Linked by Thom Holwerda on Tue 31st Jan 2006 17:40 UTC, submitted by DigitalDame
Internet Explorer "The beta version of IE7 released today by Microsoft is meant for developers and tech enthusiasts, and it's a good thing. This is not (yet) a browser for the faint of heart; in fact, if you've become accustomed to the minimalist approach of alternative browsers like Firefox, IE7 might actually feel like a step backward. The product's proper name - which should tell you most everything you need to know - is Internet Explorer 7.0 for Windows XP SP2 Beta 2 Preview. We'll refer to it simply as IE7 beta, though."
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What's new from other reviews ?
by fredb1974 on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:13 UTC
fredb1974
Member since:
2006-01-31

I cannot find something new from other review I've already read on IE7 betas.

Not a word on W3C standards, only some words on tabbed browsing.

A useless article.

Reply Score: 1

RE: What's new from other reviews ?
by n4cer on Wed 1st Feb 2006 00:10 UTC in reply to "What's new from other reviews ?"
n4cer Member since:
2005-07-06

I cannot find something new from other review I've already read on IE7 betas.

Not a word on W3C standards, only some words on tabbed browsing.

A useless article.


Go to IEBlog for more info on standards:
http://blogs.msdn.com/ie/

Also the IE Developer Center on MSDN:
http://msdn.microsoft.com/ie/

Reply Score: 1

fredb1974 Member since:
2006-01-31

I both know them. And as we say in France : "ils n'ont pas inventé l'eau chaude" => "They did not create hot water".

IE7 is a way for MS to go back in tune in browser market. In some ways, Opera, Khtml and gecko based browser are far away from IE.

Reply Score: 1

IE 7.0 TCO.
by Dark_Knight on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:18 UTC
Dark_Knight
Member since:
2005-07-10

1. Does anyone know if Microsoft will be charging for the update to IE 7.0?

2. If yes to question 1 then will this be based on individual workstations or for an entire LAN?

Reply Score: 1

RE: IE 7.0 TCO.
by modmans2ndcoming on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:33 UTC in reply to "IE 7.0 TCO."
modmans2ndcoming Member since:
2005-11-09

Have they ever charged? well in a roundabout way I guess they charged for ie 6 by making you upgrade to XP.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: IE 7.0 TCO.
by Wrawrat on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:38 UTC in reply to "RE: IE 7.0 TCO."
Wrawrat Member since:
2005-06-30

Mmm? MSIE 6.0 is available on Windows XP down to Windows 98. Only the latest version from SP2 is exclusive to Windows XP.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: IE 7.0 TCO.
by Kroc on Wed 1st Feb 2006 10:06 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: IE 7.0 TCO."
Kroc Member since:
2005-11-10

But MSIE 7 will be Windows XP-SP2, 2K3 & Vista -only-, despite the Win 2K kernal and XP Kernal being almost exactly the same. So this time MS are forcing people to upgrade their Win2K boxen to upgrade to MSIE 7.

Reply Score: 0

RE[4]: IE 7.0 TCO.
by cwdrake on Wed 1st Feb 2006 14:06 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: IE 7.0 TCO."
cwdrake Member since:
2005-08-09

Win2K is 6 years old!!! Isn't it about time to move up to something more current?

Reply Score: 1

RE[5]: IE 7.0 TCO.
by Kroc on Wed 1st Feb 2006 15:13 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: IE 7.0 TCO."
Kroc Member since:
2005-11-10

And WinXP is only one year newer than that. 2K and XP have almost precisely the same kernals. There is nothing particularly "current" about XP, it has a new skin, it's still 5 years old.

Reply Score: 1

RE[6]: IE 7.0 TCO.
by sappyvcv on Wed 1st Feb 2006 15:42 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: IE 7.0 TCO."
sappyvcv Member since:
2005-07-06

Actually XP has a lot of APIs that weren't in 2000.

Reply Score: 1

RE: IE 7.0 TCO.
by adya33 on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:11 UTC in reply to "IE 7.0 TCO."
adya33 Member since:
2005-07-18

I have installed it here & it did not said anything about fees. However I think it will be applicable if you order CD

Reply Score: 1

RE: IE 7.0 TCO.
by BluenoseJake on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:34 UTC in reply to "IE 7.0 TCO."
BluenoseJake Member since:
2005-08-11

Nothing, unless you are running win2k/NT, and then it will cost the same as an upgrade to XP, and some time running Windows Update. They have never charged for IE 3.x, 4.x, 5.x or 6.x, so why would they start now?

Edited 2006-01-31 19:34

Reply Score: 1

RE: IE 7.0 TCO.
by Dark_Knight on Wed 1st Feb 2006 17:29 UTC in reply to "IE 7.0 TCO."
Dark_Knight Member since:
2005-07-10

The reason I asked is that previously Microsoft was considering charging for the update to IE 7.0 for those not upgrading to Windows Vista. The actual amount I recall was $99.00 per Windows XP/2000/NT installation which would be costly for businesses. Though I see no mention of this at least with the IE 7.0 Beta information provided on their website so I pressume they've changed their mind, at least for now.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: IE 7.0 TCO.
by cwdrake on Wed 1st Feb 2006 18:30 UTC in reply to "RE: IE 7.0 TCO."
cwdrake Member since:
2005-08-09

Where did you hear that MS was considering charging for IE7?

Reply Score: 1

CSS? XHTML? well?
by modmans2ndcoming on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:33 UTC
modmans2ndcoming
Member since:
2005-11-09

what kind of stupid review is this?

Where are the real reviews from web devs?

Reply Score: 3

Ugly
by yoursecretninja on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:35 UTC
yoursecretninja
Member since:
2006-01-02

Not to sound like a jerk, but seriously, how does Microsoft manage to make all their software look so ugly? They did a horrible job at modernizing the interface, i'm sorry but the two round, glossy forward and backward buttons don't make up for the boxiness and poor use of gradients. This may sound nit-picky, but I spend all day on my computer at work; mostly surfing the web. It's nice to have a browser that is easy on the eyes. Most other browsers have a simple yet elegant look to them, and they allow theming if you want something nice. Microsoft should take note of that for IE development.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Ugly
by modmans2ndcoming on Tue 31st Jan 2006 18:51 UTC in reply to "Ugly"
modmans2ndcoming Member since:
2005-11-09

Are you claiming that you do not do any work at work? :-)

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Ugly
by yoursecretninja on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:22 UTC in reply to "RE: Ugly"
yoursecretninja Member since:
2006-01-02

hahaha, funny you picked up on that. I am a researcher and my job involves heavy use of the Internet - for work, not pleasure :-)

Reply Score: 1

RE: Ugly
by Sartoris on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:04 UTC in reply to "Ugly"
Sartoris Member since:
2005-07-07

I would hope they make it look more like Aero Glass. Not that I really like Aero Glass, but it should at least look similar to the rest of the OS.

In XP, it looks extremely ugly because none of the Vista styled buttons fit in.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Ugly
by ma_d on Wed 1st Feb 2006 01:02 UTC in reply to "RE: Ugly"
ma_d Member since:
2005-06-29

Aero glass effects only come in when you have the graphics system running... I'm sure that Aero glass effects come into play on Vista systems; just not XP.

Reply Score: 1

RE: Ugly
by robertojdohnert on Thu 2nd Feb 2006 02:23 UTC in reply to "Ugly"
robertojdohnert Member since:
2005-07-12

If you are saying Firefox is elegant then you are crazy. the only elegant browsers out here on the market are Netscape 8.1, Safari and maybe OmniWeb.

Reply Score: 1

Fonts
by adya33 on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:14 UTC
adya33
Member since:
2005-07-18

I have Clear type effect turned off in win XP on CRT monitor however in IE7 I am getting clear type font effect. anyone else facing same thing?

ps: abouve review is useless

Reply Score: 1

RE: Fonts
by bakanekov3 on Wed 1st Feb 2006 10:26 UTC in reply to "Fonts"
bakanekov3 Member since:
2005-07-06

There's an option for ClearType under the multimedia section in Internet Options->Advanced

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Fonts
by adya33 on Wed 1st Feb 2006 12:25 UTC in reply to "RE: Fonts"
adya33 Member since:
2005-07-18

ok got it. Thank you ;)

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: IE 7.0 TCO.
by jaboua on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:17 UTC
jaboua
Member since:
2005-09-08

I don't think they'll charge for IE7, especially as that would be to give away the opportunity to the free (no cost) opera and firefox to gain the rest of the windows browser marked, but I do think I read somewhere that they used to charge for it but made it free and included it in the OS to win over netscape in the browser wars... I can't remember where I read it, if I've gotten it wrong please put me back on track ;)

Reply Score: 1

Changes in the UI
by NelsonN on Tue 31st Jan 2006 19:47 UTC
NelsonN
Member since:
2005-12-20

Great going Microsoft. Why not change the UI some more and put the buttons on another application?

In my opinion there was no need to change the interface whatsoever.

Reply Score: 1

Looks like
by Axentrix on Tue 31st Jan 2006 20:08 UTC
Axentrix
Member since:
2005-12-16

YOUK! I realy realy, realy, don NOT like the look of that ! It looks like a pre-alpha-beta-design of firefox (Firefox is good, indeed).

I realy count on a new look in the final version.

Reply Score: 1

yuk
by cwdrake on Tue 31st Jan 2006 20:48 UTC
cwdrake
Member since:
2005-08-09

I had been using IE7 Beta 1 for a few months and really liked it. I DO NOT like the look and feel of this new beta.

Reply Score: 1

I have IE 6 running on NT4, under virtual PC.
by MIser on Tue 31st Jan 2006 21:27 UTC
MIser
Member since:
2005-12-19

It is a great way to test websites and how IE displays them when developing on a Mac. Much faster than running XP.

Reply Score: 1

Google?
by Jesuspower on Tue 31st Jan 2006 21:29 UTC
Jesuspower
Member since:
2006-01-28

Did anyone notice the google search field in the top right? Is that part of the google toolbar or a part of IE 7?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Google?
by cwdrake on Tue 31st Jan 2006 21:32 UTC in reply to "Google?"
cwdrake Member since:
2005-08-09

I thin kit is a part of IE7. If you bring down the arrow next to the magnifying glass, and go to "Get search providers", you can add from a number of different search providers. The ones you select will be added to your list, and you can choose which one you want to be the default.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Google?
by Jesuspower on Tue 31st Jan 2006 21:39 UTC in reply to "RE: Google?"
Jesuspower Member since:
2006-01-28

Is Google default then?

I just noticed the Google toolbar in another screenshot, so I guess you are right about that ;)

Reply Score: 1

The new UI
by TaterSalad on Tue 31st Jan 2006 21:54 UTC
TaterSalad
Member since:
2005-07-06

To those of you who don't like the new UI, remember this is a beta and not the final release. Well now that I stated the obvious, you can help change this by giving Microsoft some feedback on the UI. Tell them you don't like it and exactly what you don't like about it. Tell them where you think the button should be placed. Now is your chance before the interface gets worse. Take advantage of this opportunity.

Reply Score: 2

lol...
by helf on Tue 31st Jan 2006 22:32 UTC
helf
Member since:
2005-07-06

...the minimalist approach of alternative browsers like Firefox..."

minimalist, how?

anyways. I don't like the IE7 UI at all. its terrible. Looks thrown together.

Reply Score: 1

From IE7
by AdrianRyan on Wed 1st Feb 2006 00:43 UTC
AdrianRyan
Member since:
2005-07-02

Well, not exactly. I'm posting this from Firefox because I don't give IE the ability to accept cookies. The only search engine installed by default is MSN search, I'm sure this will change by the premier, other's will pay to have their engines there (unless MS thinks it will make more ad revenue by keeping everyone using MSN). The new interface is very sparce, and the buttons are all put in one area, which is actually really annoying, it takes a bit to know where to press to find something. I'm sure with more usage this will become second nature though. There is an RSS feed button, a few of them actually. The favorites have gotten an overhaul, with separate places for RSS feeds and bookmarks. The feeds thing seems really ridiculous to me: you subscribe, and it puts a link in your RSS tab in your Toolbar, and you have to click on that, you then get a new tab with the feed inside of it. Why not just add a bookmark to the site itself? I'm not sure, but then I don't use feeds anyway. Ctrl - F brings up the old search diolague, which is dissapointing. With the way I run my web browser, there is only enough room to comfortably fit 4 or 5 tabs, because there is a bunch of other stuff on the tab bar. I even prefer Opera's way of the toolbar under the tabs (which I don't like that much). The Acid 2 test is completely butchered. Finally, it doesn't match XP's theme at all, which isn't the biggest deal ever, but makes it kind of hard to use. That's my observations from about 30 minutes of using it. Download is available here since there are no links in the article or on OSNews.

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/IE/ie7/ie7betaredirect.mspx

Reply Score: 1

RE: From IE7
by AdrianRyan on Wed 1st Feb 2006 00:53 UTC in reply to "From IE7"
AdrianRyan Member since:
2005-07-02

Too late to edit it, so one more thing:

As far as I can tell, the only way to "uninstal" and go back to IE 6 is through system restore. Be forewarned.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: From IE7
by rm6990 on Wed 1st Feb 2006 01:01 UTC in reply to "RE: From IE7"
rm6990 Member since:
2005-07-04

Too late to edit it, so one more thing:

As far as I can tell, the only way to "uninstal" and go back to IE 6 is through system restore. Be forewarned.


Yep, I Google'd for uninstall ie7 and read about a lot of people who have hosed their systems so that IE doesn't even work anymore (which means Windows/Microsoft Update no longer works). Since Microsoft Update is all I normally use IE for, I have decided to not risk it and leave it on there, since it works in IE7. At least the IE-Tab extension for Firefox still works (this allows you to render a page using IE inside of Firefox, which is the same as what Netscape does). I use IETab quite a bit, so I am happy about that.

I am very unimpressed with Microsoft for making it so unsafe/difficult to roll back to a previous version of IE, espescially when the new version they are distributing is a beta. Did they not even test something as critical as this? Did they have a brain lapse of some sort?

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: From IE7
by jayson.knight on Wed 1st Feb 2006 04:16 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: From IE7"
jayson.knight Member since:
2005-07-06

As with all beta software, installing on a machine where consequences arising from this sort of thing should not be attempted. That being said, I agree that there should be an easier way to roll back the installation if something goes wrong.

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: From IE7
by jayson.knight on Wed 1st Feb 2006 05:30 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: From IE7"
jayson.knight Member since:
2005-07-06

Here's a good resource for running IE7 in "standalone" mode: http://weblogs.asp.net/jgalloway/archive/2005/08/12/422335.aspx

Reply Score: 1

RE[4]: From IE7
by AmigaRobbo on Wed 1st Feb 2006 09:57 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: From IE7"
AmigaRobbo Member since:
2005-11-15

There's a link on that page: "C'mon, spend a day with IE3 for old time's sake!"

Just downloaded IE3, and isn't it quick! On a very first look Basis, it just shows how little IE has changed in 10 years!

Reply Score: 1

RE[3]: From IE7
by cwdrake on Wed 1st Feb 2006 13:43 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: From IE7"
cwdrake Member since:
2005-08-09

To uninstall, go to Add/Remove Programs, check the Show Updates options, and scroll down to Windows XP -Software Updates. You can remove it there.

Reply Score: 1

Tried it, still using Firefox
by rm6990 on Wed 1st Feb 2006 00:56 UTC
rm6990
Member since:
2005-07-04

I used IE7 for a few hours and went back to Firefox due to some bugs that made it unusable for me.

My keyboard is very unresponsive in it. I wrote 3 sentences in a Slashdot post and there were about 10 missing letters. So I typed a few more sentences, very slowly, making sure I wasn't missing keys, and noticed that sometimes pressing a key doesn't mean it will actually display in IE7. It isn't my keyboard, because Firefox (before and after the install of IE7) doesn't have this problem. IE6 never exhibited this behaviour either.

IE7 won't save my cookies for some reason, even during a single session. I opened Slashdot in a new tab, logged in, left a couple of posts, and then closed the tab. About 20 minutes later, I went back to Slashdot and had to log in again. This problem was consistent, and occured on OSNews, Slashdot, Passport and numerous other sites. Google was the worst. Every time I opened the browser, I had to re-log into Gmail. Then, without even closing the tab, I would type www.google.com/ig into the address bar, and would have to sign in again. With Firefox, I can stay signed into Google for up to 2 weeks before having to re-enter my password.

I do know that this is a beta though, and left some comments on the page where Microsoft asks you to. Hopefully they are fixed before the final release.

Reply Score: 1

zooming
by MechR on Wed 1st Feb 2006 01:55 UTC
MechR
Member since:
2006-01-11

Interesting... there's a zooming feature that expands images along with text.

Reply Score: 1

RE: zooming
by MamiyaOtaru on Wed 1st Feb 2006 06:59 UTC in reply to "zooming"
MamiyaOtaru Member since:
2005-11-11

"Interesting... there's a zooming feature that expands images along with text."

Opera also has something like that. Not saying that IE sucks for implementing it later or that MS shouldn't put something like that in. As with tabs, good on them for adding it. I'm just saying there is another browser that does that if you are one of those who doesn't like the IE7 interface.

Speaking of zoomed images, I do wonder whether it's better to zoom images along with the text or not. I use Konqueror most of the time nowadays, with only text zooming, and sometimes miss that ability from back when I used Opera.

Zoomed text adds to readability for people with glasses, or people who lean way back when surfing (cough). Zoomed images don't do much expect look worse than at their native size. It also takes some processor time to resize them, especially with any sort of smoothing.

I can't come up with any concrete positives for zooming images as well as text, but I still kinda like it. Is it just because it's eye candy? Anyone else have any preferences there? *curious*

Edited 2006-02-01 07:03

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: zooming
by unoengborg on Wed 1st Feb 2006 11:03 UTC in reply to "RE: zooming"
unoengborg Member since:
2005-07-06


I can't come up with any concrete positives for zooming images as well as text, but I still kinda like it. Is it just because it's eye candy? Anyone else have any preferences there? *curious*


I think they could zoom SVGs and other vector image formats that doesn't degrade in quality when zoomed.

The downside of that is that it most likely will break websites that uses one pixel transparanct images to control layout.

The best solution would probably be to just zoom text but offer a zoom tool that could be applied to zoomable vector graphics images. E.g. when you moved the cursor over such an image it could change to a magnifying glass, and allow the user to zoom by holding the right mouse button down, and moving the mouse up or down.

Reply Score: 1

abhaysahai
Member since:
2005-10-20

First thing first, I mostly boot to Arch linux and use firefox as my default browser. However, I booted to WinXP SP2 to check this new browser after my friend ( working with MS) got all excited about IE7. Download and install were typical windows install ( including a reboot, I hardly reboot my Arch system). I was already feeling bad about this new browser. After reboot, I saw the changed IE icon and aprehensively clicked on it. It took me to some getting started page which gave me some ideas about the features. Further I opened gmail, distrowatch and osnews. Immidiately my perception changed. This looks similar to aqua theme of firefox and does every thing as firefox does, though tabs open a little slowly.
Never took any time to get adjusted to new placing of buttons, even feel that refresh/stop button are placed aptly. The search tool is easy to use and I configured it to use google as default. After this I just downloaded a matching windows theme and voila IE looks even better.
I relized after hours that this is the first time in 2 years that I a tinkering with XP UI, never felt like before IE7, as I always have fluxbox on Arch to fiddle with. If this can happen to a Arch user, then I presume many will like the new IE and hope that the final IE 7 will give be a strong cotender against Firefox.

Reply Score: 1

Nothing new here people, move along
by JustThinkIt on Wed 1st Feb 2006 15:03 UTC
JustThinkIt
Member since:
2005-09-04

Looks like I'll stick to Opera...

Reply Score: 1

Quick Review
by plepak on Thu 2nd Feb 2006 05:56 UTC
plepak
Member since:
2006-01-28

Looks great, works great. The new UI takes a little bit of getting used to, but I think that many people will be better off for it. IE7 works much better than the IE6/MSN Toolbar combination that I've been using since the toolbar was released. The risk of a few bugs here and there is of course a factor with beta software, but the fact that this has been publicly released should assure enough people that it is stable enough for the average person to run. Highly recommended.

Reply Score: 1