microsoft illegel” attitude that I hated about the “Linux movement”.
“Linux biggest supporters and advocates are NOT corporations, but rather those people who like free software (both in the beer and in the speech senses).”
That’s all well and good. But advocates do not a successful platform make. Advocates do not attract commercial developers. Large user bases attract software developers. Red Hat doesn’t run advertisements in industry trade publications to attract advocates. They run them to attract buyers and corporations. The ultimate success of a platform such as Linux will depend on how widely it is deployed in corporate installations. It will not depend on how many radical advocates it has.
“Forgive me if I’m wrong, but last I looked hair loss had absolutely nothing to do with mental maturity, competance or intelligence.”
Stress does have something to do with hair loss. And now you are twising my words. I never said that Linus was incompetant or lacked intelligence. Only that he sometimes has a childish temper (he needs to hire a PR guy since that is obviously NOT his field). Bill Gates has temper problems of his own, but he does a better job of not displaying them in public than Linus does.
“Besides, Bill Gates is as bald as a baloon (like Steve Ballmer), Bill just has hair plugs. You would know that if you ever talked to him in person.”
Bill Gates is not bald! LOL They only way to explain why his hair is so messy is that it is his natural hair. Because why would anyone want their hair to look like that unless they didn’t have another choice because that is what nature gave them? :p If he’s using hair plugs, he could do a far better job than what he is doing. :p
I used to love Linux. I used it for almost everything. But the Linux “counter-culture” (which is a relatively recent phenomena in the history of Linux) turned me off to it.
If it were me, I wouldn’t be swayed by others opinions or actions (which I’m not, so it must be true). I like and use Linux because it does what I want it to do and is a great OS. I use *BSD for the same reason.
That’s all well and good. But advocates do not a successful platform make.
An interesting statement since advocates are exactly what made Linux what it is today. Large companies like IBM looked at what was going on and saw a way to capitalize on it. That is quite an accomplishment considering Linux’s roots.
Large corporations may make Linux better and more accessible for the average user, but there work is largely irrelevant to the core Linux user base. Its the advocates that make both *BSD and Linux what they are. That’s is why MS is having such a hard time with Linux. They can’t squash individual contributors like they can corporations.
Advocates do not attract commercial developers.
No, but they do attract people who think its fun to write programs, which is where most Linux and BSD apps come from. Commercial development projects are driven by revenue. Linux and *BSD for the most part are not.
It will not depend on how many radical advocates it has.
I tend to disagree because I used Linux back when there weren’t any corporations involved. I liked it then and I liked it now. A good number of people feel this way.
Anyway, the main discussion is not how deeply Linux or BSD will penetrate corporations. It was your statement that BSD will dethrone Linux because MS is going to make C# and .NET available on BSD.
None of what you are saying is relevant because most Linux users couldn’t care less about C# and .NET. In fact, they probably would never use it just out of spite, even if it did have technical merit.
Like I said before. BSD will not dethrone Linux anytime soon. There installer alone is enough to drive the curious away. To this you replied that corporations are more knowledgable about such things and don’t have a problem installing BSD. I disagree. I have worked for large health care companies, banks, government agencies, retail chains, and large software companies including Microsoft. For the most part, sysadmins and developers haven’t got a clue about Linux, BSD or any other Unix or unix-like operating systems; and the decision making managers couldn’t find their unix with both hands. If they can’t install it, or don’t understand its merits, they will not use it. As I said before, until BSD gets all the whirling graphics, shiney buttons and comforting installers like Mandrake (which I don’t like by the way) BSD will never be able to dethrone Linux.
Couple this with the current popular opinion that BSD is dead and fear alone will see to it that BSD isn’t adopted.
I like Open, Net and FreeBSD and hope they are around for a long time (at least until I die, after that I don’t care) however, they have a lot of work to do on their image as well as their product before dreams of dethroning Linux will ever be realized. I’m not saying Linux is better than *BSD, I like them equally well, however, reality must be considered.
Don’t agrue with me about it, just watch and see.
“I used to love Linux. I used it for almost everything. But the Linux “counter-culture” (which is a relatively recent phenomena in the history of Linux) turned me off to it. ”
That was one of the reasons I too recently dropped linux in favor of FreeBSD.
I am also a professional programmer and am in the same boat as you…I like UNIX but have to keep up with the MS technologies in order to put food omn the table.
MY XP machine has the .Net SDK on it, and my FreeBSD box has Rotor installed on it.
C# is just a rehash of Java, but (and I hate to say this) it seems like a better version of Java.
C# is just a rehash of Java, but (and I hate to say this) it seems like a better version of Java.
It is better in some areas (like the threading model) and it is great for Windows desktop application programming; far more so than Java. However, it can’t do servlets, it doesn’t run on as many platforms (at least for now), it can’t be used for web programming except with ASP.NET and IIS (at least for now), and it can’t do applets (if you’re into that sort of thing), although it can be used to create ActiveX viruses for you to place on your web pages, and with support for “unsafe” code, the fun possibilities are endless.