Linked by Thom Holwerda on Sat 28th Jan 2017 13:43 UTC
In the News

Alphabet Inc.'s Google delivered a sharp message to staff travelling overseas who may be impacted by a new executive order on immigration from President Donald Trump: Get back to the U.S. now.

Google Chief Executive Officer Sundar Pichai slammed Trump's move in a note to employees Friday, telling them that more than 100 company staff are affected by the order.

The Trump regime's measures also impact the visa program for, among other long-time US allies, The Netherlands. Did anyone tell the Trump regime that it's a very bad idea to make it harder for your third largest investor to, uh, actually invest? Are these men really that dumb?

Interesting to note, though, that Google had to be actually impacted by the Trump regime before it spoke up (only in an internal memo, but still). Meanwhile, Elon Musk is kissing the ground Trump walks on, and Tim Cook, CEO of the most arrogantly and smugly (supposedly) liberal tech company is meeting with Trump, Trump's daughter (...?) and other Republican leaders. From other tech giants who always touted the liberal horn of equality and progressiveness - a deafening, but quite revealing, silence.

So far, it seems like the tech industry leaders are opting for appeasement instead of resistance to the Trump regime's corruption, conflicts of interest, racism, war on science, and Christian extremism. I would be disappointed if it wasn't so utterly predictable to anyone who wasn't blinded by the fake smiles, hollow promises, and empty praise of equality, science, and progressive ideals.

They still have time to be remembered as people who stood up for those that need it the most. I'm afraid, though, we will remember them as spineless cowards, hiding behind shareholders while the free world crumbles to dust.

I hope it'll be worth it.

Order by: Score:
Comment by Nico57
by Nico57 on Sat 28th Jan 2017 14:01 UTC
Nico57
Member since:
2006-12-18

> I hope it'll be worth it.

Priceless !

Reply Score: 2

Build Google campuses elsewhere
by pfgbsd on Sat 28th Jan 2017 14:35 UTC
pfgbsd
Member since:
2011-03-12

A global company like Google shouldn't depend so much on US policies, especially when the government is going crazy. Just build datacenters and campuses elsewhere, there is no way to tax "internal" code.

Reply Score: 4

Try googling ibm and ww2
by Verenkeitin on Sat 28th Jan 2017 14:40 UTC
Verenkeitin
Member since:
2007-07-01

If I were an affected employee at Google, I'd request a transfer to work at a safer location, like Venezuela or Mexico.

Reply Score: 9

RE: Try googling ibm and ww2
by pfgbsd on Sun 29th Jan 2017 22:14 UTC in reply to "Try googling ibm and ww2"
pfgbsd Member since:
2011-03-12

If I were an affected employee at Google, I'd request a transfer to work at a safer location, like Venezuela or Mexico.


Venezuela has been classified for third time in a row as the most miserable country on earth. Mexico, Ireland or even the UK are fine places.

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Try googling ibm and ww2
by David on Tue 31st Jan 2017 00:08 UTC in reply to "RE: Try googling ibm and ww2"
David Member since:
1997-10-01

I think that was the joke. Admittedly, saying "Venezuela or Sudan" would have been a better joke. Most parts of Mexico would be a pretty decent place to live on a Google salary.

Reply Score: 1

Sanity
by acobar on Sat 28th Jan 2017 15:05 UTC
acobar
Member since:
2005-11-15

When you have to deal with ignorant minds with lots of power your best option is not to avoid them but to try, at least for some time, to illuminate their dark worlds. Pure and direct confront usually only increases the tension. With some luck and doses of right arguments at right time, you may slowly drive the captain to deviate the transatlantic from the iceberg.

Reply Score: 5

When was this memo sent out?
by IndigoJo on Sat 28th Jan 2017 16:49 UTC
IndigoJo
Member since:
2005-07-06

When did Google send out this memo? If they only sent it out this morning or yesterday, it wouldn't have reached the affected staff in time and they would still not have been able to travel back. In any case, measures to make sure employees were safely in the country should have been taken as soon as he took office if not weeks before, not once he started issuing orders.

Reply Score: 2

v RE: When was this memo sent out?
by SojoPhoto on Mon 30th Jan 2017 14:08 UTC in reply to "When was this memo sent out?"
v It'll be alright
by sj87 on Sat 28th Jan 2017 18:08 UTC
v Let tre butthurt flow through you
by dylansmrjones on Sat 28th Jan 2017 18:26 UTC
HangLoose Member since:
2007-09-03

Get outta here...

Obama does not think that climate change is a "hoax made by the Chinese".

But I guess "alternative facts" is the new black... I mean orage.

Reply Score: 5

HangLoose Member since:
2007-09-03

I don't know what this has to to with the topic but I will bite: to may be so that he was lost at that moment, and some others more.

But have you looked at George Bush and Trump?

I did not vote for Trump or Bush or Obama so this "pissing contest" ends here for me.

Reply Score: 2

This was bound to happen...
by cmost on Sat 28th Jan 2017 18:47 UTC
cmost
Member since:
2006-07-16

This is what happens when the monster truck enthusiasts crowd is allowed to put a racist xenophobic narcissist in the white house. The implosion of the US has begun.

Reply Score: 5

RE: This was bound to happen...
by devloop on Sat 28th Jan 2017 19:37 UTC in reply to "This was bound to happen..."
devloop Member since:
2007-11-12

> The implosion of the US has begun.

You must be new here.

Reply Score: 6

At this rate
by Dasher42 on Sat 28th Jan 2017 19:08 UTC
Dasher42
Member since:
2007-04-05

At this rate, the amount of indignation the mainstream left has might hit such a pitch that folks will be sick of the actual game. Trump's disgusting, Obama was nice! Sure looked that way to those who didn't notice the 26,000+ bombs Obama's military dropped in 2016 alone. Really, most of the uproar is over who got the contract to lead a warmonger crony-capitalist state, because that's what both parties are gunning for. At some point, the chickens come home to roost for that.

This is really about how Trump utterly fails to mask our bullshit. He's the USA's dirty laundry flagrantly flapping in the breeze instead of tucked neatly away behind Brand Obama.

In the meantime, Trump's likely to demolish so much of the Federal government that people are likely to look to regional or near-networked institutions instead. I'm thinking we're headed for a scenario similar to the breakup of the USSR.

Edited 2017-01-28 19:10 UTC

Reply Score: 13

RE: At this rate
by Deviate_X on Mon 30th Jan 2017 14:02 UTC in reply to "At this rate"
Deviate_X Member since:
2005-07-11

At this rate, the amount of indignation the mainstream left has might hit such a pitch that folks will be sick of the actual game. Trump's disgusting, Obama was nice! Sure looked that way to those who didn't notice the 26,000+ bombs Obama's military dropped in 2016 alone. Really, most of the uproar is over who got the contract to lead a warmonger crony-capitalist state, because that's what both parties are gunning for. At some point, the chickens come home to roost for that.

This is really about how Trump utterly fails to mask our bullshit. He's the USA's dirty laundry flagrantly flapping in the breeze instead of tucked neatly away behind Brand Obama.

In the meantime, Trump's likely to demolish so much of the Federal government that people are likely to look to regional or near-networked institutions instead. I'm thinking we're headed for a scenario similar to the breakup of the USSR.


A minor quibble > but Obama was not leftist, he was centrist politically, which why 26,000 bombs were dropped in 26,000 and why the banks were bailed out and not the people.

For the true-left Trump is a gift of an unignorable rallying call.

Reply Score: 3

jgfenix
Member since:
2006-05-25

Are you kidding? The companies have to have good relationships with governments if they want to make businesses. I don't want the companies I have shares of to make politics, I want them to make businesses.

Also I disagree with that "liberal equality". I find insulting to Liberalism to call liberal to what they do in USA.

Reply Score: 5

liberal horn of hypocrisy
by viton on Sat 28th Jan 2017 22:03 UTC
viton
Member since:
2005-08-09

edit: After reviewing my post I decided to remove it, as it was a bit off-topic.
It was about neo-liberals, who are fine with medieval sectarian regimes, war, terror, torture and oppression of women if it occurs somewhere else.

Edited 2017-01-28 22:18 UTC

Reply Score: 2

v "Regime" ....
by cade on Sat 28th Jan 2017 22:31 UTC
RE: "Regime" ....
by Lennie on Sun 29th Jan 2017 12:04 UTC in reply to ""Regime" ...."
Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

One big test for Trump will be the cancellation of the blow-back based military-industrial-complex-driven war-mongering foreign policy that has existed for decades as a default stance for US governments, be it a Republican or Democrat government.


From what I've seen/heard so far, it looks like trump is a childish egomaniac puppet. Who put in place in the new government some people he needed to keep his friends happy and the republicans put in their friends for the rest.

Which includes people like Rex Tillerson and started-already-asking-for-more-money-for-more-wars James Mattis.

A good thing would be if somehow Trump arranged AMD and NVIDIA to open-source the complete documentation for their GPU technologies so that these technologies can have potential of being more easily implemented in any (hobbyist/real) OS in a high quality manner. Trump could buy them out and form a single entity, imparting America with GPU greatness. A-h-h-h-h just a fantasy, but an interesting one.


An unusual fantasy, I see no reason for someone like trump to do so. Or the path he would take to do so.

Reply Score: 3

Trump / Apple
by Alfman on Sat 28th Jan 2017 22:33 UTC
Alfman
Member since:
2011-01-28

Thom Holwerda,

Interesting to note, though, that Google had to be actually impacted by the Trump regime before it spoke up (only in an internal memo, but still). Meanwhile, Elon Musk is kissing the ground Trump walks on, and Tim Cook, CEO of the most arrogantly and smugly (supposedly) liberal tech company is meeting with Trump, Trump's daughter (...?) and other Republican leaders. From other tech giants who always touted the liberal horn of equality and progressiveness - a deafening, but quite revealing, silence.


This is bound to be controversial point, but I'm hoping it's an interesting one for discussion...

Trump seems to have a copy of Steve Job's formula for the reality distortion field. Both exhibit extreme narcissistic control and egos, taking all the credit and claiming they know better than anybody else. Both draw crowds of people who seem to like their authoritarian approach in their respective areas. Both deliberately manipulate the media by punishing those who are direct and honest.

If Jobs were president, or if Trump ran apple, their management styles would probably be almost the same. The difference is Jobs was more progressive than Trump, and his supporters would come from opposite ends of the spectrum (right?).

Reply Score: 9

RE: Trump / Apple
by dpJudas on Sun 29th Jan 2017 00:57 UTC in reply to "Trump / Apple"
dpJudas Member since:
2009-12-10

If Jobs were president, or if Trump ran apple, their management styles would probably be almost the same. The difference is Jobs was more progressive than Trump, and his supporters would come from opposite ends of the spectrum (right?).

Comparing Jobs to Trump seems pretty silly to me. Yes, Jobs was supposedly an asshole, but please show me in what business Trump managed to set up an environment for other great people to excel.

For starters, Jobs acknowledged that the Woz and other people he worked with were far superior at what they did. Contrast this with Trump that pretty much only talks about how great he himself is. I don't think Trump thinks he ever met anyone at or above his own level.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Trump / Apple
by unclefester on Sun 29th Jan 2017 02:42 UTC in reply to "RE: Trump / Apple"
unclefester Member since:
2007-01-13

Comparing Jobs to Trump seems pretty silly to me. Yes, Jobs was supposedly an asshole, but please show me in what business Trump managed to set up an environment for other great people to excel.


A real estate developer spends most of his time dealing with total scumbags including mafia, union thugs and crooked politicians. The means to success is ruthless cost cutting and the ability to deal with people you despise.

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: Trump / Apple
by Alfman on Sun 29th Jan 2017 03:52 UTC in reply to "RE: Trump / Apple"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

For starters, Jobs acknowledged that the Woz and other people he worked with were far superior at what they did. Contrast this with Trump that pretty much only talks about how great he himself is. I don't think Trump thinks he ever met anyone at or above his own level.


Steve Jobs took advantage of Steve Wozniak and even lied to his partner over finances in order to advance himself. I know it's easy to forget over the years, but his obsession with what people thought about him and desire to have all the credit reminds me alot of Trump. Sure we can nitpick the different circumstances, but the high level character similarities are striking.

Comparing Jobs to Trump seems pretty silly to me...


It's a serious comparison. I realize it presses the wrong buttons for people who adored Jobs and detest Trump, and I fully understand why you have to deny the similarities. Yet, this conflict is what makes the comparison so insightful.

Reply Score: 6

RE[3]: Trump / Apple
by unclefester on Sun 29th Jan 2017 05:49 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Trump / Apple"
unclefester Member since:
2007-01-13

It's a serious comparison. I realize it presses the wrong buttons for people who adored Jobs and detest Trump, and I fully understand why you have to deny the similarities. Yet, this conflict is what makes the comparison so insightful.


Trump has never pretended to be a saint. He also adores his family, unlike Jobs, who denied paternity and refused to met his biological father.

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Trump / Apple
by Morgan on Mon 30th Jan 2017 04:33 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Trump / Apple"
Morgan Member since:
2005-06-29

who denied paternity


And then reconciled with his daughter, forming a loving relationship[1]. If you're going to tell a story, tell the whole story.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Jobs#Family

Reply Score: 3

RE[5]: Trump / Apple
by henderson101 on Mon 30th Jan 2017 09:46 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Trump / Apple"
henderson101 Member since:
2006-05-30

And also - Jobs has multiple children, and he only ever denied paternity over the one child - Lisa - born to an on/off girlfriend in the middle of his most hedonistic/experimental/hippy phase. I believe the argument originally was that he didn't believe she was completely faithful to him and that the child was then obviously not his - then Jobs being Jobs, his own reality distortion field blinded the rest of the story. He started to believe his own doubts as being truth and only relented when the empirical evidence was stacked so much against his position that he couldn't deny it any more. Sounds familiar? Sounds like the rest of his damn career to me.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Trump / Apple
by dpJudas on Sun 29th Jan 2017 07:35 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Trump / Apple"
dpJudas Member since:
2009-12-10

It's a serious comparison. I realize it presses the wrong buttons for people who adored Jobs and detest Trump, and I fully understand why you have to deny the similarities. Yet, this conflict is what makes the comparison so insightful.

Lol, what? I don't adore Jobs. What I'm saying is that just because they have certain things in common, they are also VERY different.

For example, I don't think Jobs would have proudly announced he was going to declare trade wars on FOUR fronts (Asia, Europe, Mexico and Canada) at the same time. Even if he did have such a plan, he'd be far far more clever about it. Jobs may have been a narcissist, but that's also where the similarities end!

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: Trump / Apple
by Alfman on Sun 29th Jan 2017 08:45 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Trump / Apple"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

dpJudas,

Lol, what? I don't adore Jobs. What I'm saying is that just because they have certain things in common, they are also VERY different...


Of course, it's why I said they were at opposite ends of the spectrum. However in referring to his reality distortion field, you can't deny that he and Trump are very close cousins, metaphorically speaking. I won't dwell on it, it's just something I thought was interesting when Thom brought up apple in relation to the Trump administration. No offense intended for Steve Jobs fans, or in unclefester's case: Trump fans. I really hadn't expected that ;)

Reply Score: 4

RE: Trump / Apple
by Carewolf on Sun 29th Jan 2017 10:51 UTC in reply to "Trump / Apple"
Carewolf Member since:
2005-09-08

The difference is that Jobs still for all his lies and manipulation, still was highly competent, where Trump is not, and probably couldn't event figure out what competent means even with a dictionary.

Note though that Steve Jobs was dyslexic just like Trump, though apparently more honest about it, because Trump still pretends he can read.

Reply Score: 6

RE[2]: Trump / Apple
by henderson101 on Mon 30th Jan 2017 09:48 UTC in reply to "RE: Trump / Apple"
henderson101 Member since:
2006-05-30

Trump is like crayola Steve Jobs. Dumbed down for the kids and simple minded.

Reply Score: 4

RE: Trump / Apple
by Soulbender on Mon 30th Jan 2017 05:20 UTC in reply to "Trump / Apple"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

Yeah, but at least Jobs was a reasonably successful businessman, not a abject failure like Trump.

Reply Score: 6

RE: Trump / Apple
by StephenBeDoper on Wed 1st Feb 2017 20:03 UTC in reply to "Trump / Apple"
StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

This is bound to be controversial point, but I'm hoping it's an interesting one for discussion...

Trump seems to have a copy of Steve Job's formula for the reality distortion field. Both exhibit extreme narcissistic control and egos, taking all the credit and claiming they know better than anybody else. Both draw crowds of people who seem to like their authoritarian approach in their respective areas. Both deliberately manipulate the media by punishing those who are direct and honest.


I'm far from being the biggest Jobs fan, but I think that he and Trump are worlds apart - despite the superficial similarities. Jobs was practically the embodiment of every "American Dream" cliche there is: the son of an immigrant who started one of the world's most successful companies from his parent's garage. Trump, in contrast, was handed a huge fortune & real estate empire as inheritance.

Jobs also has, IMO, a much better track record as a businessman. Jobs took his largest business failure (getting ousted from Apple) and eventually turned that around through NeXT's effective reverse-takeover of Apple & proceeded lead the company to the most successful period in its history. Trump, on the other hand, largely ran his inherited empire into the ground, with such a long list of business failures that legitimate banks would no longer extend him credit by the early 00s - and he only staved off irrelevancy by jumping on the "D-list celebs desperate enough to do reality TV" bandwagon & turning his name into a merchandising brand.

As for the individuals themselves, while Jobs was known for being strongly & aggressively opinionated, I don't know of any instances where he uttered anything comparable to the sort of ignorant, hateful bile that Trump regularly spews. I also don't know of any allegations of sexual assault made against Jobs, credible or otherwise - even his long, well-documented history of parking in handicapped spaces seems pretty mundane when compared to some of the allegations made against Trump.

And while somewhat OT, it's also worth noting that, as the son of Muslim immigrant (from *gasp* Syria, no less), had Trump's current immigration policies been in place in the past, then Jobs would likely have never been born (since his parents met in the US) & Apple probably ever would have existed.

Edited 2017-02-01 20:04 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Trump / Apple
by StephenBeDoper on Wed 1st Feb 2017 22:24 UTC in reply to "RE: Trump / Apple"
StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

Oh, and one other point I forgot to add: whatever else can be said about Steve Jobs, he was clearly a fiercely intelligent person and someone who probably could have been successful in nearly any field he pursued. I know it's common in tech geek circles to look down on Jobs for having next to no technical background/skills - but if anything, I think that makes his accomplishments more impressive. He was massively successful in arenas that are usually very to weed out those non-techies.

Trump, on the other hand? The most intelligent thing I can credit him for is that he waited to run for president until after Hunter S. Thompson, Kurt Vonnegut, and George Carlin had all died.

Edited 2017-02-01 22:25 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Trump / Apple
by Alfman on Thu 2nd Feb 2017 13:08 UTC in reply to "RE: Trump / Apple"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

StephenBeDoper,

I'm far from being the biggest Jobs fan, but I think that he and Trump are worlds apart - despite the superficial similarities. Jobs was practically the embodiment of every "American Dream" cliche there is: the son of an immigrant who started one of the world's most successful companies from his parent's garage. Trump, in contrast, was handed a huge fortune & real estate empire as inheritance.

Jobs also has, IMO, a much better track record as a businessman. Jobs took his largest business failure (getting ousted from Apple) and eventually turned that around through NeXT's effective reverse-takeover of Apple & proceeded lead the company to the most successful period in its history.


Sure I can agree that trump is overrated in every way. He likes to pretend he built wealth from scratch, but there's hardly any evidence he'd be special if he didn't have the family wealth to start with and fall back on during his many failures.

That said, sometimes steve jobs got too much credit too. That's the thing, steve jobs fans like to give him enormous credit, but it doesn't necessarily follow that apple only did well exclusively because of him. Apple's sales went up significantly under Sculley after Job's departure and continued to go up significantly. I don't know where to find it now, but there was a graph that showed just how well apple did under Sculley.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Sculley
Sales at Apple increased from $800 million to $8 billion under Sculley's management, although many attribute his success to the fact that Sculley joined the company just when Steve Jobs' visions and Steve Wozniak's creations had become highly lucrative.


Still, many people like to give steve jobs all the credit for it, even the five years he wasn't there. Here's the thing though, a lot of people who make it into lucrative positions are never challenged to repeat it because they don't have to. Thus it makes it genuinely hard to determine how much was really luck & timing versus a unique skill.

It would have been far more satisfying for my curiosity to watch Next computers make it on their own independently from apple. Most leaders who are wildly successful once are never able to repeat it independently again.


even his long, well-documented history of parking in handicapped spaces seems pretty mundane when compared to some of the allegations made against Trump.


Haha, I completely forgot about that. I had read that steve jobs had a habit of parking his mega-yacht illegally as well.

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Trump / Apple
by StephenBeDoper on Thu 2nd Feb 2017 16:46 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Trump / Apple"
StephenBeDoper Member since:
2005-07-06

StephenBeDoper,

"I'm far from being the biggest Jobs fan, but I think that he and Trump are worlds apart - despite the superficial similarities. Jobs was practically the embodiment of every "American Dream" cliche there is: the son of an immigrant who started one of the world's most successful companies from his parent's garage. Trump, in contrast, was handed a huge fortune & real estate empire as inheritance.

Jobs also has, IMO, a much better track record as a businessman. Jobs took his largest business failure (getting ousted from Apple) and eventually turned that around through NeXT's effective reverse-takeover of Apple & proceeded lead the company to the most successful period in its history.


Sure I can agree that trump is overrated in every way. He likes to pretend he built wealth from scratch, but there's hardly any evidence he'd be special if he didn't have the family wealth to start with and fall back on during his many failures.

That said, sometimes steve jobs got too much credit too. That's the thing, steve jobs fans like to give him enormous credit, but it doesn't necessarily follow that apple only did well exclusively because of him.
"

I agree that he's often given too much credit, I'm not one of those folks who treats Jobs as if he had personal, hands-on involvement in every aspect of every Apple product released during his tenure. And I know of several instances where Apple succeeded despite Jobs, rather than because of him: E.g. Jobs initially tried to sabotage the Macintosh project, because he saw it as competition to his pet-project, the Lisa - had he succeeded, Apple may very well have ended up the same was as Atari & Commodore.

Apple's sales went up significantly under Sculley after Job's departure and continued to go up significantly. I don't know where to find it now, but there was a graph that showed just how well apple did under Sculley.


Yeah, the Sculley years were decent - as a techy, I personally prefer the pre-Jobs return Macs to the post-return models. That didn't really continue through the Gil Amelio years, though - Apple was in pretty bad shape by the late 90s. I was at MacWorld '96 in Boston, the atmosphere resembled a store in the final hours of its going-out-of-business sale.

Still, many people like to give steve jobs all the credit for it, even the five years he wasn't there. Here's the thing though, a lot of people who make it into lucrative positions are never challenged to repeat it because they don't have to. Thus it makes it genuinely hard to determine how much was really luck & timing versus a unique skill.


Oh yeah, there are all sort of ways that things could have gone differently, especially if the opportunity to be purchased/take over Apple hadn't presented itself - E.g. if Be hadn't held out for more money than Apple was willing to pay, or if Apple's earlier internal attempts to replace MacOS had succeeded.

And there's some details of Jobs' return to Apple that are a little sketchy - reportedly he helped drive down Apple's stock price shortly before his return, by selling off a large amount of his shares (done anonymously at the time & only revealed later). But even that I think is an interesting illustration of the differences between Jobs and Trump: when Jobs screwed people over and bent the rules to achieve his goals, he was at least usually successful in those goals - while Trump has a history screwing people over and bending the rules too, he still managed to fail at most business ventures.

Reply Score: 2

Globalist
by Dirge on Sun 29th Jan 2017 01:21 UTC
Dirge
Member since:
2005-07-14

Interesting, does this make trump anti globalist?

Reply Score: 1

RE: Globalist
by Flatland_Spider on Sun 29th Jan 2017 04:55 UTC in reply to "Globalist"
Flatland_Spider Member since:
2006-09-01

Yes. One of his major platforms is isolationism.

Reply Score: 3

v Smoking crack again Thom?
by unclefester on Sun 29th Jan 2017 02:32 UTC
RE: Smoking crack again Thom?
by dacloo on Sun 29th Jan 2017 03:28 UTC in reply to "Smoking crack again Thom?"
dacloo Member since:
2006-07-22

Hotbed of extremism? Are you out of your mind? Where did you get your information?

I'm Dutch (living in the US) and I can tell you that perception is completely wrong. The real extremism hotbed now is the White House.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Alfman on Sun 29th Jan 2017 04:59 UTC in reply to "RE: Smoking crack again Thom?"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

dacloo,

I'm Dutch (living in the US) and I can tell you that perception is completely wrong. The real extremism hotbed now is the White House.


It worries me greatly that people with the same legal status to be in the US as myself are being detained at borders and being refused entry to the US. While I'm not from an eastern country affected by Trump's ban, it is very alarming that the whitehouse is actually banning people who have legal visas without cause.

Four years of this could make the US a very draconian country.

Reply Score: 4

unclefester Member since:
2007-01-13


It worries me greatly that people with the same legal status to be in the US as myself are being detained at borders and being refused entry to the US. While I'm not from an eastern country affected by Trump's ban, it is very alarming that the whitehouse is actually banning people who have legal visas without cause.

Four years of this could make the US a very draconian country.


The only people being (temporarily) banned are those from seven countries with a strong history of terrorist acts against the USA.

Iran is the only one of the seven countries that produces a significant number of potentially useful migrants.

Reply Score: 0

RE[4]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Alfman on Sun 29th Jan 2017 07:56 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

unclefester,

He's banning people with green cards who have families here and additionally turning away legal visa holders who already passed the two year vetting process that was in place. We are far more likely to be harmed by domestic threats than new immigrants seeking a better life for themselves. The only reason these families are being turned away is because they've become pawns in Trump's political gambit to spread xenophobic hysteria.


His message to "make America great again" by adding new barriers is contradictory, Mexico and immigrants have always been there throughout all of our economic cycles, both rises and falls. Illegal immigration is actually down. Better men in the republican party have debated the same issues with far more wisdom than Trump.

http://www.usatoday.com/videos/news/2017/01/28/george-h.-w.-bush-an...

Donald Trump uses them as scapegoats because that's Donald Trumps modus operandi. Trump compares himself to Ronald Reagan as the great Republican, but Ronald Reagan would be ashamed of Trump.

https://reaganlibrary.archives.gov/archives/speeches/1986/70386d.htm

Call it mysticism if you will, I have always believed there was some divine providence that placed this great land here between the two great oceans, to be found by a special kind of people from every corner of the world, who had a special love for freedom and a special courage that enabled them to leave their own land, leave their friends and their countrymen, and come to this new and strange land to build a New World of peace and freedom and hope. Lincoln spoke about hope as he left the hometown he would never see again to take up the duties of the Presidency and bring America through a terrible Civil War. At each stop on his long train ride to Washington, the news grew worse: The Nation was dividing; his own life was in peril. On he pushed, undaunted. In Philadelphia he spoke in Independence Hall, where 85 years earlier the Declaration of Independence had been signed. He noted that much more had been achieved there than just independence from Great Britain. It was, he said, ``hope to the world, future for all time.''

...

We're bound together because, like them, we too dare to hope -- hope that our children will always find here the land of liberty in a land that is free. We dare to hope too that we'll understand our work can never be truly done until every man, woman, and child shares in our gift, in our hope, and stands with us in the light of liberty -- the light that, tonight, will shortly cast its glow upon her, as it has upon us for two centuries, keeping faith with a dream of long ago and guiding millions still to a future of peace and freedom.


By mouthing off as he does, Trump disgraces the role of president.

Edited 2017-01-29 08:00 UTC

Reply Score: 5

unclefester Member since:
2007-01-13

unclefester,

He's banning people with green cards who have families here and additionally turning away legal visa holders who already passed the two year vetting process that was in place.


The vetting process is a farce. The State Department has zero ability to perform rigorous background checks on people from these countries.

Australia accepted Man Haron Monis as a refugee from Iran in 1996. He sexually assaulted over 40 women and helped his girlfriend kill his ex-wife. Finally he held the staff and patrons of the Lindt Cafe in Sydney hostage. Police killed Monis after he shot and killed the manager.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Man_Haron_Monis

Reply Score: 2

RE[6]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Alfman on Sun 29th Jan 2017 10:52 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
Alfman Member since:
2011-01-28

unclefester,

The vetting process is a farce. The State Department has zero ability to perform rigorous background checks on people from these countries.

Australia accepted Man Haron Monis as a refugee from Iran in 1996. He sexually assaulted over 40 women and helped his girlfriend kill his ex-wife. Finally he held the staff and patrons of the Lindt Cafe in Sydney hostage. Police killed Monis after he shot and killed the manager.


Sure it's wrong, and I condemn it, but I don't know what cherry picking a case from Australia is supposed to prove other than "my xenophobia is justified". I'll see your Iranian murderer and raise you two American murders.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2014/04/14/suburban-kansa...

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/charleston-church-shooting-...

Don't even get started on sexual assault against woman when your defending Trump...

Look, I'm not saying violence is not a problem, it is. But statistically the US murder rate is higher for US citizens than the countries being banned, vetted immigrants are even less likely to be violent than our own.

http://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/Iran/United-States...

We have a problem with violence here in the US, and by encouraging cultural divisions and spreading xenophobic hatred, Trump is only making it worse. Rather than making peace, he's making enemies. The victims who most need our help today are being turned away, Trump is sending them right back to the destitute conditions they left and the only groups willing to accept them are the terror organizations they sought to escape in exchange for becoming new extremists. This is a travesty!

Reply Score: 5

tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

So you're using Australia to indict America. Flawless mouth breathing logic you got going there...

Reply Score: 3

RE[4]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by shotsman on Sun 29th Jan 2017 11:30 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
shotsman Member since:
2005-07-22

One of those banned by this move is a Conservative Party MP from the UK. He was born in Kurdistan which is part of Iraq hence the ban. He is a UK citizen. He has two sons at Princeton who were born in the UK.
Trump regards him as a terroist.

Oh and when President T adresses the UK Parliament, this MP will be there unless the US Secret service get him banned from Parliament where he was sent by his electorate.

Reply Score: 6

RE[5]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by shotsman on Sun 29th Jan 2017 14:04 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
shotsman Member since:
2005-07-22

It is even worse than that.
Four time Olympic Gold Medal winner Sir Mo Farrah can't return to the USA where his family is and where he had lived for the past 6 years. His crime was to be born in Somaila where he left as a refugee aged 6.
Kinghted on Jan 1st 2017, branded a terrorist before the end of Jan 2017.

That deomstrates how silly a blanket ban like this is.

Reply Score: 5

RE[4]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Lennie on Sun 29th Jan 2017 12:10 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

The list of countries makes no sense. Please do some research. There are other countries in the middle east that actually had people in the past come to the US for terrorism and they are not banned.

Reply Score: 4

RE[5]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by thulfram on Sun 29th Jan 2017 14:16 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
thulfram Member since:
2013-10-11

The list is made up of all the Moslem countries minus the Moslem countries that Trump wants to build hotels in. He's announced that he intends to build hotels in the non-banned countries.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/countries-where-trump-does-b...

The thing that is so strange about the current situation is that the new people in power aren't even attempting to hide their intent to plunder everything in sight.

Pirates!

Reply Score: 4

RE[6]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Lennie on Sun 29th Jan 2017 14:59 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
Lennie Member since:
2007-09-22

That is what I meant with: "makes no sense"

In a normal functioning government making rational decisions.

Which this government clearly is not.

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by unclefester on Sun 29th Jan 2017 05:44 UTC in reply to "RE: Smoking crack again Thom?"
unclefester Member since:
2007-01-13

Hotbed of extremism? Are you out of your mind? Where did you get your information?


Documentary maker Theo van Gogh murdered
for 'insulting' Islam
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_van_Gogh_(film_director)

Netherlands politician Geeert Wildeers under 24 hour police protection from Islamists.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Theo_van_Gogh_(film_director)

Fatwa issued against Islam critic Hirsi Ali.
https://pjmedia.com/homeland-security/2016/04/23/imam-who-threatened...

I'm Dutch (living in the US) and I can tell you that perception is completely wrong. The real extremism hotbed now is the White House.


The only threats of violence I've seen are those coming from so called 'liberals' such as Madonna.

The Netherlands has a visa and migration system which is (effectively) more discriminatory than the USA. In particular the notoriously difficult Dutch language and culture test can be used as an excuse to keep out foreigners.
https://ind.nl/en/dutch-citizenship/Pages/Naturalisation.aspx

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by moondevil on Sun 29th Jan 2017 07:56 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
moondevil Member since:
2005-07-08

In particular the notoriously difficult Dutch language and culture test can be used as an excuse to keep out foreigners.


Any foreigners should speak the country's language if it he or she want to be a citizen of that country.

In Europe, all countries do require language and culture tests for citizenship.

So in US anyone can be become a citizen without speaking English?!

Reply Score: 2

RE[4]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Brendan on Sun 29th Jan 2017 08:58 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
Brendan Member since:
2005-11-16

Hi,

So in US anyone can be become a citizen without speaking English?!


In the US, anyone used to be able to become a citizen without knowing any of the country's native languages (Navajo, Cree, Ojibwe, etc).

- Brendan

Reply Score: 5

unclefester Member since:
2007-01-13


Any foreigners should speak the country's language if it he or she want to be a citizen of that country.


The test requires an expert knowledge of Dutch language and culture. It is considered difficult even for native speakers. The real purpose is to block migrants from non-Western countries.


So in US anyone can be become a citizen without speaking English?!


English is a global language. The US naturalization English test requires rote learning a vocabulary of around 100 words.
https://www.uscis.gov/citizenship/learners/study-test/study-material...

Reply Score: 3

Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

So in US anyone can be become a citizen without speaking English?!


Thankfully for many white Americans it seems that having a good grasp of the English language is not a requirement. Not even for becoming President.

Edited 2017-02-01 04:36 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE[3]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by kwan_e on Sun 29th Jan 2017 08:36 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
kwan_e Member since:
2007-02-18

The only threats of violence I've seen are those coming from so called 'liberals' such as Madonna.


Republican voters have been calling for the assassination and incarceration of political opponents for most of the last eight years. And by political opponents, I don't mean just Hillary, but basically anyone who didn't vote their way.

The only politician killed last year because of Brexit was a remain Labour MP who the murderer called a traitor. Conservative voters have been using the language of "traitor" against political opponents for having different points of view and it was only a matter of time before that kind of language drives action.

Keep burying your head in the sand if you want.

Reply Score: 5

RE[4]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by acobar on Sun 29th Jan 2017 14:51 UTC in reply to "RE[3]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
acobar Member since:
2005-11-15

It is really tragic that the situation has reached the current point. History has lots of lessons but most just don´t care to look at them. There are warnings all around and similarities with despising/disastrous governments of past: the "blame others" attitude, the hate speech, the brash/unwary acts. As I said in some other thread, I lost the hope that the current administration will try to do good but I still have hope that some top leaders of big corporations will try to exert some influence on current government key leaders to avert the worst.

One of the problems, by my nescient knowledge of politics, is the current cards the players have to play with: Trump and his truly minions don´t have the support of most Republicans and as so must draw his power from the promises he presented to his voters; the Republicans see the current situation as a opportunity to advance long sought policies (deregulation, taxation, and so on) and may use the scuffles they had with Trump to dump any failure on him; the opposition needs more ammunition than it has right now; the press is quite surprised that all the warnings did not prevent the crash and have been until know ineffective, i.e. it showed that checking facts is not part of the culture of a large number of electors, and even worst, made part of population even more suspect of them and their motives.

Reply Score: 5

RE[5]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by dionicio on Sun 29th Jan 2017 19:08 UTC in reply to "RE[4]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
dionicio Member since:
2006-07-12

"...the Republicans see the current situation as a opportunity to advance long sought policies (deregulation, taxation, and so on)..."

While regular, "news" public just looking at the CIRCUS. It's a quite ancient war strategy, Acobar.

Reply Score: 3

RE[6]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by acobar on Mon 30th Jan 2017 12:26 UTC in reply to "RE[5]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
acobar Member since:
2005-11-15

I was talking about how disengaged the Republicans can claim they were from their president. It is quite unusual to have a "leader" so far from his own party. Usually it is painful to distance oneself from your superior and there is a price to pay (treason accusations, negligence to your duty to have to come forward beforehand and so on). They have a better upper hand now to do so and dump their own failures on Trump.

Reply Score: 4

RE[3]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by daedalus on Mon 30th Jan 2017 14:08 UTC in reply to "RE[2]: Smoking crack again Thom?"
daedalus Member since:
2011-01-14

By "foreigners", you mean what exactly? Plenty of English and other speakers happily live and work in The Netherlands. You don't need to be a citizen to work there, you just need a work permit. Of course it will help you get a job and what not if you speak Dutch, but there's no test unless you actually want to become a Dutch citizen.

If they wanted to keep out foreigners, they're going about it all wrong.

Reply Score: 4

RE: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Thom_Holwerda on Mon 30th Jan 2017 12:44 UTC in reply to "Smoking crack again Thom?"
Thom_Holwerda Member since:
2005-06-29

The Netherlands is a lowly 13th place on the list of US trading partners. The US-Netherlands trade represents less than 2% of total US trade.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_the_largest_trading_partners_o...


This is a classic case of false equivalence. "Trading partner" IS NOT THE SAME as investor. Had you looked at the actual LINK WITH SOURCE I placed in the article, YOU WOULD HAVE KNOWN THIS. Let me copy and paste directly from THE f--kING US STATE DEPARTMENT:

"The Netherlands is the third largest investor in the United States, supporting an estimated 700,000 jobs, and the eighth largest importer of U.S. goods."

https://www.state.gov/r/pa/ei/bgn/3204.htm

Considering the Netherlands is a hotbed of Islamist extremism the US is probably being sensible.


Number of deaths due to Islamic extremism in the US: ~3000.
Number of deaths due to Islamic extremism in The Netherlands: 1.

Since you clearly do not understand numbers (possibly because they're Arabic numerals): 3000 is a much, much larger number than 1.

No wonder Trumpists believe the kind of bullshit his Christian extremist regime spews forth. You people can't read, don't understand what important terms mean, and can't do basic f--king arithmatic.

Edited 2017-01-30 12:56 UTC

Reply Score: 4

RE[2]: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Novan_Leon on Wed 1st Feb 2017 15:34 UTC in reply to "RE: Smoking crack again Thom?"
Novan_Leon Member since:
2005-12-07

Number of deaths due to Islamic extremism in the US: ~3000.
Number of deaths due to Islamic extremism in The Netherlands: 1.

Since you clearly do not understand numbers (possibly because they're Arabic numerals): 3000 is a much, much larger number than 1.


The population of the Netherlands is also 16.8 million to the USA's 318+ million. The USA being the dominant superpower in the world and the de-facto leader of the free world also makes it THE prime target to attack when you fundamentally oppose Western values. There's simply no comparison between the Netherlands and the USA that makes sense in this respect.

I don't know where the other gentleman got his info on Netherlands being a hotbed for terrorism, but your counter-point isn't exactly valid either.

No wonder Trumpists believe the kind of bullshit his Christian extremist regime spews forth. You people can't read, don't understand what important terms mean, and can't do basic f--king arithmatic.


This anti-Christian streak in you has become more and more obvious as of late, and it's very disappointing. It seems your resentment for whatever ills you feel like Christianity has inflicted on you gets projected onto anything and anyone you dislike or disagree with without consideration. It's disappointing because I enjoy this site and the community around it, and I'm grateful for the role you've played in making this possible. It's like finding out your favorite celebrity is a racist or your favorite football player is a wife beater. ;)

Even if your hatred for Christians and conservatives was justified, Trump isn't especially Christian OR conservative, much less an extremist, so it makes zero sense to attack him for being such.

Edited 2017-02-01 15:47 UTC

Reply Score: 2

RE: Smoking crack again Thom?
by Soulbender on Wed 1st Feb 2017 04:24 UTC in reply to "Smoking crack again Thom?"
Soulbender Member since:
2005-08-18

Considering the Netherlands is a hotbed of Islamist extremism


Alternative facts at it's finest.

Reply Score: 2

It's good to be the king...
by Flatland_Spider on Sun 29th Jan 2017 05:24 UTC
Flatland_Spider
Member since:
2006-09-01

This is what businesses do. They kiss the ring.

Businesses make money. That is what they do; they don't deal with politics, unless it's to curry favor. In that context, the only amoral thing is to pass up a buck, and it would be in their best interest to get favorable legislation passed. Companies can talk all they want, but in the end, it's all about making a buck.

Reply Score: 4

Comment by matej
by matej on Sun 29th Jan 2017 11:31 UTC
matej
Member since:
2007-05-27

I'm really interested to see how markets will respond on what happened this weekend. Will they see it as a good thing that US democracy is strong enough to undo dumb decissions, or will they will be scared by the fact that this president is willing to make dumb decissions?

As a side-note, I really like the article from The Economist, especially this quote:
"Americans are vastly more likely to find employment with a Muslim refugee than to be killed by one. They are in fact much likelier to be killed by cows, fireworks and malfunctioning elevators than an immigrant terrorist. As a means of keeping Americans safe, then, Mr Trump’s order is almost worthless."

(source: http://www.economist.com/blogs/democracyinamerica/2017/01/keep-your... )

Reply Score: 3

Foxnews now runs the country
by Lennie on Sun 29th Jan 2017 12:37 UTC
Lennie
Member since:
2007-09-22

trump and his supporters only watch foxnews:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9nSy64mUhNk

Reply Score: 4

Being Judgemental
by cranfordio on Sun 29th Jan 2017 13:02 UTC
cranfordio
Member since:
2005-11-10

Meanwhile, Elon Musk is kissing the ground Trump walks on, and Tim Cook, CEO of the most arrogantly and smugly (supposedly) liberal tech company is meeting with Trump, Trump's daughter (...?) and other Republican leaders. From other tech giants who always touted the liberal horn of equality and progressiveness - a deafening, but quite revealing, silence.


I find it interesting you assume that because Tim Cook has decided it was best to sit down and talk with Trump and his "advisors" he must be supporting him. Whether we like it or not Trump is President and one can either choose to try and ignore him and fight him on everything he does, which with a person like Trump would probably just make him dig his heels in even deeper, or you can be respectful of the Office of President and try to speak with him to find a middle ground.

By the way Tim Cook also responded to Trump's immigration order and he doesn't agree with it either. Although I do wish he was a bit harsher in the tone, Tim Cook has never been known as being harsh. http://www.macrumors.com/2017/01/28/tim-cook-on-immigration-order/

Reply Score: 4

RE: Being Judgemental
by shotsman on Sun 29th Jan 2017 17:47 UTC in reply to "Being Judgemental"
shotsman Member since:
2005-07-22

Elon Musk is a lot closer to Donald than Tim Cook.
Just my opinion though

Reply Score: 2

RE[2]: Being Judgemental
by tylerdurden on Mon 30th Jan 2017 01:59 UTC in reply to "RE: Being Judgemental"
tylerdurden Member since:
2009-03-17

Elon Musk has not choice but to be close to whoever sits in local/state/federal government, since some of his ventures are heavily dependent on subsidies.

Reply Score: 2

RE: Being Judgemental
by Cutterman on Tue 31st Jan 2017 22:52 UTC in reply to "Being Judgemental"
Cutterman Member since:
2006-04-10

Tim Cook is being naïve if he thinks that Trump will take any notice of him or even absorbed a word he said.

The only reason Trump agreed to meet him is because he is a wealthy corporation CEO, a photo-opportunity and to give the impression he cares. I think that Cook knows this, but felt that it was something he had to do. Same for Musk and all the rest of them.

Trump only listens to the voices in his head.

Tony Schwartz who ghost-wrote "The Art of the Deal" says that he never got to know Trump, see http://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2016/07/25/donald-trumps-ghostwri... and now regrets his involvement. Trump promised to donate his royalties to charitable causes - no trace of that! Schwartz has now donated most of his royalties to charities like the National Immigration Law Center. And Trump tried to stiff him for half the huge cost of the extravagant book launch.

You guys have got a real big problem on your hands, but you'll come to understand that it's much bigger than you ever thought or could imagine. Sorry to tell you..

Mac

Reply Score: 1

End of US monopoly
by zhengiszen on Sun 29th Jan 2017 18:48 UTC
zhengiszen
Member since:
2012-08-26

Good thing... If it could start a kind of end to the financial and technological monopoly the US has on the rest of the world.

Alternatives to the way US has governed the world (consumerism, pollution, warfare, etc.) are more than welcome...

Reply Score: 3

RE: End of US monopoly
by zhengiszen on Sun 29th Jan 2017 20:14 UTC in reply to "End of US monopoly"
zhengiszen Member since:
2012-08-26

"US President Donald Trump signed an executive order halting the entire US refugee programme and also implementing a 90-day travel ban for nationals from seven Muslim-majority countries – Syria, Iran, Iraq, Sudan, Libya, Somalia and Yemen. The President signed the order on Holocaust Remembrance Day, an irony not lost on families of survivors of the Nazi regime.
..."

Legacy of Bush & Obama was fire, war and blood & now Trump brings us this... The US of Shame...

Reply Score: 1

RE[2]: End of US monopoly
by bnolsen on Sun 29th Jan 2017 23:08 UTC in reply to "RE: End of US monopoly"
bnolsen Member since:
2006-01-06

How are those "refugees" treating the german people?? My wife's relatives don't seem to have any problems with travel.

Reply Score: 2

...while the free world crumbles to dust
by quackalist on Mon 30th Jan 2017 07:36 UTC
quackalist
Member since:
2007-08-27

WTF, is that being ironic or what.....

Reply Score: 3

acobar Member since:
2005-11-15

Uber-hyperbolic, hyper-exaggerated, cynical, hypocritical, ironic, mega-pretentious or just plain wrong. Or all of them. ;)

Edited 2017-01-30 10:03 UTC

Reply Score: 4

I'm pretty sure Donald Trump is the President
by cjcox on Mon 30th Jan 2017 21:50 UTC
cjcox
Member since:
2006-12-21

I hear a lot of US Citizens making very very heinous remarks about our President. Maybe that's the wrong approach? I don't hear people making arguments against policy, all I hear is potty-mouth 8 yr olds whining against the President of the United States.

Please, by all means, make your argument. Just don't be an 8 yr. old (unless you're 8).

(preparing to duck the crayons that are about to be thrown)

Reply Score: 1

ezraz Member since:
2012-06-20

I hear a lot of US Citizens making very very heinous remarks about our President. Maybe that's the wrong approach? I don't hear people making arguments against policy, all I hear is potty-mouth 8 yr olds whining against the President of the United States.

Please, by all means, make your argument. Just don't be an 8 yr. old (unless you're 8).

(preparing to duck the crayons that are about to be thrown)


Oh jeezus, are you for real?

No 8 year olds typing here. I have a 9 year old, I'm a grown ass man.

Don John is the biggest con working in america. "It's good to be king" is right. 27% of american adults bought that act. They are grenade rollers.

But Don, their vessel, he's got problems:
Serial sexual assaulter. Serial liar. Serial braggart. Serial narcissism. Weird public crush on his daughter.

Sociopath?

The worst of human traits. I know many pray and point to his money. Those are the worst of us all, the followers of the evil scamming for their own little piece.

His 3rd wife? Parents are communists. Lied about her education for over a decade. Lied about her modeling career. Possibly lied about her visa status. More of a potential sleeper agent than barry soweto ever was.

Shall I go on? You don't even have to get to his lack of coherent policy. The man should be in prison, not in the white house. And the evidence is everywhere, every day.

Edited 2017-01-31 21:35 UTC

Reply Score: 2

Worry about Bannon, not Trump
by Cutterman on Tue 31st Jan 2017 22:04 UTC
Cutterman
Member since:
2006-04-10

I think you guys should worry more about Bannon than Trump. Yes, Trump is thoroughly unpleasant, but he is just a greedy egoist and political naïf who alone would just hurt America badly.

Bannon OTOH is a self-confessed Leninist who wants to smash the entire system. He will use Trump and the Republicans to turn America into a one "party" police state, just as Putin has done with Russia.

Remember what Lenin did to the Old Bolsheviks, once the Revolution was achieved and the Civil War won? Remember the Treaty of Brest-Litovsk?

Don't think your Constitution will help you, not when the Republicans, The Justice Department, the Supreme Court and all your "checks and balances" have been emasculated.

I think you guys are in a very hazardous position.

Good luck, because you're sure gonna need it.

The Cutter

Reply Score: 1