It seems like Microsoft is continuing its quest to force Windows users to use Microsoft accounts instead of local accounts, despite the fact Microsoft accounts on Windows are half-baked and potentially incredibly dangerous. In the most recent Windows 11 Insider Preview Build (26220.6772), the company has closed a few more loopholes people were using to trick the Windows installer into allowing local user accounts.
We are removing known mechanisms for creating a local account in the Windows Setup experience (OOBE). While these mechanisms were often used to bypass Microsoft account setup, they also inadvertently skip critical setup screens, potentially causing users to exit OOBE with a device that is not fully configured for use. Users will need to complete OOBE with internet and a Microsoft account, to ensure device is setup correctly.
↫ Amanda Langowski at the Windows Blogs
It seems that the specific workaround removed with this change is executing the command “start ms-cxh:localonly” in the command prompt during the installation process (you can access cmd.exe by pressing shift+F10 during installation). Several other workarounds have also been removed in recent years, making it ever harder for people forced to use Windows 11 to use a local account, like the gods intended.
The only reason Microsoft is pushing online accounts this hard is that it makes it much, much easier for them to collect your data and wrestle control over your installation away from you. A regular, proper local account with additional online accounts for various services would work just as well for users, allowing them to mix and match exactly what kind of cloud services they want integrated into their operating system. However, leaving this choice to the user invariably means people aren’t going to be using whatever trash services Microsoft offers. And so, Microsoft will make that choice for you, whether you like it or not.
There are a million reasons to stay away from the Windows version that must be making Dave Cutler cry, and the insistence on online accounts is but one of them. It’s a perfect example of how Microsoft developers Windows not to make it better for its users, but to make it better for its bottom line. I wonder how much more Microsoft can squeeze its users before we see some sort of actual revolt.
Windows used to just lack taste. These days, it’s also actively hostile.
If you must use Windows 11, use the last Windows 11 ISO that allows creation of a local account (via the “start ms-cxh:localonly” commmand), then let Windows Update do its thing.
8 years from now. when Windows 11 goes EOL and we’ll be forced to Windows 12, we’ll reminisce about how this was possible.
Eight years from now the local Windows installation will be an immutable stub baked into the EFI area of the PC, and it will download the full OS onto the drive for actual use, but not until you sign into the stub with your Microsoft account. And if you ever do anything to piss off Microsoft and they ban your account, your machine will be rendered useless as it is forever tied to that account and you can’t install Linux or any other OS to get around it. This is the end goal for Microsoft, to provide the OS as a service and lock down the hardware as if it were a game console.
I think the much bigger danger is the hardware tendency to not have removable main storage anymore…as long as the storage is removable, people can always stick their SSD in an USB box and get their data off it after an “incident”. With non-removable storage and locked-down EFI, people will basically just have oversized phones 🙁
Isn’t it Bitlocker all about?
A few weeks ago, I bought a fantastic N150 mini PC, and luckily, I was able to install Win10 on it despite the manufacturer’s claim of “lack of support.” I’m increasingly convinced that Win10 will be like Win7 for me—I stopped using Win7 as my primary non-Linux system less than two years ago.
@autumnlover
Not sure what made you move off Windows 7 but, for most people, what always pushing them eventually is application compatibility. For Windows 7, it was unicode support. That is what made applications like Firefox abandon Windows 7. And newer apps use newer APIs that only the latest OS has. Once the apps you use are no longer available, you eventually have to chase them to the next version. We are like prehistoric people following migrating herds of animals. We can only stay behind for so long.
Of course, a lot of people also follow their hardware. They upgrade for whatever reason and then just use the Windows it comes with. Same “following the herd” analogy fits here too.
I switched to all Apple products last November. I tried Windows 11 but it was awful. The locking down of Android is also quite distasteful. If the big tech companies are going to spy on me and force me to live in a walled garden, I might as well live in the best walled garden.
All of my non-Apple tech purchases are whatever is currently the most open source friendly (accessories, smart light bulbs, etc). My next big tech purchase is going to be the Steam Deck 2. My old gaming laptop is slightly more powerful than the current Steam Deck so I might as well wait until I can get a full upgrade before I spend money.
So you went to another super-closed system escaping Windows?
kwanbis,
Yeah, I understand not everybody wants linux, but it’s weird to complain about one prison only to jump into another. I’m kind of expecting users boycotting the android app lock down will do the same thing: migrate to iphone. This is a symbolic protest because switching to IOS won’t solve any of the gripes over the restrictions happening on android.
Migrating to iPhone certainly wouldn’t solve the issue, but I suppose at least if enough people do, it might send a message to Google.
The openness(ish) of Android is really the only reason I use it. If that goes away, well, so does Android quite honestly.
The question is, “will Google (read feudal tech lords) care?”
I use android because is much more open than iOS:
* You can install a different browser than Chrome.
* You can install a different launcher.
* You can install a different keyboard (I don’t know now but it was not possible on iOS).
* You can install outside apps, even if they have to be signed.
* You have 500 models from different brands that you can choose, from the cheap as heck 100 dollars phones to 2000 or more, which are not just what Tim Cook decided.
* You can install a different OS if you want.
So Android is much much open than iOS.
kwanbis,
I agree it is still more open than IOS.
However android won’t deserve much credit for “can install outside apps” after they require google’s permission to install them. Even if they’ll sign the packages, it’s very clearly a “closed” policy that culls owner & FOSS rights. This fact leaves android more vulnerable to censorship.
I wouldn’t give full credit for “You can install a different OS” because in practice most android devices can’t do it, they’re not sufficiently open. Although clearly with the right device I agree it’s better than IOS.
I was using a Pixel and I felt like a beta tester for Google. Shoving AI “features” that I didn’t want onto my phone made the experience buggy and it finally made me willing to explore alternatives. I planned to install some alternate operating system onto the Pixel but I haven’t had time. I’ve been able to turn off the AI features on the iPhone and frankly the iPhone works much better as a phone.
I have an additional laptop that I use that runs Fedora (I’m typing on it now), but there are certain proprietary apps that I need for work that don’t work on Linux. I switched to Apple, partly out of curiosity. I have to say that the hardware is the best that I have ever owned and once you’re all in on the ecosystem. It just works. I’m in my 40’s now and I’m tired of tinkering constantly.
I’m not against using Linux but I just can’t make it work at the moment. It’s close. I find Plasma 6.4 to be more intuitive and a better interface than MacOS, but it doesn’t have all of the apps that I need.
I think their justification is that: If I am going to live in a walled garden from now on, I might as well live in the one with the best morning buffet.
I feel the same way. I went back to Android last year because I was tired of Apple’s bullshit, but now Google’s bullshit is about to be come just as bad, if not worse (at least Apple doesn’t sell your data to third parties, they just use it to serve you their own ads). Combining this action with them closing up AOSP to block projects like GrapheneOS and LineageOS, Android and iOS are effectively on a level playing field again, at least for my needs.
I still have my iPhone 15 Pro, and I don’t want to have to go back to it, but I also haven’t wiped it because I knew I might need it as a backup in case anything happened to my Pixel. “Anything” is happening and it’s not an accident, it’s Google being (even more) malicious and user-hostile.
calm down. Obstacles create opportunities. We have other mobile OSes already, although less known, like Jolla, PostmarketOS, etc. Some even support running Android apps. Also, there’s e/OS (I’m using it on my Fairphone 6), and Librephone project from FSF. Things are happening. We all need options, so options will show up, or be created by one of us. No worries.
marc_dimarco,
I agree with the push for alternatives, but network effects still make things unfair and difficult. IMHO “no worries” under emphasizes how bad it’s getting. If anything I think we need more people speaking out; It may be our last chance to protest this crap from google before it permanently becomes the new norm.
@marc_dimarco:
Fuck that condescending garbage. I won’t be calm about something like this.
None of which run on a phone I can easily get here in the US, that works with my carrier. There is a reason I haven’t mentioned going to a full Linux phone, which I would absolutely do in a heartbeat if it were feasible.
Which is equally as affected by Google’s intention to do away with AOSP. e/OS is based on AOSP, so say goodbye to it soon as well.
That’s highly optimistic, and I wish I could share in it, but reality paints a different story.
With all of that said, going back to iPhone is an absolute last resort, and I would rather spend three times the cost of a Linux device on tariffs and change carriers than do that. I’m still going to switch to GrapheneOS this weekend as I should have done when I first got the phone, and I’ll ride that wave as long as I can until the Google hammer drops.
We should all be fucking worried, mate.
To quote kurkosdr; “I think their justification is that: If I am going to live in a walled garden from now on, I might as well live in the one with the best morning buffet.”
That is exactly my sentiment. I switched partly out of curiosity and as an experiment. I’ve stayed with it because the experience is better. It’s nice not to fight with my technology constantly. I’m older now and I have other responsibilities than to tinker with tech. If there were a viable non-big-tech option that didn’t require me to constantly fight with it; then I would switch.
I plan to buy a Steam Deck in the future because Valve supports Linux and open source. I have mostly switched to ProtonMail and their other ecosystem products to get away from Google. Once Proton has a spreadsheet application then I can switch away from Google completely, although I might just switch those over to Numbers (Apple’s spreadsheet app) just to finish moving away from Google. Getting away from Google has proven to be more difficult than getting away from Microsoft. I didn’t realize how embedded I was into the Google ecosystem until I started trying to escape.
@kwanbis
It would not have been my choice but what he is saying is that he has to live in a walled garden either way, so why not choose the one he prefers. It sounds like the “walled garden” is what was keeping him away form Apple and Microsoft no longer feels any better in that way.
A bit like the line from Tombstone, “I already have the guilt. Might as well have the money too”.
I made the switch partly out of curiosity but I still support open source when I can. I use ProtonMail and their other services. I have been attempting to stop using all Google services and that has proven to be far more difficult than escaping Microsoft. Proton’s customers are constantly pushing them to make their Linux support first class. They seem to be doing better in that regard. The only service without proper Linux support is their Drive service and I can appreciate the difficulty in supporting that on Linux. They have decided to release a Drive SDK that is fully open source and will be the basis of all future Drive products on all platforms. That should eventually make Linux support excellent.
My next tech project is probably going to be to build a home NAS/streaming server. using TrueNAS Scale. I have been using Synology and I don’t like the direction that they are going. If a decent phone with real Linux is released, and I can use my work related apps, then I will seriously consider switching. If it’s cheap enough, I would probably buy one just for personal use and to support the company.
@kwanbis
Which Android manufacturers still allow all of the things you’ve listed? I’m afraid almost all of the items you’ve listed won’t be possible anymore with newer devices on Android 16. I can’t even get custom launchers working on most devices these days without jumping through hoops or hurdles put in by manufacturers. I would be most interested to know which manufacturer(s) still ticks all the points you’ve made about being more ‘open than iOS’.
If it’s what you like then good for you, I guess. I just did the opposite recently and switched from an all Apple setup to a mix of GrapheneOS on a Pixel 8 and Bazzite on a Framework laptop. I do still have an iPad, but will eventually be replacing that too. I got really tired of Apple constantly begging me to use all their services and the straw that broke me was when they snuck an ad for their stupid F1 movie into my Apple Wallet – more than annoying, that’s just an overreach. I mean, if Apple are going to market their devices as premium experiences, with price tags to match, then why does using one these days feel like a free to play game?
Google may be making Android’s future questionable, but at least for now why not enjoy the good stuff while we can?
I had a problem with Google forcing AI features onto my Pixel. I would turn them off and then they would be reset after an update. I got ads from Google for their services constantly. I was in their ecosystem for over a decade and they went after me hard. I probably should have tried switching to an alternate operating system but it just seemed time consuming and I didn’t want to risk breaking my primary device.
I signed up for all of the Apple trial services and then ended them before getting charged. They haven’t pushed anything else on me up to this point. I went with Google because of how open they were and to see them close up and push AI that I don’t want onto me as a user felt like a betrayal. “Don’t be evil.” What a fool I was to ever believe that any company sees its users as anything other than a piggy bank to be broken up and raided.
It won’t happen under the current USA administration, but sooner or later this abuse of monopoly status will need to be stopped.
We are losing the very freedom that the personal computer revolution gave us: The right to control and manage our own computing and data.
JohnnyS777,
I agree. x86 has been good to us so far, nearly all of it is unlockable and bootable under FOSS. That means we can pick up a cheap or free x86 commodity computer and bring our own OS with very good odds of it booting! FOSS still doesn’t get much official support, but I have some hope that at least there is enough critical mass on x86 today that hardware manufacturers are disincentivized from totally blocking owners from installing alternatives.
The situation is more dire on mobile, even where mobile devices are running linux, ironically. Neither google nor manufacturers are FOSS friendly. We have to specifically cherry pick hardware to try alternatives, a random used phone probably won’t work. Now Google are even planning to put an end to open sideloading, which is a regression people weren’t even expecting.
I worry that the restrictions we now see on mobile could become more prevalent on laptop/desktop form factors. Google has already done this with chromebooks. Both apple and microsoft are slowly adding restrictions. I hope x86 hardware remains open, knock on wood, but if microsoft believed that antitrust regulators were off the trail. it wouldn’t take much to have Secure boot permanently block alternatives on new computers or via a BIOS update.
Alfman,
I think Intel abandoned the idea, but at one point x86S was considered as an 64-bit only (and possibly trimmed down) x86 variant.
As long as we keep this architecture alive, we should be fine. But if it ever becomes likes ARM, we would need permission just to install a bootloader.
(And I don’t think this is a “this party or that party” situation. As long as you have enough lobby spending and “contributions” in Washinton, you can pretty much do anything you want)
What’s the stance and status of RISC-V in that regard ?
@Kochise
There really is no RISC-V scene yet, especially not on the desktop. We may see that start to change over the next 24 months or so as the RVA23 chips come out. Too soon to say for sure.
But RISC-V is much more immune to this kind of thing due to its open nature. There is no one party that can enforce these kinds of restrictions for RISC-V as anybody can release competing hardware that is more open.
This openness is bigger than just the ISA. For RISC-V, there are multiple companies that play the role that ARM does in their ecosystem (licensing designs etc). If you want to make a RISC-V product, you have multiple suppliers and designs to choose from.
You can only get X86-64 from AMD and Intel. You can only get ARM from suppliers ARM approves of. You can legally make a RISC-V processor yourself if you want to. There are designs on GitHub.
That does not mean of course that restrictions will not be added on the software side. It does not even mean that a popular supplier will not try to lock things down (like Apple Silicon on ARM). And it does not mean that all RISC-V processors will be surrounded by unlocked or open specification hardware. But anything locked down will have to compete with something more open–it will be up to us which succeed. An open ISA and Open Source software are our best defense and RISC-V is off to a good start.
LeFantome,
I think it’s great to have an open architecture, but I am more pessimistic about it translating to more openness for downstream users..
Say an android manufacturer switched to RISC-V chips so they could buy/produce RISC-V chips without requiring licensing and royalties as with ARM. So far so good, but who’s to say the manufacturers of consumer products won’t be a pain in the ass and lock down these devices just like they did with ARM? Does anyone think Google’s OEM terms won’t require sideloading restrictions to apply on RISC-V?
I’m not really trying to blame RISC-V, but if more doesn’t change with regards to product manufacturing, then it seems quite plausible that we could end up with everything that’s happened to ARM happening again with RISC-V as well…despite the chips being royalty free and having open architectural plans.
I agree, there is plenty to be excitement about around RISC-V’s potential for DIY…but I had this same excitement around ARM and look at where it ended up. I really do hope you are right though.
Urgghh… This is such a shit show part of me just thinks “Get over it and install Linux”. I reckon most small/medium companies could handle the transition with a little hand-holding.
I work for a small company and we are 8 quite tech savvy people. I was hired as the “IT guy”.
I didn’t manage to convince anyone out of MSFT because “industry-standard”, “easier to comply to security certifications that we need to have to convince our clients that we are secure”, “we could not handle it”, “it’s just easier here”, “federating with clients” and the best “they must be the industry standard for a good reason”, “Azure is the best thing ever”.
We are getting ready for Cyber Essentials and 90% of the compliance steps would have been easier and cheaper under open source.
Want to push policy? Well, pay for Intune.
Want better security controls? Well, pay for E2/5, whichever number that is.
Do you want MFA and federated login to our SaaS shit? Well, you need an enterprise license and pay for at least 100 seats. “You need only 9 seats?”, well, too bad, pay for 9 licenses and everyone is global admin, too bad.
It is hell.
Plus I already calculated that being on an open source base would cut our cloud costs by 2/3, but naaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah, we would never be able to self host our data, we are too stupid, it would be less reliable, take too much maintenance.
Keeping MSFT still takes a lot of time anyway.
@Shuinbird
I feel you and have encountered similar things.
The irony is Windows shops paying for Azure and Microsoft using Linux themselves for a tonne of that infrastructure. Microsoft DocumentDB is just Postgresql. Why would the makers of SQL Server use an Open Source database? Do we really think they are running all those Azure Gov VMs on Hyper-V? AI Agents? Azure Sphere. Azure Cloud Switch. IoT Edge, Azure Kubernetes. All Linux. And all FedRAMP, SOC2, ISO27001, and CJIS compliant. How and why can this be if the objections you raised are valid?
Linux is the real industry standard for everything other than desktops. Let’s be real.
> Microsoft DocumentDB is just Postgresql.
I wonder, perhaps you were referring to Amazon DocumentDB?
Yes I foresee much change and pain in these areas. Certification. Policy. Compliance.
Completely surprised the big players haven’t moved faster yet.
MS should have the power to force the hand and the motherboard/laptop manufacturers lock out alternative OS completely to comply. Sphones locked to their OS. x86 locked to MS. Linux and alt OS relegated to VMs.
Gov and Nvidia may end up accelerating this too.
I think it is the revolving door BS and wanting to profit on own studies what is creating a lot of inertia.
All the certification bodies consist of people who studied and worked with the prevalent open source technologies. If you spend a boatload of money for AWS certifications, you want to make good on your investment. If you spent your career at MSFT and then move to work for ISO, you will tend to look more at what you are more familiar with.
Auditor skills matter, too. It’s much easier to confirm that a few checkboxes are clicked in your aws/azure/ibm/oracle console than having the ability to REALLY audit your open-source based MFA authentication flow connected to your on-premises SMS gateway time synced by your on-premises GPS clock glued together via a bunch of conf files or ansible recipes.
Heck, it is much easier to screw up a sharepoint setup than a nextcloud one and create a huge security risk but go get ISO on a nextcloud setup?
Having just installed Windows 11 in a VM this morning, as of today, oobe\\bypassnro still works on a clean install of 25H2.
it doesn’t matter. The thing is – as long as you keep using it, it will throw stupid shit at you and you will still need to fight with your own OS. That’s why I jumped ships ~XP, went to Linux and BSDa and never looked back.