Linked by Eugenia Loli on Sat 12th Apr 2003 17:42 UTC, submitted by Martin Olsson & Kim
Opera Software Opera Software released Opera 7.10 for Windows and Opera 7.10 for Linux Beta with features that are not only new to Opera, but also completely new to the world of browsing. Right from the beginning, users can see the two new buttons FastForward and Rewind in the toolbar, accelerating Opera users' Web navigation. Users can also speed up researching with the completely new Notes features or view photo files with SlideShow.
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Hmm
by Reformist on Sat 12th Apr 2003 17:52 UTC

Looks pretty good. Although I'm not sure how well a fast-forward feature could work, guessing a user's browsing choice, such that it could be called "intuitive."

Scrolling?
by Ronald on Sat 12th Apr 2003 18:01 UTC

There seems to be a problem with scrolling(jerkiness not smooth at all.)

Use it at http://www.heightbooster.com/

Anyone Tried Flash????
by emey on Sat 12th Apr 2003 18:08 UTC

I tried to visit macromedia.com but it just give me a blank page.

Anyone got the success story on this website???

mouse gestures
by knop on Sat 12th Apr 2003 18:10 UTC

I find mouse gestures very intuitive and find myself trying to use them everywhere. I hope this feature finds itself into some future version of mozilla.

7.1
by JCooper on Sat 12th Apr 2003 18:14 UTC

I have to admit, this is worthy of the .1 release. At last we can fully sutomise mouse gestures ;)

Its a shame they're standing by their original (and IMO a bit too OTT) skin, rather than something nice and clean from my.opera.com

A good release though, and I love where this browser is heading, having used it since the v5 days...

re: knop
by dwilson on Sat 12th Apr 2003 18:16 UTC

I find mouse gestures very intuitive and find myself trying to use them everywhere. I hope this feature finds itself into some future version of mozilla.

It is already availabe for Mozilla, and has been for some time. The plug-in is available here: http://optimoz.mozdev.org/gestures/.

I also agree, once you are used to them they are hard to live without.

re:Anyone Tried Flash????
by pnghd on Sat 12th Apr 2003 18:25 UTC

Works here on Debian sarge.

Excellent
by Bascule on Sat 12th Apr 2003 19:06 UTC

It seems a lot of lingering bugs have been fixed (including using the new window gesture on an empty background). Hats off to the Opera team.

new tabs
by deepu sudhakar on Sat 12th Apr 2003 19:27 UTC

i wish they made something like middle-clicking a link to open in a new tab like mozilla.

Re: Scrolling?
by bsdrocks on Sat 12th Apr 2003 19:28 UTC

There seems to be a problem with scrolling(jerkiness not smooth at all.)

Use it at http://www.heightbooster.com/


No problem here in FreeBSD, it's scrolling pretty smooth.

RE: Hmm
by Stephen Smith on Sat 12th Apr 2003 19:29 UTC

The "fast forward" feature is mostly useful in forums where Opera can find a repeatable parttern or a "next" button. It works fairly well, only I never really got used to it (maybe it's because I don't surf in a linear fashion).

RE: Hmm
by Stephen Smith on Sat 12th Apr 2003 19:32 UTC

Oh yeah, and if you go to mail.yahoo.com and enter your password and what-not, check your mail, go to osnews.com, click on an article, go to slashdot.org, click on an article, browse the discussions, and then go to theonion.com the rewind button will go back to the root pages of all of those sites rather than the back button which simply goes to the last page, whether it's a root or not.

Re: deepu sudhakar
by Bascule on Sat 12th Apr 2003 19:33 UTC

Uhhh...

Use click + pull down to open a new child window in the foreground, or pull down then up to open it in the background.

Remember, Opera invented the child window/tab concept...

Re: Scrolling?
by Ronald on Sat 12th Apr 2003 19:43 UTC

No problem here in FreeBSD, it's scrolling pretty smooth.

Yeah it went away soon(5 mins) after I posted. Oh well, back to Zelda. ;)

comment
by Claus on Sat 12th Apr 2003 20:09 UTC

Impressive upgrade from v6x. My alternate browser is now Opera. I've gotten used to Konqueror and wish it had mouse gestures. Mozilla is a little chunky. I noticed that OSNEWS has gotten a spot in Opera's preconfigured Bookmarks under News.

Speed...
by JCooper on Sat 12th Apr 2003 20:10 UTC

....after having used the browser for a while now, has anyone else noticed a slight pickup of speed when rendering pages?

Slightly OT:
On a different note, is there any way OSNews can utilise the Link menu of the browser to provide some quick links on the site - it only seems to be a couple of simple hrefs in the html, and would be pretty handy having the Home link linking back to the main page, the Help to the 'Contact Us' page, and maybe the Previous and Next providing the movement between sections of the comments on the site (useful for us dialup users who dont want to load over 100 comments of flames and other OT discussions)

Just a thought.... ;)

Re: mouse gestures
by knop on Sat 12th Apr 2003 20:55 UTC

Thanks for the heads up dwilson, I just installed the mouse gestures plugin for mozilla and it works great! I wonder why this is not included in mozilla proper though, or at least an option during install, everyone who I have introduced to mouse gestures loves them.

Re: deepu sudhakar
by SmallStepForMan on Sat 12th Apr 2003 22:30 UTC

[i]i wish they made something like middle-clicking a link to open in a new tab like mozilla.[/i}

Try holding CTRL_SHIFT and left click. It will open the link in a background tab. Almost everything has a keyboard shortcut in Opera, try CTRL-B for a full list.

mouse gestures
by Alex (The Original) on Sat 12th Apr 2003 22:30 UTC

What are mouse gestures? Is that with the 4 button mouse where you click the third and fourth button to move backward and forward?

I got my answer
by Alex (The Original) on Sat 12th Apr 2003 22:41 UTC

"Opera's amazing mouse gestures lets you do frequently performed browse operations with small..."

http://www.opera.com/features/mouse/?session=f2812d4c77bfabf3754de3...

Notes not new...
by Anonymous on Sat 12th Apr 2003 23:18 UTC

MyIE2 has had its, "Simple Collector" for quite some time now. It is functionally identical to the Opera 7.10 "notes" feature.

Notes
by Stephen Smith on Sat 12th Apr 2003 23:27 UTC

...?

What on earth are they??? I'm using Opera 7.10, and the only mention of the word "notes" is when you right-click on the webpage marker thing and you get the option to "paste to note". Where the hell are these things?

Not working for me
by OpenMind on Sat 12th Apr 2003 23:44 UTC

I followed the posted link and installed the plug-in (as root since it would not let me install with a user account), but Mozilla would only open if running as root. This was confirmed when plug-in was uninstalled, allowing Mozilla to be run under user account again.

Any idea?

@bascule
by Anonymous on Sun 13th Apr 2003 00:02 UTC

Remember, Opera invented the child window/tab concept...

Hardly. The Program Manager had it since Windows 3.0. Word had it until Windows 2000. They may've been the first well-known webbrowser to use an MDI, but they didn't invent it. And it's taken until now before they've had any equivalent to tabbed browsing[1]---the MDI was just like an SDI except instead of putting windows on the taskbar, it put them on its own.

[1]: I have not tested Opera 7, so I don't know how well it works. It's not my favorite browser.

re: Notes
by JK on Sun 13th Apr 2003 01:23 UTC

Have a look in the hotlist, quite a few of the best new Opera 7 features are contained in it.

Now that the most annoying bugs are fixed I can happily upgrade to Opera 7.1, earlier versions had some really annoying problems that kept me using Opera 6. IMO there's a hell of a lot that's hard to live without in Opera once you get used to it, it's great being able to customise so much of the browser. For example I've stripped the options I don't often use from the contextual menus to make them more efficient.

Features like rewind and fast forward, the links panel, notes and all the other little touches may seem quite unimportant, but they really do make browsing more fun and efficient. After using Opera there's no other browser I'm happy using for heavy web browsing.

Good God
by Anonymous on Sun 13th Apr 2003 02:56 UTC

The default font reminds me of Linux in the 90s

Screenshots
by Stephen Smith on Sun 13th Apr 2003 03:42 UTC

Anybody have any Linux screenshots?

Notes are found..
by pnghd on Sun 13th Apr 2003 03:55 UTC

in the hotlist window (F7, F4 etc).
the bar has mail, contact info, notes, info, history,
transfers, etc, all of which can be removed or added.

You can also probably access them through main menu and
keyboard shortcuts.

fonts on linux for opera
by Dopey on Sun 13th Apr 2003 04:27 UTC

The font rendering is bad on linux.

Konqueror and mozilla do much better jobs dunno why but they look pretty shit.


screen shots
by Dopey on Sun 13th Apr 2003 04:35 UTC

yeah heres a screen shot comparing konqueror, mozilla and opera.

http://www.vnet.ndirect.co.uk/browsers.png

also snap shot of my desktop running kde 3.1.1 and karamba

http://www.vnet.ndirect.co.uk/snap.png

Re: Dopey
by Darius on Sun 13th Apr 2003 06:40 UTC

How do you get your fonts looking so good in Linux ? ;)

I've got TrueType fonts installed (Mandrake 9.1) and the fonts don't look half that good.

Slight more on topic
by Darius on Sun 13th Apr 2003 06:43 UTC

I wish they could somehow combine Phoenix and Opera, as I am currently torn between the two ;) I like the type-ahead find thing in Phoenix and the ability to right click on bookmarks to edit them, but I find that mouse gestures work much better in Opera, plus it is a lot faster!

darius
by Dopey on Sun 13th Apr 2003 07:03 UTC

im using debian unstable. But they all use the same mechanism. To render the fonts are u running a true type font servers ? Try installing xfs-xtt or xfstt or both. and in /etc/X11/XF86Config-4
u should have a line like this:
Section "Files"
FontPath "unix/:7110" # xfs-xtt local font server
FontPath "unix/:7100" # xfs font server

(ports may differ debian changes the ports to allow all 3 font servers to run at same time)

But other than that the actual thing that renders the fonts should be the same.

Not me
by sabreman on Sun 13th Apr 2003 08:18 UTC

Fast forward button......why??......how do you get rid of it???
Fast reverse button........what is wrong with a pulldown list ???? ......again,how do you get rid of it???
Scrolling up and down is still a joke.
Where is my hotlist button????
Its still slower than 6.06.

On the good side.....at least you can turn that stupid wand thing off.......Who in their right mind is going to line up all their passwords.....idiots.

I think all they have done is moved sideways.

Thanks Opera!
by Lebowski on Sun 13th Apr 2003 09:27 UTC

So where's the OS X version??

http://daringfireball.net/2003/02/operatic.html

L.

Thanks Opera!!
by Lebowski on Sun 13th Apr 2003 09:30 UTC

So where's the OS X version??

http://daringfireball.net/2003/02/operatic.html

L.

Re: Anonymous
by Bascule on Sun 13th Apr 2003 12:04 UTC

Hardly. The Program Manager had it since Windows 3.0... blah blah blah

You do realize, of course, that I'm talking about this in regards to a web browser. Opera is a full MDI application, while other browsers simply provide "tabs".

But regardless, the level of integration of window management features into Opera goes well beyond any other browser

re: sabreman
by JK on Sun 13th Apr 2003 14:12 UTC

"Fast forward button......why??......how do you get rid of it???"

It's there to speed up browsing by providing a very quick way of moving to the next page. You don't need to scroll to find the next button, you can use a mouse gesture to flick through a the results of a search or messages in a forum. If you don't want it you can simply right click on the toolbar icon and chose remove from toolbar.

Fast reverse button........what is wrong with a pulldown list ???? ......again,how do you get rid of it???

A pulldown list is slower as you have to search through it, while the rewind button does the job with a single click. Again you can remove it like any other toolbar button or other control in Opera.

"Scrolling up and down is still a joke."

Personally I haven't had a problem with scrolling, it's as fast as any other browser I've used.

"Where is my hotlist button????"

On the toolbar?

"Its still slower than 6.06."

Not IME.

"On the good side.....at least you can turn that stupid wand thing off.......Who in their right mind is going to line up all their passwords.....idiots."

Almost everything in Opera can be turned off if you don't want it, the ability to customise the browser is Opera's best feature IMO.

"I think all they have done is moved sideways."

By adding numerous optional features and greatly improving the rendering engine and compatability with most web sites? What exactly would you consider an upgrade?

Too many bugs...
by Leo on Sun 13th Apr 2003 14:38 UTC

Hi,


There are still too many bugs/strange behaviours...

Opera6.x will still be my main browser for a long time I'm afraid...

(ex.: menu colours problems I mentionned still not fixed, how can I open the hotlist in a *SEPARATE* window ? Scrolling bugs, etc...)

Leo.

PS: I only tested Win version.

re: re: sabreman
by JCooper on Sun 13th Apr 2003 14:41 UTC

"On the good side.....at least you can turn that stupid wand thing off.......Who in their right mind is going to line up all their passwords.....idiots."

I suspect the implementation of a password manager is considerably more secure than IE for example, and its continual security flaws. Opera's security record has been almost spotless, apart from a few teething problems with the initial 7 release.

Fast reverse button........what is wrong with a pulldown list ???? ......again,how do you get rid of it???
How many times do you visit multiple sites in one window, then find yourself going back through them to get to the main page of each. Well the fast reverse button does this a lot quicker than a list of every single page you've visited (still available from the back button).

"Its still slower than 6.06."
LOL....I admit the 6 series is speedier for some sites, but from the improvement I've seen in 7.1 over the past 24hrs on a 56k, I have to say it is now hands down the fastest browser in my experience.

I don't know how they've tweaked it, but pages seem to load much quicker, even with the cache emptied. Also try using more RAM cache if u have the ram to spare - it helps a lot. The 'perceived' load time is always much quicker in opera IME, simply because you get to see the page as its rendered, rather than the all or nothing approach of some other browsers.

By adding numerous optional features and greatly improving the rendering engine and compatability with most web sites? What exactly would you consider an upgrade?

Some people obviously don't know a good browser when they see one ;)

_ _ _

Once again slightly OT...
_ _ _
As far as skinning of 7.1 goes, my new fave skin has to be http://my.opera.com/customize/skins/skin.pl?id=456 (M7)...currently running under the Sand 'Color Scheme'...u've gotta love super retro orange ;)

Cheers for the skin
by Anonymous on Sun 13th Apr 2003 15:22 UTC

When I clciekd the link I thought, WTF, but its a good skin. Cheers!

re -open mind
by Jim on Sun 13th Apr 2003 16:23 UTC

You need to go to the folder /chrome/mozgest

and then (as root)

chmod -R 755 *

that should work.

Re: deepu sudhakar
by KJK::Hyperion on Sun 13th Apr 2003 18:00 UTC

> Remember, Opera invented the child window/tab concept...

Microsoft invented the MDI. Apple tried to dismiss it as obsolete and unpractical, and even Microsoft believed it for a while. Then Opera (and others) did the bleeding obvious: they added a tab bar with a list of the open documents on the bottom of the MDI frame. No more reaching for the Window menu or CTRL-F6'ing. Then everybody started to copy it, and the rest is story

Re: Hmm
by KJK::Hyperion on Sun 13th Apr 2003 18:02 UTC

> Looks pretty good. Although I'm not sure how well a
> fast-forward feature could work, guessing a user's
> browsing choice, such that it could be called "intuitive."

it works pretty damn good. It recognizes "next" links, login forms, structural meta-links, etc. It's a real pleasure to use. Too bad that pattern matching has been broken a bit between 7.03 and 7.10

fast-forward and rewind?!?!?
by myo on Sun 13th Apr 2003 20:01 UTC

Can anyone explain what those buttons do? All I see on press release or the webpage is that they improve the user's experience... With no explanation as to WHAT they do.

I've seen some more info in this discussion, but I'd like a complete explanation ;) thanks

error!
by tom on Mon 14th Apr 2003 02:45 UTC

here is the site, I have problem with,

http://espn.go.com/tennis/

please some body with Opera 7.1, try and see if it works

tom

Re: tom
by Bascule on Mon 14th Apr 2003 02:52 UTC

This looks virtually identical to IE6 in Opera 7.10 for Windows. In Opera 6.12 for FreeBSD the "Explore MSN" sidebar doesn't render, but otherwise the page is fine.

first tabbed browser
by Galley on Mon 14th Apr 2003 14:38 UTC

NetCaptor was the first "tabbed" browser. It was first released more than five years ago.
http://www.netcaptor.com

Opera 7.1 is "fan-freaking-tastic"!

Re: Speed...
by Brad Clarke on Mon 14th Apr 2003 14:53 UTC

"....after having used the browser for a while now, has anyone else noticed a slight pickup of speed when rendering pages? "

I haven't tried 7.10, but I found Opera 7.03 rendered slower than Opera 6.06 (W2K, K6-2+ o/c to 500 mHz, 448 MB RAM)

What those buttons do
by Chris Canfield on Mon 14th Apr 2003 15:31 UTC

Can anyone explain what those buttons do? All I see on press release or the webpage is that they improve the user's experience... With no explanation as to WHAT they do...thanks

The rewind button brings you back to where you first jumped into a site. For example, if you bookmarked mysite.com/forums.html, and navigated around for a little bit, the rewind button would bring you back to mysite.com/forums.html. Not revolutionary, but useful.

The fast forward button brings you to where you usually go (I think). For example, if you usually go from mysite.com to forums, the fast forward button would do just that for you. Why you wouldn't just bookmark mysite.com/forums is anybody's guess, but that's why the little button hasn't lit up for me yet.

When on a page that looks like a slide show, the Fast Forward button becomes a slide show button, and will follow the image links one at a time in a page until you come to the last one. Very, very useful for trudging through other people's vacation photos.

Notes lets you jot down, well, short little notes in the hotlist. It's handy for copying addresses to mapquest through an intermediary, or keeping track of names. It's not revolutionary, but it does save you the trouble of opening a separate notepad program and switching between it.

Info gives you the main page url, the charset, mime type, size (in bytes), num of inline elements, size of inline elements, security types, and the location of the local cache file. Mostly the information is useful for developers and not much else, but the cache file location can be very, very useful. Hopefully this will expand to include the date of last modification of the page and other useful pieces of data (whois data, for example), and tying the local cache data to the history.

The wand is a password manager like all others... press the wand button or ctrl-enter to enter your pre-recorded name and password on a page. It is faster than the Mozilla password manager, but it sends an Enter key for confirmation, which on a few bank pages (namely mine) causes a page reload. Still, new for 7.1 the wand can now save passwords server-wide rather than on just one page, so that pesky forum logins can be auto-inserted on response pages without having to use a primary login page.

Another feature that many people don't know about new for the 7 series is titlebar integrated searches. Like ICAB, typing "g rummy" will search google for the word "rummy", "e powerbook" will search ebay for a new powerbook, and "f franklin" will search the current page for one of our most beloved presidents.

I have yet to find the new cookie manager or how to create new mousegestures, but I'm pretty happy with my cookie server filters and the default mousegestures. I'll look for them later.

how can I open the hotlist in a *SEPARATE* window ? Scrolling bugs, etc...

I haven't seen the scrolling bugs you mentioned (on windows... Linux box is Xless), but to open the hotlist in a separate window, goto view->hotlist->floating.

One of the advantages of Opera is that it is basically infinitely customizable now. Every interface element besides page tabs and folders is treated as a swappable object. You can move hotlist tabs to the main bar, add bookmarks to your right-click menus, move the address bar up to the home space... However you want to work. I'm so tied to mousegestures that I've removed the forward and back buttons, but more radical departures are available... people have combined buttons for example, to make forward / fast forward buttons.

Opera is slowly moving away from being a "fast and easy" browser to being a "fast and intricate" browser. It is a powerful tool if you do a lot of HTML work or web surfing, and can speed up your browsing / make your life easier. But with that power comes a rather steep learning curve... I recommend Opera to everyone who is computer proficient, but computer literacy may not be enough to understand or enjoy that power.

If there is anything you don't like about Opera's interface, there really is a way to change it. Whether that takes two hours of research and ini scripting or two mouseclicks...

Re: Speed
by JCooper on Mon 14th Apr 2003 15:50 UTC

I haven't tried 7.10, but I found Opera 7.03 rendered slower than Opera 6.06 (W2K, K6-2+ o/c to 500 mHz, 448 MB RAM)

I moved from 7.03 to 7.1 and noticed an improved rendering speed (be it realistic or perceived). (WXP P4 1.8b,512mb ram)

That things does work wonders speedwise (P200 MMX, W95)but for some strange reasons it keeps asking me for a password to visit my company intranet homepage.

I never had to enter anything .
If I do it says I am not allowed.

Is there something I need to do to sort that one out?

Otherwise I am happy with it, I ll get rid of a couple of bookmarks (maybe 99.99% of them) and some buttons but I will definetly keep it.